DISCUSSION - Edge needs to go over Undertaker or HHH at Mania if the WWE.............

**Heyman** · 02-09-2010, 07:29 PM

DISCUSSION - Edge needs to go over Undertaker or HHH at Mania if the WWE.............

Once and for all, want to consider Edge as one of the "big boys."

"But Heyman - Edge has won the World title 7 times....he *already is* a big boy" ~ certain faggots on here might say. My response is this: YES - Edge is a 7-8 time World champion, but outside of Foley and Kurt Angle, he has never really had that ONE CONVINCING and CLEAN victory over a true top-tier guy....and by top-tier, I mean someone that can literally be perceived as the #1 guy in the company. In yester-year, this meant Austin, The Rock, Triple H, or Undertaker. In today's world, this means, Undertaker, Triple H, John Cena, or Dave Batista.

At Wrestlemania, Edge will most likely be wrestling one of the following:

-Undertaker
-Triple H
-Chris Jericho
-Sheamus
-Randy Orton

I have excluded Batista and Cena here since they will most likely square off against one another. Orton is also an unlikely possibility due to his burgeoning feud with fellow Legacy members. That leaves the other 4. While Sheamus has been pushed to the moon thus far, it's highly unlikely that the WWE will have him main-event Wrestlemania (nor should they). I still think there's a large part of them that respects the "time honored tradition" of paying one's dues. Rule Sheamus out. That leaves the other three. While Edge/Jericho would be a great match, I don't think it would do much for Edge's credibility if he defeated Jericho....since Edge would already be expected to win such a match.

I think if the WWE TRULY wants Edge to be "one of the big boys" in the WWE, they will have him go CLEANLY over Undertaker or Triple H at Mania'....in the FINAL match of the night.

If it was up to me, I'd have Edge go over Taker.

Heyman's Wrestlemania Card:

-Edge vs. Undertaker
-Shawn Michaels vs. Triple H
-Randy Orton vs. Ted Dibiase vs. Cody Rhodes
-Dave Batista vs. John Cena
-Bret Hart vs. Vince McMahon
-Chris Jericho vs. Sheamus vs. John Morrison vs. Christian vs. Kofi Kingston vs. CM Punk

And many more!....

**Loose Cannon** · 02-09-2010, 07:39 PM

To this day I just still don't see Edge on that top tier level. I don't know what it is, but he's not there to me. He's won a shit load of World Titles and been around forever, but he's not where HHH, HBK, Cena, Batista, Taker and even Orton are. I see him on the same level as Jericho.

And with the streak, I've always said it should be Cena. Cena is top dawg and I think he should be the one that ends it. BUT...... I am fucking digging (cheap pop from screech) this HBK character right now and I hope they go with Taker/HBK at Mania so he could do it. But I can see HBK vs HHH like you have up there. But with HBK basically willing and begging to do anything to get his match with Taker, I hope they go down that route.

So to answer your initial quesiton, I really don't want to see Edge in there. Even if he beats Taker, I probably still wouldn't see him in a different light.

**Heyman** · 02-09-2010, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loose Cannon

To this day I just still don't see Edge on that top tier level. I don't know what it is, but he's not there to me. He's won a shit load of World Titles and been around forever, but he's not where HHH, HBK, Cena, Batista, Taker and even Orton are. I see him on the same level as Jericho.

And with the streak, I've always said it should be Cena. Cena is top dawg and I think he should be the one that ends it. BUT...... I am fucking digging (cheap pop from screech) this HBK character right now and I hope they go with Taker/HBK at Mania so he could do it. But I can see HBK vs HHH like you have up there. But with HBK basically willing and begging to do anything to get his match with Taker, I hope they go down that route.

So to answer your initial quesiton, I really don't want to see Edge in there. Even if he beats Taker, I probably still wouldn't see him in a different light.

I would also greatly prefer to see HBK/Taker (although at this point, it looks like we might be seeing a heel HBK vs. HHH). You are correct however - HBK finding some kind of way to get into a match with Taker (and going OVER Taker) would be FUCKING EIPC. I really hope we see that.

As far as Edge goes, I also agree with you here. However - if the WWE ever had a chance to create a new 'big boy', it could be Edge. Given Edge's lackluster 'face' reactions (combined with the fact that Edge seems fairly bland as a face), perhaps the WWE are better off staying away from this.

**Loose Cannon** · 02-09-2010, 07:52 PM

Edge lost me when he started wearing that skater scull cap. And he looked like the lead singer from Puddle of Mudd. I do think that Edge may face Jericho at Mania as well. They could make it a ladder match too, but I believe Money In The bank will probably be on the card like always

**jskinnyg** · 02-09-2010, 08:02 PM

I agree with the Heyman for the most point above... And...

EDGE to beat the win streak from the DeadMan would be killer!!! He's def got the momentum right now... But you cansee them building the Jericho thing for a lONG time... That will be a badass feud...

**Nicky Fives** · 02-09-2010, 08:26 PM

Undertaker will never lose at WM... it is Vince's way of thanking him for his years of dedication to his show..... no one will ever, REPEAT EVER come close to that Streak..... I love Edge as much as the next guy, but I think there is zero chance he will go over Taker at WM....

**Fignuts** · 02-09-2010, 08:35 PM

I don't think the streak should end, personally. If they were going to end it, just to get somebody like edge over, then they should have done it a long time ago. At this point it's become too big to end as just a shortcut to getting a guy over.

And I'll be really pissed if Michaels does it. Nevermind the fact that the first build-up and match was perfect, and doesn't need a sequel. What the hell does anybody gain, by michaels ending the streak.

**Heyman** · 02-09-2010, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fignuts

What the hell does anybody gain, by michaels ending the streak.

I think it would be a culmination of a pretty amazing story line/angle.

I also think it would help further cement HBK's legendary status (i.e. if he went down as the only guy in WWE history to beat Taker at Mania). Given how many guys HBK has put over at Mania, I think it would be a great way of saying 'thank you' to HBK.

**Skippord** · 02-09-2010, 08:47 PM

and a nice way of saying "fuck you " to Taker

XL · 02-09-2010, 08:49 PM

I am another one of those guys that doesn't see Edge as "one of the top guys".

Yeah, going over Taker and ending "The Streak" would be big but I don't think it would make Edge "The Man". At this point I don't think a lot would. Edge is a 9 time World Champ (I'm sure they said that on last week's SmackDown!) and if he isn't held in the same esteem as a Rocky, a Stone Cold or a HHH (or a Cena/Batista/Orton for that matter) by now I don't think he ever will.

For me it comes down to one thing: HHH/Rock/Austin etc were the champion. They held the top belt in the company. Edge has only ever been one of two champions in WWE. Winning the belt in the Brand Split Era just isn't as special.

The only way Edge could be bumped up to Austin/Rock/HHH status is by winning both the WWE and World Heavyweight Championships at the same time.

With that said, I'd like to see him fued with and go over HHH cos it's something we haven't really seen before.

**Stickman** · 02-09-2010, 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loose Cannon

To this day I just still don't see Edge on that top tier level. I don't know what it is, but he's not there to me. He's won a shit load of World Titles and been around forever, but he's not where HHH, HBK, Cena, Batista, Taker and even Orton are. I see him on the same level as Jericho.

This except I do put Jericho quite a bit higher. I put Edge on the level of a Owen Hart or Bulldog. Good, just doesn`t have `it` to put himself a step above.

**Juan** · 02-09-2010, 09:21 PM

Edge is one of the most entertaining guys in WWE. That's really all I care about.

**Ol Dirty Dastard** · 02-09-2010, 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Juan

Edge is one of the most entertaining guys in WWE. That's really all I care about.

**Mr. Nerfect** · 02-09-2010, 09:31 PM

I don't think the WWE should put Edge against either of the two guys you mentioned for one reason: They are both faces and Edge going against them will only split the crowd, which is not where they need to take Edge right now. I can understand why people don't seem as THE guy, though. Actually, since he has returned he has felt like that guy, but until his injury he always felt to be on that tier just below.

The top guys in the WWE, in my opinion, are the ones who have won both the WWE Title and World Heavyweight Championship. These men are Triple H, Shawn Michaels, The Undertaker, Edge, Randy Orton, Chris Jericho and Batista. In a kayfabe sense, I think these men should be considered on their own tier -- even above guys like Big Show, CM Punk, etc.

But that being said, if they want to make Edge work as a face, I think he needs to go against, first and foremost a strong heel at WrestleMania. Someone the fans really want to see Edge destroy. Chris Jericho fills both the quota of being a hated heel, and a member of the "headliner" club I listed above. I think the biggest problem facing Edge/Jericho -- and I may be the only one who thinks this -- is that they are so similar to each other. Both are Canadian, both are visually very similar, both are often seen as just below that "top guy" status by many, etc. Another problem is that it seems like Jericho would just be winning the World Heavyweight Title out of the blue to drop it to Edge.

CM Punk is the only other heel really hated enough to really put Edge over as a positive entity right now. He is probably hated just as much as Chris Jericho, so it gets the job done. The match also seems "fresher" to me. Edge pinning CM Punk in the WrestleMania main event would get him to the point where he is both beloved and seen as credible (he's walking out of WrestleMania as World Heavyweight Champion, after all). I'm not saying that Punk is more credible than Chris Jericho; but right now, I think it would be more believable if Punk won the World Heavyweight Title than Jericho. Do not ask me why. Maybe it is because he held it more recently than Jericho? It's not a logical feeling I get, it's just that I think it feels more natural right about now. Jericho winning his sixth World Title right about now would just be a bit "convenient."

**blak23** · 02-09-2010, 09:31 PM

Takers streak should never be broken for the simple reason that; when it comes to mania it's bigger than the wwe or whc title matches. It's a draw just like the mitb match. Taker undefeated is a big part of wrestlemania.
Edge is already a big boy in the company, but i prefer him as a heel and if he is a face it should only be for a jericho match and then bring the rated r superstar back. way better for him

**blak23** · 02-09-2010, 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noid

I don't think the WWE should put Edge against either of the two guys you mentioned for one reason: They are both faces and Edge going against them will only split the crowd, which is not where they need to take Edge right now. I can understand why people don't seem as THE guy, though. Actually, since he has returned he has felt like that guy, but until his injury he always felt to be on that tier just below.

The top guys in the WWE, in my opinion, are the ones who have won both the WWE Title and World Heavyweight Championship. These men are Triple H, Shawn Michaels, The Undertaker, Edge, Randy Orton, Chris Jericho and Batista. In a kayfabe sense, I think these men should be considered on their own tier -- even above guys like Big Show, CM Punk, etc.

But that being said, if they want to make Edge work as a face, I think he needs to go against, first and foremost a strong heel at WrestleMania. Someone the fans really want to see Edge destroy. Chris Jericho fills both the quota of being a hated heel, and a member of the "headliner" club I listed above. I think the biggest problem facing Edge/Jericho -- and I may be the only one who thinks this -- is that they are so similar to each other. Both are Canadian, both are visually very similar, both are often seen as just below that "top guy" status by many, etc. Another problem is that it seems like Jericho would just be winning the World Heavyweight Title out of the blue to drop it to Edge.

CM Punk is the only other heel really hated enough to really put Edge over as a positive entity right now. He is probably hated just as much as Chris Jericho, so it gets the job done. The match also seems "fresher" to me. Edge pinning CM Punk in the WrestleMania main event would get him to the point where he is both beloved and seen as credible (he's walking out of WrestleMania as World Heavyweight Champion, after all). I'm not saying that Punk is more credible than Chris Jericho; but right now, I think it would be more believable if Punk won the World Heavyweight Title than Jericho. Do not ask me why. Maybe it is because he held it more recently than Jericho? It's not a logical feeling I get, it's just that I think it feels more natural right about now. Jericho winning his sixth World Title right about now would just be a bit "convenient."

I can see where you are coming from and let me state edge should NOT have won the rumble because of what they couldve done with the jericho storyline. I feel that shouldve took priority over putting him in the main event right away. as for edge v punk i think edge v jericho is the better choice because its what we've been waiting for and at least I (i don't know about anyone else) am involved enough to care about that moreso than i care about and edge v punk. and also How are the visually similar?

**Mr. Nerfect** · 02-09-2010, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blak23

I can see where you are coming from and let me state edge should NOT have won the rumble because of what they couldve done with the jericho storyline. I feel that shouldve took priority over putting him in the main event right away. as for edge v punk i think edge v jericho is the better choice because its what we've been waiting for and at least I (i don't know about anyone else) am involved enough to care about that moreso than i care about and edge v punk. and also How are the visually similar?

Visually was the wrong word. It's not strictly visual. But when I think of the two facing off, I just cannot help by remember that Kurt Angle lockerroom promo with Chris Jericho, where he is describing Edge and Jericho realises that Angle might as well be describing himself.

As for The Undertaker's streak: I see more and more people saying that it should remain intact. I for the life of me cannot understand that. This is professional wrestling. The Undertaker is getting a "thank you" from the WWE right now, with his reasonably long World Heavyweight Title run. Taker got a "thank you" by keeping the streak for as long as he has since JR pointed it out in 2001, I believe. Taker will get a "thank you" when he is entered into the WWE Hall of Fame and things like his WrestleMania streak are brought up.

Andre the Giant being undefeated meant a lot because it matters when someone beats him. A long title reign for a heel means a lot because when a face wins it, a special moment is created, and a new hero has risen. The Undertaker keeping his streak is such an anti-climax.

Even if Taker just does what he has said he would be willing to do in the past, and he puts Kane over before he leaves. Anyone who beats The Undertaker has got something under their thumb that means more than any WWE Title or World Heavyweight Title reign. They defeated The Undertaker at WrestleMania. They instantly become this force that should inevitably win a World Title come Backlash. They instantly become, in a kayfabe sense, the most credible force on the WWE roster.

The Undertaker keeping the streak does nothing for business. NOTHING. To me, it would feel like The Undertaker was being a mark for himself, and almost slapping the WWE in the face. Taker should put over someone with the streak. Even if it is someone he just really likes and wants to see succeed. For example: I've always gotten the impression that The Undertaker likes working with Shelton Benjamin. They had that series of matches on SmackDown! around WrestleMania time last year. Taker strikes me as the type of guy to only do something like that if he enjoys it. That the matches were competitive is also telling. Perhaps The Undertaker would put over Shelton Benjamin at WrestleMania? It may seem like a let-down, but in a kayfabe sense, Shelton Benjamin's star would be at its peak.

Maybe Taker sees a young guy backstage that he really wants to groom? Triple H has Sheamus and Shawn Michaels has Drew McIntyre, for example. Maybe The Undertaker really likes someone like Dolph Ziggler, and could drop the streak off to them to ensure that they get over.

**blak23** · 02-09-2010, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noid

Visually was the wrong word. It's not strictly visual. But when I think of the two facing off, I just cannot help by remember that Kurt Angle lockerroom promo with Chris Jericho, where he is describing Edge and Jericho realises that Angle might as well be describing himself.

As for The Undertaker's streak: I see more and more people saying that it should remain intact. I for the life of me cannot understand that. This is professional wrestling. The Undertaker is getting a "thank you" from the WWE right now, with his reasonably long World Heavyweight Title run. Taker got a "thank you" by keeping the streak for as long as he has since JR pointed it out in 2001, I believe. Taker will get a "thank you" when he is entered into the WWE Hall of Fame and things like his WrestleMania streak are brought up.

Andre the Giant being undefeated meant a lot because it matters when someone beats him. A long title reign for a heel means a lot because when a face wins it, a special moment is created, and a new hero has risen. The Undertaker keeping his streak is such an anti-climax.

Even if Taker just does what he has said he would be willing to do in the past, and he puts Kane over before he leaves. Anyone who beats The Undertaker has got something under their thumb that means more than any WWE Title or World Heavyweight Title reign. They defeated The Undertaker at WrestleMania. They instantly become this force that should inevitably win a World Title come Backlash. They instantly become, in a kayfabe sense, the most credible force on the WWE roster.

The Undertaker keeping the streak does nothing for business. NOTHING. To me, it would feel like The Undertaker was being a mark for himself, and almost slapping the WWE in the face. Taker should put over someone with the streak. Even if it is someone he just really likes and wants to see succeed. For example: I've always gotten the impression that The Undertaker likes working with Shelton Benjamin. They had that series of matches on SmackDown! around WrestleMania time last year. Taker strikes me as the type of guy to only do something like that if he enjoys it. That the matches were competitive is also telling. Perhaps The Undertaker would put over Shelton Benjamin at WrestleMania? It may seem like a let-down, but in a kayfabe sense, Shelton Benjamin's star would be at its peak.

Maybe Taker sees a young guy backstage that he really wants to groom? Triple H has Sheamus and Shawn Michaels has Drew McIntyre, for example. Maybe The Undertaker really likes someone like Dolph Ziggler, and could drop the streak off to them to ensure that they get over.

you know what i see what your saying and can get on board with that. I would mark out if Kane broke it and got that final title run. your argument was well put together and thought out and i can agree with what you said it should be used to get a guy over. As for the purposes of this forum i don't believe edge to be that guy that nor should shawn micheals id like to see a guy like Dolph do it.

**The Gold Standard** · 02-09-2010, 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noid

The Undertaker keeping the streak does nothing for business. NOTHING. To me, it would feel like The Undertaker was being a mark for himself, and almost slapping the WWE in the face. Taker should put over someone with the streak. Even if it is someone he just really likes and wants to see succeed. For example: I've always gotten the impression that The Undertaker likes working with Shelton Benjamin. They had that series of matches on SmackDown! around WrestleMania time last year. Taker strikes me as the type of guy to only do something like that if he enjoys it. That the matches were competitive is also telling. Perhaps The Undertaker would put over Shelton Benjamin at WrestleMania? It may seem like a let-down, but in a kayfabe sense, Shelton Benjamin's star would be at its peak.

Noid, you are the man. I would love to see Shelton take down The Undertaker.

**HTrain90** · 02-09-2010, 11:07 PM

I would like to see Edge go over Batista. I realize that Cena-Bats seems like it's coming, but perhaps we could be given a swerve there.

I completely agree that Edge is not on the top tier. Something is missing. You cannot credibly put him against HBK, Trips, Taker, Cena, etc. I really think his long feud with Cena hurt him in the long run - he looked like Wile E. Coyote trying to take the belt off Cena for over a year. He has never been established well, and a win at Mania over Bats could do it.

This brings me to another point - who was the last great heel champion? I can't think of one that came after HHH (McMahon-Helmsley regime). He was hated by the fans, yet he held the belt for a damn long time. I cannot recall if a heel since then has held the belt for longer than even 4 months.

**Loose Cannon** · 02-09-2010, 11:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nicky Fives

Undertaker will never lose at WM... it is Vince's way of thanking him for his years of dedication to his show..... no one will ever, REPEAT EVER come close to that Streak..... I love Edge as much as the next guy, but I think there is zero chance he will go over Taker at WM....

the streak is an on going wrestling storyline that's been making money for Vince the last 5 or 6 years. Come on, it's not like Taker's doing anything other then getting his name penciled in for the W every single year. The more the WWE plays it up, the more people are interested and the more people will pay to see if it continues.

But it's getting to the point where people are going to want to see it end and that moment will be talked about for a long long time.

Noid pretty much said what I've been saying in the past about the streak. But I don't think it should be used to put over any mid carder. It's got to be a super match and the guy who ends it has to be a top guy or have ties to Taker (aka Kane)

**HTrain90** · 02-09-2010, 11:14 PM

I don't even think Kane can credibly end it, at this point. Kane has had a couple good runs, but he had been a mid-to-top-card jobber most of his career - a big body that can go. If Taker loses the streak, it has to be to a legend. It's a very short list of people who could do it: HBK, Cena, Triple H. Those may be the only options.

**jettson80** · 02-09-2010, 11:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loose Cannon

But with HBK basically willing and begging to do anything to get his match with Taker, I hope they go down that route.

HBK turns super heel and takes out Bret as a favor to Vince to get his shot at Taker

**Favre4Ever** · 02-10-2010, 12:42 AM

Edge's marketability I think is the prime thing holding him back. Despite that, I have to say that the way he's been pushed the last few years, if I suddenly saw him wrestling mid-card matches with R-Truth for the next six months I think I would believe that he was out of place.

**Arnold HamNegger** · 02-10-2010, 02:17 AM

It would be nice to see Edge snap and rebel against the "PG" bullshit and bring back a little more Rated R to the scene. Bring back a "Pillman" type vibe as a loose cannon who terrorizes each brand. This would include some clean wins over the established "big boys" that Heyman named.

What I liked about Raw Monday was a little of the "Attitude" seems to be coming back. Could be perfect timing.

**Skippord** · 02-10-2010, 02:23 AM

that's a lot of quotation marks

**Arnold HamNegger** · 02-10-2010, 02:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skippord

that's a lot of quotation marks

"lol"

**Emperor Smeat** · 02-10-2010, 03:15 AM

I doubt Edge breaking the streak would be enough to put him into the top tier compared to a few years ago when it was his streak vs Undertaker's streak at Wrestlemania. That was WWE's best chance to really cement Edge as a top tier wrestler and basically pass the "torch" in terms of having Edge as the keeper of the streak. Could then create the tradition of the streak killer being the new "top" star WWE needs to push for future needs.

If he was to beat the Undertaker this year, it still would be a memorable event in Wrestlemania history but could have been much stronger had it occurred in their 1st meeting in Wrestlemania. Would also make more sense since unless Edge or Triple H move brands, the match might not help in long term booking since Edge still needs to get involved with Jericho and Triple H with HBK.

**dronepool** · 02-10-2010, 03:59 AM

All I know is Sheamus better not break the streak to try and get him 'over'.

**Team Sheep** · 02-10-2010, 08:32 AM

Edge has always been a chicken shit champion that does anything it takes to win, that's his character and it's been great. Now that he's a face and we'll see him getting wins and championships cleanly you might start to see him in a different light over the coming months.

**The Franchise** · 02-10-2010, 10:30 AM

I don't think winning any title or ending the streak or any single event will make some "on that level"

Obviously being put over and all is a major factor but I don't think one thing like a win over Taker at WM will elevate Edge to Rock/Austin/HHH/Taker status.

**Anybody Thrilla** · 02-10-2010, 10:48 AM

Edge could have been made with a nice decisive win over Cena back when their feud was hot. They could have easily let him win that TLC match in Canada.

**Mr. Nerfect** · 02-10-2010, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jettson80

HBK turns super heel and takes out Bret as a favor to Vince to get his shot at Taker

This would be incredible. Just incredible. It'd play up to HBK's character, too. Last year, he went in as a representative of the light that would conquer darkness. Sure, he may have been a little cocky about it, and such, but this time there would not be any light. HBK would have sold his soul to the devil for his opportunity at The Undertaker.

Edge will be fine, though, I think. The logical thing to do is have Chris Jericho win the World Heavyweight Title in the Elimination Chamber. Edge challenges Jericho out of personal animosity, as well as a desire to be the World Heavyweight Champion (the only six-time World Heavyweight Champion in WWE history, I might add). Edge beats Jericho at WrestleMania, the fans go home happy, the end.

Edge can then joke around with Christian for a bit, and perhaps the WWE could even put out an Edge & Christian DVD. And from there, you just forward with them as a replacement for DX as the new "fan favourite super-team" of the WWE.

**LewisTheTruest** · 02-10-2010, 02:19 PM

Edge isn't 'one of the top guys' because he's never been a world champ face. That seems likely to change soon tho.

**Londoner** · 02-10-2010, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Juan

Edge is one of the most entertaining guys in WWE. That's really all I care about.

**Innovator** · 02-10-2010, 07:50 PM

He hasn't gotten the clean main event victories, cause he hasn't been face since reaching the main event. Couple clean wins over a guy like Cena or Orton should help clear up this confusiong that people think Edge isn't the man.

**Heyman** · 02-10-2010, 10:18 PM

To TL, Juan, and Jewstead:

Wouldn't you guys rather see "one of the most entertaining guys" in the WWE get MORE air-time and MORE important angles & storylines?....relative to those that are boring, stale, and have been dominating the top spots for years?

What if guys like Edge, Christian, Jericho, etc. were getting the air time that guys like Cena, Batista, and HHH are currently getting?

Wouldn't that be beautiful?

**Juan** · 02-10-2010, 10:39 PM

That's why I don't watch Raw.

**Juan** · 02-10-2010, 10:40 PM

Jericho and Edge get plenty of air time on Smackdown. I know you don't think it's the same because Raw is the "A" show, but I couldn't care less.

**Mr. Nerfect** · 02-10-2010, 11:37 PM

Yeah, I actually have to agree with Juan on that one. Air-time has never been a problem for Edge. He's been heavily featured as one of, if not THE top heel of the WWE over the past few years. You may have a point with credibility (which I don't these days), or his ability to play a face character; but I don't think exposure is his problem.

Edge is a nine-time World Champion that at one point banished The Undertaker from the WWE. From a kayfabe perspective, Edge is a world-beater. WWE crowds are just used to seeing him as a heel. Give this face run time.

02-09-2010, 07:29 PM	#1
Heyman Father of Hinduship Posts: 21,083	DISCUSSION - Edge needs to go over Undertaker or HHH at Mania if the WWE............. DISCUSSION - Edge needs to go over Undertaker or HHH at Mania if the WWE............. Once and for all, want to consider Edge as one of the "big boys." "But Heyman - Edge has won the World title 7 times....he already is a big boy" ~ certain faggots on here might say. My response is this: YES - Edge is a 7-8 time World champion, but outside of Foley and Kurt Angle, he has never really had that ONE CONVINCING and CLEAN victory over a true top-tier guy....and by top-tier, I mean someone that can literally be perceived as the #1 guy in the company. In yester-year, this meant Austin, The Rock, Triple H, or Undertaker. In today's world, this means, Undertaker, Triple H, John Cena, or Dave Batista. At Wrestlemania, Edge will most likely be wrestling one of the following: -Undertaker -Triple H -Chris Jericho -Sheamus -Randy Orton I have excluded Batista and Cena here since they will most likely square off against one another. Orton is also an unlikely possibility due to his burgeoning feud with fellow Legacy members. That leaves the other 4. While Sheamus has been pushed to the moon thus far, it's highly unlikely that the WWE will have him main-event Wrestlemania (nor should they). I still think there's a large part of them that respects the "time honored tradition" of paying one's dues. Rule Sheamus out. That leaves the other three. While Edge/Jericho would be a great match, I don't think it would do much for Edge's credibility if he defeated Jericho....since Edge would already be expected to win such a match. I think if the WWE TRULY wants Edge to be "one of the big boys" in the WWE, they will have him go CLEANLY over Undertaker or Triple H at Mania'....in the FINAL match of the night. If it was up to me, I'd have Edge go over Taker. Heyman's Wrestlemania Card: -Edge vs. Undertaker -Shawn Michaels vs. Triple H -Randy Orton vs. Ted Dibiase vs. Cody Rhodes -Dave Batista vs. John Cena -Bret Hart vs. Vince McMahon -Chris Jericho vs. Sheamus vs. John Morrison vs. Christian vs. Kofi Kingston vs. CM Punk And many more!.... Last edited by Heyman; 02-09-2010 at 07:39 PM.

02-09-2010, 07:39 PM	#2
Loose Cannon I'm all there is Posts: 31,811	To this day I just still don't see Edge on that top tier level. I don't know what it is, but he's not there to me. He's won a shit load of World Titles and been around forever, but he's not where HHH, HBK, Cena, Batista, Taker and even Orton are. I see him on the same level as Jericho. And with the streak, I've always said it should be Cena. Cena is top dawg and I think he should be the one that ends it. BUT...... I am fucking digging (cheap pop from screech) this HBK character right now and I hope they go with Taker/HBK at Mania so he could do it. But I can see HBK vs HHH like you have up there. But with HBK basically willing and begging to do anything to get his match with Taker, I hope they go down that route. So to answer your initial quesiton, I really don't want to see Edge in there. Even if he beats Taker, I probably still wouldn't see him in a different light.

02-09-2010, 07:52 PM	#4
Loose Cannon I'm all there is Posts: 31,811	Edge lost me when he started wearing that skater scull cap. And he looked like the lead singer from Puddle of Mudd. I do think that Edge may face Jericho at Mania as well. They could make it a ladder match too, but I believe Money In The bank will probably be on the card like always

02-09-2010, 08:02 PM	#5
jskinnyg Voices Say I'm Awesome... Posts: 1,715	I agree with the Heyman for the most point above... And... EDGE to beat the win streak from the DeadMan would be killer!!! He's def got the momentum right now... But you cansee them building the Jericho thing for a lONG time... That will be a badass feud...

02-09-2010, 08:26 PM	#6
Nicky Fives b/c 5 is better than 4 Posts: 9,721	Undertaker will never lose at WM... it is Vince's way of thanking him for his years of dedication to his show..... no one will ever, REPEAT EVER come close to that Streak..... I love Edge as much as the next guy, but I think there is zero chance he will go over Taker at WM....

02-09-2010, 08:35 PM	#7
Fignuts Hey Mister! Posts: 54,952	I don't think the streak should end, personally. If they were going to end it, just to get somebody like edge over, then they should have done it a long time ago. At this point it's become too big to end as just a shortcut to getting a guy over. And I'll be really pissed if Michaels does it. Nevermind the fact that the first build-up and match was perfect, and doesn't need a sequel. What the hell does anybody gain, by michaels ending the streak.

02-09-2010, 08:47 PM	#9
Skippord I'm Mr. White Christmas Posts: 44,526	and a nice way of saying "fuck you " to Taker

02-09-2010, 08:49 PM	#10
XL Feeling Oof-y Posts: 17,151	I am another one of those guys that doesn't see Edge as "one of the top guys". Yeah, going over Taker and ending "The Streak" would be big but I don't think it would make Edge "The Man". At this point I don't think a lot would. Edge is a 9 time World Champ (I'm sure they said that on last week's SmackDown!) and if he isn't held in the same esteem as a Rocky, a Stone Cold or a HHH (or a Cena/Batista/Orton for that matter) by now I don't think he ever will. For me it comes down to one thing: HHH/Rock/Austin etc were the champion. They held the top belt in the company. Edge has only ever been one of two champions in WWE. Winning the belt in the Brand Split Era just isn't as special. The only way Edge could be bumped up to Austin/Rock/HHH status is by winning both the WWE and World Heavyweight Championships at the same time. With that said, I'd like to see him fued with and go over HHH cos it's something we haven't really seen before.

02-09-2010, 09:21 PM	#12
Juan Doin' It Right Posts: 35,461	Edge is one of the most entertaining guys in WWE. That's really all I care about.

02-09-2010, 09:31 PM	#14
Mr. Nerfect Posts: 61,543	I don't think the WWE should put Edge against either of the two guys you mentioned for one reason: They are both faces and Edge going against them will only split the crowd, which is not where they need to take Edge right now. I can understand why people don't seem as THE guy, though. Actually, since he has returned he has felt like that guy, but until his injury he always felt to be on that tier just below. The top guys in the WWE, in my opinion, are the ones who have won both the WWE Title and World Heavyweight Championship. These men are Triple H, Shawn Michaels, The Undertaker, Edge, Randy Orton, Chris Jericho and Batista. In a kayfabe sense, I think these men should be considered on their own tier -- even above guys like Big Show, CM Punk, etc. But that being said, if they want to make Edge work as a face, I think he needs to go against, first and foremost a strong heel at WrestleMania. Someone the fans really want to see Edge destroy. Chris Jericho fills both the quota of being a hated heel, and a member of the "headliner" club I listed above. I think the biggest problem facing Edge/Jericho -- and I may be the only one who thinks this -- is that they are so similar to each other. Both are Canadian, both are visually very similar, both are often seen as just below that "top guy" status by many, etc. Another problem is that it seems like Jericho would just be winning the World Heavyweight Title out of the blue to drop it to Edge. CM Punk is the only other heel really hated enough to really put Edge over as a positive entity right now. He is probably hated just as much as Chris Jericho, so it gets the job done. The match also seems "fresher" to me. Edge pinning CM Punk in the WrestleMania main event would get him to the point where he is both beloved and seen as credible (he's walking out of WrestleMania as World Heavyweight Champion, after all). I'm not saying that Punk is more credible than Chris Jericho; but right now, I think it would be more believable if Punk won the World Heavyweight Title than Jericho. Do not ask me why. Maybe it is because he held it more recently than Jericho? It's not a logical feeling I get, it's just that I think it feels more natural right about now. Jericho winning his sixth World Title right about now would just be a bit "convenient."

02-09-2010, 09:31 PM	#15
blak23 Posts: 1,763	Takers streak should never be broken for the simple reason that; when it comes to mania it's bigger than the wwe or whc title matches. It's a draw just like the mitb match. Taker undefeated is a big part of wrestlemania. Edge is already a big boy in the company, but i prefer him as a heel and if he is a face it should only be for a jericho match and then bring the rated r superstar back. way better for him

02-09-2010, 11:07 PM	#20
HTrain90 HBK mark since 1995 Posts: 488	I would like to see Edge go over Batista. I realize that Cena-Bats seems like it's coming, but perhaps we could be given a swerve there. I completely agree that Edge is not on the top tier. Something is missing. You cannot credibly put him against HBK, Trips, Taker, Cena, etc. I really think his long feud with Cena hurt him in the long run - he looked like Wile E. Coyote trying to take the belt off Cena for over a year. He has never been established well, and a win at Mania over Bats could do it. This brings me to another point - who was the last great heel champion? I can't think of one that came after HHH (McMahon-Helmsley regime). He was hated by the fans, yet he held the belt for a damn long time. I cannot recall if a heel since then has held the belt for longer than even 4 months.

02-09-2010, 11:14 PM	#22
HTrain90 HBK mark since 1995 Posts: 488	I don't even think Kane can credibly end it, at this point. Kane has had a couple good runs, but he had been a mid-to-top-card jobber most of his career - a big body that can go. If Taker loses the streak, it has to be to a legend. It's a very short list of people who could do it: HBK, Cena, Triple H. Those may be the only options.

02-10-2010, 12:42 AM	#24
Favre4Ever Incoming Text Posts: 2,646	Edge's marketability I think is the prime thing holding him back. Despite that, I have to say that the way he's been pushed the last few years, if I suddenly saw him wrestling mid-card matches with R-Truth for the next six months I think I would believe that he was out of place.

02-10-2010, 02:17 AM	#25
Arnold HamNegger Terminator Daddy! Posts: 2,428	It would be nice to see Edge snap and rebel against the "PG" bullshit and bring back a little more Rated R to the scene. Bring back a "Pillman" type vibe as a loose cannon who terrorizes each brand. This would include some clean wins over the established "big boys" that Heyman named. What I liked about Raw Monday was a little of the "Attitude" seems to be coming back. Could be perfect timing.

02-10-2010, 02:23 AM	#26
Skippord I'm Mr. White Christmas Posts: 44,526	that's a lot of quotation marks

02-10-2010, 03:15 AM	#28
Emperor Smeat Former TPWW Royalty Posts: 66,659	I doubt Edge breaking the streak would be enough to put him into the top tier compared to a few years ago when it was his streak vs Undertaker's streak at Wrestlemania. That was WWE's best chance to really cement Edge as a top tier wrestler and basically pass the "torch" in terms of having Edge as the keeper of the streak. Could then create the tradition of the streak killer being the new "top" star WWE needs to push for future needs. If he was to beat the Undertaker this year, it still would be a memorable event in Wrestlemania history but could have been much stronger had it occurred in their 1st meeting in Wrestlemania. Would also make more sense since unless Edge or Triple H move brands, the match might not help in long term booking since Edge still needs to get involved with Jericho and Triple H with HBK.

02-10-2010, 03:59 AM	#29
dronepool the low Art Gloominati Posts: 5,466	All I know is Sheamus better not break the streak to try and get him 'over'.

02-10-2010, 08:32 AM	#30
Team Sheep T�m Defaid Posts: 6,646	Edge has always been a chicken shit champion that does anything it takes to win, that's his character and it's been great. Now that he's a face and we'll see him getting wins and championships cleanly you might start to see him in a different light over the coming months.

02-10-2010, 10:30 AM	#31
The Franchise Just a bro. Posts: 3,517	I don't think winning any title or ending the streak or any single event will make some "on that level" Obviously being put over and all is a major factor but I don't think one thing like a win over Taker at WM will elevate Edge to Rock/Austin/HHH/Taker status.

02-10-2010, 10:48 AM	#32
Anybody Thrilla Cranky Kong Posts: 78,671	Edge could have been made with a nice decisive win over Cena back when their feud was hot. They could have easily let him win that TLC match in Canada.

02-10-2010, 02:19 PM	#34
LewisTheTruest Posts: 293	Edge isn't 'one of the top guys' because he's never been a world champ face. That seems likely to change soon tho.

02-10-2010, 07:50 PM	#36
Innovator Inno Knows. Posts: 43,710	He hasn't gotten the clean main event victories, cause he hasn't been face since reaching the main event. Couple clean wins over a guy like Cena or Orton should help clear up this confusiong that people think Edge isn't the man.

02-10-2010, 10:18 PM	#37
Heyman Father of Hinduship Posts: 21,083	To TL, Juan, and Jewstead: Wouldn't you guys rather see "one of the most entertaining guys" in the WWE get MORE air-time and MORE important angles & storylines?....relative to those that are boring, stale, and have been dominating the top spots for years? What if guys like Edge, Christian, Jericho, etc. were getting the air time that guys like Cena, Batista, and HHH are currently getting? Wouldn't that be beautiful?

02-10-2010, 10:39 PM	#38
Juan Doin' It Right Posts: 35,461	That's why I don't watch Raw.

02-10-2010, 10:40 PM	#39
Juan Doin' It Right Posts: 35,461	Jericho and Edge get plenty of air time on Smackdown. I know you don't think it's the same because Raw is the "A" show, but I couldn't care less.

02-10-2010, 11:37 PM	#40
Mr. Nerfect Posts: 61,543	Yeah, I actually have to agree with Juan on that one. Air-time has never been a problem for Edge. He's been heavily featured as one of, if not THE top heel of the WWE over the past few years. You may have a point with credibility (which I don't these days), or his ability to play a face character; but I don't think exposure is his problem. Edge is a nine-time World Champion that at one point banished The Undertaker from the WWE. From a kayfabe perspective, Edge is a world-beater. WWE crowds are just used to seeing him as a heel. Give this face run time.