MLB 2010-2011 Off Season Thread

[YOUR Hero]

http://a323.yahoofs.com/ymg/ept_sports_mlb_experts__71/ept_sports_mlb_experts-963885496-1290611916.jpg?ymMDsIEDKq_R6HbD

[DaveWadding]

D-Backs aquire Zach Duke from the Pirates for a PTBNL.

Wasn't his best season. Maybe a change of venue will do.

He's going to get crushed at Chase Field. Mark my words.

Also, Mariano is worth what he's asking for (I heard 2 years 36 mil) and Jeter is not.

[Loose Cannon]

yea, Mariano I'm fine with. It's the Jeter thing that's ridiculous. And I understand it's just his agent trying to get as much as he can. Unfortunately, it's how it works. I am pretty sure they'll come to an agreement though

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>The media is blowing this way out of proportion. Jeter will not play anywhere else.</font>

[Big Fat Mike]

<font color=goldenrod>The media is blowing this way out of proportion. Jeter will not play anywhere else.</font>

Never thought I would see Andy Pettite in an Astros uniform.

[YOUR Hero]

Babe Ruth, Boston Braves

[McLegend]

I must Jeter going to The Red Sox would be hilarious.

[Droford]

Jeter wants 6 years 150 Million (http://www.sportingnews.com/mlb/feed/2010-10/yankees-offseason/story/derek-jeter-seeking-six-year-150-million-deal)according to the Sporting News

[Droford]

He's going to get crushed at Chase Field. Mark my words.

Also, Mariano is worth what he's asking for (I heard 2 years 36 mil) and Jeter is not.

Ok, I know that Rivera was one of the best closers but he's clearly not as dominant as he was even a couple years ago..but..how is a guy thats 4 years older than Jeter and might play the equivalent of 6 games total in IP (IP declining down to 60 in 2010) worth $18 million and Jeter isn't worth $25 million as an everyday player even with his declining offensive skills.

[ClockShot]

Jeter wants 6 years 150 Million (http://www.sportingnews.com/mlb/feed/2010-10/yankees-offseason/story/derek-jeter-seeking-six-year-150-million-deal)according to the Sporting News

Ain't happening.

[ClockShot]

Twins win the Tsuyoshi Nishioka sweepstakes with a $5.3 mil. bid.

They got 30 days to work out a deal.

[Dragon]

Ok, I know that Rivera was one of the best closers but he's clearly not as dominant as he was even a couple years ago..but..how is a guy thats 4 years older than Jeter and might play the equivalent of 6 games total in IP (IP declining down to 60 in 2010) worth $18 million and Jeter isn't worth $25 million as an everyday player even with his declining offensive skills.

Rivera hasn't really shown any signs of decline yet, his last 3 years have been some of the best of his career. And he's still one of if not the best closer in baseball still.

His highest ERA in the past 3 years was 1.80 and his highest WHIP was .90.

While I do agree that no closer in baseball, no matter how dominant is worth 18M, he has a much better case than Jeter to be the highest paid player at his position. Even though the Yankees would still be making Jeter the highest paid SS with their 15M offer.

Rivera's WAR last year was 3.0, Jeter's was 1.3. So even though Mariano only pitched 60 innings, he was more valuable than Jeter playing every day. Thats how terrible Jeter was.

Another thing is that other teams would probably pay Mariano decent money to sign him. Not 18M, but not terribly far off from that. Jeter isn't getting close to 15M (the Yanks offer), nevermind the 25M he's seeking.

[Triple Naitch]

Ok, I'm totally on the Yankees' side about Jeter now.

[ClockShot]

Dodgers sign Jon Garland to a 1-year, $5 mil. deal.

Kershaw, Kuroda, Billingsley, Lilly, and Garland. That's a solid rotation Donnie Baseball gets to work with.

[Aguakate]

Dodgers sign Jon Garland to a 1-year, $5 mil. deal.

Kershaw, Kuroda, Billingsley, Lilly, and Garland. That's a solid rotation Donnie Baseball gets to work with.

They gotta do something about that offense, though.

[Triple Naitch]

Bullpen's an even bigger problem.

[Droford]

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Felix "dont call me Cherry" Pie gets a bit upset because he's terrible and made a huge boneheaded mistake (what the hell was he doing so far off first with the winning run on 2nd in the bottom of the 11th?).

[SammyG]

Starting to like our rotation, but yeah. We need some offense. Bullpen help too, Broxton has been TERRIBLE. Would love to get Beltre back.

[Evil Vito]

Twins win the Tsuyoshi Nishioka sweepstakes with a $5.3 mil. bid.

They got 30 days to work out a deal.

<font color=goldenrod>Seems like a Kaz Matsui clone.</font>

[YOUR Hero]

Anyone else find it ironic that a guy who's won the gold glove last year in the toughest position, a guy who's fans defended his selection fervently, that boasted he'd won it 5 times since 2004 are now questioning his declining defensive skills as one of the main raesons as to why not to sign him for such a huge amount of money or years.

Talking about Jeter and Yankee fans, btw ;)

[Droford]

Seems like a Kaz Matsui clone.

Hope he doesnt tear his asshole

[Innovator]

Jeter getting overpayed at 3 years 45 million, sad thing is I don't see who the replacement would be if he left. Nunez? ugh.

[Aguakate]

I still don't see Jeter playing anywhere else. I believe even HE doesn't want to play in another team, he's just trying to leverage himself against the Yanks in this contractual dispute, yet no other team seems to want to offer him anything, perhaps because they know he'll just use their offer to get more money with the Yankees.

[screech]

Javier Vazquez to join the Marlins, pending a physical. One-year deal, $6-7 mil.

[Innovator]

You can have him.

[McLegend]

The Red Sox should seriously offer 3 years for 51 million for Derek Jeter. Especially if Beltre goes somewhere. What's the worse that can happen?

Having Jeter has a 3b wouldn't be that bad, and thats the worst case scenerio.

[Emperor Smeat]

The Red Sox should seriously offer 3 years for 51 million for Derek Jeter. Especially if Beltre goes somewhere. What's the worse that can happen?

Having Jeter has a 3b wouldn't be that bad, and thats the worst case scenerio.

That could be a real possibility based on if Red Sox don't get Dunn or another 1B to let Youkilis move to 3B.

If Rivera was shrewd enough, he could even leverage the Red Sox need for an established closer as a reason for more money or a better deal from the Yankees.

[Innovator]

I developed a heart palpitation when legend said that.

[McLegend]

The Red sox have to offer Jeter something just to scare The Yankees a little.

[screech]

You can have him.

lol I'm not a Marlins fan, just saw no one else posted it.

Not a big fan of Vazquez either, but I think he'll do better there.

[Aguakate]

lol I'm not a Marlins fan, just saw no one else posted it.

Not a big fan of Vazquez either, but I think he'll do better there.

He will. He usually does good on NL teams that have no chance of winning it all. Even then, he's a 15-10 pitcher.

[YOUR Hero]

Outside of NYY, Vasquez has put up solid numbers, K, innings pitched. He just don't love New York.

[Innovator]

Good to know it was a loveless relationship.

[Aguakate]

Outside of NYY, Vasquez has put up solid numbers, K, innings pitched. He just don't love New York.

If Omar Minaya was still Mets GM, I'm 99% certain that he would've signed Vazquez now when the Yankees didn't re-sign him.

Thankfully, he's not. So thankfully, he didn't.

[ClockShot]

Who's got some Reality Potion?

Oh, and Juan Uribe goes across the bridge to the Dodgers. 3-years, $21 mil.

[SammyG]

Too much money, but I like the pickup. If anything, it takes away from the Giants.

[ClockShot]

Rangers sign Yorvit Torrealba to a 2-year, $6.25 mil. deal.

Mets are working on a deal with Chris Young.

[Skippord]

just read that the Rockies signed Tulo to a 7 year extension ending in 2020

hope that's true

[Supreme Olajuwon]

The only thing at stake in this Jeter contract dispute is Jeter's legacy. If Jeter stays a Yankee then he gets grouped with DiMaggio and Mantle. If he leaves, his legacy is destroyed. Dunno how he has any leverage here.

[Juan]

Oh, and Juan Uribe goes across the bridge to the Dodgers. 3-years, $21 mil.

Son of a bitch

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Rockies re-up Jorge De La Rosa for reportedly 3 years, $32 million. Thought he was going to be that guy who got the ridiculously overpriced contract this offseason, but I guess being a Type A free agent hurt his interest with other clubs.

[SammyG]

UURRIIBBEE, bye Theriot!!! ok, diggin' us now

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Buster Olney said the Mets were close to signing Young but then a bunch of other reporters refuted it and said nothing was close to being done. Typical offseason "he said, she said" bullshit.

That being said, I'd love to have Young. The pitching market is relatively weak this year outside of Lee, and out of that group Young's a guy I definitely wanted. He'd fit in really well at Citi. Plus they need a starter anyway since nobody knows when Santana will be ready.</font>

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Too much money, but I like the pickup. If anything, it takes away from the Giants.

UURRIIBBEE, bye Theriot!!! ok, diggin' us now

How are these two posts about the same player

[SammyG]

I still think it's too much money...

[Supreme Olajuwon]

I think you're right. I've never been a big Uribe fan at all. Definitely earned his money last year, but I don't see his numbers coming close.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Do Dodgers fans want Kemp out? That seems to be the way the media is portraying it but come on the guy's a stud. I'd take him and I'd give up a lot to get him.

[McLegend]

I hate Juan Uribe. He's terrible.

[Aguakate]

Juan Uribe is a guy who's just been lucky to be "in the right place, at the right time". Plus he's streaky as heck.

[screech]

Love Matt Kemp. So good.

[Skippord]

Kemp was pretty bad last year. I just think its because he can be pretty lazy at times though and not that he's bad.

[Droford]

just read that the Rockies signed Tulo to a 7 year extension ending in 2020

hope that's true

If Jeter isn't worth $20 million a year, he's most certainly not either (and thats what he'll be making in 5 years..)

[Hardkore Kidd J]

Do Dodgers fans want Kemp out? That seems to be the way the media is portraying it but come on the guy's a stud. I'd take him and I'd give up a lot to get him.


I really thought I'd be the only one. I love Matt Kemp the guy is a great player. And I would seriously give up a lot to get him. Probably just not as much as the Dodgers want. At this point I probably wouldn't trade Montero or Nunez(The Yankees think highly of him. They think he could be the next shortstop for the Yankees after a little more teaching)

I heard something about the Dodgers trading Kemp to us for a Cano package a few years ago. As much as I like Kemp he is not worth a Cano package IMHO.

If it came down to Montero/Nunez etc.etc. I might have to think it over but if they are not budging from their Cano package I would be so fucking pissed if the Yankees went for that.

[Dragon]

That Cano-Kemp rumor was at least a year or two ago.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

I know. Sorry I had to meant to write "A few years ago" in there and thought I did.

[Skippord]

If Jeter isn't worth $20 million a year, he's most certainly not either (and thats what he'll be making in 5 years..)
Tulo is way better than Jeter at this point in their careers

[Dragon]

If Jeter isn't worth $20 million a year, he's most certainly not either (and thats what he'll be making in 5 years..)

You're talking about players with a decade+ difference in age. Jeter is in the latter part of his career and is fighting age right now.

Tulowitzki is a much better bet at being a better player over the next however many years. He's not even in his prime yet and Jeter is obviously nearing the final stages of his.

I don't know if he'll be worth 20M a year in the future and the contract didn't seem necessary yet when the Rockies had him signed for another 3-4 years already but if he keeps putting up seasons like his last two then he'll be just as productive if not more than Jeter was in his prime.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

That Tulo deal is definitely a reaction to not keeping Holliday.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Colorado really seems to love having that face of the franchise too. Larry Walker, Todd Helton, and now Tulo.

[Dragon]

Must be why they did this so soon. They had him for the next 4 years already for cheap. Seems unnecessary to give him an extra 6 years on top of that so soon when they really didn't have to.

I guess it gives them their franchise player but still would have been smarter to wait a couple years before extending on top of his current deal.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Rangers are about to offer a 5-year deal to Lee. One of their main selling points is the fact that Texas has no state tax. They are also trying to sell him that it's closer to his home in Arkansas.

As if that matters one bit. Sure you have to pay taxes in New York, but besides the millions the Yankees will give you you also have money pouring in from endorsements and the like.

This is Sabathia all over again, people are making any excuse possible as to why he won't move. He will be a Yankee.</font>

[YOUR Hero]

Lots of negative vibes around the Yankee organization right now. I would not be surprised if that factors in Lee signing with Texas

[Aguakate]

Lots of negative vibes around the Yankee organization right now. I would not be surprised if that factors in Lee signing with Texas

There are even rumors of Andy Pettitte leaving. True or not, who cares? The thing is, that like Hero said, a lot of negative vibe around the Yankees...you'd think the team crash and burned last year, lost 100 games and missed the playoffs, the way this offseason is going.

[Droford]

You're talking about players with a decade+ difference in age. Jeter is in the latter part of his career and is fighting age right now.

Tulowitzki is a much better bet at being a better player over the next however many years. He's not even in his prime yet and Jeter is obviously nearing the final stages of his.

I don't know if he'll be worth 20M a year in the future and the contract didn't seem necessary yet when the Rockies had him signed for another 3-4 years already but if he keeps putting up seasons like his last two then he'll be just as productive if not more than Jeter was in his prime.

And Troy will be the same age as Jeter is now at the end of the contract getting $20 million in 2019 and 2020. I know you have to factor for inflation so $20 million now wont be $20 million in 10 years but still.

[Dragon]

And Troy will be the same age as Jeter is now at the end of the contract getting $20 million in 2019 and 2020. I know you have to factor for inflation so $20 million now wont be $20 million in 10 years but still.

His final year under contract will be his age 35 season. Next year Jeter is gonna be 37.

I'm guessing once Tulowitzki's big contract is up he won't be getting another 20M per year deal until his 40s.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

OKay let's say Hypothetically the Yankees don't get Lee. Do you think they are gonna throw a package at someone for a good to great pitcher in the NL? The way I see it the Yankees don't really have a choice. The Yankees need someone and if they don't get Cliff. I see them throwing together some good package for some good pitcher in the NL. I shudder to think what the Yankees would give away if that was the case.

[Triple Naitch]

Is there anybody out there worth getting? It seems the Yankees think Grienke does not want to/has the heart to pitch in New York. I can't think of anyone in the NL available.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

Is there anybody out there worth getting? It seems the Yankees think Grienke does not want to/has the heart to pitch in New York. I can't think of anyone in the NL available.

I believe Grienke has some depression disorder or some deep stress issue and the Yankees nor Greinke don't think he can handle New York . I'm kinda worried in dealing with someone with a medical problem on a big market team like the Yankees .We need someone though.

[Skippord]

Grienke has like crippling anxiety issues or something

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Adam Dunn signs a 4 year $56 million deal with the White Sox.

The White Sox have a DH and US Cellular is the most homer friendly park in the majors. This is going to work.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

I wonder where Manny Ramirez will go. Do you think he might sign with the Rangers? I hear Texas is looking for another hitter. Thought they would get Texas Native Adam Dunn.

[Jeritron]

Adam Dunn signs a 4 year $56 million deal with the White Sox.

The White Sox have a DH and US Cellular is the most homer friendly park in the majors. This is going to work.

He was my top wish for the Red Sox to grab, and his name wasn't even brought up.

They let Victor Martinez go. An awful move. He was more than affordable for an offensive catcher. One of the hardest finds in baseball. They could easily have afforded him and still done whatever else they may (and probably don't) have plans for.
And unless they go and pull an Adrian Gonzalez deal (unlikely) then the off-season is pretty underwhelming.

I'm not too keen on Carl Crawford. He's a great player, but he's going to be overrated in a relatively weak crop of free agents, and he's far from the answer for the Red Sox. They need a powerhouse in the middle of the lineup. It hasn't been right since Manny left.
They have speed and great all-around players. Crawford is an asset to any team, no doubt, but I don't think he's right for the tag here.
And Werth isn't worth it. No pun intended.

They won't sign Beltre, but I'm more than okay with that.

It's almost like they should wait, but they haven't done shit in a while. They basically treated last season as a bridge year too.

Rumors are they are trying to really keep costs low to stay flexible for a sale, or just to scale back spending since they basically assume the fans will still come and they now have other ventures.

Jeritron out.

[Jeritron]

Adam Dunn signs a 4 year $56 million deal with the White Sox.

The White Sox have a DH and US Cellular is the most homer friendly park in the majors. This is going to work.

Do you think they will keep Konerko as well? He's still on the market, I believe.
I would be sort of suprised if they didn't, since he is a cornerstone there.
But with Dunn, they could potentially let him go.

[Jeritron]

I met Paul Konerko this summer and he's the greatest guy ever. He's also a manbeast. I'd hate to see the White Sox disown him, but I'd also love to see him on the Red Sox.
I still doubt they'd invest in him at this juncture. Especially with Gonzalez and Fielder as possibilities in the future.

[Triple Naitch]

Couldn't see Dunn playing for Boston. He plays horrible defense wherever you put him. I want them to get Crawford. I don't know why, but I really want him.

[Jeritron]

David Ortiz is not going to play forever. Adam Dunn is born for that DH spot, and they could potentially be looking at Gonzalez or Fielder next season, or sooner if a trade happens.
Youkilis slides to third.

Suck on that lineup. What's funny is it's possible too. Dunn has a smaller pricetag than what they're probably going to squander away elsewhere.

Just not feeling Crawford as an elite signing for them as a team. At all.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

I could see Konerko getting real excited about having Dunn hitting behind him in the order. Not like Dunn's any threat to steal his time in the field.

[Triple Naitch]

I heard the White Sox say they can't afford Dunn, Konerko, and Buerhle but are getting close to re-signing Konerko.

[Jeritron]

I wonder what the status is on those Hanley trade rumors. I doubt it, but it's certainly an interesting rumor.
The only problem with half of these potential trades is everyone wants Bucholz. They can suck my peepee.

[Jeritron]

I could see Konerko getting real excited about having Dunn hitting behind him in the order. Not like Dunn's any threat to steal his time in the field.

Oh no, I didn't mean they can't exist on the same team. I just wondered if the White Sox would shell out for both in the same offseason.

[Jeritron]

I mean, look at the Lackey deal compared to others. I never understood that either, because he was a second starter on the Angels. And his numbers against good teams (especially the Yankees and Rays) were piss poor.

Hate to be that guy who bitches about money, but that deal is a fucking joke and it was before he ever threw a pitch here.
His wife would catch it though. Maybe she can play catcher now that they didn't sign V-Mart. I could get into that.

[Jeritron]

This kid I know who is a drunk piece of shit was at an Angels/Red Sox playoff game and was being an asshole to some chicks rooting for the Angels, and one of them ended up being John Lackey's wife apparently.
She was absolutely disgusted and said something like "Ugh, who is this pig?"

What a piece of shit

[Jeritron]

Her husband is making far too much money that should have gone to a juicy free agent though

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Oh no, I didn't mean they can't exist on the same team. I just wondered if the White Sox would shell out for both in the same offseason.

Kenny Williams said that getting Konerko back is his top priority now.

Always seems like the White Sox can find money when they want to.

[Jeritron]

Paul Konerko spoke with the Red Sox yesterday. But that doesn't really mean anything.

He also turned down arbitration from the White Sox, which means he wants money. And it means they'd have to give up their top draft pick.
So it's very doubtful. Especially since the Red Sox are probably looking to field other options at that position in the near future.
And we know the Yankees aren't looking for a first baseman.

So unless some random team makes an irrefusable offer towards him, he'll be on the White Sox I guess. But a lot of people seem to be saying the opposite.

And Jayson Werth isn't nearly as valuable as Adam Dunn, especially longterm, no matter where he plays.

[Jeritron]

* Orioles are apparently interested in him. They have money, and a need for him.

[Jeritron]

it would be problematic for Boston to sign another old, plodding power hitter who can't play much defense.

Douchebag NESN blogger ragging on Konerko's defense

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Well Konerko did have the worst fielder rating of any 1B in the majors last year. And it wasn't even close.

[Jeritron]

But he was Top 5 the year before that, and usually pretty good. Especially as far as % goes. I don't think he's nearly as bad at first as that guy makes it seem

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Well no matter who they sign, they're not gonna get a better defensive 1B than Youkilis. So if he's on 3rd that's just something they'll have to deal with.

[Jeritron]

That's what snobs in Boston like to do. Dwell on the defensive shortcomings of a guy who hits 40/100. That's what blogs are for.
I hope they get their Crawford and wonder why the lineup still isn't getting it done for a remarkable pitching staff.

[Jeritron]

Well no matter who they sign, they're not gonna get a better defensive 1B than Youkilis. So if he's on 3rd that's just something they'll have to deal with.

I think it's well worth it. Youkilis is a huge asset, and luckily he's flexible so they can pave way for a huge bat.

[Emperor Smeat]

From what is being reported, Victor looked like he wanted to be out of Boston regardless of the money or deal Red Sox offered almost similar to Jayson Bay leaving even though he was happy at Fenway.

Varitek signing the 1 year at $2 million means the team knows it needs to speed up developing its future catcher or buy one after next season.

The rumor of them thinking about selling the team doesn't make sense when in 2 years, they can apply for the government to designate Fenway as a landmark and save millions they spend each year renovating the place. The government would give them the money needed to fix the stadium like they do with every official landmark.

Red Sox still need to fix the bullpen since it was a disaster last year with all the blown saves and costly mistakes it did.

[Jeritron]

Bullpens are built at the very end of the offseason though. That's just how it's done. Tbh, it's kind of a crapshoot a lot of the time.

[Jeritron]

No way the government approve Fenway as a landmark. It is a landmark, but it doesn't need to be approved for government funding since it's making money hand over fucking fist.
I think the powers that be will recognize that.

[Jeritron]

They just bought a massive soccer team you know (Liverpool.) All ventures in a portfolio have an impact on one another. Even if they say it doesn't, it does. The Red Sox ownership likes money. They put a lot into the team to make it very viable, but now they could be scaling back a bit. These are financial decisions.

The Red Sox of the past 6 or 7 years behave very much like a small market team with their moves. Some who don't follow the team may scoff at that blindly, but it's true. They just make more of them, and have more leeway.
Theo Epstein is closer to Billy Beane than Brian Cashman. Sometimes I wish they'd be a bit more aggressive though, rather than cultivate multiple contracts and eat money.
But in the past couple years they've really changed their approach. It's obvious.

However PR is beginning to change. Fans are starting to bitch, and ownership has actually shown up on TV and radio addressing it specifically this week.
So they might do something.

[Jeritron]

The Red Sox also have the media bought here in Boston lately. Most of the baseball writers and major outlets eat out of their hands. The reason for this is because the team and ownership have a very upfront relationship with the media.
They give them priveleges. It used to be the exact opposite before them.

The trick, though, is that nobody says anything to shake the tree, because they don't want to lose their priveleges.
Baseball writing in Boston is pretty awful lately, and they let a lot of things slide that they never used to. Only a few really state their mind, and they are outsiders anyways.

The major Boston sports radio outlet is owned by the Red Sox, as is the television network.
There is an alternative now though, and they are a bit more honest since they're not on the payroll and being kept in line.

I also think the baseball writers are a bit easy on them because of 04 and 07 too, though. Understandable, but not completely.

[Emperor Smeat]

They already applied the paperwork, they just need to wait 2 more years for it to become the 1st 100 year old stadium that is still in use for a major sports league (not sure if college has any that are older and still in use). It is also why they pushed very hard to get the 2012 All-Star game as a celebration of the centennial of the stadium.

I agree that the team seems to change how it spends money since they like to go all out one year (ex. 2004, 2007, 2010) and then cut back the next year as a way to restock the cash or see what they need for a long term fix. It helps to explain why their team salary ends up being #2 one year and around #4-#6 a year or two later.

[Jeritron]

But they didn't get the 2012 AllStar Game. And I doubt they'll get that government funding to make renovations to an already updated venue that sells out every night and makes boatloads of cash. Paperwork completed or not. But we shall see.
I'm not saying it doesn't deserve the title of a landmark, but I don't think it deserves the money. At all.

[Jeritron]

I also wouldn't call signing John Lackey and Mike Cameron going all out. I'd call it a waste of money, but life goes on.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

The Rose Bowl is a landmark and that actually seems to create more problems than anything. Once it's a landmark you can't change anything without approval.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Soldier Field lost its landmark status after they renovated it four years ago.

[Jeritron]

Fenway Park should be made a landmark once the team stops playing there, so it doesn't get torn down.
The proposed plan for that years ago was to take down the seating structure, but leave the field, wall, and foul poles, and pave the infield with cobblestone.

And then I'd imagine they'd add new walkways or fences around it, and some statues of Red Sox legends or moments etc.

I don't think any of that will happen anytime soon though. That new field went kaput after the new ownership came in. They've put a bunch of money into it to make it modern. Plus the demand for tickets and nostalgia/preservation has never been higher. I'm sure way less people are in favor of a change now than 10 years ago, and it was always a touchy issue.

The businesses surrounding the ballpark (and there are a lot) would suffer greatly. Plus the zoning for a new park would be really difficult. Fenway is right in the middle of downtown Boston. It's right on top of everything else. It's not on the outskirts of a much larger city like New York or Chicago, and there's really no room for anything else.

There is no way they could build a new park even remotely near the current location unless they bought up boatloads of property, and even still I'm not sure if it could work with the city's layout.

[DaveWadding]

Why shouldn't Fenway have landmark status? Wrigley does. (Or at least the sign, the brick wall behind home, and the ivy does). The Cubs obviously make money hand over fist as well and have for some time, in spite of the fact that they are basically the worst team ever.

[Jeritron]

Apparently you just skim

[Jeritron]

Wrigley also has no screen, hardly any digital scoreboards, and their huge Toyota sign isn't allowed to light up at night.
I'm all for tradition, but that's a bit ridiculous.
So it's basically an eyesore after dark. It's a wonder they ever opened up to having floodlights for night games.

And the tradition of playing mostly day games is believed by many in baseball to be a burden for the team.

[Dragon]

Yankees close to re-signing Rivera to a 2 year, $30M deal.

Apparently he passed up another teams offer of 17M/year for 3 years. Red Sox and Angels offered him 3 years too.

This makes Jeter look even more ridiculous with his demands.

[Jeritron]

The fact that they gave it to A-Rod is what makes his demands carry weight.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Except A-Rod is a far better player than Jeter.</font>

[Innovator]

The fact that they gave it to A-Rod is what makes his demands carry weight.
Hank helped with that contract, Hal is more in charge now.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Except A-Rod is a far better player than Jeter.

Not according to the people in Yankee land. And even so, when those guys are done, only one of them is getting his jersey retired.

[Triple Naitch]

Except A-Rod is a far better player than Jeter.

Not when it counts.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Ron Santo has died.

Oh god...we all need to hug Dave Wadding right now. :(

RIP</font>

[Skippord]

I hate to be "that guy" but the Rockies apparently traded Chaz Roe for Jose Lopez yesterday

didn't see it posted so I figured I'd mention it

[DaveWadding]

<font color=goldenrod>Ron Santo has died.

Oh god...we all need to hug Dave Wadding right now. :(

RIP</font>

:'( :'( :'(

[Aguakate]

It's SO sad Ron Santo died without making the Hall of Fame. Sure, they could vote him in now, but what good does it do, if he couldn't have the experience of standing up at the podium and "living" the experience of being inducted? He went through the heartache of not making it so many times, that it's really sad. If they vote him in now, it means that he's always been worthy, because, he hasn't had more hits or RBI's the last couple decades, so why would he be worthy now, but not before?

Shame on the HOF writers and Veteran's Committee.

[Jeritron]

Red Sox-Padres A-Gon trade rumors going hard right now.

[Jeritron]

<font color=goldenrod>Except A-Rod is a far better player than Jeter.</font>

It's not this simple. And there are other ways to look at it. Either way, ensuring Jeter retires a Yankee is far more important to the Yankees than how he plays over the next 4 years. It's not like he's going to be shit.
And although past accomplishments aren't usually honored in contract years, Jeter is clearly one of the exceptions.

It's really about principle. If the Yankees shell out money to A-Rod, they have to give it to Jeter or there is going to be disgust among fans, both in NY and around the league.
Especially because it's the Yankees. It's not like Jeter is trying to shake down the Royals for money they don't have. It's the Yankees and we all know how they do business.

Jeter has never brought down shame, and he's been more valuable when it counts and over time. A Rod is still a great player, but he's the same age as Jeter. Most of his signing was to ensure he broke the HR record in pin-stripes.
Jeter hanging up his cleats in The Bronx shouldn't be any less important. He's the biggest Yankee legend since Mantle.

[Droford]

The craziest thing is that Oriole Park is the 11th oldest Park and it was only opened in 1992. When the Marlins move out of whatever the hell they call that stadium down there, Oakland moves out of Oakland and the Rays get a new stadium/move, it'll be #8 (Fenway Park/Wrigley Field/Dodger Stadium/Angels Stadium/Kaufman Stadium/Rogers Center/US Cellular Field/OPACY) I dont see any of them being torn down any time soon though.

[Jeritron]

Why is that crazy? There are 30 teams and Camden was the first of a huge wave of new stadiums. It's in the middle. It's not suprising at all.

[Droford]

Why is that crazy? There are 30 teams and Camden was the first of a huge wave of new stadiums. It's in the middle. It's not suprising at all.

I remember going to my first game there in 1992 when I was 10. It doesn't seem like it should be the one of the oldest parks in Baseball. It makes me feel old. Also kind of bad that they're renovating it and knocking out 3,000 seats but most of the time they're empty anyway.

[Jeritron]

It's just because every few decades, there is a huge trend of new parks. In the 60s it was the toilet bowls, and in the 90s Camden spurred the old-school ballpark craze.
Now just about everyone has a new park, unless it was authentic old school.

[Aguakate]

Why is that crazy? There are 30 teams and Camden was the first of a huge wave of new stadiums. It's in the middle. It's not suprising at all.

It's still one of the prettiest stadiums.

[Nervous Ferret]

Being the 11th oldest doesn't really make it "one of the oldest" though. Only really consider Fenway and Wrigley as "the oldest" anymore. And then maybe Dodgers/Angels stadium are in the next breath

[Emperor Smeat]

Sad to hear the news about Santo since the voters will probably end up voting him in the Hall of Fame due to the 2010 ballot not being a mega-name year.

Yankees set to sign Rivera to a 2-year $30 million deal and had to accept a value closer to what Mariano wanted due to the Red Sox matching the offer. Had he signed with the Sox, Papelbon would have been released and Bard given another 2 years to develop more.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>I guess the thing that just irks me about the Jeter drama is the writers trying to make non-stories out of it. Who cares if they are $50 million and three years apart? Jeter is one of the few players in baseball that I doubt would have accepted an offer from any other team. Another team could have offered him an exact duplicate of A-Rod's contract and he would probably still turn it down.

I guess that's the problem with baseball writing in general at this point. So many bullshit stories. It seems like writers just cause blind speculation in hopes that they are right so they can say they were the first to report it. We'll see tons of it in the Winter Meetings.</font>

[glanville6]

Wow. I heard the name, but I was reading this thread, I saw some Ron Santo love, and I have this preminition that he won't last that much longer, sadly. Love the guy.




posted less than a month ago by me. November 11th at 12:38 am

sad, sad, sad day

Wouldn't be right if I didn't post a pic of me and this Cubs legend

[glanville6]

It's SO sad Ron Santo died without making the Hall of Fame. Sure, they could vote him in now, but what good does it do, if he couldn't have the experience of standing up at the podium and "living" the experience of being inducted? He went through the heartache of not making it so many times, that it's really sad. If they vote him in now, it means that he's always been worthy, because, he hasn't had more hits or RBI's the last couple decades, so why would he be worthy now, but not before?

Shame on the HOF writers and Veteran's Committee.


What will be even better is all those writers and members of the veterans committee will say "I don't know why he wasn't in before!"

Because of you assholes.

[Aguakate]

What will be even better is all those writers and members of the veterans committee will say "I don't know why he wasn't in before!"

Because of you assholes.

I'd hate to see this happen to Pete Rose too...uknow, die without making the Hall of Fame, but being worthy of making it.

However, I cared more about Ron Santo than Rose, just because he went through so much, was a great person, loyal to his Cubbies, and no one could say a bad thing about him.

[glanville6]

I'd hate to see this happen to Pete Rose too...uknow, die without making the Hall of Fame, but being worthy of making it.

However, I cared more about Ron Santo than Rose, just because he went through so much, was a great person, loyal to his Cubbies, and no one could say a bad thing about him.


My aunt can. Its really, really dumb. She wrote him a letter because my brother has a disease, and she wanted some inspirational words for my brother, and she never got a response. She was a die hard Santo fan until that point.

Whats dumb about it is that every time my brother and I have run into Santo, he was friendly, always said hi. The guy recognized us for a while.

That kindness was so much more important than not getting a letter back.

Anyway, Pete Rose deserves to be in, I'm all for the no ceremony thing, but he deserves the recognition.

[DaveWadding]

In honor of This Old Cub, my favorite Ron Santo related item ever:

<font face="Verdana" size="1" color="#999999"><br/><a href="http://www.myspace.com/video/vid/25387173" style="font: Verdana">whos been at third since santo?</a><br/><object width="425px" height="360px" ><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"/><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"/><param name="wmode" value="transparent"/><param name="movie" value="http://mediaservices.myspace.com/services/media/embed.aspx/m=25387173,t=1,mt=video"/><embed src="http://mediaservices.myspace.com/services/media/embed.aspx/m=25387173,t=1,mt=video" width="425" height="360" allowFullScreen="true" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" allowScriptAccess="always"></embed></object><br/><a href="http://www.myspace.com/194371095" style="font: Verdana">skip parker</a> | <a href="http://www.myspace.com/video" style="font: Verdana">Myspace Video</a></font>

[Aguakate]

My aunt can. Its really, really dumb. She wrote him a letter because my brother has a disease, and she wanted some inspirational words for my brother, and she never got a response. She was a die hard Santo fan until that point.

Whats dumb about it is that every time my brother and I have run into Santo, he was friendly, always said hi. The guy recognized us for a while.

That kindness was so much more important than not getting a letter back.

Anyway, Pete Rose deserves to be in, I'm all for the no ceremony thing, but he deserves the recognition.

He probably never even got the letter.

[Jeritron]

<font color=goldenrod>I guess the thing that just irks me about the Jeter drama is the writers trying to make non-stories out of it. Who cares if they are $50 million and three years apart? Jeter is one of the few players in baseball that I doubt would have accepted an offer from any other team. Another team could have offered him an exact duplicate of A-Rod's contract and he would probably still turn it down.

I guess that's the problem with baseball writing in general at this point. So many bullshit stories. It seems like writers just cause blind speculation in hopes that they are right so they can say they were the first to report it. We'll see tons of it in the Winter Meetings.</font>

I can only speak from what I've seen, but I've heard nothing but support for Derek Jeter. Note: I'm from Boston.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

OH SHIT

The Boston Red Sox (http://espn.go.com/mlb/team/_/name/bos/boston-red-sox) have agreed to a deal in principle to acquire slugging first baseman Adrian Gonzalez (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?playerId=5405), sources told ESPN The Magazine's Buster Olney on Saturday morning.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

and the talks are that the Sox don't give up any major leaguers in the deal

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Sounds like the Red Sox are giving up Casey Kelly, Anthony Rizzo, and Reymond Fuentes</font>

[YOUR Hero]

and the talks are that the Sox don't give up any major leaguers in the deal
All about prospects.

[YOUR Hero]

Deal is done...

Multiple sources are reporting on Saturday morning that the San Diego Padres and Boston Red Sox have agreed on a trade that will finally send first baseman Adrian Gonzalez(notes) to Fenway Park for a package of minor leaguers. Dan Hayes of the North County Times reports the crop will include three of Boston's top six prospects — pitcher Casey Kelly, first baseman Anthony Rizzo and outfielder Reymond Fuentes.

Gonzalez is currently in Boston, where he'll undergo a physical and then attempt to negotiate a contract extension with the Red Sox that would begin in 2012.

The ramifications of this deal are pretty clear. The Red Sox will get the Mark Teixeira(notes)-type MVP contender that they have long coveted for their lineup. They'll sacrifice a few top prospects, but it's a fair price in their eyes (and mine, too) to acquire a franchise cornerstone and play keeping-up-with-the-Joneses against the New York Yankees. It's scary to think how A-Gone will perform now that he'll be playing half of his games with that short right field at Fenway Park instead of in the spacious pastures of Petco Park. (Gonzalez hit 11 home runs in San Diego in 2010, compared to 20 on the road.)

Meanwhile, the swap is a loud indication that the Padres won't get nostalgic about their unexpected success in 2010 and will stick to their plan of stockpiling and cultivating young and cheap talent. In addition to this Gonzalez trade, Ken Rosenthal of Fox Sports is reporting that the Padres will "absolutely" trade closer Heath Bell(notes) at some point this offseason.

This undoubtedly won't go over well with Padres fans, but you can't blame the team's front office here. San Diego didn't score many runs or attract many fans with the presence of Gonzalez, a friendly hometown guy playing for the team he grew up supporting. Why lock him into a deal expected to approach Teixeira's $180 million that would hamstring the franchise while adding other players for the next eight-nine years?

It's the business of baseball and the Padres are already proving themselves adept at realizing the differences between big and small markets. They didn't get sentimental with Jake Peavy(notes) in 2009 and sent him to the Chicago White Sox for a package of prospects. Just over one year later, Peavy is a gigantic injury question mark that will cost the White Sox $33 million over the next two years while the Padres still have one of the best young pitching rotations in the league. Time will tell if the Padres GM Jed Hoyer picked the right prospects from the Red Sox (the team he used to work for), but he has made the right move in remaining flexible while building his team of the future.

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/blog/big_league_stew/post/Party-s-over-for-Padres-A-Gone-is-just-that-aft;_ylt=Ar5TLT1bwCCa98_qNcaw.K8RvLYF?urn=mlb-291837

[YOUR Hero]

Mets’ K-Rod pleads guilty to attempted assault

NEW YORK (AP)—Mets closer Francisco Rodriguez pleaded guilty Friday to attempted assault to settle charges he attacked his girlfriend’s father at Citi Field last season in a deal that spares him jail time but sends him to additional anger management classes.

The 28-year-old reliever had been charged with assault after he was accused of grabbing Carlos Pena, hauling him into a tunnel near the family lounge beneath the team’s ballpark and punching him in the face after an Aug. 11 game

[...] http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=AkVXjuCkSVkI2Q5n0qdhyvcRvLYF?slug=ap-mets-rodriguezassault

[YOUR Hero]

If the RSox are wanting so badly to move Papelbon out of the closer role, I wonder if they'd also go after Heath Bell of the Padres.

[MVP]

Man I am thrilled the Red Sox landed Gonzalez, and they didn't even have to give up Jose Iglesias. I think the transition to the AL won't be too difficult for him since he's moving from Petco to Fenway and he's been a model of consistency in the past few years.

[OssMan]

ANTHONY RIZZO

Used to watch him play Single A for the Salem Red Sox :( :( :( Best hitter on the team

[YOUR Hero]

ANTHONY RIZZO

Used to watch him play Single A for the Salem Red Sox :( :( :( Best hitter on the team
Really? - He batted a combined 260 last year (297 the year before) did hit 25 HRs though... (100 rbi)

He's 20 years old.
Do you think he's ML ready?

[OssMan]

Noh probably not. Well I only saw him in like 4 games over the last 2 seasons. Hit in the number 3 spot. I think he plays 2B as well or I could be confusing him with somebody with a similar name on the team. He does have good power though.

[Aguakate]

Really? - He batted a combined 260 last year (297 the year before) did hit 25 HRs though... (100 rbi)

He's 20 years old.
Do you think he's ML ready?

He's probably not ML ready, but any 20 year old that hits 25 HR's and drives in 100 in the Minors, has something special. Like most hitters, he needs to pick that Batting Average up, and that'll come as he gets more selective and patient at the plate.

[Evil Vito]

Mets’ K-Rod pleads guilty to attempted assault

NEW YORK (AP)—Mets closer Francisco Rodriguez pleaded guilty Friday to attempted assault to settle charges he attacked his girlfriend’s father at Citi Field last season in a deal that spares him jail time but sends him to additional anger management classes.

The 28-year-old reliever had been charged with assault after he was accused of grabbing Carlos Pena, hauling him into a tunnel near the family lounge beneath the team’s ballpark and punching him in the face after an Aug. 11 game

[...] http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=AkVXjuCkSVkI2Q5n0qdhyvcRvLYF?slug=ap-mets-rodriguezassault

<font color=goldenrod>Shame the guy had to fuck up royally. He actually was pitching extremely well last year. I can live with him closing for one more season, but I hope his 2012 option doesn't vest. Omar inexplicably gave him a <b>$17.5 million</b> option that automatically kicks in if he finishes 55 games next year.

I figure the Mets will be hovering around .500 again next year so that would mean K-Rod finishes off about 2/3rds of wins, including blowouts. Jerry used to pitch K-Rod at least once every few days even if he wasn't really needed because otherwise he'd lose effectiveness. Collins is gonna have some trouble figuring that one out.

If the Mets aren't in contention but K-Rod's doing well I hope they can move him and let another team worry about that option. Let Parnell spend this year in the 8th inning and take over the closing duties for 2012.</font>

[Jeritron]

All about prospects.

Yea but I'm fine with the Red Sox finally dealing some. They've had so many prospects in the past few years.
Not all of them are going to turn into Bucholz, Lester or Pedroia. So I'm glad did this deal. I'm not for emptying the farm, but they got a ton and I think some of a prospect's value is all in potential.

[Triple Naitch]

:cool:

[Jeritron]

NOW I'm in favor of signing Crawford. I just wanted a big bat

[YOUR Hero]

Yea but I'm fine with the Red Sox finally dealing some. They've had so many prospects in the past few years.
Not all of them are going to turn into Bucholz, Lester or Pedroia. So I'm glad did this deal. I'm not for emptying the farm, but they got a ton and I think some of a prospect's value is all in potential.

If the Red Sox are planning to contend again right away (I think they are) This move makes perfect sense.

[Droford]

Oh man, I dont think I will be able to stand the Os next year. Holes at 1B and 3B and the best options appear to be Mark Reynolds for 3rd and Carlos Pena at 1st. Granted, both could hit about 35-40 HR in Camden Yards, but otherwise they'll be awful. (Reynolds hit .198 last year, Pena hit .196, both are career .240 hitters).


Reynolds, 27, would have been a fine power replacement for Adrian Gonzalez (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/g/gonzaad01.shtml?utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker), who appears to be headed to Boston. He's hit at least 28 home runs in each of the last three seasons, at least 32 in the last two seasons. Reynolds does strike out at a historic rate though; he's the first man in baseball history to be set down on strike three at least 200 times in three straight seasons.
Reynolds is under contract for $5MM in 2011 and then $7.5MM in 2012 before a $11MM club option for 2013 ($500K buyout) comes into play. Earlier today (http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2010/12/olneys-latest-gonzalez-red-sox-reynolds-reyes.html) we heard that the Orioles were the front-runner to acquire him.

[Triple Naitch]

NOW I'm in favor of signing Crawford. I just wanted a big bat

Are you worried that the lineup may be too heavy on the left side of the plate now?

[Jeritron]

No

[DaveWadding]

Oh man, I dont think I will be able to stand the Os next year. Holes at 1B and 3B and the best options appear to be Mark Reynolds for 3rd and Carlos Pena at 1st. Granted, both could hit about 35-40 HR in Camden Yards, but otherwise they'll be awful. (Reynolds hit .198 last year, Pena hit .196, both are career .240 hitters).

Too bad they couldn't have signed Dunn to DH. All 3 of the main "3 True Outcomes" players in the league. (HR, BB, K)

[YOUR Hero]

Jeter’s back, but the Yankees have work to do


On the very day the Boston Red Sox reached across the country to get the player they’ve always wanted, the New York Yankees reached across their clubhouse and got the player who, by some appearances, had been shoved down their throats.

Derek Jeter(notes) is a Yankee again, and history will show he never really wasn’t. And maybe it’s best to remember it that way, as one long and seamless and elegant path, right up until the time someone has to tell Jeter he can’t play shortstop anymore. What’s a little “messy” among friends?

Until then, Jeter resumes his place as the one Yankee the Yankees never had to worry about, which is good, because the Red Sox today have given them plenty of that.

The Yankees will be into Jeter for about $50 million over three more seasons, a contract that could extend to four years until he is 40, and in that time likely will pay for itself. He is 74 hits from 3,000, just that far from one of the grander celebrations the new ballpark will ever see. He will raise his helmet by its earflap, the way he always does, and blink away any notion he is more than a humble servant of the pinstripes and the game. Jeter is wonderful like that, and a winner like that, and proud like that.

The Yankees can only hope that he is still a player like that.

The outcome presided over by St. Steinbrenner himself, it is the contract that had to happen and, if you’ll pardon the melodrama, the destiny that had to be abided. In spite of the cranky rhetoric that spilled from beneath meeting-room doors, Jeter was going to be a Yankee, for better or worse, in sickness and in wealth. The money was never going to damage the Yankee machinery, and neither was Jeter. On opening day, he would trot stiff-legged to the foul line, he would flap his glove at the right-field bleachers, he would inside-out a fastball and the Steinbrenners would applaud from their suite.

The rest, however, remains to be written.

If Jeter proves his poor 2010 was a statistical aberration (career low .270 batting average and .710 OPS), the Yankees win. If Jeter’s legs and bat have irretrievably slowed, then the Yankees exhale and wait for the day the Florida Marlins decide they can no longer afford Hanley Ramirez(notes).

Either way, the Jeter and Mariano Rivera(notes) contracts arrived within hours of each other, momentarily comforting Yankee Universe and clearing Brian Cashman’s desk. As they did, however, a tremor rose from the north, where the Red Sox were recasting a roster that last season was strangled by injury. The Yankees, tending first to themselves, had spent roughly $80 million and weren’t yet better than they were last season, when they finished second in their division and were put to rest by a superior pitching staff in Texas.

On the board still are the best free agents: Cliff Lee(notes), Carl Crawford(notes), Adrian Beltre(notes), Jayson Werth(notes) and Rafael Soriano(notes). As the Tampa Bay Rays fall back, the floor is cleared for the Yankees and Red Sox, and as one divisional executive sighed Saturday morning, “Such is life in the AL East.”

On the eve of the winter meetings, the Red Sox completed their swap of prospects for San Diego Padres first baseman and slugger Adrian Gonzalez(notes), who in their ballpark could become Manny Ramirez(notes) without the act. Leaning against re-signing third baseman Beltre and repositioning Kevin Youkilis(notes) in left field, the Red Sox remain engaged with outfielders Crawford and Werth.

The offseason turns now on a free-agent class that tips toward mediocrity after a handful of players. Even with Jeter and Rivera in, the Yankees are shy at least one pitcher and perhaps a bat, meaning Lee (and, presumably, Andy Pettitte(notes)) and one of those outfielders. They convinced Jeter and Rivera to defer portions of their contracts, in part so they could bear down on Lee, in particular. Lee appears to be not a luxury for the Yankees, but a necessity, as the Red Sox already had the deeper rotation and threaten again to bang with the Yankees.

They’ll all know better come March, when the sides will have been chosen and the money spent. But, for now, what’s best for the Yankees is to know who will lead them, whoever they are by then.

Their captain, of course.

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=AtbbaC9k5ysdfu_oSQ4xjj0RvLYF?slug=ti-jeteryankeesagreement120410

[YOUR Hero]

Word is no one wants to play in Baltimore (or Seattle)

[Emperor Smeat]

Not surprised at the lack of intrest for playing in Seattle since the team basically "gave up" after the bad start to the season and how they couldn't keep Cliff Lee for the year or get Jason Bay.

Meanwhile Cardinals signed Berkman to a 1 year at $8 million deal and Reds keep Arroyo for another 2 years at $23.5 million.

[Droford]

Word is no one wants to play in Baltimore (or Seattle)
Combined with Andy MacPhail's unwillingness to get hosed in trades or spend a lot of money on FA's.

They'll probably get Reynolds and Pena because there wont be much of a market for either of them.

[Aguakate]

Not surprised at the lack of intrest for playing in Seattle since the team basically "gave up" after the bad start to the season and how they couldn't keep Cliff Lee for the year or get Jason Bay.

Meanwhile Cardinals signed Berkman to a 1 year at $8 million deal and Reds keep Arroyo for another 2 years at $23.5 million.

Bronson Arroyo 2 years at $23.5 million. WOW.

[Triple Naitch]

Are you saying Bronson doesn't deserve it?

[Aguakate]

I thought he'd ask for more.

BTW, just read thar Aaron Harang signed a 1 year del with the Padres.

[Loose Cannon]

Yankees sign Derek Jeter!!!!!!!!! unfucking real. Can't wait to see him in pinstripes

[Skippord]

Adrian Gonzalez will finally stop hurting the Rockies

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

[ClockShot]

So while I was away on vacation:

Jeter and Rivera sign.

Red Sox get A-Gon.

Aaron Harang to the Padres.

Rockies go into uncharted waters and sign Tulowitski to mega bucks.

The Cardinals sign Lance Berkman

Adam Dunn to the White Sox.

The great Ron Santo passes away.

Everything else seems kinda minor. It's only gonna get more insane starting tomorrow.

[Aguakate]

This Adrian Gonzalez trade is going to be great for the Sox. They'll probably have Ortiz bat 3rd, Gonzalez 4th, Youkilis 5th. Plus, if they get Werth, they can have him hit 2nd or 6th. As always, Pedroia leading off. That is "Yankee-like".

And of course, Beckett-Lester-Lackey.

[ClockShot]

This Adrian Gonzalez trade is going to be great for the Sox. They'll probably have Ortiz bat 3rd, Gonzalez 4th, Youkilis 5th. Plus, if they get Werth, they can have him hit 2nd or 6th. As always, Pedroia leading off. That is "Yankee-like".

And of course, Beckett-Lester-Lackey.


WRONG!

Breaking News:

The Adrian Gonzalez trade has apparently collapsed. Both sides couldn't come to a agreement on a new contract.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>A-Gon wanted 8 years, Red Sox only wanted to offer 6</font>

[Aguakate]

The trade hasn't COLLAPSED. It can still be done, the only thing that ended was the window given by MLB so the Red Sox and Gonzalez could get an extension done.

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/Adrian-Gonzalez-trade-with-Chicago-Cubs-or-Boston-Red-Sox-still-possible-120310

[Jeritron]

Dude

[Triple Naitch]

:|

[Loose Cannon]

terrible deal by the Nationals for Werth. no way

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>ROFL 7 years/$126 million for Jayson Werth</font>

[Triple Naitch]

Guy already got a ring. I don't blame him for cashing in.

[Jeritron]

Red Sox are cheap shit. If they don't get this done they're not going to get anybody now.

[Jeritron]

This Adrian Gonzalez trade is going to be great for the Sox. They'll probably have Ortiz bat 3rd, Gonzalez 4th, Youkilis 5th. Plus, if they get Werth, they can have him hit 2nd or 6th. As always, Pedroia leading off. That is "Yankee-like".

And of course, Beckett-Lester-Lackey.

I love that you have Lackey in there but not Bucholz.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Jesus Boston, the guy's 28. Give him the years.

[Jeritron]

They make me fucking sick dude. Their cheap shit continues

[Jeritron]

Can't wait to hear Felger tomorrow at 2

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Seriously though, if length was the only issue and price was fine, this is the most retarded thing I've heard in a long time.

[Jeritron]

Especially considering that they are shit out of luck now if they don't get Gonzalez. And because they have money to spend and don't want to, consistently.
So fucking what if they have to eat 2 years. That's the benefit of being a big market team. They like to pretend they're not.

Plus it was well fucking worth it, not only as a baseball move but as a business decision. The tv ratings have gone down by 50% in the past 2 years. This isn't going to make the Boston fans happy at all.

Fuckin Nationals making moves and the Red Sox looking for bargains

[Emperor Smeat]

I think it had to do with the difference between the 2 years since Red Sox wanted something around a 6 year $120 million deal but his agent wanted something near 8 years at $180 million. His agent was smart with the attempt since everyone was comparing him to Manny who got around $160 - $180 million when he signed.

Either way Red Sox are going to have to spend money since no Gonzalez means they have to give Beltre whatever he wants while Crawford's price rises due to Werth gone and fierce competition for him.

[Jeritron]

Yea and it should have been spent towards Gonzalez and not for a player like Beltre. I don't think there is any angle that will make me content with this shit unless it's flat out rectified.
They just count on people to be slaves to the team.

[Dragon]

The one thing I don't understand is that the Sox must have known Gonzalez would want a Teixeira type deal, maybe they were hoping for a deal but they had to know it would eventually get to that price range. And he deserves it. He's put up the numbers the past 4 years or so in a ballpark that is terrible to hitters and a lineup with no protection.

They look even worse when you figure they were sticking on offering less years and money than Werth ended up getting.

[Dragon]

I think it'd be a terrible move for the Sox to sign Beltre now though, especially if he ends up getting a 5 year deal, which you have to think he will. That locks them up with Beltre and Youkilis at 1B/3B for a while.

Smartest move for them would be to get a one-year stopgap type 1st baseman like Lee or Pena and then be prepared to offer money for Pujols or Gonzalez (or Fielder I guess) after the season.

[dablackguy]

The Red Sox would be foolish to not get it done. They're too deep in to tell the fanbase that it didn't get done.

And lol at Werth. He'll never live up to that deal. He got Holliday money and isn't anywhere near as good

[Dragon]

Also, that Werth deal is huge to Crawford.

He should get 8 years easily if Werth was able to get 7.

[McLegend]

Jayson Werth getting paid.

[glanville6]

Werth is good. He isn't that good.

And neither are the Nationals. And I don't think they will be at all during his contract.

Strasburg is out pretty much all next year, and nothing is guaranteed after that.

Harper is supposed to be good, but as a Cubs fan I know Shawon Dunston, Corey Patterson and so on and so on never really panned out. They were ok for a few years, but they weren't what they were supposed to be.

That said, both sides are going to regret this deal.

That said... I'd rather have Werth than Soriano for the money.

[McLegend]

What's Werth going to regret about this deal?

126 million>everything else

[dablackguy]

Some players don't want to be the franchise guy - like it or not, Werth is that now. Him, Zimmerman and Stratsburg

[Droford]

ROFL 7 years/$126 million for Jayson Werth

http://img816.imageshack.us/img816/6600/edgewerth.jpg

[McLegend]

But he's making $126 million even if he sucks.

He won't regret making that.

[Triple Naitch]

Dablack guy lol'ing at Werth. Werth's lol'ing all the way to the bank.

[Jeritron]

http://www.freewebs.com/kbeerodhee/3.jpg

[Loose Cannon]

lol

[dablackguy]

Dablack guy lol'ing at Werth. Werth's lol'ing all the way to the bank.

Also lol at the chances of 38 year old Werth being able to produce at an 18 million dollar rate

Can't knock the guy, somebody vastly overpaid him and he took the money. Good for him.

[glanville6]

Also lol at the chances of 38 year old Werth being able to produce at an 18 million dollar rate

Can't knock the guy, somebody vastly overpaid him and he took the money. Good for him.


Thats what my brother always says about Milton Bradley.

But yeah I guess he won't regret it, but if he's any kind of competitor, he will be frustrated a lot.

[ClockShot]

Can't believe the Nationals ponied up the cash for Werth. Scott Boras must have done a pretty good job put that together.

The ball's in Crawford and Lee's court now.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Red Sox and Padres decided to make the trade without the extension. I'm sure they'll keep working on it, but A-Gon is now in Boston.</font>

[Triple Naitch]

Phew

[ClockShot]

Guess it turned out to be a good day for BoSox fans after all.

When Theo and A-Gon return to the table for contract talks, I'd like to be a fly on the wall in that room.

[Jeritron]

What a fucking day. I was so fucking angry. They still need to get a contract in place but at least he's here for next year.

[Jeritron]

10 minutes after the deal went cold my father told me the Yankees signed Cliff Lee and Crawford just to fuck with me

I guess Crawford will go to the Tigers now. Nobody is going to compete with NY for Lee unless Texas opens their wallet.

[OssMan]

Jayson Werth to Nationals NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

[Aguakate]

I love that you have Lackey in there but not Bucholz.

Right, him too.

BTW, to all those going like "LOL at Werth for going to the Nats"...it should be more like "LOL at the Nats for giving Werth all that money, instead of spending it wisely". Werth's fine, he's all right.

...7 years and $126 million...that's a Superstar deal...

[Hardkore Kidd J]

I really thought the Red Sox would get Werth. I guess this means the Red Sox will do whatever it takes to sign Crawford. This is a good thing to me because Cliff did seem like a candidate for Washington. But, now I don't think so. They could have easily given Cliff Lee a 7 year contract but after giving a 7 year contract to Werth it looks like they might be out of the mix.

[Jeritron]

I don't know if they'll do everything to sign him. Detroit will probably pay more. But they could.

[DaveWadding]

That said... I'd rather have Werth than Soriano for the money.

Why?

[Aguakate]

If the Red Sox are willing to shell out the big bucks to sign Crawford, why not go after Cliff Lee instead? To me, it's weird the Red Sox haven't even been mentioned in the "Cliff Lee discussion".

[Jeritron]

I think it's assumed they won't be putting cash into starting pitching since they already have quite a rotation.

[Aguakate]

Lackey's no sure thing, neither is Matsuzaka. You'd think they'd AT LEAST be "in the mix" for Lee, but that's not the case. Maybe the Red Sox have total confidence that their starters will play up to their standards.

But it's still weird, TO ME, that the Red Sox haven't been linked to Lee this offseason at all.

[Jeritron]

I'm not a fan of either but they're bothing making a lot of money. The Red Sox rotation is pretty tied up.
If they hadn't signed Lackey or extended Beckett, they might have gone after Lee.

I still hope they can manage to deal Matsusaka. The Cubs had interest.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

Lackey's no sure thing, neither is Matsuzaka. You'd think they'd AT LEAST be "in the mix" for Lee, but that's not the case. Maybe the Red Sox have total confidence that their starters will play up to their standards.

But it's still weird, TO ME, that the Red Sox haven't been linked to Lee this offseason at all.

They do have about 3 sure things with Beckett, Bucholz and Lester. Their major problem last year was hitting and maybe the bullpen. So I say the Red Sox get one more player maybe Crawford. And then trade for a few bullpen arms maybe and the Red Sox would be pretty much all set.

I think Bucholz and Beckett are gonna have a real good season and I'd be surprised if Lester isn't. You guys may need a new closer too. I think it's about time for Paps closer days in Boston to come to an end especially since 2011 is the last year on his contract if I'm not mistaken. You guys do need a stop gap for this Daniel Bard fellow.

I don't pay that much attention to the Red Sox how good is Bard? How close do you think he is to becoming the new closer of the Red Sox?

[Aguakate]

Red Sox should get Kerry Wood to set up Papelbon, and if needed (is Papelbon goes through a rough stretch), take over the Closer role.

[Emperor Smeat]

They have Bard for that and if Okajima gets back to pitching like he did in 2007 and 2008, he would become the setup man. Bard just needs to work on lowering the number of critical HRs he gives up before he can officially become their closer.

Beckett is a strange case since he's been very streaky the last few years and usually you can tell if he will be good or bad based on how large his gut is when Spring Training arrives.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

I could of sworn that Wood was all ready signed by someone. I thought he may have have signed with a National League team. *Shrugs* Daniel Bard maybe a better guy for the set up role and take over closing sometimes if Paps should fall into a bad stretch.

[glanville6]

I could of sworn that Wood was all ready signed by someone. I thought he may have have signed with a National League team. *Shrugs* Daniel Bard maybe a better guy for the set up role and take over closing sometimes if Paps should fall into a bad stretch.

Nope, but the Cubs COULD be interested. Id hope, anyway...I miss him.

Also would love to see the Cubs go for Zack Greinke...but I'd like to see the Cubs go for someone...

We'll probably get Carlos Pena...damnit

[Aguakate]

Nope, but the Cubs COULD be interested. Id hope, anyway...I miss him.

Also would love to see the Cubs go for Zack Greinke...but I'd like to see the Cubs go for someone...

We'll probably get Carlos Pena...damnit

The Cubs don't seem to have a real plan, and that sucks, 'cause they are my favorite team. But you just don't see them making moves that make any sense...I don't see them having a clear vision about what kind of a team they want to have, not just in 2011, but in the years ahead. No long term plan. They just seem to sign different players every offseason, and hope that something clicks.

[Droford]

I could of sworn that Wood was all ready signed by someone. I thought he may have have signed with a National League team. *Shrugs* Daniel Bard maybe a better guy for the set up role and take over closing sometimes if Paps should fall into a bad stretch.

Last I heard Wood was one of the many relievers the Os were looking into but I hope that it doesn't come down to him cause I feel as if it would end up being a disaster.

[Splaya]

10 minutes after the deal went cold my father told me the Yankees signed Cliff Lee and Crawford just to fuck with me

I guess Crawford will go to the Tigers now. Nobody is going to compete with NY for Lee unless Texas opens their wallet.


Wait what? where did you hear this that he will go to Detroit?

[ClockShot]

HAPPY WINTER MEETINGS DAY!

[Hardkore Kidd J]

Nope, but the Cubs COULD be interested. Id hope, anyway...I miss him.

Also would love to see the Cubs go for Zack Greinke...but I'd like to see the Cubs go for someone...

We'll probably get Carlos Pena...damnit

They might have some competition Washington is looking for a first baseman as well. And Pena or LaRoche is at the top of their list.

[YOUR Hero]

Price also went up for Pujols. Cards are looking to sign an extension with fat Albert. Have a feeling his $$$ price just went up.

[YOUR Hero]

Jason Werth = the new Vernon Wells deal.

[YOUR Hero]

Jays sending Marcum to Brewers

Shaun Marcum(notes) went 13-8 with a 3.64 ERA and 165 strikeouts this past season for the Toronto Blue Jays after taking a year off to recover from Tommy John surgery. It looks like the surgery was successful. Not the kind of guy you want to lose, right?

Well, the word from the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel is that Marcum, who turns 29 next week, is moving back to the States; he's been traded to the Milwaukee Brewers though it's not clear for who. The paper notes that the Blue Jays would like to have second-base prospec Brett Lawrie, who just happens to have been born in Canada, as well as some pitching prospects.

[...]

[YOUR Hero]

Also, Jays looking at trading for Zack Greinke.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

Also, Jays looking at trading for Zack Greinke.

This is good. They do need a more established pitcher on their team. I wonder what they would ask from the Jays. You think maybe Travis Snider or Ricky Romero might have to be part of the deal?

[Aguakate]

GM Pat Gillick is elected to the National Baseball Hall of Fame by the Veteran's Committee...

...George Steinbrenner falls short.

...Really?

[Nervous Ferret]

Good pickup for the Brewers. Marcum pitched well last year, really.

[Triple Naitch]

Droford will be ecstatic to hear the O's got Mark Reynolds and his #1, #2, and #3 records on the single season strikeout list.

[Triple Naitch]

The unlucky number of $126 million.

Barry Zito, Vernon Wells, Jayson Werth.

[screech]

Was really hoping Werth would go to a contending team. Don't blame him for cashing in, though.

[screech]

Have the Tigers expressed interest in Crawford? Not sure why, but I picture them getting him somehow.

[screech]

Pat Gillick's top five moves with the Phillies, according to Todd Zolecki:

1. Signing Jayson Werth.
2. Trading Bobby Abreu.
3. Trading Jim Thome.
4. Trading for Jamie Moyer.
5. Trading for Brad Lidge.

http://zozone.mlblogs.com/archives/2010/12/gillick_elected_to_hall_of_fam.html

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Adrian Gonzalez and the Red Sox agree on 8 years, $161 million</font>

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Orioles get: 3B Mark Reynolds

Diamondbacks get: RHP David Hernandez and RHP Kam Mickolio</font>

[Splaya]

We have had very little interest in Crawford. So if you guys have heard something about the Tigers getting him do share

[DaveWadding]

<font color=goldenrod>Orioles get: 3B Mark Reynolds

Diamondbacks get: RHP David Hernandez and RHP Kam Mickolio</font>

See? You don't have to trade away your 5 tool stud to get nice things in return.

[DaveWadding]

According to Jon Heyman of SI.com, the Diamondbacks are "looking hard" at free agent first baseman Derrek Lee.

Make it happen, Towers. DO IT.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

It seems like Baltimore is in a permanent identity crisis. Are they rebuilding or not?

[weather vane]

SOXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Adrian Beltre is 31 and has 1,889 hits. Wow, didn't think he had that many.

If he plays 7 more years and averages around 160, he can make it to 3,000. If he plays longer than that his odds of reaching that get even better.

3,000 seems to be automatic induction. Hard to fathom that Adrian fucking Beltre actually has a realistic chance of getting in.</font>

[Jeritron]

I don't think he does

[Droford]

See? You don't have to trade away your 5 tool stud to get nice things in return.

The Os didnt have a 5 tool stud to start with. I feel like this is trading 2 cans of spam for some ground chuck. They might be able to turn Reynolds around and have a semi-decent 3B, but at the end of the day they've still got a career avg .240 hitter with 35 HRs thats struck out 200 times 3 straight years.

People are arguing that the ks are fine because he's not hitting into double plays but at the same point if he k's with runners on and 2 outs it ends the inning anyway so it doesnt matter. About the only thing I like about him is that I think he had 80 walks last year which would have led the Os, he had the 5th highest pitch per PA in the majors...

Also from what Ive read, he doesnt want to come to Baltimore which sounds like a recipe for disaster.


It seems like Baltimore is in a permanent identity crisis. Are they rebuilding or not?

The Orioles are just trying to field a team that won't be as embarassingly awful as they were the first half of last year. 3B was definitely a major hole after the Atkins and Josh Bell experiments bombed and they didnt have anyone else in the system, and the same goes for 1B, SS. They have a lot of good young pitchers but they are not all panning out so it would be nice to have a decent veteran SP too.

[Nervous Ferret]

Would you want to come to Baltimore?

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Adrian Beltre is 31 and has 1,889 hits. Wow, didn't think he had that many.

If he plays 7 more years and averages around 160, he can make it to 3,000. If he plays longer than that his odds of reaching that get even better.

3,000 seems to be automatic induction. Hard to fathom that Adrian fucking Beltre actually has a realistic chance of getting in.

He also started playing when he was 19 so he had a bit of a head start.

[Jeritron]

Averaging 160 hits every year for 7-8 years (in your 30s) would be hard for a player who has only done it a few times in their career to begin with.

He's more in the 140-150 range at best, and I don't think things are uphill for Adrian Beltre. Last year wasn't really something that's going to happen consistently. It was a nice spike year for a likey-over the hill steroid era player.

[SlickyTrickyDamon]

Would you want to come to Baltimore?

Only people who want to come to Baltimore are the Yankees, Red Sox, Blue Jays and Rays to kick their asses 9 times a year.

[Jeritron]

And Boston/NY fans who go to watch it

[Aguakate]

Would you want to come to Baltimore?

Don't see why not. They have a beautiful ballpark, nice uniforms, a young team full of talent, and Buck Showalter as Manager. If you're looking for the right fit, and not necessarily a contending team, then I don't see why you wouldn't go to Baltimore.