MLB 2007-2008 Offseason Thread

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Mets are gonna be making a multi-year offer to Yorvit Torrealba soon.

I really don't get why the Mets have a hard-on for him, he's only a career .251 hitter. I'd rather see Ramon Castro as the everyday starter</font>

[Skippord]

He's a really good catcher

but I dont know if he is worth what they'll be paying

[SammyG]

Bring Torii Hunter to LA

[Dragon]

Apparently the Yankees are willing to negotiate with A-Rod as long as Boras isn't in the room. I'm assuming its A-Rod's way of making a market for himself though. I don't believe he really wants to come back here.

As soon as teams hear A-Rod is talking with the Yankees again it will make them jump sooner on deals. It seems like everyone's first choice seemed to be trading for Cabrera before getting A-Rod and this just helps A-Rod's value on the market. It would still be an extreme longshot in my mind that A-Rod comes back here. I would definitely want it to happen, but it most likely won't. The only way it would happen I'd think is if A-Rod and Boras leave money on the table, and I definitely don't see that happening.

[Hanso Amore]

<font color=goldenrod>Mets are gonna be making a multi-year offer to Yorvit Torrealba soon.

I really don't get why the Mets have a hard-on for him, he's only a career .251 hitter. I'd rather see Ramon Castro as the everyday starter</font>


Its never about hitting with catchers. They say Yorvit is a big reason the rockies pitching came around. Thats worth cash.

251 isnt that bad for a catcher anyways.

and he is young for a catcher.

[FakeLaser]

Eric Wedge and Bob Melvin are your managers of the year.

I agree with Wedge but I thought Clint Hurdle would have won it in the NL. Melvin is still a good choice though, D'Backs were a young team who couldn't hit for shit and they still managed to win 90 games.

[FakeLaser]

I really wouldn't be too shocked if A-Rod came back with all the rumblings we've heard lately. I don't know who else out there is going to offer him the kind of money he wants. I don't think the Angels want to give him that kind of money. The Giants might, but I don't know if he'd want to play there as he wants a World Series, though he did sign with the Rangers, so if the money is right I could see it. I don't think the Dodgers will sign him. People act like he and Torre were really close, all of the sudden.

If they resign A-Rod, I think they'll push hard for Santana. I think their uncertainty at 3rd base is stalling that, as they might feel obligated to trade their chips for Miguel Cabrera.

Ideally, I'd sign A-Rod, deal for Santana (I'd surrender Wang/Melky/Kennedy in a heartbeat) and then sign Torii Hunter. Imagine, Santana/Pettitte/Hughes/Chamberlain/Mussina. Wow.

[Hanso Amore]

I really wouldn't be too shocked if A-Rod came back with all the rumblings we've heard lately. I don't know who else out there is going to offer him the kind of money he wants. I don't think the Angels want to give him that kind of money. The Giants might, but I don't know if he'd want to play there as he wants a World Series, though he did sign with the Rangers, so if the money is right I could see it. I don't think the Dodgers will sign him. People act like he and Torre were really close, all of the sudden.

If they resign A-Rod, I think they'll push hard for Santana. I think their uncertainty at 3rd base is stalling that, as they might feel obligated to trade their chips for Miguel Cabrera.

Ideally, I'd sign A-Rod, deal for Santana (I'd surrender Wang/Melky/Kennedy in a heartbeat) and then sign Torii Hunter. Imagine, Santana/Pettitte/Hughes/Chamberlain/Mussina. Wow.


UNless they unload Matsui and Damon is full time LF, pass on Hunter. We already have an aging CF on the decline making too much money. We dont need 50 million for 4 outfielders.

If they are going to sign a FA CF, go for Aaron Rowand. Younger, Better Faster Stronger....

[FakeLaser]

UNless they unload Matsui and Damon is full time LF, pass on Hunter. We already have an aging CF on the decline making too much money. We dont need 50 million for 4 outfielders.

If they are going to sign a FA CF, go for Aaron Rowand. Younger, Better Faster Stronger....
I actually prefer Rowand to Hunter and Andruw Jones. I like Hunter a lot but I think he's due to breakdown after playing so many years on turf. Jones is as good as anyone with the glove but he is coming off a real down year and doesn't seem like the type to make adjustments. He's strictly a power hitter anyway. Rowand has a good glove, plays hard and is a solid hitter.

Damon is the left fielder. Matsui is going to DH. They're saying Giambi is going to see time at first. I'd sign Mientkiwicz if that's the plan to platoon or take over in late innings for Giambi if that's the case.

[Dragon]

I've seen a couple things about if A-Rod does end up coming back the Yankees will go hard after Santana and would be willing to include Hughes in the deal.

I dunno. I'm all for getting Santana but I wouldn't complain if Cashman doesn't get it done because I realize what it would take. I'd love to get Santana but not if it takes Joba, Hughes or Cano. A package of Melky, Kennedy, Tabata, etc...something like that I could deal with. That is still a good amount of talent in my mind but maybe not enough to get Santana. And if thats the case they should just pass. Especially considering there is no guarantee Santana would sign an extension.

I'm probably overrating our prospects a bit but I still wouldn't deal Joba, Hughes or Cano. Maybe it wouldn't be the best decision but it would still be the decision I would make.

[Hanso Amore]

Jones range has been getting smaller as his waist and power numbers have gotten bigger. He is becoming Adam Dunn South.

I look at it this way. Hughes may be a star someday, but Santana is THE hands down best pitcher in the MLB, and he is only a few years older. I am completely ok with losing one good player and some POTENTIALLY good player (who may never do JACK) to get the BEST. But just like everything, there is a fair price, so as long as they dont give up too much more than he is worth, its ok.

Giving an average Pitcher (wang) and a solid CF, with a pitching prospect that hasnt done much and might never for the top Pitcher seems fair to me.

[Hanso Amore]

I've seen a couple things about if A-Rod does end up coming back the Yankees will go hard after Santana and would be willing to include Hughes in the deal.

I dunno. I'm all for getting Santana but I wouldn't complain if Cashman doesn't get it done because I realize what it would take. I'd love to get Santana but not if it takes Joba, Hughes or Cano. A package of Melky, Kennedy, Tabata, etc...something like that I could deal with. That is still a good amount of talent in my mind but maybe not enough to get Santana. And if thats the case they should just pass. Especially considering there is no guarantee Santana would sign an extension.

I'm probably overrating our prospects a bit but I still wouldn't deal Joba, Hughes or Cano. Maybe it wouldn't be the best decision but it would still be the decision I would make.


I wouldnt deal Joba or Cano, they are hands off, Cano is already an all star and Joba is the real deal, but anyone else should be fair game. Santana is better than Hughes is now and better than he ever will be.

[FakeLaser]

Hughes is untouchable too, as far as I'm concerned.

[Hanso Amore]

Hughes is untouchable too, as far as I'm concerned.


If Santana isnt Untouchable to the twins, hughes shouldnt be for the Yanks. I would part with with Wang, or hughes, but not both. I would send

Hughes/Melky and a 2nd tier guy (Kennedy/tabata)

or

Wang, Melky and 2nd tier guy.

I dont think they should trade 2 starters for one, but one for one with melky/prospect would be alright. Santana is so good that he covers the difference.

I dont see Santana going anywher but a NY team, they need a CF and the Yanks and Mets have a combined 200 Stud OF prospects.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>A-Rod back to the Yankees is basically a done deal for about $290 million.

Gonna take a HUUUUUGE PR hit if it really does happen</font>

[SammyG]

Gay

[FakeLaser]

I'll take it

[Innovator]

Am I the only Yankee fan who likes Melky?

[Dragon]

I think every Yankee fan likes Melky, but also realizes that he won't be anything great. He is a solid player but his offense is really weak and I don't think will get drastically better.

And also, Santana isn't a couple years older than Hughes, he's 7-8 years older I believe. Like I said, it might not be the best decision but I would keep Hughes, Joba and Cano. Anyway, I don't see any reason why Santana would even discuss an extension with a team that trades for him. Unless it is some monster offer that noone will even come close to.

[ClockShot]

Some news and rumors.

The Rays excersied their option on Al Reyes.

Many a team interested in Carlos Silva.

In Carl Crawford news, Cubs are getting into the game and are thinking a Rich Hill and Eric Patterson deal might bring him over.

As for this new A-Rod situation. I'm not all that set on it. Vito pretty much hit the nail on the head. We're gonna be the laughing stock throughout the league. Here we are barking that if he leaves, we ain't talking to him again. SEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE YA, good bye, get the hell out of New York. And now he calls us up and wants to talk one on one. H & H Steinbrenner must have softer hearts than old man George.

I'm reading that alot of his friends want him to fire Boras but he ain't. Probably be the smartest thing he would ever do. But I guess if this is gonna straighten out our corner situation, then so be it. I'll reserve judgement until we hit the postseason.

[Loose Cannon]

oh greaaaaat. just what I wanted to see happen. wtf, are you with us or not? Or has Boras been shoving his hand up your throat the whole time and talking for you? I'm going to be that Indians fan in Major League and boo his ass until he proves himself in the post season. I'm not signing on until then

[Dragon]

I dunno. I don't understand why we would be the laughing stock of the whole league. I'll take it though if it means signing the best player in the game and saving us prospects that we'd have to give for Cabrera or another third baseman. And its not like the Yankees went to A-Rod begging for him to come back. He came back on his own apparently and wanted to negotiate with them. If he ends up signing below market value then it would get him into the good graces of people pretty quickly. Who knows what his market value even is though.

I was obviously pissed about how the opt-out thing was handled but whatever. If he does come back next year I won't boo him.

[FakeLaser]

I'll be happy if he comes back. It's been said that he must come back on the Yankees terms. That allows them to save face a bit.

If A-Rod wants to look classy he should fire Boras. He won't though.

[SammyG]

On SportsCenter, they are saying that A-rod is simply sharing his thoughts and explaining himself to the Yankees.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Wow. Apparently for the Mets to get Dan Haren, they'll need to part with John Maine, Lastings Milledge, and Aaron Heilman. :| Beane always asks for too much.

If it were just Milledge and Heilman I'd do it in a heartbeat. Maybe they could trade those two for Blanton or something.</font>

[Dragon]

7Sports is reporting that the Braves, Angels, Cardinals and Yankees have all offered Mike Lowell four-year contracts worth $55 million-$60 million.

This scoop from a Boston TV station sounds ludicrous and is likely fiction, but we'll report it anyway. That the Braves would be in the mix is especially bizarre. Chipper Jones wouldn't want to move back to left field, and Lowell can't play shortstop.
-Rotoworld


Ugh. I hope Cashman really isn't this stupid. Either the A-Rod stuff won't happen or he really wants Lowell to play 1st? Adding Lowell to that whole first base mess would be incredibly stupid. I'd much rather go with a Betemit/Duncan platoon and have Giambi start every now and then.

[FakeLaser]

According to SI.com's Jon Heyman, Alex Rodriguez will likely be guaranteed about $280 million over 10 years from the Yankees, with the chance to go over $300 million through incentives.

Heyman says agent Scott Boras is in intense negotiations with the Yankees to complete the deal. We suppose anything is possible with these two parties involved, but it seems highly unlikely that a deal will fall through at this stage.

I, for one, am ecstatic.

[weather vane]

I am glad he is going back. When we win the World Series again next year it will be great to see his face.

[Dragon]

Its kinda weird he is getting more than we offered before though, and that is with the money Texas owed us. I thought the plan was to take 21M or whatever off the contract? Not add it on to make the contract even larger.

There were rumors about a 220M contract but that seems like absolute nonsense so I believe this 280-300M deal is more like the real deal.

I'm not gonna complain too much because I'm glad he may be coming back but if this is true then Boras is getting exactly what he wanted and he wasn't even there apparently. This contract would most likely be the most any team offers anyway.

[Hanso Amore]

Maybe the Yanks will be the Laughing stock, but that will wear off quick when Arod hits 50 bombs for the yanks and not someone else.

I love Melky, but I love Cy Youn Pitchers more. He is no bernie, and we need a top number one.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

lol A-Rod is such a dick. Not only that he is making his agent look like a huge idiot

He will still be the best player on the Yankees by far but won't be a "true Yankee" for some reason.

[Dragon]

Kind of ridiculous that Mariano hasn't agreed to that $45 million/3 year deal. Apparently he is still holding out for a guaranteed fourth year. Its insane to me that he's even taking this long to agree to that deal; I can't see any other team even coming close.

[FakeLaser]

No one is going to give him that kind of money. He's Mariano Rivera, but he's going to be 38. That's starting pitcher type money.

[Loose Cannon]

anyone of you trying to go to the AS game next year? That would be so awesome

[FakeLaser]

Definitely

[Loose Cannon]

I'm gunning for something next year, no doubt. It's either going to be the AS game, Yanks/Boston in the summer, or a postseason game (if they make it).

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>I'm not even a Yankees fan but I'm gonna try to go to a game. I've only been there once, I wanna go to one more game before it comes down.

Anyway, saw an interesting trade proposal by someone who runs a Twins blog. Now obviously it has no merit, but it'd still be interesting.

Mets get: Johan Santana
Twins get: Lastings Milledge, Mike Pelfrey, Carlos Gomez, and Fernando Martinez

At first it seems like the Mets are giving up an assload, particularly their big 3 OF prospects...but really its not that bad and probably could be negotiable outside of Milledge. Martinez probably won't even appear in a big league game until like 2009 and even that would be as a September call-up so its impossible to predict his future.</font>

[FakeLaser]

I'm gunning for something next year, no doubt. It's either going to be the AS game, Yanks/Boston in the summer, or a postseason game (if they make it).
Went to two Yankees/Sox games this year. You can get pretty good deals on Stubhub. I went to the one where Wang had a no hitter through 7 and Joba threw at Youkills' head twice. It was amazing.

[Hanso Amore]

Yanks interested in Lowell to play 1st.....

jesus, How old and Expensive will this team be this spring!!!!

[weather vane]

Lowell is going to come back to the Boston Red Sox or else I am going to kill him.

[Dragon]

Hopefully he does go back to Boston. No need at all for him to play first when there is Betemit/Giambi/Duncan/Phillips already over there. A Betemit/Duncan platoon could work out pretty well.

[FakeLaser]

I think they should resign Mientkiewicz and platoon him with Giambi. Have Matsui DH, and Damon in left. Betemit can back up the other 3 infield positions.

Ideally, I'd have a Slam Duncan/Doug platoon but Giambi once again fucks everything up.

Andy Phillips is never going to work out, I've decided.

[FakeLaser]

Jake Peavy was the unanimous selection as the NL Cy Young Award winner on Thursday, netting all 32 first-place votes.

Brandon Webb was listed second on every ballot except for one. Someone picked Aaron Harang over him even though Webb had the better ERA by a large margin (3.01 to 3.73) and threw a few more innings. Brad Penny received 14 third-place votes to finish third ahead of Harang (10 points), Carlos Zambrano (3), John Smoltz (2), Cole Hamels (2), Jose Valverde (2) and Jeff Francis (1).
Obvious choice

Yorvit Torrealba's agent told ESPN Radio that the catcher will sign a three-year contract with the Mets.

With Ramon Castro also set to choose the Mets, the Marlins and Rockies appear set to pick from Paul Lo Duca, Michael Barrett, Jason Kendall and Rod Barajas as they seek their next catcher. Torrealba's deal is likely worth $5 million per year or slightly less. He doesn't require draft-pick compensation from the Mets, though the Rockies will get a supplemental first-rounder for losing him.

Torrealba is not worth 5 million a year. He's an okay defender but he can't hit for shit.

Free agent Mariano Rivera wants a fourth guaranteed season from the Yankees.

A source told FOXSports.com that Rivera, who turns 38 on Nov. 29, has instructed his agents to shop him, in part because he was angered by Hank Steinbrenner referring to his age in recent comments about the Yankees' three-year, $45 million offer. The team's current proposal would make Rivera the game's highest-paid reliever by a wide margin. It doesn't appear likely that any other team will try to top it.

Come on Mo, just sign already.

[Dragon]

I dunno. I prefer a Betemit/Duncan platoon with Giambi in there every now and then. Betemit is a solid left handed hitter but terrible right handed. You'd think that would work out decently. Maybe if Giambi wasn't here I'd want Doug back, but as it is I don't really want him. Giambi is pretty much a pinch hitter at this point; he looked pathetic last year. Couldn't get around on a fastball and couldn't even take walks like he usually does.

And yeah, Phillips has had a decent amount of chances and has had some personal stuff to deal with too these past two years but he'll never be a consistent first baseman for the Yankees. He just doesn't have enough pop in his bat.

[FakeLaser]

The only reason I say sign Mientkiewicz to platoon with Giambi is because Cashman said he plans on using Giambi at first this year.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>The Torrealba deal would piss me off more if not for the fact that its been said that the Mets intend on giving Ramon Castro more playing time.</font>

[VonErichLives]

Bonds Indicted By BALCO Federal Grand Jury

The five-count indictment -- four counts of perjury and one of obstruciton of justice --

http://www.ktvu.com/news/14606146/detail.html

[SammyG]

Good.

[RP]

Man i hope that dude thats in jail for not snitching gets his money from Barry before the goverment takes it. That'd be suck.

[Dragon]

Another report that the Yankees offered Lowell 4 years - 56-60 million

Cashman is an idiot if he does this.

[Hanso Amore]

A ROD IS A YANKEE!

Basically it looks like A Rod decided that he wasnt going to let Boras leave him stranded looking for 300 Million with no takers. He got a raise, an extension, and the Yanks got their guy back. I think both sides saved a little face by just giving up playing Tough Guy

[SammyG]

275 million, Jesussssss.

[Loose Cannon]

LOL Bonds.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Wow, no way the Red Sox will be matching that if it's true

I figured with A-Rod signing though it'd come down to the Phillies or the Red Sox for Lowell

-edit, talking about the Lowell deal Dragon just posted.

[FakeLaser]

Alex Rodriguez is expected to be guaranteed $275 million under terms of his 10-year deal with the Yankees.

Among the incentives that could push the deal over $300 million will be bonuses for passing Babe Ruth, Hank Aaron and Barry Bonds on the all-time home run list. A-Rod is currently at 518 homers, leaving him 244 behind Bonds.
~~~~~~~~~~~~<3 !!!!

Bonds could serve up to 30 years if indicted. That's wild.

[MVP]

Looks like that hall of fame ball really should have an asterik.

[Skippord]

I hope the Rockies get Michael Barrett

[OssMan]

Reasons why the Yankees signing A-Rod is awesome:

They spend $275,000,000 dollars
He sucks at playing in the playoffs
The Mets aren't getting him :love:

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Rumor has it the Mets might shift their focus to David Eckstein if Castillo's demands are too high (I read he's looking for a 4-year deal which is insane).

I'd love Eckstein. The guy's a scrappy player and plays with heart. He'd be a great fit for the team, batting 2nd and playing 2nd.</font>

[VonErichLives]

I love the rumor that this was part of the a-rod/boros plan that if the NYY walked away for A-Rod to go back w/o Boros.

[FakeLaser]

According to the New York Daily News, the Yankees and Jose Molina have agreed to a two-year contract worth $4 million.
Nice.

WBZ-TV's Dan Roche believes that the Yankees' offer to Mike Lowell is a four-year deal worth between $50 million and $55 million, not $56 million-$60 million as previously reported.
I don't get why we want Lowell so bad. I think we just want to fuck with the Red Sox by signing him. He's a really good third baseman, which is his strength, yet we'll be moving him to first base where we already have 700 options. His numbers are going to take a huge hit at Yankee Stadium.

I guess he's better than what we have at 1st base right now but 4 years? God. We need a stopgap for now because Posada is eventually going to have to move to first or DH, also, Matsui should be DHing too.

We must have something huge planned. If Lowell gets signed, I think Damon is going to get traded. For who, I have no idea. Maybe some relief pitching or we'll just deal him for some prospects. Probably prospects. I could see some sort of 3 team deal where we trade Damon for prospects, then send those prospects and Melky Cabrera to the Twins for Santana, then we'll sign a new CF.

[Dragon]

Offering Lowell that contract is beyond ridiculous. Thats a pretty huge amount of money to pay just to screw with the Sox. It will hurt them but that contract will hurt us more later on. I seriously believe a platoon or whatever we have going on at 1st could come close to Lowell's production if he played most his games at Yankee Stadium.

I've been hearing a lot of things about Hughes, Cano AND Cabrera for Santana. I will kill Cashman if he gives up that much. If its really gonna take that much to get him then I would just assume stick with the young guys and see what we have. Pettitte must come back no matter what and then the rotation wouldn't be terrible. Nothing like with Santana but still probably better than last year.

[Dragon]

As for Molina. Not a huge signing name-wise or whatever but he was great for us last year. He seems to fit in really well with this team and handles the young guys well. Definitely nice to not have to worry too much when Posada needs a day off.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Joe Nuxhall died last night. :'(

Aside from my father he was probably the most instrumental figure in developing my love for the game of baseball. Pretty good pitcher and a phenomenal broadcaster. RIP Joe.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

I really can't see the Yankees offering Lowell that much to play first, for the things already mentioned about in this thread. If they have Lowell at first for four years where the hell are they gonna put Posada when he breaks down?

Plus I dunno if it would really fuck with the Red Sox THAT bad, I'm sure they could trade Coco Crisp and like an average prospect for a 3B like Hank Blalock or something. I bet he'd hit pretty well in Fenway

[Dragon]

Yeah, it will hurt some if the Sox want to start trading kids for a Cabrera type but I don't see that. It will hurt the Yankees a lot more than it will the Sox if Lowell ends up coming here for 4 years. Lowell is most valuable to the Red Sox by far and they're only offering 3 years; that should say something about offering him 4 years to play away from Fenway. If Cashman is doing this hoping to get the last laugh on Boston by taking him away from them he is sorely mistaken. I really do hope Lowell loves Boston enough to go back with a lesser deal lol.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

I dunno if they'd start going after Cabrera though, maybe but the rumor I heard was the one I posted in my above reply, which wouldn't be bad at all. I'm still curious if the Yankees deal is even true though, I mean its a pretty ridiculous offer.

[Dragon]

Yeah, I kind of doubt it too considering it'd cost at least one or two of Buchholz, Lester, Ellsbury. Definitely don't see the Red Sox dealing any of those guys.

[FakeLaser]

The only one I'd think about dealing is Lester but he's pretty untouchable, IMO.

[SammyG]

LA going hard after Cabrera, and Lowell

[ClockShot]

Big news.

Kenny Rogers fires agent Scott Boras. Rogers will be representing himself for now.

[YOUR Hero]

Kenny's past his prime but it does seem like Boras has lost some of his shine.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Yeah, I kind of doubt it too considering it'd cost at least one or two of Buchholz, Lester, Ellsbury. Definitely don't see the Red Sox dealing any of those guys.
Me either, the Sox are starting to have a lot of success with homegrown guys in the field (Youk, Pedoria, Ellsbury etc.) so I can't see them shipping off top prospects for a positional player. An ace-type pitcher then maybe but other then that I don't know

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>YESSSSSSSSSSSSS

Somehow, the Mets/Torrealba deal "collapsed" and so he will not be on the team. I'm ecstatic</font>

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Unfortunately though, I don't think Lo Duca will be back :( He is reportedly insulted by the fact that the team didn't even give him an offer.

I wouldn't be opposed to just see them sign some backup catcher or bring someone up from the minors and let Castro start</font>

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>ESPN Radio just reported something:

Twins get: SS Jose Reyes, LHP Oliver Perez, RHP Mike Pelfrey, OF Carlos Gomez
Mets get: LHP Johan Santana, C Joe Mauer

Holy shit. I bet the guy on the radio meant to say it was just a rumor, because I do NOT think that trade will ever happen. But if its true, holy shit. It certainly would explain the Torrealba deal falling apart.</font>

[Hanso Amore]

<font color=goldenrod>ESPN Radio just reported something:

Twins get: SS Jose Reyes, LHP Oliver Perez, RHP Mike Pelfrey, OF Carlos Gomez
Mets get: LHP Johan Santana, C Joe Mauer

Holy shit. I bet the guy on the radio meant to say it was just a rumor, because I do NOT think that trade will ever happen. But if its true, holy shit. It certainly would explain the Torrealba deal falling apart.</font>


No way that would happen. It would take way more to land those 2. While I see maybe both getting traded sometime.

Add 3 more prospects and maybe

[Hardkore Kidd J]

<font color=goldenrod>ESPN Radio just reported something:

Twins get: SS Jose Reyes, LHP Oliver Perez, RHP Mike Pelfrey, OF Carlos Gomez
Mets get: LHP Johan Santana, C Joe Mauer

Holy shit. I bet the guy on the radio meant to say it was just a rumor, because I do NOT think that trade will ever happen. But if its true, holy shit. It certainly would explain the Torrealba deal falling apart.</font>

I don't think so Mauer is way to valuable to the Twins to lose. They value Mauer to much to get this trade done. This could probably do to get Santana. But there isn't any way anyone is gonna get Mauer from the Twins.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Yeah, I haven't heard anything about that rumor since. As I said, the Twins were lowballing possibly their top two players. As much as I'd hate to lose Reyes, I'd make that deal in a heartbeat.

Anyway, according to the NY Post, Rivera is expected to finally sign that 3-year, $45 million deal</font>

[Hardkore Kidd J]

<font color=goldenrod>Yeah, I haven't heard anything about that rumor since. As I said, the Twins were lowballing possibly their top two players. As much as I'd hate to lose Reyes, I'd make that deal in a heartbeat.

Anyway, according to the NY Post, Rivera is expected to finally sign that 3-year, $45 million deal</font>

As would anybody do that deal in a heart beat. But that deal sounds to good to be true. And most deals that sound to good to be true most of the time aren't.

And I'm very excited to see that MO might come back. We did pretty good first Posada, then A-rod(Though I would have preferred if it was less then 10 years) and now Mo. Now, try to get Pettitte to sign on the dotted line.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Strangely, the Posada deal hasn't even been made official...so theoretically the same thing that happened suddenly with Torrealba could happen with Posada.

lol it would be a swerve of WCW proportions if Posada decided to leave after all that</font>

[ClockShot]

So Warren Buffett is the man who told Alex Rodriguez to bypass Scott Boras and talk to Yankees directly. Pity A-Rod could not think of this all by himself.

And apparently, the Mike Lowell Yankees deal is pretty much not gonna happen.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

<font color=goldenrod>Strangely, the Posada deal hasn't even been made official...so theoretically the same thing that happened suddenly with Torrealba could happen with Posada.

lol it would be a swerve of WCW proportions if Posada decided to leave after all that</font>

I know the A-rod deal hasn't been made official yet either. It would be an extreme shame if A-rod and Posada both decided to leave that. But I don't know about A-rod leaving can he really find a team that pays him more then 10/250 Million? I think the A-rod deal is just about done. I hope Posada and Mo both decide to make it official.

Edit: Okay I didn't know A-rod had signed with them yet.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Seriously, just imagine Posada getting ready for a press conference or something and just before he signs the contract he rips off his Yankees jersey to reveal a Mets one or something. MAH GAWD IT WAS A SET UP</font> :lol:

[Hardkore Kidd J]

<font color=goldenrod>Seriously, just imagine Posada getting ready for a press conference or something and just before he signs the contract he rips off his Yankees jersey to reveal a Mets one or something. MAH GAWD IT WAS A SET UP</font> :lol:

Oh Yeah I can see it now.

ESPN: Posada has just signed a 3 year 45 million dollar contract.

*Cuts to press conferance. with Posada signing his contract.*

Posada: I just want to say that..................... *Rips off Yankee Jersey to reveal a Red Sox Jersey.



JR:Oh mah gawd! Posada has just set the Yankees up what a bastard. What a cowardly gutless bastard.

*Ends*

:rofl: :lol: :lol:

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Twins have reportedly offered Johan a 5-year, $93 million extension

Don't really see Johan getting traded if he doesn't sign that. Teams are gonna be afraid that they'll trade the farm only to watch him leave after the year</font>

[FakeLaser]

That's not gonna get it done. He's gonna want 20 million per year.

[Loose Cannon]

explain to me something cause I still don't get it after 20 years

when you trade somebody, is there a contract or anything? Like Vito just said Johan could leave after a year, so I'm assuming when you get traded you're only obligated to that team for th rest of the season. is that right?

[FakeLaser]

If you get traded, you are trading the contract too. Johan is under contract with the Twins for one more year, so if he got traded, he'd be under contract with the new team for one year.

[FakeLaser]

Yankees should take a look at Francisco Cordero as a potential setup man for Mo. Solid arm, plus he's shown he can pitch in the AL, and not just in the AL, in a hitters park (Texas).

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Yeah, that's why I think that at this point, any team acquiring Johan will require him to agree to an extension beforehand, especially considering how costly he'll be.

The Mets really seem like the most likely team at this point. They've come out and said they will trade part of the future for a starter if need be. Whereas the Yanks have said they aren't trading Hughes/Joba, the Red Sox aren't likely to part with their top guys, the Dodgers are more set on acquiring a bat, and the Angels are all talk and never make the big deal</font>

[Loose Cannon]

ah, got you.

[FakeLaser]

How about this?

Jason Giambi for Johan Santana.

A guy can dream...

[Hardkore Kidd J]

How about this?

Jason Giambi for Johan Santana.

A guy can dream...

That wouldn't get it done. Pavano, and Jason Giambi for Santana. That might be able to get it done.;)

[FakeLaser]

Throw Farnsworth in there too.

[Splaya]

I'm sure if the Yankees were to want to be in the Johan sweepstakes, I would imagine they would command Joba in the deal. And I do not see them giving him up

[Hanso Amore]

Fuck Johan for 20 Million. Would you pay that much a year for a guy who at most plays 35 games. For that price you get the whole Rockies pitching staff that got them to a World Series. How many Series did Johan get to?

Shit, you could get 2 Josh Becketts for that.

[FakeLaser]

Would you pay that much a year for a guy who at most plays 35 games.
Yes.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

I'm sure if the Yankees were to want to be in the Johan sweepstakes, I would imagine they would command Joba in the deal. And I do not see them giving him up

Fuck Santana then. We are not giving up Joba or Cano or Hughes they are "Untouchables". I'd rather Santana go to Boston then trade away any of these guys.

[YOUR Hero]

They paid Rocket Roger 18 mil to play half a season.

[McLegend]

And he didn't play very well.

[Hanso Amore]

Zito gets 18 mil a year.


Worth it!

Pitchers should not make as much as they do. You should be able to have a full solid starting 5 for 30 million.

for 20 million, would you rather have Johan or Matt Holiday? Posistion players are worth much more. Im not saying solid picthing doesnt matter, as you need it, but there is a fine like between great and overpaid. Shit, A Rod is the best hitter in the MLB and he is overpaid.

[FakeLaser]

They're all overpaid, bro. If these past few years have shown us anything, especially as Yankee fans, is that pitching is what wins championships. Your position players will only take you so far.

[ClockShot]

A's trade Marco Scutaro to the Blue Jays for minor league arms Kristian Bell and Graham Godfrey.

The Texas Rangers are gonna throw down a 5-year deal to Torii Hunter tomorrow night.

Rumors going around that Mariano Rivera may sign that 3-year 45 mil. the Yankees gave him sometime this week.

[Dragon]

Actually, from what I've seen the Yankees might be willing to include Hughes in a deal for Santana. I dunno, I just don't see the Mets as a favorite to get Santana or anything. They just don't seem to have that big prospect to get him. I just don't think Humber or Pelfrey are on the same level as a Hughes, Joba or Buchholz prospect-wise. They do have the young outfield guys but I don't think its enough without a big young pitcher.

I'm kind of torn on Santana. I obviously want him but he will cost a ton. I've been hearing things like Cano, Hughes and Melky. Even two of those will be a terrible deal for me. I'm almost just hoping the Yankees see what they have next year with their big three young guys, make sure Pettitte comes back, hope Minnesota keeps Santana and he becomes a free agent and get him then. Unless the deal somehow falls to a Melky, Kennedy, Tabata, Horne, etc...which is still a ton of talent to give up anyway. That'll never happen though.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

Actually, from what I've seen the Yankees might be willing to include Hughes in a deal for Santana. I dunno, I just don't see the Mets as a favorite to get Santana or anything. They just don't seem to have that big prospect to get him. I just don't think Humber or Pelfrey are on the same level as a Hughes, Joba or Buchholz prospect-wise. They do have the young outfield guys but I don't think its enough without a big young pitcher.

I'm kind of torn on Santana. I obviously want him but he will cost a ton. I've been hearing things like Cano, Hughes and Melky. Even two of those will be a terrible deal for me. I'm almost just hoping the Yankees see what they have next year with their big three young guys, make sure Pettitte comes back, hope Minnesota keeps Santana and he becomes a free agent and get him then. Unless the deal somehow falls to a Melky, Kennedy, Tabata, Horne, etc...which is still a ton of talent to give up anyway. That'll never happen though.

There's always the chance that Cashman and the Minnesota GM can go out drinking and get the Twins GM drunk and make a deal of Clippard, Desalvo, and Tabata for Santana.;)

But, if they want Cano and Hughes then you can forget it. I don't want the Yankees to give up Hughes or Cano. And if Santana doesn't hit the FA market. There's always Sabathia, Lackey, or Peavy.

[Dragon]

Yeah, there's a pretty huge free agent market for pitchers the next couple years but I'd bet most if not all sign contract extensions with their current teams. Definitely the way most pitchers seem to be going. Barely any big name pitchers hit free agency anymore. So I can definitely understand going after Santana, I just don't want to give up the price wanted. If Pettitte comes back the rotation still looks good, Santana just makes the rotation look ridiculous.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Glavine has signed a 1-year, $8 million contract to return to the Braves. Nice, Mets snag an extra first round pick :cool:

And the Mets agreed to a 4-year contract with Luis Castillo. Damn, I like Luis and everything and he definitely works after Reyes...but 4 years for those knees. I've never seen somebody walk to the plate, wincing in pain, limping....then hit the ball, run and have everything look fine...then look to be in pain. Then steal 2nd flawlessly, only to get up and appear to be in agony. It was so weird to watch</font>

[Loose Cannon]

Rivera is good

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Angels aquire Jon Garland for Orlando Cabrera and cash</font>

[FakeLaser]

Wow, I'm surprised they'd deal Orlando Cabrera, especially for a mediocre Jon Garland.

[MVP]

Jon Garland is overrated and shitty, and Cabrera is a good hitter. Bad move by the Angels.

[ClockShot]

Word going around is that even though Orlando Cabrera might be going out, Miguel Cabrera might be coming in. Angels are still the front runners right now.

Red Sox and Yankees are out of the running.

[weather vane]

MIKE LOWELL

[Dragon]

Word going around is that even though Orlando Cabrera might be going out, Miguel Cabrera might be coming in. Angels are still the front runners right now.

Red Sox and Yankees are out of the running.

I've heard Dodgers are leading that bidding. Florida wants Kemp, Kershaw and LaRoche though, which is an insane amount.

[Boondock Saint]

Lowell :love:

[FakeLaser]

Greg Maddux and the Padres agreed to a 1 year $10 million deal.

[MVP]

Mike F'n Lowell :cool:

[YOUR Hero]

I think the Angels got the better of that Garland/Cabrera deal, tbh. Nothing at all wrong with what Cabrera did, I'd be happy to have him on my team, but pitching is more an asset. You can get a SS on the F/A pretty cheap, plus the Angels are pretty deep in IF's on their team and farm system.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Yeah that would be true if Garland was a good pitcher

[McLegend]

I really wish Lowell was more greedy.

[YOUR Hero]

Yeah that would be true if Garland was a good pitcher


yeah 2 18 win seasons before last season = is shitty. pitching over or @ 200+ innings a year the last 6 years = is shitty.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Dunno, would rather have a .300 hitter with a Gold Glove then a 4.3something ERA.

[MVP]

My argument against Garland being good is that his ERA was not great the past 2 seasons, his K's are always very low, and his BAA is around .270-90 range. He had the wins in 05 and 06, but I think 05 was a career year for him unfortunately.

[YOUR Hero]

Easier to get a .280 hitter than a 200 inning pitcher. IMO

[FakeLaser]

He's not just a .280 hitter, he's also a gold glove defender at a premium position.

I think they're going to push hard for Cabrera now. This trade makes Ervin Santana more expendable.

[SammyG]

Dodgers gonna get Cabrera, woo

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Rollins wins NL MVP

God dammit...</font>

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>I don't get it. Most of the writers said that Utley and Howard also could have won it.

If your team has 3 MVP candidates isn't it obvious none of them should win it?</font>

[ClockShot]

Your 2008 MLB draft line-up is as follows:

FIRST ROUND
1. Devil Rays
2. Pirates
3. Royals
4. Orioles
5. Giants
6. Marlins
7. Reds
8. White Sox
9. Nationals
10. Astros
11. Rangers
12. Athletics
13. Cardinals
14. Twins
15. Dodgers
16. Brewers
17. Blue Jays
18. Mets (from Braves for loss of Tom Glavine)
19. Cubs
20. Mariners
21. Tigers
22. Mets
23. Padres
24. Phillies
25. Rockies
26. Diamondbacks
27. Angels
28. Yankees
29. Indians
30. Red Sox

[rob11]

The Devil Rays with that first pick almost every year it seems have to eventually get better with all of that talent being put into their system.....or not.

[ClockShot]

Some news and notes.

Cleveland Indians sign free agent Japanese closer Masahide Kobayashi to a 6.25 million, two-year contract.

White Sox cut OF Scott Podsednik

The Mets might have solved their catcher problem. Trading away Pitcher Guillermo Mota for Johnny Estrada of the Brewers.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>I FUCKING LOVE YOU OMAR!!!!!!!!

Get that piece of shit Mota off the team</font>

[McLegend]

<font color=goldenrod>I don't get it. Most of the writers said that Utley and Howard also could have won it.

If your team has 3 MVP candidates isn't it obvious none of them should win it?</font>
Both of them missed significant time though.

[Skippord]

What the fuck?

The Rockies are getting the shaft here

[YOUR Hero]

fucking Tampa Bay, how many 1st round picks are they going to get?

[FakeLaser]

Jimmy Rollins is the NL MVP. I was expecting Holiday, but Rollins had an amazing season as well.

The Mets made a great deal in acquiring Johnny Estrada. All they gave up is Guillermo Mota. Amazing deal, they dump Mota and get a better catcher than Lo Duca and Torrealba. Plus it's a one year commitment. Big time win.

Brewers replaced Estrada with Jason Kendall. He's on the decline but still decentish.

Indians signed the Japanese closer Kobayashi. They're looking at him as a setup man for Joe Borowski, though I think either he, Betancourt or Rafael Perez will eventually take over closing duties. Either way, great pickup and makes the Indians bullpen even stronger.

[ClockShot]

Some late news and notes.

Phillies and a few other teams are interested in Kris Benson.

All signs point to Torii Hunter inking a deal with the Rangers within this week or next.

Cardinals reopened talks with David Eckstein. He's looking for something in the 4-year 36-40 mil. range.

[Skippord]

All signs point to Torii Hunter inking a deal with the Rangers within this week or next.


Or not

[YOUR Hero]

Yeah didn't he sign with the Angels?

[McLegend]

Yes he did. Doesn't Gary Matthews Jr play for the Angles though?

[McLegend]

O Gary Matthews can DH.

Another reason why the DH is awsome

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>White Sox sign Linebrink to a 4-year, $19 million deal

lol stupid White Sox. I bet I could get a 4-year deal in this market</font>

[FakeLaser]

Matthews won't DH, he has a great glove. Garrett Anderson will probably DH and Matthews will move to left.

[McLegend]

Matthews won't DH, he has a great glove. Garrett Anderson will probably DH and Matthews will move to left.
That's still great

[MVP]

Yeah didn't he sign with the Angels?

Torii Hunter signed with the Angels for 5 years, $90 million. Way too much money for him if you ask me.

[SammyG]

Come on Dodgers get Cabrera.

[FakeLaser]

I think the Angels will get Cabrera. They have all the trade chips needed now that they have a pitching excess and a shitload of great young position players.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>As expected, Johan declined the 5-year, $93 million extension and then said he wanted $126 million instead...which is the exact same amount Barry Zito got.

Good lord.</font>

[ClockShot]

The Royals were in on the Torii Hunter sweepstakes. But since they didn't win, their top target right now is Jose Guillen.

Royals also have a deal all squared away for Japanese pitcher Yasuhiko Yabuta. A 2-year 5-6 mil. deal with a club option for 2010.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Ken Rosenthal of FOXSports.com, citing a ‘major-league source,’ reports A’s LHP Joe Kennedy died Friday morning at his home in Florida.

According to Rosenthal, the cause of death has not been determined.

The 28-year old left-hander was 43-61 with a 4.79 ERA in his seven-year career.

------

R.I.P Joe</font> :(

[FakeLaser]

RIP

[ClockShot]

R.I.P.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Francisco Cordero to the Reds: 4 years, $46 million</font>

[YOUR Hero]

RIP, Kennedy

[Supreme Olajuwon]

<font color=goldenrod>Francisco Cordero to the Reds: 4 years, $46 million</font>

wooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

[YOUR Hero]

Is that a done deal? I don't think it's a done deal yet.

/dashing Supreme's hopes

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>lol Yankee fans. On their message board they all speak like it is a definite that they'll get Santana, if not in 2008 then in 2009.

It's gonna take a 7 or 8 year deal worth at least $130 million to get Johan to sign right now. Any deal longer than 4 years for a pitcher scares the crap out of me...but for Johan I'd make an exception.</font>

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>What gets me is, everyone seems to be making the Twins out to be bad guys because they are demanding at least one established MLB star plus multiple top prospects. If you were the Twins and you were set to trade the best pitcher in baseball, why would you ask for anything less?</font>

[YOUR Hero]

If the players can get the most for themselves, the team should be able to as well.

[ClockShot]

Giants are gonna be shopping Benji Molina. Mets are interested. However they are letting Johnny Estrada get one foot in the door in the organization and may trade him for Benji. They want someone better behind the plate. But if they can't find anybody, Estrada gets the nod.

[YOUR Hero]

Benji is soooooooooo slow.

[FakeLaser]

Peter Gammons is reporting that the Twins will want Phil Hughes, Melky Cabrera and Austin Jackson in a package for Johan Santana.

I dunno mannnnnnnn. I don't know if I want to trade Hughes. Perhaps we can swing some sort of deal with Ian Kennedy and someone else.

[YOUR Hero]

O,FFS

[ClockShot]

While still in negotiating the fine details, Yankees and A-Rod have agreed to a $30 mil. marketing deal. Here's what has been revealed right now.

$6 mil. for tying Mays', Ruth's, Aaron's, and Barry Bonds' #762 Home Run records.

Addtional $6 mil. if he ends up passing Bonds in the end.

Other stuff is still being worked out in it.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>I don't see the Twins going for that deal...they are gonna want Cano on top of it.

I really think Johan is gonna remain a Twin until sometime in July. They have Liriano coming back and a chance to contend in 2008. If they are out of it (or at least a longshot) by July, then they'll deal him.

I'd like to see the Mets send over Milledge, Heilman, and Mulvey for Dan Haren (who is ridiculously affordable for the next 3 years)...then make a run at Santana in the offseason (I see him hitting the FA market no matter what)</font>

[YOUR Hero]

I think that ARod bonus stuff is really telling. It's all out personal bonuses based solely on HRs, not about winning championships,etc. Like they think him passing Mays is going to be a big thing to 'America'. They'll try to market it as such, but I really don't think it's going to be a big revenue stream for them. Start winning some championships and playing the game hard.

[Hanso Amore]

I think that ARod bonus stuff is really telling. It's all out personal bonuses based solely on HRs, not about winning championships,etc. Like they think him passing Mays is going to be a big thing to 'America'. They'll try to market it as such, but I really don't think it's going to be a big revenue stream for them. Start winning some championships and playing the game hard.

The only reason the giants didnt shit can Bonds was for the HR record. That chase will bring in 10 tiems that 30 million in ad revenue and ticket sales. I saw an article about how much money was made off bonds, let me see if I can find it. It was fucking crazy how much TV money they make off these events.

[Dragon]

Peter Gammons is reporting that the Twins will want Phil Hughes, Melky Cabrera and Austin Jackson in a package for Johan Santana.

I dunno mannnnnnnn. I don't know if I want to trade Hughes. Perhaps we can swing some sort of deal with Ian Kennedy and someone else.

Yeah, pretty much with you on Hughes. Looking forward to seeing him at full strength for a full season. After the injuries he never really got the velocity back up to where he usually was. I assume he'll be back 100% next year.

Trading for Santana might seem like an obvious choice but still. Hughes is 7 years younger. I really do hope the Yankees put Kennedy, Melky, Tabata and Horne or somebody in a package for Santana and don't include Hughes. If they can't get it without Hughes then move on I'd say.

[YOUR Hero]

The only reason the giants didnt shit can Bonds was for the HR record. That chase will bring in 10 tiems that 30 million in ad revenue and ticket sales. I saw an article about how much money was made off bonds, let me see if I can find it. It was fucking crazy how much TV money they make off these events.

Breaking The record again, so relatively soon won't have the same effect. That's my onion anyway. Yes, I said onion.

[FakeLaser]

Some news from Rotoworld

Cubs agreed to terms with RHP Kerry Wood on a one-year contract.

The Cubs didn't disclose the value of the deal, but it's been reported as $4 million. For the second year in a row, the 30-year-old Wood opted to stay with the Cubs despite promises of more interesting offers elsewhere. In return, the Cubs figure to give him the first shot at taking over their closer's role.

Free agent Mike Piazza reportedly will consider going to Japan if he can't land a guaranteed deal in the U.S.

Barry Bonds' apparent removal from the market would seem to help Piazza's chances of landing a DH job, but no one seems interested so far. Perhaps that will begin to change next month.

[weather vane]

lol Yankees

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

lol A-Rod's contract

[ClockShot]

Your 2008 Hall of Fame ballot. Let the debating begin.

• Brady Anderson
• Harold Baines
• Rod Beck
• Bert Blyleven
• Dave Concepcion
• Andre Dawson
• Shawon Dunston
• Chuck Finley
• Travis Fryman
• Rich "Goose" Gossage
• Tommy John
• David Justice
• Chuck Knoblauch
• Don Mattingly
• Mark McGwire
• Jack Morris
• Dale Murphy
• Robb Nen
• Dave Parker
• Tim Raines
• Jim Rice
• Jose Rijo
• Lee Smith
• Todd Stottlemyre
• Alan Trammell

[SammyG]

Marks out for David Justice.

[Loose Cannon]

Mattingly will never make it :(

[ClockShot]

Mattingly will never make it :(

Maybe in a few years he might.

Goose Gossage will definately get it this time around. He missedout by 21 votes last year.

[YOUR Hero]

Wonder if McGwire will make it this year.

[Hanso Amore]

Mattingly will never make it :(

he is one of the top 3 guys on hat weak ballot...maybe

[OssMan]

Goose Gossage :cool:
Chock Knaublauch :lol:
Bert Blyleven :cool:
Rod Beck :wtf:
HAROLD BAINES :love:

[ClockShot]

Goose Gossage :cool:
Chock Knaublauch :lol:
Bert Blyleven :cool:
Rod Beck :wtf:
HAROLD BAINES :love:

Beck gets waived on the 5-year rule because he died.

[OssMan]

Beck gets waived on the 5-year rule because he died.
seems he is only on the ballot only because he died, his numbers are above average but def not HOF.

[YOUR Hero]

Hall of medicore.

[MVP]

I think this is Jim Rice's last year on the ballot. :-\

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Goose Gossage maybe, other than that I dunno

lol Brady Anderson

[Supreme Olajuwon]

I would absolutely vote for Blyleven, Dawson, Gossage, McGwire, and Parker. Concepcion, Murphy, Rice, and Smith should get consideration too.

[FakeLaser]

Really weak class.

I don't understand how Blyleven isn't in. 287 wins, 3.31 ERA, 5th in career strikeouts.

I like Blyleven and Gossage to get in. Dawson is borderline for me. I think Lee Smith should be in but I don't know if he'll get in. I think it's too soon for McGwire.

[Loose Cannon]

Rice should of been in a long time ago. Compare his numbers to all the other left fielders in the HOF and he's right there. I don't understand what they are waiting for

[Vastardikai]

Dale Murphy was one of the bright spots for the Braves during the Rotten years.

Tommy John, if for nothing else, because of the surgery named after him.

[FakeLaser]

I'm not sold on Rice at all. His numbers just aren't very impressive.

.298, 382 HR, 2452 H, barely slugged over .500 (.502). He does have one MVP. He was a solid hitter but nothing really stands out. It's not like he has a really high batting average, a lot of home runs a lot of stolen bases or a particularly good glove (no gold gloves, also, weak defensive position). He was a really good player who had a lot of really good seasons but definitely not HOF worthy in my book.

He's similar to Don Mattingly. Great player, had a few really good years, but in the end the numbers just don't add up.

[YOUR Hero]

The Hawk needs to be in there. :'(

[ClockShot]

Yankees and Twins are really getting serious about Santana now. It's actually a news bit now.

[Dragon]

Yankees and Twins are really getting serious about Santana now. It's actually a news bit now.

I think its only news because Hank decided to talk about it. He seems to talk about whats going on every day within the Yankees. Definitely has to be different for Cashman, who usually doesn't let anything out during free agency/trades.

[FakeLaser]

I have a feeling we've seen the last of Phil Hughes as a Yankee.

[Dragon]

Yeah, everything I've seen does have Hughes in a deal. Still don't like giving him up though. I'm kind of torn on getting Santana because of that.

[FakeLaser]

I really don't want to give up Hughes but if you really think about it, you're trading a guy who might be an ace for a guy who is arguably the best pitcher in baseball and is still 28 years old. We've been burned by pitching acquisitions in the past, but this is a special case. It gives us a big game pitcher, something we sincerely lack. If Pettitte returns, we'll be really, really tough to beat in the playoffs, especially a short series, which is where we've failed these past few years. I wouldn't want to face Santana, Pettitte and Wang in a short series.

If we get Santana and Pettitte returns, I can see the Yankees keeping Joba in the setup role for another year until Mussina peaces out. Santana/Wang/Pettitte/Kennedy/Mussina is pretty solid, and if we keep Joba in the pen in the 8th with Vizcaino in the 7th and Rivera in the 9th we'll be pretty fucking hard to beat.

[Dragon]

I dunno though. Just getting screwed by pretty much every big pitcher trade or signing the past couple years makes me worry. Yeah, we haven't gotten anybody like Santana in that time but still. Also, the 7 year age difference between Hughes and Santana is pretty huge. I dunno, the deal makes sense but I just don't know if I would do it. I would offer Kennedy, Tabata, Melky and Horne and walk away if something like that doesn't work. I could honestly see Santana not getting traded at all this offseason so there still is a chance he could get to free agency.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

I really want to keep Hughes. I think we could cut a deal without giving up Hughes , Cano or Joba. I would be willing to trade anybody else on the Yankees aside from those 3. Do you think Kennedy/Betences/Melky/Horne might be able to get it done?

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>IMO, despite what the reports say, the Twins are gonna want 2 of Joba/Kennedy/Hughes UNLESS Cano is included.</font>

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>To add to that, I've heard a lot about the Twins trading Matt Garza to the Rays for Delmon Young. If they do that they will probably keep Santana and see where they stand in July.</font>

[Hardkore Kidd J]

IMO, despite what the reports say, the Twins are gonna want 2 of Joba/Kennedy/Hughes UNLESS Cano is included.


Then we're better off without him. Joba Cano and Hughes are to risky to lose.

[Dragon]

I don't think their is any way that the Twins expect to get 2 of those guys though. They might want them but they really can't be expecting that.

What I've heard is one of the big three pitchers, Melky and probably one of the big outfield prospects

[FakeLaser]

Hughes/Melky/Jackson seems to be the popular rumor.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

Hughes/Melky/Jackson seems to be the popular rumor.

No way! One of our best prospects and both are young Center Fielders? Santana should fuck off to another team if that's what they want. Hopefully the Yankees aren't dumb enough to pull the trigger on this.

[FakeLaser]

I'd rather they took Tabata than Jackson. Tabata is good and all but he's so young. We'll probably need an OF in a year or two with Abreu's extension expiring and Damon's contract up in another year. Also, Matsui should not be an outfielder.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

Okay quick question If Boston comes right out ands says "All right we'll give you Ellsberry/Buchholz/Lester" Would you guys panic and try to counter with a Hughes package trade?

[MVP]

I will cry if Theo offers those 3 players for Santana. That is as damaging as Joba/Hughes/Cano. Good thing that's just an example.

[SammyG]

Yeah, Santana is not worth those 3 at all.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Read something on ESPN saying the Twins aren't exactly thrilled with Melky Cabrera and that they would prefer Carlos Gomez out in center field (they feel they are relatively safe with pitching but need a good CF). That combined with the Mets' willingness to trade more top prospects might make the Mets the frontrunners to this point.

Holy shit. If the Mets could grab Santana and still keep Milledge it would be fucking amazing. I'd gladly part ways with Gomez and two of Pelfrey/Humber/Mulvey tbh</font>

[FakeLaser]

I think they are saying that because they're going to try and get Cano, which is not going to happen.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>I dunno, I think the Twins know they aren't getting Cano or Joba from the Yanks nor will they get Wright or Reyes from the Mets.

I also wouldn't underestimate that the Twins might want to get Santana out of the AL.

Twins also are interested in Fernando Martinez. I think the kid will be great but he JUST turned 19 last month and is unlikely to reach the big leagues until 2009...I'd throw him in if needed.</font>

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Mets get RHP Brian Stokes from the Rays for cash......7.07 ERA last year :| Meh, probably won't even make the team.

Anyway the Twins are reportedly on the verge of getting Delmon.....which leads me to believe that Santana is going nowhere until the deadline UNLESS you throw in a Cano or Reyes</font>

[VonErichLives]

Every deal I've heard with the Sox for Santana involves Buchholz which I'm ok with.

The word is they want Ellsbury, I don't part with him.... he's on my can't touch list.

Buchholz, Lester, Crisp and some AAA prospect I'm ok with...

or maybe something with Youke... yeah, he was gold glove and put up decent numbers, but he doesn't make much and could switch back to 3B which the Twins need... and if it means getting the lefty ace in Santana I'd do it.

[Dragon]

Not really understanding the Twins dealing Garza. I can't see them getting rid of Garza and Santana. Anyway, if that deal goes through I'd guess Santana's price also went up trade-wise. I can definitely see them just hanging on to Santana until next season if this is the case.

[Dragon]

I guess that pretty much means Hughes is a definite in any discussions.

Also, the Rays would have a pretty decent and young front part of the rotation with Kazmir, Shields and Garza if this deal happens.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Mets also discussing a deal with the O's to get Erik Bedard and Ramon Hernandez in case Santana talks don't work out.</font>

[FakeLaser]

I guess that pretty much means Hughes is a definite in any discussions.

Also, the Rays would have a pretty decent and young front part of the rotation with Kazmir, Shields and Garza if this deal happens.
All they need is a closer, a setup man and the rest of a bullpen and they'll be set!

[FakeLaser]

Almost official now:

The Twins are close to landing Delmon Young from the Devil Rays in a six-player deal that would send Matt Garza, Jason Bartlett and Juan Rincon to Tampa Bay.

If that's true, then wow, great deal for the Rays. Rincon sucked last year but he's better than any other arm they've got out there by far. Bartlett isn't a bad IF and Garza gives them a strong front end.

[FakeLaser]

ESPN's Buster Olney reports that the Rays and free agent Troy Percival are working on a deal.

Well, that post I made about 15 minutes ago now looks kind of dumb. Percival will probably close, with Al Reyes in the 8th and Rincon working the 7th. Chad Orvella and Dan Wheeler will probably round out the pen with another arm or two, and suddenly the Rays look pretty good. Percival and Rincon could both turn out to be busts but I like this move a lot for the Rays.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Just to add my 2 cents in, I don't see the Red Sox trading for Santana...They've already landed an ace pitcher for a star caliber young positional player (Hanley Rameriz) so I can't see them giving up Elllsbury. (Who would definitely need to be included)

[Hanso Amore]

I dont think that the D rays should part with young fo so little. I mean, garza is ok, barlett is HORRIBLE. Young is a potential 100 rbi 30 hr playr with the best arm of anyright fielder.

[FakeLaser]

Young also has 0 plate discipline and the Rays have a plethora of young outfield bats. They need pitching. I think it was a great move for the Rays.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

<font color=goldenrod>Mets also discussing a deal with the O's to get Erik Bedard and Ramon Hernandez in case Santana talks don't work out.</font>
Really? Damn that'd be good for the Mets

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Yeah, there's 3 guys...I really want the Mets to get one of them: Santana, Haren, or Bedard. I guess Blanton could be there too...but I'd prefer Haren.

Plus there's still the chance that they are gonna sign Carlos Silva. Something like Bedard-Pedro-Maine-Perez-Silva is a great improvement over last year.

Hell who knows, if the Twins hang onto Johan through 2008 the Mets could make a run at him for 2009 once guys like Pedro and Delgado are off the books.</font>

[YOUR Hero]

Delmon Young replaces Torii, they save money, they *should* be able to swing an extention for Santana. Unless Santana simply doesn't wish to play there anymore, I see them getting him re-signed. Even if it's a short 2 year 50 million deal to make a run at things with the like of Liriano coming back. If I were the Twins, I'd of course want to lock him up for longer/good, but maybe entice him with something like that. U-NO

[Dragon]

I don't think there's any way Santana accepts a 2-year deal though. I could see them holding on to Santana until the trade deadline though.

[ClockShot]

A few Yankee rumors and my say on the Johan Santana deal.

The asking price of the Twins right now is "A major league star and three top prospects, including one pitcher."

Twins wanted Melky Cabrera, two prospects (one of them being Austin Jackson), and one of "The Big 3" pitchers.

Also going around was Robinson Cano's name. A japanese newspaper reported Hideki Matsui being mentioned.

Twins don't want Chien-Ming Wang.

Well I see it as this. Out of the big 3 pitchers, I would surrender Ian Kennedy. I see him as the weaker of the three. A coin flip would have to be made on Hideki Matsui. He does start out slow, but he's able to wake up and hit dingers every few days.

I don't know about you everyone else here. But I'd send them over two of either Farnsworth/DeSalvo/Igawa/Nieves. As I mentioned earlier on around the trade deadline, we were ready to push the button on Igawa to the Padres, but the Yankees are gonna give him another shot. See game 3 of the season against the Red Sox for DeSalvo.

Keep Wang around. He's as economic as they come. If he can get over his fear of starting on the road, tune up his sinker, and maybe learn another pitch, he may have a shot at getting Cy Young. Only thing that held him back was the ALDS disaster.

However, since the Twins seem to be this year's Marlins, other options if this fails could be asking about Carlos Silva, and Joe Nathan might be expendable if the Twins lose both their top arms.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>WFAN just reported the Mets are about to offer Carlos Gomez, Deolis Guerra and Kevin Mulvey for Dan Haren and Kiko Calero.

---

I have no doubt Beane is gonna ask for more...but I'd love this deal. Guerra looks like he could be the man, only 18 and throwing 95 MPH...but that just spells "arm trouble"</font>

[FakeLaser]

That would be a great deal for the Mets. Haren will fucking tear it up in the NL.

[FakeLaser]

A few Yankee rumors and my say on the Johan Santana deal.

The asking price of the Twins right now is "A major league star and three top prospects, including one pitcher."

Twins wanted Melky Cabrera, two prospects (one of them being Austin Jackson), and one of "The Big 3" pitchers.

Also going around was Robinson Cano's name. A japanese newspaper reported Hideki Matsui being mentioned.

Twins don't want Chien-Ming Wang.

Well I see it as this. Out of the big 3 pitchers, I would surrender Ian Kennedy. I see him as the weaker of the three. A coin flip would have to be made on Hideki Matsui. He does start out slow, but he's able to wake up and hit dingers every few days.

I don't know about you everyone else here. But I'd send them over two of either Farnsworth/DeSalvo/Igawa/Nieves. As I mentioned earlier on around the trade deadline, we were ready to push the button on Igawa to the Padres, but the Yankees are gonna give him another shot. See game 3 of the season against the Red Sox for DeSalvo.

Keep Wang around. He's as economic as they come. If he can get over his fear of starting on the road, tune up his sinker, and maybe learn another pitch, he may have a shot at getting Cy Young. Only thing that held him back was the ALDS disaster.

However, since the Twins seem to be this year's Marlins, other options if this fails could be asking about Carlos Silva, and Joe Nathan might be expendable if the Twins lose both their top arms.
You're living in a dream world dude. If you think the Twins are gonna take Matsui or we'll give him up you're crazy. You're even crazier if you think they'd want Farnsworth, DeSalvo, Igawa or Nieves. Farnsworth COULD be good, but he isn't. DeSalvo is not a highly rated prospect. Igawa is a bust who is a #5 starter AT BEST and Nieves is probably the worst hitting catcher in major league baseball. He was hitless spanning THREE SEASONS. This is a deal for the top pitcher in Major League Baseball. They're going to want some serious trade chips. I'm talking Phil Hughes, Melky Cabrera and Austin Jackson.

Wang will never win a Cy Young. He doesn't K enough. I like him but he has shown that he isn't really a big game pitcher. Perhaps it was a fluke this year but I don't think so. Also, he's too one dimensional. He needs to learn to blow people away every now and then. He needs another pitch. His sinker his great but when it's off, forget about it. He's done. He's a good pitcher but he's not a true ace.

[Dragon]

Wang needs to bring his slider into the game more. He did it every now and then and he dominated people. I remember one game where he used the slider as his out pitch against the Sox and he was killing them. He came up through the system with the slider as his best pitch anyway. Nowadays if his sinker isn't sinking much or even if its moving too much he gets knocked around pretty bad. Just like against Cleveland; hopefully they get him working on that this season.

And after that Twins trade I really think the Yankees chances in getting Santana may have dropped. They got a center fielder in the deal which may not make Melky that much more appealing to them. And Melky was a pretty huge part of that deal if it were ever to happen. I could definitely see the Twins asking for too much for Santana now and not trading him at all.

[Dragon]

Also, if Melky is dealt I really do worry about what the Yankees will do with a vacant CF spot. Damon shouldn't even be considered. Matsui in left and Damon in center would be a catastrophe again.

They will probably go hard after Rowand or Jones and sign them to massive contracts, which would probably be even worse. I really hope they stick someone like Gardner out there and let him play. All he needs to do is play good defense and not be a complete waste of a lineup spot. Its not like Melky has some monster offensive stats or anything anyway.

[FakeLaser]

Also, if Melky is dealt I really do worry about what the Yankees will do with a vacant CF spot. Damon shouldn't even be considered. Matsui in left and Damon in center would be a catastrophe again.

They will probably go hard after Rowand or Jones and sign them to massive contracts, which would probably be even worse. I really hope they stick someone like Gardner out there and let him play. All he needs to do is play good defense and not be a complete waste of a lineup spot. Its not like Melky has some monster offensive stats or anything anyway.
All I keep hearing is Rowand will be signed by the end of the week so we'd probably be left with Andruw Jones.

[VonErichLives]

<font color=goldenrod>WFAN just reported the Mets are about to offer Carlos Gomez, Deolis Guerra and Kevin Mulvey for Dan Haren and Kiko Calero.

---

I have no doubt Beane is gonna ask for more...but I'd love this deal. Guerra looks like he could be the man, only 18 and throwing 95 MPH...but that just spells "arm trouble"</font>

is it me or does every good pitcher that leaves oakland seem to do crap (or not as good) elsewhere?

[Evil Vito]

is it me or does every good pitcher that leaves oakland seem to do crap (or not as good) elsewhere?

<font color=goldenrod>I dunno, it varies. Mulder was great his first year out then crap then injured. Hudson was great then had a down year then bounced back. The only guy who really sucked right away was Zito, who probably stopped caring after netting himself job security for 7 years and a guaranteed $126 million.

Anyway, I think Haren would work very well with the Mets and Calero would be a great bullpen addition as well (last year being his only bad year really).

I still think the proposed trade is too good to be true and Beane is gonna try to rape us as always and cancel the trade if he doesn't.</font> :-\

[ClockShot]

And another player gets caught.

Former Colorado Rockies pitcher Dan Serafini suspended 50 games for testing positive for a performance enhancing drug.

[Skippord]

He pitched in like 1 game

[FakeLaser]

More ish from Rotoworld:

According to the New York Daily News, there's "speculation in MLB circles" that the Mets are considering parting with Jose Reyes in a potential trade for Johan Santana.

Minnesota traded away its starting shortstop Wednesday, sending Jason Bartlett to Tampa Bay. However, previous reports have suggested that the Mets aren't willing to trade Reyes, David Wright or Carlos Beltran. If a deal for Santana can't be worked out, the newspaper speculates that the Mets will pursue Erik Bedard, Dan Haren or Dontrelle Willis.
The popular rumor I keep hearing now is some outfield prospects and Humber for Haren, which would be a pretty solid deal for the Mets. Trading Reyes would be retarded, he's the Mets franchise player along with David Wright.

After failing in their bid to sign Mike Lowell, the Phillies are reportedly interested in Melvin Mora.

Mora said earlier this month that he'd waive his no-trade clause if the Orioles decided to deal him to a winning team. Mora is set to make $8 million in 2008 and 2009, with a club option for $8 million in 2010 that can be bought out for $1 million.
It's a good fit for the Phillies, IMO, and would give them one of the best infields in baseball, with Mora, Rollins, Utley and Howard.

The Pittsburgh Post Gazette reports that the Pirates are interested in Japanese reliever Kazuo Fukumori.

General manager Neal Huntington said Wednesday that the team is "in negotiations" with several relievers. A 31-year-old right-hander, Fukumori is coming off a poor season in Japan that saw him post a 4.75 ERA before having bone chips removed from his elbow.
Sounds like a great move :shifty:

Rockies general manager Dan O'Dowd said Wednesday that "it looks like Kaz Matsui is going to sign with somebody else."

The Rockies have several in-house candidates to potentially replace Matsui at second base, including Ian Stewart and Jayson Nix, but O'Dowd indicated that the team may bring in a veteran like Mark Loretta. "If we can create competition for those internal candidates, without blocking their path completely, we will certainly do that," O'Dowd said.
Dumb ass move for Matsui who can't seem to play decently anywhere except Coors field.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Dear God I hope they don't trade Reyes.....just go for Haren or Bedard if thats what its gonna take to get Johan.</font>

[Dragon]

Keep hearing different things about Santana. I really hope he gets dealt sometime next week during the meetings so that can be done with.

Some people say the Red Sox are the frontrunners with a deal of Lester, Crisp, Masterson and Lowrie (which I don't see as a great haul). I kind of see Lester on the same level as Kennedy (maybe a little higher potential) and Melky is better than Crisp. And then some people say the Sox are out of it because they won't offer Ellsbury.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>If the Red Sox get Santana:

Santana
Beckett
Schilling
Matsuzaka
Buchholz

Dear God</font> :|

[OssMan]

I'd consider not being a Mets fan if they traded Reyes or Wright :-\

[OssMan]

Also there's no way Minaya is trading away a Hispanic player

[FakeLaser]

The Mets will sign Livan Hernandez, I bet.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>I wouldn't mind Livan if and only if they can get an ace. In that case, Livan would basically be there to eat innings every 5 days</font>

[FakeLaser]

Yeah, I'm not saying it's a bad thing, just a feeling I have. He's not a good pitcher anymore really but he's a workhorse.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Apparently the team that trades for Johan is gonna have a 3-day window to negotiate an extension or else Johan will veto the trade.

Imagine how hard the Twins could put the Yanks' balls in a vice? "Yeah so Johan is negotiating with the Red Sox now...you've got 3 days to give us Hughes, Kennedy, and Cabrera or he's going to Boston</font>

[Dragon]

I don't think the Yankees would do that though. Even if he's close to signing with Boston I don't think they'd give up two of the three pitchers. Just too much especially when we don't even know if Pettitte is coming back. And honestly I don't see how a Kennedy, Melky, Tabata, Horne, throw in a shortstop etc... deal is any worse than Boston's proposed deal. Maybe its just me but I don't see Lester as anything more than a 3-5 starter, like Kennedy. And Melky and Crisp are very similar stats wise except Melky is making less, is younger and is under team control.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Pretty sure I just heard that Billy Beane, as expected, declined the offer from the Mets. Rumor has it he's gonna wait until Santana is gone so that he can further up the costs.

I'd be shocked if the Mets and A's actually made a deal. Beane has dangled so many players in the Mets' face over the years without actually going through with a trade, from Damon to Hudson to Zito.</font>

[MVP]

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/extras/thebuzz/

Charlie Walters of St. Paul Pioneer Press claims the Sox are the frontrunners for Santana at the moment. This is the pending offer:

Red Sox get
Johan Santana

Twins get
Jon Lester
Coco Crisp
Jed Lowrie
Justin Masterson