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Old 08-14-2008, 08:59 AM   #81
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Putting the mask on him does nothing. All it does is remask a guy for no reason. Taking it off "unleashed" his inner monster; exposed his evil. That made sense. Putting it on and hiding what we already know he looks like does....what, exactly?
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Old 08-14-2008, 09:36 AM   #82
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They could make the mask work. His inner demon wants to return him to the days he was still a monster (His debut) because that is when he was his best.

Something I just thought of going off what Afterlife said.

So we just ignore everything that maskes no sense. Kane Kidnapped Rey and has been tormenting him. Kane is now evil kane again, hurting people left andright. eventually someone is able to talk the Good kane's persona out again, and he will struggle to supress evil kane for awhile, until he remasks himself, since taking it off unleashed his inner demon, putting it back on controls it.

Obviously I am not the best writer, but something liek that could be very cool.
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Old 08-14-2008, 09:40 AM   #83
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Kane would then have sort of a 3 faces of Foley. 3 personalities.

Masked Kane- The innocent burn victim. Exacting revenge on the taker. Pre 2003
Unmasked Evil Kane- The cruel evil murderer Kane, who is the result of trauma and a life of abuse. 2003-Whenever he started being good again.
Unmasked Good Kane - The Kane we know today. Him trying to fit into society and be normal.

I wouldnt swap between them like Foley, but it could explain stuff. They really need to play off that Kane is a fucking loon, and there is alot going on in his head.
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Old 08-14-2008, 10:43 AM   #84
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Kane's polarity has been on the verge of a multiple personality break for a long time. I think it could work if it's kept to mild measures.
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Old 08-14-2008, 10:45 AM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noid View Post
So why hasn't the WWE reported the disappearance of Rey Mysterio? Has Kane been wearing it to the Mysterio dinner table?
If he's been at home training and finishing his recoup, who's to know? Besides, maybe Kane just busted in on him, smacked him around and took the damn mask. Rey's too embarassed to tell anyone and won't show up without it.

I'm not writing the story, I'm just giving options so you'll calm the hell down.
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Old 08-14-2008, 12:08 PM   #86
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Honestly, with the whole "alive or dead" thing, I was truly expecting Mankind's mask to come out of that bag, not Mysterio's. But I can def see him pulling out random masks. Los Conquistadors' masks, Charlie Haas's goofy mask, Aldo Montoya's jock strap...

All classic.
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Old 08-14-2008, 12:08 PM   #87
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Also, it's been shown that Mysterio wears more than one mask at a time, to give one to the fans, so I'm sure Rey can just go into his Mask Closet, turn on the lights, show hundreds of racks with thousands of masks, and pull another one out.
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Old 08-14-2008, 12:11 PM   #88
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What did Haas' mask look like?
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Old 08-14-2008, 06:00 PM   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Afterlife View Post
If he's been at home training and finishing his recoup, who's to know? Besides, maybe Kane just busted in on him, smacked him around and took the damn mask. Rey's too embarassed to tell anyone and won't show up without it.

I'm not writing the story, I'm just giving options so you'll calm the hell down.
Calm the hell down? Chill man, I'm not getting worked up. Just saying I can't see the WWE going in the route you are going with it. I know I fantasy book all the time, and I'm not saying your idea is bad, I'm just saying that you presenting it as a good outcome of where this storyline could be going is a little weird. The WWE is not going to unmask Rey Mysterio, simply because he sells too much merchandise with it. It also doesn't make sense in relation to how the WWE usually does their storylines. Simple and chronological, with the audience being present even when they shouldn't be.

If you meant us calming down as a collective regarding the general outrage this storyline seems to be heading, then I appreciate you waiting to see where it's going, which is what I think most of us have agreed to do, it's just that the storyline could have been handled much better. I mean, this Rey thing could turn out to be good. It's not the easiest way to make this good, though, and played off the expectations people had. The reason people had those expectations was because they wanted the WWE to go in that direction. There are times when playing against audience expectations can be good (when people are expecting shit, and you deliver awesomeness, for example). But when people want something, and you jerk them around, it's a bad way to play against expectations.

The reason people have reacted like this, is mainly because they are disappointed. If you go over this thread, you'll see a lot of people who say "Well, I was interested in where this is going." If it turns out awesome, more power to the WWE, but they've lost a lot of people they had with this angle, and they have no one to blame for that but themselves.

Besides, if Kane did unmask Mysterio, then why couldn't Rey put on one of his other fifty million masks?

You know I love you, Afterlife.
Last edited by Mr. Nerfect; 08-14-2008 at 06:10 PM.
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Old 08-14-2008, 06:08 PM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Afterlife View Post
Putting the mask on him does nothing. All it does is remask a guy for no reason. Taking it off "unleashed" his inner monster; exposed his evil. That made sense. Putting it on and hiding what we already know he looks like does....what, exactly?
Putting a mask on him revives a marketable image and nostalgic feelings of the Kane character. I'm not going to reverse myself on this. Yes, there is a feeling of the Big Red Machine that will always carry with Kane, but if you unmasked Jason Voorhees, and then he went back to the mask a number of years later, don't convince yourself that it wouldn't sell, even if there was a story and fictional "improvement" in the direction of the Voorhees character for removing the mask.

Taking it off unleashed a more psychotic and human Kane. It was revealed his scars were more mental than physical, and he became something more of a broken mind than a soulless machine. That was cool. But now Kane is sort of running dry again, and this is coming from an epic Kane mark.

If taking the mask off Kane can somehow make him better (in a kayfabe sense), then why can't putting the mask on him be given the same effect? For example, what if Kane dipped his face in a bucket of acid? That is a deeply psychotic act, and would probably horrify a lot of little kids in the audience, and create a new arc for Kane. Not just revert back to an old one. Why can't Kane miss the good old days when he used to block out pain, and wreck things like a well-oiled killing machine? Why can't a new mask bridge the gap between psychotic Kane and supernatural Kane?

Another position of putting Kane in a new costume, is that it would allow him to hide his physique. I like Kane, but he's not longer the tanned, ripped fiend he was under the mask. He's still a big guy, and strong as hell, but he's a lot less intimidating than he used to be, physically. A costumed Kane could help hide that, and allow the imagination to fill in the blanks.

You seem to be under the assumption that Kane reverting to the mask has to be a step backwards, rather than a new path for Kane to follow.
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Old 08-14-2008, 06:09 PM   #91
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Also, Haas has a few masks. At least two. They were pretty much just generic luchadore things. One was red, and another was blue. Not sure if he had more.
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Old 08-14-2008, 09:24 PM   #92
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Expect both of those masks to turn up in Kane's creepy mask collection soon.
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Old 08-15-2008, 06:31 AM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noid View Post
Calm the hell down? Chill man, I'm not getting worked up. Just saying I can't see the WWE going in the route you are going with it. I know I fantasy book all the time, and I'm not saying your idea is bad, I'm just saying that you presenting it as a good outcome of where this storyline could be going is a little weird. The WWE is not going to unmask Rey Mysterio, simply because he sells too much merchandise with it. It also doesn't make sense in relation to how the WWE usually does their storylines. Simple and chronological, with the audience being present even when they shouldn't be.

If you meant us calming down as a collective regarding the general outrage this storyline seems to be heading, then I appreciate you waiting to see where it's going, which is what I think most of us have agreed to do, it's just that the storyline could have been handled much better. I mean, this Rey thing could turn out to be good. It's not the easiest way to make this good, though, and played off the expectations people had. The reason people had those expectations was because they wanted the WWE to go in that direction. There are times when playing against audience expectations can be good (when people are expecting shit, and you deliver awesomeness, for example). But when people want something, and you jerk them around, it's a bad way to play against expectations.

The reason people have reacted like this, is mainly because they are disappointed. If you go over this thread, you'll see a lot of people who say "Well, I was interested in where this is going." If it turns out awesome, more power to the WWE, but they've lost a lot of people they had with this angle, and they have no one to blame for that but themselves.

Besides, if Kane did unmask Mysterio, then why couldn't Rey put on one of his other fifty million masks?

You know I love you, Afterlife.
Here's one: Maybe Kane just swiped that damn mask. Maybe Kane was talking about Mysterio's career being dead because he's a physical wreck and hardly worth his name. Maybe it has nothing to do with unmasking him at all.

Also, the reason I'm seeing for people to be "uninterested" is because they were wrong about the contents of the bag. Which leads me to....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Noid View Post
Putting a mask on him revives a marketable image and nostalgic feelings of the Kane character. I'm not going to reverse myself on this. Yes, there is a feeling of the Big Red Machine that will always carry with Kane, but if you unmasked Jason Voorhees, and then he went back to the mask a number of years later, don't convince yourself that it wouldn't sell, even if there was a story and fictional "improvement" in the direction of the Voorhees character for removing the mask.

Taking it off unleashed a more psychotic and human Kane. It was revealed his scars were more mental than physical, and he became something more of a broken mind than a soulless machine. That was cool. But now Kane is sort of running dry again, and this is coming from an epic Kane mark.

If taking the mask off Kane can somehow make him better (in a kayfabe sense), then why can't putting the mask on him be given the same effect? For example, what if Kane dipped his face in a bucket of acid? That is a deeply psychotic act, and would probably horrify a lot of little kids in the audience, and create a new arc for Kane. Not just revert back to an old one. Why can't Kane miss the good old days when he used to block out pain, and wreck things like a well-oiled killing machine? Why can't a new mask bridge the gap between psychotic Kane and supernatural Kane?

Another position of putting Kane in a new costume, is that it would allow him to hide his physique. I like Kane, but he's not longer the tanned, ripped fiend he was under the mask. He's still a big guy, and strong as hell, but he's a lot less intimidating than he used to be, physically. A costumed Kane could help hide that, and allow the imagination to fill in the blanks.

You seem to be under the assumption that Kane reverting to the mask has to be a step backwards, rather than a new path for Kane to follow.
...The saddest part about it. You said it yourself, putting the mask on him would be "reverting" to the old shtick. Revertion is a step back. And the reason it's so sad is that everyone here must admit it's the only thing you can think of.

Kane has been knocked around so much that the only way the fans can figure to "move him forward" is to back track 5 years. As if, even after all this time, his character still teeters on a mask he doesn't even wear. Kane was an emphatic ECW champion; there is no reason his steam should blow out before he's in contention for the title on RAW, except that the writers are apparently as creative as at least our portion of the IWC.
Last edited by Afterlife; 08-15-2008 at 06:33 AM.
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Old 08-15-2008, 06:32 AM   #94
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Old 08-16-2008, 03:26 PM   #95
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I think the mask would be more than just swiping a mask to Mysterio in a storyline when considering the tradition of the mask for Mexican wrestlers (remember that whole thing in WCW that lasted FOREVER about Mysterio's mask). It could be the symbolism of having the mask of someone who "believes" in that whole traditional thing.

This is why I still think we may see an unmasked Rey (why not) in the future. A Filthy Animals revival would also be fun. Have Kane by one of them to start the stable or something.
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Old 08-16-2008, 03:37 PM   #96
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I think the mask would be more than just swiping a mask to Mysterio in a storyline when considering the tradition of the mask for Mexican wrestlers (remember that whole thing in WCW that lasted FOREVER about Mysterio's mask). It could be the symbolism of having the mask of someone who "believes" in that whole traditional thing.
Yeah, except Rey shat all over that tradition when he put the mask back on.

Not saying WWE wouldn't do that, but tradition went out long ago.

And while we're at it, why would Rey have to come out unmasked? He's had like 50 different masks. Does he throw them away after each match and buys a new one?
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Old 08-16-2008, 03:44 PM   #97
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Its the same mask, he just alters it to look different every time.
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Old 08-16-2008, 03:46 PM   #98
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WHAT IF IT'S A SWERVE AND KANE AND REY ARE COLLUDING TOGETHER AS HEELS AND KANE DOES COME BACK MASKED SOMEHOW AND REY COMES BACK A HEEL? EH?
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Old 08-16-2008, 03:48 PM   #99
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Yeah, except Rey shat all over that tradition when he put the mask back on.

Not saying WWE wouldn't do that, but tradition went out long ago.

And while we're at it, why would Rey have to come out unmasked? He's had like 50 different masks. Does he throw them away after each match and buys a new one?
I think it's not that he lost a mask, it's that someone ELSE was the one that STOLE a mask. Hence the symbolism of the whole thing. Rey could have masks in storage for sure, but the tradition is, as far as I remember it, is that part of the cred of a wrestler is symbolic within the mask (or something like that).

That and as someone else pointed out, it may be the current character of Mysterio that is "dead", and the mask is the most symbolic with the current Mysterio gimmick. Remember how the core ECW crowd shat all over Psycosis when he came out without a mask at the first ONS in 1995. They were ready to boo him out of the building because the mask is so symbolic to the character they remembered him as. The Rey unmasked thing didn't do THAT with too many people, though it might NOW for a few people who hang onto tradition.
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Old 08-16-2008, 03:48 PM   #100
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I hate dags.
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Old 08-16-2008, 03:52 PM   #101
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Next week he should pull out that ridiculous headdress thing that Rey wore at Wrestlemania Whatever.
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Old 08-16-2008, 10:22 PM   #102
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darkpower, don't you mean 2005? ECW didn't even do pay-per-views in 1995. :P
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Old 08-17-2008, 02:51 AM   #103
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HOLY SHIT! I JUST REALISED SOMETHING!!! SPOILERS IN BLACK!!! HIGHLIGHT TO READ!!!

I believe this is the first thread of mine to reach 100 replies.
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Old 08-17-2008, 01:00 PM   #104
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If Kane ever puts the mask back on, there should be a proper build up and a reason that makes sense.... not just "if Kane puts the mask on, he becomes even more of a monster than he already is". It's the whole "Mick Foley isn't a glorified broken-down jobber when he wears a different T-shirt" thing again.

Maybe if something tragic happened to him over a series of events that broke him down to a shadow of his former self, culminating in some horrific facial injury that put him on the shelf for a few months, and upon his return he is masked and badass again... that would be more understandable.
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Old 08-17-2008, 01:03 PM   #105
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But, again, if they were to do that and inevitably take it off again they'd need to explain the lack of real injury... Again.
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Old 08-17-2008, 02:10 PM   #106
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Which adds to the uselessness of putting it on.
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Old 08-17-2008, 02:19 PM   #107
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they could have him kill Mysterio, and don his mask which would give him luchador powers
Last edited by Savio; 08-17-2008 at 04:40 PM.
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Old 08-17-2008, 04:34 PM   #108
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OR... they could have him kill Mysterio, and don the mask.
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Old 08-17-2008, 04:53 PM   #109
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Kane could put the mask on his 6 foot dick and be like Johnny Knoxville's character in MIB2.
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Old 08-19-2008, 12:00 AM   #110
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*Ahem* I think I can say "I told ya so".
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Old 08-19-2008, 12:05 AM   #111
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Wait, so did they just completely ignore the angle this week? Don't see anything in the results.
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Old 08-19-2008, 12:25 AM   #112
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My guess, heel turn by the new music he has, i actually liked his new theme, a remixed/better version of his old theme when he wore his masked "Burned" was the title of his old theme
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Old 08-19-2008, 01:28 AM   #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xero Limit 126 View Post
Yeah, except Rey shat all over that tradition when he put the mask back on.

Not saying WWE wouldn't do that, but tradition went out long ago.

And while we're at it, why would Rey have to come out unmasked? He's had like 50 different masks. Does he throw them away after each match and buys a new one?
That's pretty much exactly my problem with it. I got pissed off when Rey came off an epic feud with Eddie Guerrero, and then suddenly became the only guy who loved him, judging by how he got pushed after Eddie's death. Rey suddenly becoming a champion of Mexican tradition would not sit well with me.

But Afterlife, you were sort of right. My hat's off to you. Now you can say that you are as smart as a WWE writer. Watch out, Freddie.

Seriously, though, it sounds like the WWE just scavenged to put something together out of this. Even though your idea was good, and the WWE seems to be doing something similar to it (without the unmasking Rey and Oscar stuff), I'm still finding it riddled with holes and played expectations that led nowhere but disappointment. I still think it's the WWE shocking for the sake of shocking, and then somehow needing to land it.

Also, putting Kane in a mask wouldn't necessarily be a reversion. You're into keeping your mind open. There are plenty of ways to get a mask on Kane, and it act as a step forward. New music, new costume, new mask and a new dominant streak with a story behind it all. There are plenty of ways they could do it.
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Old 08-19-2008, 01:46 AM   #114
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Fucking raw results in the headlines, are missing the entire Kane segment.
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Old 08-19-2008, 02:08 AM   #115
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He came out and said he beat up Rey in a parking lot 6 weekas ago. Rey is slim blah blah blah. His spirit is dead. Blah Blah Blah. I'm going to be Dominics pappie now. Blah Blah Blah. New theme music. Blah Blah Blah. Etc.
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Old 08-19-2008, 05:46 AM   #116
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I'd like to see Kane with new attire, by the way. His attire lacks fire, which has a pretty big significance with Kane.
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Old 08-19-2008, 06:58 AM   #117
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I now don't think the mask is really needed for Kane, anymore. I mean, before when I thought it was what he had in his bag that it was what he needed. But I liked what I saw of this new Kane. Keep going with this new deranged persona and theme music, and perhaps also give him new attire to fit his persona. Maybe cover him up again. At least give him a shirt.
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Old 08-19-2008, 07:07 AM   #118
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I'm liking this kane storyline/his new music, i think i prefer this over getting his old mask back. Gotta agree with afterlife on this one.
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Old 08-19-2008, 10:51 AM   #119
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Well, I am liking that they are going somewhere with Kane. I don't feel that he needs the mask back, specifically, but he could just use a stronger direction. The mask would accomplish this (it's like a wrestler turning face/heel, it just freshens them up), but this more psychopathic direction for Kane seems to be getting the job done.

I'd mark out for him killing Rey, that's all I'm going to add.
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Old 08-19-2008, 11:18 AM   #120
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Allow me to translate for those of you who cannot read more than one line of text per Noid post:

"Kane = good, no mask needed... could be used, but psycho-ness = greatness, Rey needs to die"
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