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Old 03-28-2007, 12:18 AM   #1
Marc the Smark
 
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The best there is, the best there was, and the best there ever will be....
Do you really think this describes Bret Hart? If you do, please explain. If you don't, who do you think is the best? I'll give my opinion later...
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Old 03-28-2007, 12:30 AM   #2
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It fit his personality, he was a Confident Personality. He was down to the point in his interviews, his matches, and basically his whole career.

So yes, i think the title suits him just fine.

And yes, i personally think he was one of the best.
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Old 03-28-2007, 01:26 AM   #3
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I think Shawn Michaels was the best worker ever, but Ric Flair with his legacy and everything puts him down as the best ever overall.
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Old 03-28-2007, 01:41 AM   #4
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Old 03-28-2007, 01:51 AM   #5
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Bret Hart doesn't make my top 50 wrestlers. I'm so dead serious. So no, I don't think he was the best ever, at any point. As far as soley what happens inbetween the bells, I'm sorry, but for my dollar, no one can ever touch Shawn Michaels. In general, Flair is the best there is, the best there was, and the best there ever will be.
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Old 03-28-2007, 02:06 AM   #6
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The one, we are at one with one another
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Old 03-28-2007, 02:08 AM   #7
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How many times can YOU use the word "one" in a sentance?
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Old 03-28-2007, 02:10 AM   #8
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Old 03-28-2007, 02:15 AM   #9
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The Rock, because this has always been sports entertainment and no one was better then The Rock.
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Old 03-28-2007, 02:32 AM   #10
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It fits his character but compared to other wrestlers, sadly he is not the best.
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Old 03-28-2007, 03:50 AM   #11
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Old 03-28-2007, 04:31 AM   #12
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He's so not gonna be able to do the "Chairman" gimmick.
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Old 03-28-2007, 01:58 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M-A-G
It fits his character but compared to other wrestlers, sadly he is not the best.
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Old 03-28-2007, 02:02 PM   #14
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Yeah, I think it suits him because I do think he is 'the best there is, the best there was and the best there ever will be!'
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Old 03-28-2007, 03:12 PM   #15
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He is was and always will be the best, so yes.
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Old 03-28-2007, 03:15 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The One
Bret Hart doesn't make my top 50 wrestlers. I'm so dead serious. So no, I don't think he was the best ever, at any point. As far as soley what happens inbetween the bells, I'm sorry, but for my dollar, no one can ever touch Shawn Michaels. In general, Flair is the best there is, the best there was, and the best there ever will be.
You're entitled to your own opinion, and arguing against opinion is fruitless. However, who would be the 50 wrestlers that you think were better then Bret Hart?
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Old 03-28-2007, 03:35 PM   #17
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Flair clearly isn't the best there is right now
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Old 03-28-2007, 03:45 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Show Off
You're entitled to your own opinion, and arguing against opinion is fruitless. However, who would be the 50 wrestlers that you think were better then Bret Hart?
Whole thread about this already...
http://www.tpww.net/forums/showthread.php?t=60436

For the record, I'm am not saying Bret didn't leave behind an incredible legacy. I'm not saying others cann't like him. I'm saying I never did. Hogan has an incredile legacy and legions of fans, I can't take that away from him, but I can say I don't give two squirts of piss about either of them...
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Old 03-28-2007, 03:51 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeritron
Flair clearly isn't the best there is right now
If Flair's legacy started today, no he wouldn't be. But if Bret's legacy started today, he'd just be some dude with a concussion who can't wrestler. Hardly makes him the best there is right now either...
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Old 03-28-2007, 03:53 PM   #20
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If you can say that then I can say if Flair's legacy started today then he would just be an old guy with boobs flopping and chopping and wooing.
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Old 03-28-2007, 03:55 PM   #21
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I think likes of jushin thunder liger, ultimo dragon, rey mysterio and other great lucha libre wrestlers are the best.
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Old 03-28-2007, 03:56 PM   #22
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That's what I'm saying. Jeritron was making a comment that modern day Flair isn't the best ever. I agreed but pointed out that modern day Bret isn't anything. Part of being great, is having your history. Flair is the best ever, not because of his work in 2007, but because of the entire career of the 30+ years before now...
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Old 03-28-2007, 04:02 PM   #23
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I agree I was simply cracking wise on Flair's current career in WWE.

But as for Bret, I do like him. But he's not the best from his time period, Shawn is. He's not the best of all time, Flair probably is. And as a champion, I enjoyed him and I find him to be one of the most talented wrestlers of all time. However behind champions like HBK, Austin and The Rock I find him to be a tad on the boring side, despite being entertaining to me in his time.
Bottom line is I respect Bret, I appreciate Bret and I do like him. He's a class act in a classless business, he's an amazing worker and a legend. But I stil don't think he literally lives up to his catch phrase.
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Old 03-28-2007, 04:06 PM   #24
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Bret is the most overrated wrestler in wrestling history. He was good but not great. The only great thing about him was his connection with the fans, and that was limited.

HBK and Flair are the two greatest in recent years. Can't say more than that.
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Old 03-28-2007, 04:11 PM   #25
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I Avenger.

...Denny Crane.
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Old 03-28-2007, 04:12 PM   #26
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You can't really be the best there is when another guy on your current roster is out performing you. Seriously, Shawn Michaels has a longer list of instant classics in a short period of time as anyone ever.
If I had to list what I though were the 30 greatest matches of all time, I think Shawn would be in 10+. Possibly.
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Old 03-28-2007, 04:15 PM   #27
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My best matches of all time list consists of alternating between Flair and Michaels' matches.
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Old 03-28-2007, 04:17 PM   #28
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You think there was any form of jealousy or resentment of accomplishment in Bret that fueld their real life fued? I think so. He'd probably never admit it but Shawn came and stole his spotlight, and he proably hated him for being better. Sorry to break it to people, but Shawn is better than Bret. All politics and character issues aside, bell to bell.
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Old 03-28-2007, 04:30 PM   #29
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I always wondered if one of the reasons the real life fued ever started was back when Shawn was in the Rockers and they won the Tag Titles and the whole Neidhart resigning or not resigning thing happened...I'm sure they wern't huge fans of the Harts after that. Throw more fuel to the fire that Shawn was beginning to take the spot that had been groomed for him with Hogan's departure. Hart probably felt like the Kliq was a big slap in his face since it was basically all the upper midcard/main event players who wern't somehow related to him...yeah it's not real hard to figure out why they didn't like each other. Plus you factor in the style of wrestling that the two sides represented and the general attitude of each group and you realise it was like throwing the Capulets and the Montagues together and expecting no one to get a bloody noise now and then...
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Old 03-28-2007, 04:30 PM   #30
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I would say it's a possibility as it is possible with any wrestler but I would say before the incident I don't think so but after, there may have been. If Rock took a break from acting and came back for a few years, he would definitely steal the spotlight from everyone, especially John Cena but Rock is a classy guy and would put him over so there would be no jealousy.

If Shawn back then was like The Rock then I'm sure they could have shared the spotlight or went back and forth. If Bret was gonna be jealous of anyone I thought it would have been Stone Cold. Bret was the face and the star then this bad ass foul mouth came a long and people booed Bret. But they became good friends in real life.
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Old 03-28-2007, 04:33 PM   #31
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Shawn still out-performs everyone on the WWE roster today.
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Old 03-28-2007, 04:34 PM   #32
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But that would be a case of a seasoned vet coming in and resuming their place on top. Bret was totally groomed to be "The guy" of WWE after Hogan, Savage, and the other big draws from the 80's left. Shawn was, I'm sure in Bret's mind, a little punk ass bitch kid with some flashy moves and a coke problem who was suddenly getting bigger reactions than him. It's threatening, and in a lot of ways, I'm sure he was quite insulted.
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Old 03-28-2007, 04:37 PM   #33
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Actually I wouldn't be surprised if they were both jealous of each other.
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Old 03-28-2007, 04:49 PM   #34
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There can be only one top guy. I think they probably both wanted to be it. That's probably why he, in real life, told Bret to "get the fuck out of the ring this is my moment" at WM12.
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Old 03-28-2007, 04:51 PM   #35
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13
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Old 03-28-2007, 04:52 PM   #36
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wtf, 12 of course. My bad, ugh.
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Old 03-28-2007, 04:55 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeritron
There can be only one top guy. I think they probably both wanted to be it. That's probably why he, in real life, told Bret to "get the fuck out of the ring this is my moment" at WM12.
I don't know what I'd do if I was in that situation. If someone said that to Taker he'd probably rough him up.
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Old 03-28-2007, 04:55 PM   #38
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13 was supposed to be Bret going over Shawn, but like we've said, egos get in the way.
It's hard to judge, I'd really have to be there to side with someone. Because they paint Shawn in this bad light, but Bret isn't exactly the most happy go lucky guy. He's pretty fucking miserable and in everythign I've seen seemed to be so before the screwjob.
So who knows, maybe he really did treat Shawn like shit and had it coming. Maybe Shawn shouldn't have done the job back for him. Seems snake-ish on HBKs part, but it's really hard to judge not knowing the whole picture.
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Old 03-28-2007, 05:07 PM   #39
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Neither man wanted to put the other over at any point. We paint over the fact that Bret refused to let the Iron Man end with Michaels just going over, hence the overtime outcome. Shawn didn't want to put Hart over at 13. Bret didn't want to put Shawn over in his hometown. Blah, blah, blah. They both have egos, Shawn just was a better politician. Shawn had to do less than Bret did for that reason alone. Neither one of them comes out smelling like roses, but the facts remain, both went out of their way to punk the other one out. They didn't like each other, the crews they rolled with didn't like each other, it was Westside vs. Eastside. Whatever...

Shawn entertained me, I side with Shawn for that reason alone.
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Old 03-28-2007, 05:13 PM   #40
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I will always maintain my opinion on the screwjob. Bret was wrong, Vince was right.
I don't even see the argument and never will. He didn't want to lose in his hometown to Shawn. Too bad, thats where his last contracted event was, Shawn was the guy they wanted to take the belt and thats that.

I like Bret, but I see him as a miserable guy. I think he's a miserable guy with some class and principles, but he's so fuckin miserable. And not just because of the screwjob, he was a miserable asshole before it. That's why it happened. He should have dropped the belt cleanly beforehand or on that night and that's that.
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