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Old 12-04-2007, 05:05 PM   #1
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Orton - Spoiler warnings
You know Flair beat Orton, the world champion, on 11/26. Then on last night's raw (12/3) Micheals techincally wins against Orton by disqualifaction. Plus in recent history, the only time Orton has beaten Micheals is when Micheal's couldn't use his full move set. So, doesn't that mean there are 2 people with stronger cases to be #1 condender against Orton than Jericho? PS, I'm not bashing Jericho as much as saying Flair and Micheals rule.
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Old 12-04-2007, 09:06 PM   #2
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Honestly, the 'Swog has more claim to the #1 contendership than Jericho. At least 'Swog has worked up through the midcard a bit. Nobody should be given a title shot on their debut/redebut. They've basically equated Jericho's return to that freaking Scott Steiner mess back in '03. Except nobody ever EXPECTED anything from Big Poppa Shithead.
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Old 12-04-2007, 09:28 PM   #3
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Remember when Hassan debuted.

The storyline for weeks and weeks was that he couldn't get a title shot. ANY title shot. That's when they went down the racist storyline path.

Oh and yeah Flair and MIchaels do rule.

Yeah I know BDC, go to hell jobber. :foc:
Last edited by KYR; 12-04-2007 at 10:37 PM.
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Old 12-04-2007, 10:03 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarthTedious View Post
Honestly, the 'Swog has more claim to the #1 contendership than Jericho. At least 'Swog has worked up through the midcard a bit. Nobody should be given a title shot on their debut/redebut. They've basically equated Jericho's return to that freaking Scott Steiner mess back in '03. Except nobody ever EXPECTED anything from Big Poppa Shithead.
He should have had to earn the shot, at the very least. Maybe even have to face Orton in singles competition a couple of times. But this? This is a TNA move.
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Old 12-04-2007, 10:24 PM   #5
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You know that making sense is against the rules, come on.
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Old 12-05-2007, 01:37 AM   #6
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Logically speaking, Chris Jericho is the reason that Ric beat Randy (that and a low blow) on RAW, so if it wasn't for the savior, Flair would be retired. If it was the mafia, Flair would owe his life to Jericho. In this case, he just reneges any supposed title contendership status, based on the fact that he cheated to win.

And Shawn didn't "technically" win anything last night. Shawn made the decision to fight Kennedy instead of his opponent, thus getting himself counted out. An amateur mistake for the seasoned HBK, but a loss for his record books none the less.

See? Neither man has contendership over Jericho. You're dilluting yourself.
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Old 12-05-2007, 11:34 AM   #7
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Fox is right. BDC is watering himself down.
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Old 12-05-2007, 11:34 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox View Post
Logically speaking, Chris Jericho is the reason that Ric beat Randy (that and a low blow) on RAW, so if it wasn't for the savior, Flair would be retired. If it was the mafia, Flair would owe his life to Jericho. In this case, he just reneges any supposed title contendership status, based on the fact that he cheated to win.

And Shawn didn't "technically" win anything last night. Shawn made the decision to fight Kennedy instead of his opponent, thus getting himself counted out. An amateur mistake for the seasoned HBK, but a loss for his record books none the less.

See? Neither man has contendership over Jericho. You're dilluting yourself.
I'm not dilluting myself, I'm still 100% BDC with no filler.

And shut up. :foc:
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Old 12-05-2007, 11:34 AM   #9
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Quote:
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Fox is right. BDC is watering himself down.
No I'm not. I'm coffeeing myself down if anythtng.:foc:
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Old 12-05-2007, 11:38 AM   #10
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Chris Benoit vs Daniel Benoit for the World Title! Adrian Adonis is the special ref.
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Old 12-05-2007, 12:34 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RP View Post
Chris Benoit vs Daniel Benoit for the World Title! Adrian Adonis is the special ref.
Wow, that has nothing to do with anything. Also, Benoit jokes are old hat now. Get fresh material.
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Old 12-05-2007, 02:24 PM   #12
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You know this is professional entertainme...er....wrestling right?
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Old 12-05-2007, 02:57 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigDaddyCool View Post
I'm not dilluting myself, I'm still 100% BDC with no filler.

And shut up. :foc:
Dunno, I think you've lost your edge, Daddy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigDaddyCool View Post
No I'm not. I'm coffeeing myself down if anythtng.:foc:
Fine. Coffeeing yourself down.

Anyway, Fox isn't right. I just wanted to make the diluting crack.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigDaddyCool View Post
Wow, that has nothing to do with anything. Also, Benoit jokes are old hat now. Get fresh material.
Yeah, Benoit's starting to get ripe. We need a new celebrity suicide to dig up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stickman View Post
You know this is professional entertainme...er....wrestling right?

Rule #1: If it doesn't make sense, it sells.
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Old 12-06-2007, 07:41 AM   #14
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Chris Jericho challenging for the WWE Championship makes perfect sense to me. For one, it was not like Jericho walked in and was granted a match. He fucked around with Randy's head until Orton said "OK, you have your match."

Ric Flair did beat Randy Orton, and has a legitimate claim to the WWE Championship. Shawn Michaels lost to Randy Orton last night. It's a Batista-like move to give him another title shot. HBK should be the next WWE Champion, but he is in no way the #1 Contender.

I can see some people's problem with Jericho getting the title shot, and if William Regal or Vince McMahon came out, and said "you're not getting the shot, you haven't been back long enough," then it would make sense. Actually, I'd like to see Regal do that, Jericho remind him that he pissed in his tea, and then Regal and Jericho having a match to decide whether or not Jericho can get the shot.

Jericho has a win against Umaga now, which is pretty impressive. Jeff Hardy also has a win, but he's less proven as far as his resume goes, and he is getting a #1 Contender's opportunity at Armageddon.

So, in summary:

This all makes sense, to a certain degree. So shut the fuck up.
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Old 12-06-2007, 08:06 AM   #15
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I agree with fox. If it weren't for Jericho Flair would be retired, so shut the fuck up BDC.
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Old 12-06-2007, 11:21 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alienoid06 View Post
Jericho has a win against Umaga now, which is pretty impressive. Jeff Hardy also has a win, but he's less proven as far as his resume goes, and he is getting a #1 Contender's opportunity at Armageddon.
Cause you know beating Umaga and Santino after not winnning a match in over 2 years is way more impressive than being the one to win the match at Suvior Series, being IC champion, and being the most over guy on Raw. Yeah, Jericho's resume is way better than Jeff Hardy's.
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Old 12-06-2007, 12:02 PM   #17
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Imagine if Jericho wins the title and HHH beats Jeff, that means Jericho is gonna job to HHH again
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Old 12-06-2007, 12:21 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Y2Ant View Post
Imagine if Jericho wins the title and HHH beats Jeff, that means Jericho is gonna job to HHH again
Jeff is going over HHH. So Jeff is jobbing to Jericho.
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Old 12-06-2007, 12:28 PM   #19
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Old 12-06-2007, 02:47 PM   #20
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Jericho is jobbing to Orton though. Which means Orton is jobbing to HHH. Or Jeff is jobbing to Orton.
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Old 12-06-2007, 03:02 PM   #21
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Or their is going to be an elemination chambed with orton, jeff, jericho, hhh, hbk, and kennedy.
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Old 12-06-2007, 03:53 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Y2Ant View Post
Jericho is jobbing to Orton though. Which means Orton is jobbing to HHH. Or Jeff is jobbing to Orton.
Seriously, I’m feelin’ Orton/J. Hardy @ RR ’08 for the WWE title. Jeff loses in a close battle, and over the next couple months we see Jeff and Orton feuding over the title, leading up to a J. Hardy/Orton Main Event for the WWE title at WM XXIV, where Jeff finally (unlike a certain coach in the NFL) wins the big one. That is the only proper way to do this thing.
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Old 12-06-2007, 06:13 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alienoid06 View Post
Chris Jericho challenging for the WWE Championship makes perfect sense to me. For one, it was not like Jericho walked in and was granted a match. He fucked around with Randy's head until Orton said "OK, you have your match."

Which would have been nicer if it hadn't been all of one night.

Not counting his debut, he had like, an altercation and a half with Orton. That's not a lot of fucking with him.

Meh, I don't really care that much, because Jericho makes as much sense as anyone else anyway.
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Old 12-06-2007, 06:19 PM   #24
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Frankly I’m surprised nobody in the company came up with a hokey billing for the match, such as “The Youngest World Champion In WWE History v. The First Undisputed Champion”. Hell, I’m surprised Jericho didn’t think of that one himself, being as how he’s all about being the first Undisputed Champion and all...
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Old 12-06-2007, 06:34 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by BigDaddyCool View Post
Cause you know beating Umaga and Santino after not winnning a match in over 2 years is way more impressive than being the one to win the match at Suvior Series, being IC champion, and being the most over guy on Raw. Yeah, Jericho's resume is way better than Jeff Hardy's.
Yeah, because Jeff Hardy has been World Champion how many times? As opposed to Chris Jericho winning the WCW Championship twice, and unifying it with the WWE Championship? In fact, to this day, I think Chris Jericho may be the only man to ever win two seperate World Championships in two matches in one night.

The most Jeff Hardy can claim to is being IC Champion four times, something Chris Jericho has done seven times. Jericho is more decorated, which is what I was referring to when I said resume. Jeff is still a mid-carder on paper.

Jeff Hardy is also not the most over guy on RAW. That much is debatable. Right now, Shawn Michaels and Chris Jericho would both give him a run for that role. As much as it pains me to say it, so does Triple H.

And the WWE has not acted like being IC Champion has meant anything in years. If it did, the belt would probably be on the line at Armageddon. Winning the Survivor Series match is probably the best thing Jeff Hardy has going for him, and even then, Chris Jericho has won big matches since returning (against Umaga, who is still put over as an unbeatable monster, even though he's losing more and more). Jeff got the last pin, which was good for him, but in the end, it was a tag team victory. Jeff Hardy shared the ultimate win with Triple H, so anything that Jeff can claim from the win, Triple H technically can, too. That may be, you know, why they are having a contenders' match between them on PPV?

Chris Jericho is a makeshift challenger while William Regal sorts out who gets the shot out of Triple H and Jeff Hardy. I'm fairly certain Jericho will be protected, not win the title (although I can see some kind of repeat of the Triple H/Jericho incident from 2000), while Triple H beats Jeff Hardy to get the match at the Royal Rumble. I'm fairly certain Randy Orton will retain there, a real feud between Triple H and Jeff Hardy will kick-start, and Shawn Michaels will get the No Way Out title shot. Chris Jericho should win the 2008 Royal Rumble, and HBK should win the WWE Championship at No Way Out, giving us Shawn Michaels vs. Chris Jericho in the main event.
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Old 12-06-2007, 06:36 PM   #26
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Wtf is that?
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Old 12-06-2007, 06:38 PM   #27
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Wtf is that?
KK carving a Turkey.
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Old 12-06-2007, 06:43 PM   #28
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KK carving a Turkey.
Didn't know you came from an Asian background. Must be why you're such a Jimmy Wang Yang fan.
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Old 12-06-2007, 06:49 PM   #29
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Yeah, because Jeff Hardy has been World Champion how many times? As opposed to Chris Jericho winning the WCW Championship twice, and unifying it with the WWE Championship? In fact, to this day, I think Chris Jericho may be the only man to ever win two seperate World Championships in two matches in one night.

The most Jeff Hardy can claim to is being IC Champion four times, something Chris Jericho has done seven times. Jericho is more decorated, which is what I was referring to when I said resume. Jeff is still a mid-carder on paper.

Jeff Hardy is also not the most over guy on RAW. That much is debatable. Right now, Shawn Michaels and Chris Jericho would both give him a run for that role. As much as it pains me to say it, so does Triple H.

And the WWE has not acted like being IC Champion has meant anything in years. If it did, the belt would probably be on the line at Armageddon. Winning the Survivor Series match is probably the best thing Jeff Hardy has going for him, and even then, Chris Jericho has won big matches since returning (against Umaga, who is still put over as an unbeatable monster, even though he's losing more and more). Jeff got the last pin, which was good for him, but in the end, it was a tag team victory. Jeff Hardy shared the ultimate win with Triple H, so anything that Jeff can claim from the win, Triple H technically can, too. That may be, you know, why they are having a contenders' match between them on PPV?

Chris Jericho is a makeshift challenger while William Regal sorts out who gets the shot out of Triple H and Jeff Hardy. I'm fairly certain Jericho will be protected, not win the title (although I can see some kind of repeat of the Triple H/Jericho incident from 2000), while Triple H beats Jeff Hardy to get the match at the Royal Rumble. I'm fairly certain Randy Orton will retain there, a real feud between Triple H and Jeff Hardy will kick-start, and Shawn Michaels will get the No Way Out title shot. Chris Jericho should win the 2008 Royal Rumble, and HBK should win the WWE Championship at No Way Out, giving us Shawn Michaels vs. Chris Jericho in the main event.
So you are saying some guy that was good 3 years ago is a better #1 contender than an up and comer with a hotstreak? Is that what you are saying? That something that happened 6 years ago is more relevant than what happen in the past 6 months?
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Old 12-06-2007, 07:03 PM   #30
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So you are saying some guy that was good 3 years ago is a better #1 contender than an up and comer with a hotstreak? Is that what you are saying? That something that happened 6 years ago is more relevant than what happen in the past 6 months?
When the last 6 months have mostly been perception, and fan boys salivating over Jeff, and the past 6 years completely overshadow any of the accomplishments in the six months, then yes. Absolutely.

Randy Orton's been a pretty solid heel character lately, but the most relevant thing he has done is become the youngest World Champion in WWE history, in my opinion. Chris Jericho being a three-time World Champion completely trumps anything Jeff Hardy has ever done, and at the risk of sounding cynical, may ever do.
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Old 12-06-2007, 07:29 PM   #31
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Randy Orton's been a pretty solid heel character lately, but the most relevant thing he has done is become the youngest World Champion in WWE history, in my opinion.
I was always under the impression that Orton's first title win (and subsequent claim to be the youngest WWE Champion in history) was because with Lesnar leaving the company, Vince didn't want that record staying with Brock.

It wasn't the fact that Orton was so deserving of the title (although it did make a half-decent storyline with the break-up of Evolution and then Dancin' Dave leaving as well and feuding with HHH) but more the fact that Vince was pissed that Lesnar had the record and there were few other (young) choices at the time to put the title on who could claim the record.

Has anyone else heard this story?
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Old 12-06-2007, 07:46 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by Alienoid06 View Post
When the last 6 months have mostly been perception, and fan boys salivating over Jeff, and the past 6 years completely overshadow any of the accomplishments in the six months, then yes. Absolutely.

Randy Orton's been a pretty solid heel character lately, but the most relevant thing he has done is become the youngest World Champion in WWE history, in my opinion. Chris Jericho being a three-time World Champion completely trumps anything Jeff Hardy has ever done, and at the risk of sounding cynical, may ever do.
This coming from someone who thinks Val Venis should be champion.
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Old 12-06-2007, 07:52 PM   #33
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Wow, just.....wow.
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Old 12-06-2007, 08:47 PM   #34
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Didn't know you came from an Asian background. Must be why you're such a Jimmy Wang Yang fan.
He's not Asian, He's a redneck. YEEEEHAAAAW!

Dumbass!
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Old 12-06-2007, 08:50 PM   #35
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Has anyone else heard this story?
It's the most common story/rumor/legend about his title run. Dunno if it's true, but it's very common.
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Old 12-07-2007, 10:34 AM   #36
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This coming from someone who thinks Val Venis should be champion.
But ask me if in a kayfabe sense Val Venis deserves to get the title shot over Chris Jericho, just because Venis has done more in the last six months (by default).

Jeff Hardy is yet to crack the big one. Chris Jericho cracked said big one three, arguably four times.
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Old 12-07-2007, 10:36 AM   #37
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But ask me if in a kayfabe sense Val Venis deserves to get the title shot over Chris Jericho, just because Venis has done more in the last six months (by default).

Jeff Hardy is yet to crack the big one. Chris Jericho cracked said big one three, arguably four times.
With increadibly weak title riegns to go along with it. He never looked like anything more than a pretender to the throne when he was champion, as long as we are looking back 6 years ago.
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Old 12-07-2007, 10:37 AM   #38
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I was always under the impression that Orton's first title win (and subsequent claim to be the youngest WWE Champion in history) was because with Lesnar leaving the company, Vince didn't want that record staying with Brock.

It wasn't the fact that Orton was so deserving of the title (although it did make a half-decent storyline with the break-up of Evolution and then Dancin' Dave leaving as well and feuding with HHH) but more the fact that Vince was pissed that Lesnar had the record and there were few other (young) choices at the time to put the title on who could claim the record.

Has anyone else heard this story?
That's one perception of it, and while it is true, it was the right move to put the World Heavyweight Championship on Randy Orton at that point in time. Toronto could feel it, and a lot of people were hoping it would happen. Some people claimed that it was a little fast for Orton, but most seemed to agree that he had proven himself a more than capable Champion.

Vince probably had both objectives in mind. Replace Brock Lesnar, and push Randy Orton. A two-for-one deal. Brock Lesnar is still technically the youngest WWE Champion of all-time, though. If all Vince cared about was replacing Lesnar, Orton would have won that belt, or Kenny Dykstra/Chris Masters would have won it by now.
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Old 12-07-2007, 10:40 AM   #39
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Anyhow, Jericho is jobbing at Armeggedon. Wouldn't you rather Jeff Hardy job to Orton while Jericho bides his time and beats others building himself up more than showing picture of cookie monster can?
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Old 12-07-2007, 10:46 AM   #40
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Anyhow, Jericho is jobbing at Armeggedon. Wouldn't you rather Jeff Hardy job to Orton while Jericho bides his time and beats others building himself up more than showing picture of cookie monster can?
I actually enjoyed that promo of Jericho. It made sense, and was far more entertaining than anything I had seen from John Cena.

But no, I do not think that Randy Orton vs. Jeff Hardy would be better at Armageddon. Quite frankly, I could not see myself ever buying a PPV with that as the main event. I think that Chris Jericho needs to be protected here, but off his return, this match makes a lot of sense. If he were working on the undercard, he'd just be losing steam, and then the WWE would end up never putting him in the main event.

I will say, however, that with the Royal Rumble looming, the WWE could have had Jericho beat Umaga, or something, qualify for the Rumble, and then win it to get his title shot. Jericho is just a much more credible choice than Jeff Hardy. Shawn Michaels getting another match against Orton was probably the best choice, but that program was doing nothing for me, either.
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