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Old 10-25-2009, 05:46 PM   #201
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Rob, i dont know if that was directed at me or not, so let me just be clear that i'm not accusing Machida or anyone in particular of anything. i'm just saying that it seems kinda suspicious that such a one-sided fight would have been scored that way. not saying that it's the first time it's happened, but it is the first time i've seen anything that flagrant in a UFC title match.
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Old 10-25-2009, 05:50 PM   #202
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one thing's for sure now. the Machida Mistique has been broken. Shogun showed how to beat him (by forgetting about the head, basically). i wont speak for the MMA viewing public, but my perception now is that someone like Anderson Silva would crush Machida.
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Old 10-25-2009, 08:35 PM   #203
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what KW said.

I stand by GSP as #1 lb. for lb., though.
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Old 10-25-2009, 09:59 PM   #204
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DaveBrawl got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)DaveBrawl got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)DaveBrawl got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)DaveBrawl got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)DaveBrawl got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)DaveBrawl got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)DaveBrawl got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)DaveBrawl got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)DaveBrawl got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)DaveBrawl got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)DaveBrawl got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)DaveBrawl got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)
So we can all agree that Anderson Silva isn't scared of the latest flavor of the month this time either?
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Old 10-25-2009, 10:00 PM   #205
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I'm fine with that.
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Old 10-25-2009, 10:38 PM   #206
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[QUOTE=KillerWolf;2786845]
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Originally Posted by Reavant View Post



so, is it really naive of me just to consider the possibility that three experts who came up with such a flagrant, outrageous judgement may have been acting on behalf of someone's interest? possibly even their own? is it not possible?


when i said "money riding on Machida" i meant in a 4 to 1 favorite, gambling sense - not a time and investment sense.
YES! Yes it is naive on your part to think that because that would involve many different people to agree on it and that means it would be easier to proove foul play because the more people that are involved, the easier it is to get information. And I knew what you meant on the 4-1 on machida, but I guess you forgot that rigging a fight which has implications on that 4-1 betting lines IS A FEDERAL CRIME! and if theres ever any indication of foul play it will be investigated like a terrorist threat and they will be caught.
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Old 10-25-2009, 10:42 PM   #207
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Originally Posted by KillerWolf View Post
Rob, i dont know if that was directed at me or not, so let me just be clear that i'm not accusing Machida or anyone in particular of anything. i'm just saying that it seems kinda suspicious that such a one-sided fight would have been scored that way. not saying that it's the first time it's happened, but it is the first time i've seen anything that flagrant in a UFC title match.
Also if people wanted to make money, they make the decision for Shogun since the odds were so lop-sided against him. Since the judges have all the power in terms of deciding a fight, if they were to fix a fight, they would fix it in the way for shogun because they would make 4 TIMES the amount of what they bet you fucking retard.

It is clearly obvious that you do not think with common sense or have any idea how anything from fighting to betting works so it would be in your best interest to shut up about it because you sound like a stupid conspiracy theorist who sounds more and more ignorant with every post.
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Old 10-25-2009, 11:13 PM   #208
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Have to say I agree with everyone in here on the Shogun/Machida fight, well everyone except the conspiracy whackos lol. I personally had Shogun winning the fight overall with the more aggressive striking, and with the most damage done. But it wasn't a blowout like people are making it to be. A lot of rounds where really close, and I can see them being awarded in Machida's favor. That is why they always say don't leave it up to the judges though, because you never know how they will score something.

Either way a rematch is a must. I think that their next fight will be amazing, especially considering all the hype from the controversy, which is justifiable in my opinion.
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Old 10-25-2009, 11:36 PM   #209
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If they do a rematch, they have to do it on a card with lesnar on it or else noone will buy it.
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Old 10-25-2009, 11:51 PM   #210
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Shogun wins the 205lbs... 10-25-2009 10:35 PMKillerWolf who do you think you are calling me a retard and shit. try listening to what im trying to say. i'm assuming you only talk to people this way on these message boards, right? act like a person.

I just thought I should reply to this here too, Yes I would react the same way to anyone who would time after time say and repeat ignorant bull shit over and over. If you dont know how things work or what is going on at all, then leave your thoughts out of it.

Perhaps YOU should try listening to what you, yourself is saying. Then again perhaps there is a language barrier where I am trying to listen in english all the while you are speaking in Dumbass.
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Old 10-26-2009, 12:13 AM   #211
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[QUOTE=Reavant;2787692]

Quote:
Also if people wanted to make money, they make the decision for Shogun since the odds were so lop-sided against him.
yeah, i know that's where the long money would have been, but then, no one gave Shogun a chance. i'm not saying that the decision was rigged for the purpose of gambling. i'm not saying that they necessarilly had to have been rigged. im just saying that i find it very suspicious that three judges would render a decision that completely flies in the face of what EVERYONE saw. i've seen this kind of thing before in boxing, and i would say it was fair enough then to say that the decision was rigged (for the purpose of keeping a big-name fighter's credibility intact after losing a warm up match leading to a "big-money" match-up against another big-name opponent).

Quote:
Since the judges have all the power in terms of deciding a fight, if they were to fix a fight, they would fix it in the way for shogun because they would make 4 TIMES the amount of what they bet
obviously then, they didnt bet on Shogun. look, i know the gambling scenario is very unlikely - it's just a place to start. all i'm saying is THAT decision was beyond stupid or inept. BIASED, i think sounds a little more accurate.

Quote:
you fucking retard.
uh huh. so, that's how it's gonna be? i may have you confused with someone else, but arent you an amateur MMA fighter? got a couple of ameteur fights under your belt? that must make you a pretty bad dude relative to being on these forums, right? because you sure do sound like a little punk to me when you show such a lack of emotional control - and such anger. why? you dont agree with what i'm saying? so far as i can tell we can all only speculate. if you have some information that might convince me that there was no bias in what we can all agree was a flagrantly "wrong" decision, i'd like to hear it. but this: () aint gonna convince me.

Quote:
It is clearly obvious that you do not think with common sense or have any idea how anything from fighting to betting works so it would be in your best interest to shut up about it because you sound like a stupid conspiracy theorist who sounds more and more ignorant with every post.
clearly obvious is it? since common sense is something i apparently lack, i'll have to borrow some of yours. does your common sense tell you that three judges, who saw the same fight as you and me, were

A: profoundly blind and inept

or

B: biased

?
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Old 10-26-2009, 12:50 AM   #212
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Old 10-26-2009, 01:14 AM   #213
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Quote:
clearly obvious is it? since common sense is something i apparently lack, i'll have to borrow some of yours. does your common sense tell you that three judges, who saw the same fight as you and me, were

A: profoundly blind and inept

or

B: biased

?
just answer this question and we'll leave it at that. A or B ?
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Old 10-26-2009, 01:18 AM   #214
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Here we go, I'm about to watch it again.

Round One: Too close to call, as far as I'm concerned.

Round Two: Not one-sided at all, but I give Machida the edge in this one.

Round Three: I think Machida took this round, definitely.

Round Four: Shogun landed much more consistently, so I give him this one.

Round Five: Machida looked tired. Definitely a Shogun round.

Conclusion: Coin toss on the first round, for me, decides the winner. Excellent technical fight. I was very impressed with Machida's takedown defence, and knees. As for Shogun, his kicks looked like they wore Machida down.

You're free to ignore my opinion, since I've only been watching this sport for a year, but there it is.

I'll get out of here, before RP comes back.
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Old 10-26-2009, 01:19 AM   #215
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reavant View Post
I think shogun won but stop saying shit was fucking rigged cuz that means if shogun KOed machida then they would have still given the match to machida so stop that shit. judges are fucking retarded and they like to either side with the champion or the bigger name and in this fight id say that they went with both and ended up giving it to machida... thats how it fuckin is, it sucks, oh well. thats why you need to finish fights.
^ close fights go that way

Quote:
Originally Posted by KillerWolf View Post
but now this. this wasnt even close. personally, i think Shogun won every round. and i dont even like Shogun. my MMA fandom doesnt extend to Pride. i've only seen Shogun in the UFC. so to me, Shogun has just been some over-rated dude who has looked like shit since arriving in the UFC. of course, he looked much improved when he beat Chuck Liddell. and tonight he was the best in the world at 205 lbs, solving the Machida Enigma and anyone who says they aggree with tonights decision is just making themself look stupid.

why would Dana and the UFC fix a decision though? marketability maybe. it seemed that Machida was getting over with the fans, which was natural since he seemed basically unbeatable, and almost untouchable. Machida is a handsome dude, so i can see how he might draw more female fans. or maybe just the fact that if there had been a just decision tonight, no LHW champion would have successfully defended the LHW Title since Rampage Jackson, 3 champions ago. sounds a little paranoid and far feched? it probably is.
ummm whats your definition of a blow out then because the first three rounds were definitly close enough to go either way.... (you know they score by round right?)
clearly theres some bias but whatever, they turn in the score after each round not the end of the fight, so they dont score on momentum of the match, just on their feelings at the time they turn in the round cards... and seeing as how the judges side with champions/big names it shouldnt suprise you that maybe 1, 2, and 3 were close enough for them to throw them to machida (i too think its BS but thats how it is)

yes every reason is stupid and not thought out... moving on...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reavant View Post

UFC has NO say in what the judges do.

When a round is close the judges will side with the person who is either A. the champion (machida, sylvia vs arlovski 3) or B. the bigger name (couture over sylvia, forrest over rampage). They also remember past performances and I gaurantee you that they saw some of Shogun's past shit performances.

Lets not forget that these are people making judgement calls, not robots and decisions are not made via fan votes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KillerWolf View Post
you say that - and youre probably right. but, you saw the fight. i mean, there's just no fuckin way. which makes it hard not to consider things like the amount of money riding on Machida (the 4-1 favorite), just as an example.
Here YOU are making a judgement call on the fight just like the judges except your doing it looking back at the whole fight where as they turned their cards in after each round. then you try and bring up a new idea that if you thought through, you would realize is completely idiotic but i will explain that a little later
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reavant View Post


Do you realize how much money UFC dropped to get Shogun into the UFC??? They want him to do well to finally get a good return on their investment of him. If the UFC was fixing fights, they would give it to him so they could hype him and then make him even more marketable.
apparently you didnt read this or you dont "get" contracts or money or anything at all...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reavant View Post
Exactly... up until he KOed Thiago Silva, nobody liked to watch him.

I dont get it. You have all seen shit decisions before. How, by now can you be so ignorant towards how everything works?

The state athletic commissions appoint refs and judges, not the UFC. This is because if the UFC did appoint them, they could fix fights and THAT would be a FEDERAL CRIME.
^driving the point home...
Quote:
Originally Posted by KillerWolf View Post



i agreed with you about the Forrest/Rampage fight - that the judges leaned in favor of the guy who was more the most "over" guy in the UFC. i'm not some crazy conspiracy theorist. what i'm saying is we saw the fight. the action wasnt even close. so, is it really naive of me just to consider the possibility that three experts who came up with such a flagrant, outrageous judgement may have been acting on behalf of someone's interest? possibly even their own? is it not possible?


when i said "money riding on Machida" i meant in a 4 to 1 favorite, gambling sense - not a time and investment sense.
LOL at whats in red... oh and in terms of it "not being close" again YOU are simply making a judgment call... perhaps even the right one, but then again your going by the entire fight and seeing what happened in the 4th and 5th and compairing that to 123 and seeing how rua "might have" edged out those rounds, but in real time scoring the way the judges do and how they side with one fighter over the other it should not suprise you.
but here was my reply to this post just so you can see it again...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reavant View Post

YES! Yes it is naive on your part to think that because that would involve many different people to agree on it and that means it would be easier to proove foul play because the more people that are involved, the easier it is to get information. And I knew what you meant on the 4-1 on machida, but I guess you forgot that rigging a fight which has implications on that 4-1 betting lines IS A FEDERAL CRIME! and if theres ever any indication of foul play it will be investigated like a terrorist threat and they will be caught.
did you read this or did you see a giant block of text and just say 'fuck it'?



then this...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reavant View Post
Also if people wanted to make money, they make the decision for Shogun since the odds were so lop-sided against him. Since the judges have all the power in terms of deciding a fight, if they were to fix a fight, they would fix it in the way for shogun because they would make 4 TIMES the amount of what they bet you fucking retard.

It is clearly obvious that you do not think with common sense or have any idea how anything from fighting to betting works so it would be in your best interest to shut up about it because you sound like a stupid conspiracy theorist who sounds more and more ignorant with every post.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KillerWolf View Post


yeah, i know that's where the long money would have been, but then, no one gave Shogun a chance. i'm not saying that the decision was rigged for the purpose of gambling. [then why bring this up??????????] i'm not saying that they necessarilly had to have been rigged. im just saying that i find it very suspicious that three judges would render a decision that completely flies in the face of what EVERYONE saw. i've seen this kind of thing before in boxing, and i would say it was fair enough then to say that the decision was rigged (for the purpose of keeping a big-name fighter's credibility intact after losing a warm up match leading to a "big-money" match-up against another big-name opponent).
see thats how fixing a contest based on gambling lines work... you go with the long money. Not for the sake of just getting more money for yourself, but also taking all the money of the people who went, in this case, for machida.


umm who is the big money match that this was a warm up for? Rampage? Oh yea he retired... Rashad? Oh yea machida beat him... anderson silva? oh yea theyre friends and wont fight... wanderlei? oh yea he has lost 5 of the last 6 and is dropping to 185... chuck? oh yea he lost to rua and the closest thing to training has been dancing... do I need to keep going?

Quote:
Originally Posted by KillerWolf View Post
obviously then, they didnt bet on Shogun. look, i know the gambling scenario is very unlikely - it's just a place to start. all i'm saying is THAT decision was beyond stupid or inept. BIASED, i think sounds a little more accurate.
its very unlikely but a place to start? if its THAT unlikely then it has no ground to start on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KillerWolf View Post
uh huh. so, that's how it's gonna be? i may have you confused with someone else, but arent you an amateur MMA fighter? got a couple of ameteur fights under your belt? that must make you a pretty bad dude relative to being on these forums, right? because you sure do sound like a little punk to me when you show such a lack of emotional control - and such anger. why? you dont agree with what i'm saying? so far as i can tell we can all only speculate. if you have some information that might convince me that there was no bias in what we can all agree was a flagrantly "wrong" decision, i'd like to hear it. but this: () aint gonna convince me.
Outside of saying shogun deserved the fight, i dont agree with a single thing you have said. It pisses me off that you jump to wild speculation with out a single clear thought as to what you are trying to say. Think about this: If shogun KOed Machida... would machida still have won?

Quote:
Originally Posted by KillerWolf View Post
clearly obvious is it? since common sense is something i apparently lack, i'll have to borrow some of yours. does your common sense tell you that three judges, who saw the same fight as you and me, were

A: profoundly blind and inept

or

B: biased

?
being biased has NOTHING to do with 'fixing' a fight. but right there is the only time you brought up just bias. I have been saying throughout the entire thread that when a judge comes to a decision that their bias is involved. Ive already told you what the bias is of judges in a championship match. to answer your question.. B. biased... but everyone knows that. Is it bull shit? YES. did th right guy win the match? I dont think so.
Last edited by Reavant; 10-26-2009 at 01:23 AM.
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Old 10-26-2009, 01:23 AM   #216
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perhaps there is a language barrier where I am trying to listen in english all the while you are speaking in Dumbass.
pretty proud of that one are ya? yeeeeup, that's a good one. mind if i try and shoe horn that one in at work tomorrow?

in all seriousness though, i am interested to see how you answer that common sense A or B question - if you are so inclined.
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Old 10-26-2009, 01:25 AM   #217
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cant you read it? or do you need the translator?
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Old 10-26-2009, 01:25 AM   #218
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NoJabbaNoBogRoll View Post
Here we go, I'm about to watch it again.

Round One: Too close to call, as far as I'm concerned.

Round Two: Not one-sided at all, but I give Machida the edge in this one.

Round Three: I think Machida took this round, definitely.

Round Four: Shogun landed much more consistently, so I give him this one.

Round Five: Machida looked tired. Definitely a Shogun round.

Conclusion: Coin toss on the first round, for me, decides the winner. Excellent technical fight. I was very impressed with Machida's takedown defence, and knees. As for Shogun, his kicks looked like they wore Machida down.

You're free to ignore my opinion, since I've only been watching this sport for a year, but there it is.

I'll get out of here, before RP comes back.
How can you come to that opinion when Machida was hugely outstruck in every round and took the harder shots?

They said Machida never lost a round before this fight. After the 1st round, the whole press row said "Machida has now lost a round".
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Old 10-26-2009, 01:27 AM   #219
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whats funny though is your 'clever' question does nothing to prove any sort of point which again goes to show you complete lack of thinking
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Old 10-26-2009, 01:29 AM   #220
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Originally Posted by Rob View Post
How can you come to that opinion when Machida was hugely outstruck in every round and took the harder shots?

They said Machida never lost a round before this fight. After the 1st round, the whole press row said "Machida has now lost a round".
I agree with you but look at it from a judges point of view and knowing what you know about how judges score.
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Old 10-26-2009, 01:34 AM   #221
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I agree with you but look at it from a judges point of view and knowing what you know about how judges score.
I can't how a judge could score it. Especially since in person that close to the cage, the kicks sound 10 times worse.
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Old 10-26-2009, 01:36 AM   #222
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I've just seen some of the posts about me since I left.

Is Krispy obsessed with me much?

And I was disappointed in how much some of the regulars can't see jokes and great trolling.

Heyman could and he doesn't even post here. Because he rules.
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Old 10-26-2009, 01:36 AM   #223
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How can you come to that opinion when Machida was hugely outstruck in every round and took the harder shots?

They said Machida never lost a round before this fight. After the 1st round, the whole press row said "Machida has now lost a round".
I've seen the stats. Obviously, they say a lot more than my personal opinion.

The first time I watched it, I thought Shogun had won, clearly. When I watch it for a third time, perhaps I'll see something different, again.
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Old 10-26-2009, 01:47 AM   #224
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oh, i see, you did answer it. thanks. your answer was B, right? and no, that wasnt the only time i brought up bias.

Quote:
Outside of saying shogun deserved the fight, i dont agree with a single thing you have said. It pisses me off that you jump to wild speculation with out a single clear thought as to what you are trying to say. Think about this: If shogun KOed Machida... would machida still have won?
obviously not, but in 2004 if that European nobody had KO'ed DeLaHoya instead of only dominate him, he wouldnt have lost either. but since he didnt KO him, the decision went to DeLaHoya. if Matt Hammil would have KO'ed or submitted Bisping, he wouldnt have lost either, but he only dominated him, so the decision went to Bisping. in that case, i have a pretty good idea why the judges were biased. in this case, it's clear that they were, but i dont know why.

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umm who is the big money match that this was a warm up for? Rampage? Oh yea he retired... Rashad? Oh yea machida beat him... anderson silva? oh yea theyre friends and wont fight... wanderlei? oh yea he has lost 5 of the last 6 and is dropping to 185... chuck? oh yea he lost to rua and the closest thing to training has been dancing... do I need to keep going?
my point was that i've seen biased decisions before and this decision was clearly biased - not just inept.

look, i think we both agree that the judges' decision was biased. i am only speculating as to why. i think the first thing i said here is,"but why." you seem to be of the opinion that it was biased because judges are just cunts. all im saying is that a lot of crooked shit happens in boxing, and the UFC may not be immune to it. i just would have presumed that this was a conversation that could be had without people calling each other bitches and cunts.
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Old 10-26-2009, 02:10 AM   #225
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whats the criteria for a judge to decide a fight? punches/kicks/knees/elbows landed, effective punches/kicks/knees/elbows landed, what if its 'kind of' blocked but still 'sort of' hit? number of takedowns/attempts, octogon control (what is that though? staying in the center or effectivly circling the outside?), aggression (what if one guy is a counterstriker), grappling positions, top position, cardio shape.



Does anyone reading this think a person can actually make the perfect call on all this or is bias going to come into this whether its boxing or mma?

Im an actual fighter and I cant answer how the judges do it. I do understand that the champion goes into a fight with an automatic advantage along with a fighter that is more popular or has had plenty of great performances to leave impressions on the judges. Three areas that shogun was not covered by.
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Old 10-26-2009, 02:12 AM   #226
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obviously not, but in 2004 if that European nobody had KO'ed DeLaHoya instead of only dominate him, he wouldnt have lost either. but since he didnt KO him, the decision went to DeLaHoya. if Matt Hammil would have KO'ed or submitted Bisping, he wouldnt have lost either, but he only dominated him, so the decision went to Bisping. in that case, i have a pretty good idea why the judges were biased. in this case, it's clear that they were, but i dont know why.

my point was that i've seen biased decisions before and this decision was clearly biased - not just inept.
this is whats driving me crazy.... before you were talking about a fixed fight! bias is not the same. If machida/delahoya/bisbing were KOed, they would have still lost so there is no fix!
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Old 10-26-2009, 02:13 AM   #227
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You have a better arguement saying a fight like Serra/GSP 1 was a fix rather than a 5 round MMA war where anything can happen.
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Old 10-26-2009, 03:34 AM   #228
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Guys, I think we can all agree that Tito Ortiz has a really huge head.
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Old 10-26-2009, 03:50 AM   #229
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Here we go, I'm about to watch it again.

Round One: Too close to call, as far as I'm concerned.

Round Two: Not one-sided at all, but I give Machida the edge in this one.

Round Three: I think Machida took this round, definitely.

Round Four: Shogun landed much more consistently, so I give him this one.

Round Five: Machida looked tired. Definitely a Shogun round.

Conclusion: Coin toss on the first round, for me, decides the winner. Excellent technical fight. I was very impressed with Machida's takedown defence, and knees. As for Shogun, his kicks looked like they wore Machida down.

You're free to ignore my opinion, since I've only been watching this sport for a year, but there it is.

I'll get out of here, before RP comes back.
After re-watching the fight I completely agree with this assessment. Round one is really close, and I could give it to either man. Both had some big shots, Machida threw some flurries, and Shogun landed a sick body kick. Just too close to say either fighter definitely beat the other in that round .

On second viewing this fight is beautiful to watch, it really is a clash of styles in the octagon. Shogun's strategy to forget the head and go for the body was very effective. You could tell at some points through the fight Machida was surprised that he was taking some of those leg kicks and body blows. Very impressed with both guys, more so Shogun because he really hasn't been this impressive in the Octagon.
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Old 10-26-2009, 04:34 AM   #230
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this is whats driving me crazy.... before you were talking about a fixed fight! bias is not the same. If machida/delahoya/bisbing were KOed, they would have still lost so there is no fix!
first of all, stop letting it drive you crazy. find peace and solice in the fact that meant it in the most general way possible - meaning fixed = rigged = biased. not saying that the definitions are the same, but it's how i meant it. i understand that a "fix" generally means that someone takes a dive, but as broader term can mean unless there is a stoppage, so and so wins.

Quote:
You have a better arguement saying a fight like Serra/GSP 1 was a fix rather than a 5 round MMA war where anything can happen.
again, i get your point, but i meant fixed as a general term tantamount to biased.
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Old 10-26-2009, 05:20 AM   #231
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now for something that will really blow your mind. proving that i can at least say i am a big enough person in life that i dont need to cling to my opinions in order to save face as KillerWolf on TPWW let me say this: one poster stated that he intended to watch the fight with the sound off, so as not to be influenced by the commentary. i think we should all do this. i just did this. it's embarrassing to say, but not only was the fight not as one sided as it seemed watching it live, but i dont even have a really big problem with the three judges' decision. so to anyone who i may have called a half a fag earlier for saying that they could see where the judges are coming from, i now say that you either are a half a fag, just the way i called it; or you have an uncanny intuitiveness when it comes to calling the action in a fight, or you watched it live without being able to hear the commentary. i'll let you decide. and for anyone who thinks that i am now half a fag, i say watch the fight with the sound off and pay careful attention.

now i will speculate on why in what i now say was a close fight, i originally saw as such a one-sided rout of the champion.

1. rounds that are very close = a complete breakdown of the Machida Effect that we're used to seeing, and that was reflected in the commentary of Rogan and Goldberg.

2. scores are turned in at the end of each round (yes, something i was aware of, Reavant) but as a fan, it's hard not to look at who looked beat the fuck up, who appeared to be more gassed at the end, and in this case especially, who's game plan was completely derailed.

3. seeing the Machida gameplan derailed makes it look like he's losing the fight. the storyline of the commentary was that Machida was losing the fight. so it looked to me, and most everyone else that Machida clearly lost the fight.

4. when Machida was announced as the winner, i, like so many people was but one in a room full of people that, in perfect unison said "WHAT THE FUCK!?! THAT'S FUCKIN' BULLSHIT! not to mention the booing of the fans, the shock from Rogan and Dana White, the instant contraversy, this thread, the instant remach...

maybe a second viewing is all that it would have taken, but seeing the fight with the volume all the way down really gave a different perspective than the one that i originally had.
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Old 10-26-2009, 08:55 AM   #232
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Watched it without sound, my opinion hasn't changed. Shogun won
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Old 10-26-2009, 09:23 AM   #233
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Looks like Reavant's got some crayons.
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Old 10-26-2009, 09:38 AM   #234
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What a fantastic thread.
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Old 10-26-2009, 09:41 AM   #235
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Oh yeah, welcome back Rob
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Old 10-26-2009, 09:41 AM   #236
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yeah Rob, well done for bringing a ratings smash to the table
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Old 10-26-2009, 12:18 PM   #237
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Quote:
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first of all, stop letting it drive you crazy. find peace and solice in the fact that meant it in the most general way possible - meaning fixed = rigged = biased. not saying that the definitions are the same, but it's how i meant it. i understand that a "fix" generally means that someone takes a dive, but as broader term can mean unless there is a stoppage, so and so wins.



again, i get your point, but i meant fixed as a general term tantamount to biased.
thats like saying hi im dumb and im going to say stupid things so dont correct me or get annoyed when i dont get it because im dumb. I dont care how you mean it but fixed does not = biased ever it is not tantamount to biased at all.
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Old 10-26-2009, 12:21 PM   #238
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lol wtf. The one fight I do not see and all havoc breaks loose here.
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Old 10-26-2009, 02:47 PM   #239
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thats like saying hi im dumb and im going to say stupid things so dont correct me or get annoyed when i dont get it because im dumb. I dont care how you mean it but fixed does not = biased ever it is not tantamount to biased at all.
no it isnt.

it's like saying i can see how you thought one thing based on my choice of words, but rest assured, i meant something different.

christ, dude.
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Old 10-26-2009, 05:06 PM   #240
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Quote:
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Here we go, I'm about to watch it again.

Round One: Too close to call, as far as I'm concerned.

Round Two: Not one-sided at all, but I give Machida the edge in this one.

Round Three: I think Machida took this round, definitely.

Round Four: Shogun landed much more consistently, so I give him this one.

Round Five: Machida looked tired. Definitely a Shogun round.

Conclusion: Coin toss on the first round, for me, decides the winner. Excellent technical fight. I was very impressed with Machida's takedown defence, and knees. As for Shogun, his kicks looked like they wore Machida down.

You're free to ignore my opinion, since I've only been watching this sport for a year, but there it is.

I'll get out of here, before RP comes back.
Sounds like you didn't even watch the fight.
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