MLB 2010-2011 Off Season Thread

[Hanso Amore]

Well, except for that one year where he unanimously won the MVP award, the other seasons where he finished top 5, and several other seasons where statistically speaking he clearly should have but was penalized by voters for playing on a bad team.

Other than that, though, never.

Yes, because MVP = Best player in the league. :shifty:

I can name 15 players that are better than Joey Votto right now in the MLB.

And that includes pitchers. FYI.

Bags was never one of the top 5 players in his era.

Griffey, Bonds, Johnson, Clemens, Gwynn, etc etc

Name a year in his career and I can tell you at least 5 better players at that point in time.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Joey Votto oozes class and sex appeal. That makes him better than everyone in the league.

[Vox Populi]

Right, except that's not what you said initially at all.

Bagwell was never even one of the 5 best players in the league at any point in his career.

1994 was a point in Bagwell's career. It could be rationally argued that Greg Maddux was better in 1994 than Jeff Bagwell, though since that was an unusually strong pitching season, Bagwell's numbers produce a higher WAR and WARP. Aside from Maddux, no one else came close. That's it.

1997 was a point in Bagwell's career. In that year, he was by all overall statistial measures the fifth best player in all of baseball. In 1999, only Pedro, Pudge and Chipper beat out Bagwell, and Pudge only does once his position is factored in. 2000-1 are another two years where most statistical measures place him in the top 5.

Again, by quite literally every reputable source and account, the ONLY more productive offensive player than Bagwell over the course of Bagwell's entire career was Barry Bonds. I'd go so far as to add Greg Maddux to the list on the pitching side, effectively making Jeff Bagwell the third best player in all of baseball from 1991 to 2005. Other than that, you're looking at a ton of pitchers who had peaks and valleys during Jeff's career, and a bunch of offensive players whose offensive output he simply dwarfed from '91-'05. Thomas would be his only other real competition in that regard had his peak and subsequent decline not occurred so early on.

[ClockShot]

World Series Hero Edgar Renteria ends up with the Reds. Looking like a 1-year, $3 mil. deal loaded with incentives.

[Loose Cannon]

come on guys, Koko B Ware is in the Hall for god sakes

[Nervous Ferret]

Raul Mongedesi

[Aguakate]

Yes, because MVP = Best player in the league. :shifty:

I can name 15 players that are better than Joey Votto right now in the MLB.

And that includes pitchers. FYI.

Bags was never one of the top 5 players in his era.

Griffey, Bonds, Johnson, Clemens, Gwynn, etc etc

Name a year in his career and I can tell you at least 5 better players at that point in time.

It's not about being one of the best players in the game, or all that.

The letters MVP stand for MOST VALUABLE PLAYER.

Valuable to who?

To the team that player plays for.

So in terms of MVP, Joey Votto was the MOST VALUABLE PLAYER to the Cincinnati Reds, a team that had been a losing franchise for some time, until last year.

Just because you win the MVP, doesn't necessarily mean you are one of the Top 5 players in the game...and just because you are one of the Top 5 players in the game, doesn't necessarily mean you should be MVP.

How many MVP awards did Hank Aaron win? One. Yet he was the first guy to break Babe Ruth's all time Home Run mark (Ruth also won one MVP award).

Yet guys like Jimmy Rollins, Terry Pendleton, Jeff Kent and Willie McGee have also won MVP awards, yet they never were "Top 5 players" when they won the award. They just were the MOST VALUABLE PLAYER to their team.

[MVP]

I think that's what Hanso is saying though.

[ClockShot]

Looks like the Cubs are gonna get Big Game Garza from the Rays. Cubs are probably gonna send Chris Archer, Hak-Ju Lee, Brandon Guyer, and Robinson Chirinos. Not finalized yet, but it looks like it's gonna happen.

Brian Bannister is taking his talents to Japan. Signed a deal with the Tokyo Giants.

Finally, Carl Pavano might be going back to Minnesota for 2 more years.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Really don't understand what the Rays are doing. They knew they would lose Crawford, and losing Pena and his sub-Mendoza line BA isn't that big of a deal. But then they traded Bartlett and Garza and don't seem to be making any sort of play to get Soriano back, or even a guy like Balfour. They HAVE been interested in Fuentes but it doesn't sound like they'll be willing to spend enough to land him.

It's like they're conceeding that winning the division is going to be too hard now with the Red Sox' acquisitions. I know fans never show up for their games but how can they be so strapped for cash that they need to have a fire sale when they still had a team that could contend?

If anything, keep Garza until the deadline and at least make it look like you care about this season.</font>

[Dragon]

Looking at where the Cubs prospects ranked in their system the Rays seem to be getting a solid return for Garza though. Just makes their farm system even more ridiculous.

3 of the guys are in the Cubs top 10 prospects. They're ranked #3, #4, #8 and #15.

Definitely doesn't help their chances for next season but will help them to reload for another run when some of their big guys get to the majors again. Waiting to the deadline would have been smarter I would think though.

[ClockShot]

You have Carlos Silva, Carlos Zambrano, Tom Gorzelanny, Randy Wells, Ryan Dempster, and now Matt Garza for a rotation.

Somebody other than Garza is getting bounced out. Either via trade or to the bullpen.

[Triple Naitch]

The Rays had plenty of starters as well, so they're dealing from their strength. Price, Shields, Davis, Niemann, and Hellickson is still an impressive rotation.

[DaveWadding]

You have Carlos Silva, Carlos Zambrano, Tom Gorzelanny, Randy Wells, Ryan Dempster, and now Matt Garza for a rotation.

Somebody other than Garza is getting bounced out. Either via trade or to the bullpen.

I think it depends on who performs better in the Spring between Gorze and Silva. They had been trying to trade Gorze, but I don't think it'll happen and he ends up in the pen.

Pretty excited for Garza though.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

You also have to factor in Zambrano's yearly temper tantrum so it's good to have another option while he's being a big whiny bitch who doesn't deserve to wear a professional uniform.

[DaveWadding]

I hope his yearly temper tantrum this year involves a 95 mph fastball at the head of Joey Votto.

[Boomer]

I love reading Keltner lists during HOF season. Really gives you good perspective on if a guy deserves the HOF.

[Hanso Amore]

The Rays are essentially rebuilding. Their GM even says they cannot sustain success on their budget, so their plans are to reload, rebuild, contend, rinse repeat. By Success I mean as a WOrld Series COntender. They lose their big names, now they are rebuilding for another run.

[Hanso Amore]

I think that's what Hanso is saying though.

LOL Exactly.

I am saying winning an MVP does not equate to being the best or even a great player - to dispute the claim that Bagwell is a First Ballot player by winning an MVP. So....

Basically Aquakate repeated exactly my point, to counteract my point....

[Emperor Smeat]

The Rays used to be a $15-$20 million per year payroll team before becoming decent so it sort of makes sense why the GM or owner can't sustain long-term funding. The fanbase isn't strong enough in both revenue and interest to sustain an expensive team which probably means they don't get much in tv revenue either.

The 2010 payroll was $71 million so the team itself jumped a good $40-$50 million the last couple of years just to compete in the AL East and their youth playing great.

It won't take another 12 years to rebuild but at the same time they will be competing with the Orioles as the next team to rebound in the division unlike before when it was just the Rays alone.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

It looks like Soriano really wants to play for the Yankees. He is willing to be the 8th inning guy and that's the only team that he wouldn't mind being the 8th inning guy. But, it looks like it won't happen because they don't want to lose a pick for him.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Classic Yankees. Won't go after a big name at the expense of their farm system.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

Classic Yankees. Won't go after a big name at the expense of their farm system.

I can kinda understand their reasoning a little bit. If they were saying this for Lee I would be pissed as hell. But, they do have some options for 8th inning guy. And besides with the way our offseason is going I would much rather use whatever farm resources we have for a starter or 2 at the deadline not for a 8th inning guy.

Do you know what type of free agent Andruw Jones is? Is he A or B?

[glanville6]

Half the people in Chicago are crying because the Cubs got Matt Garza. Crying in anger because they traded 3 of their top 10 prospects.

As a Cub fan, I'm happy with the trade. Most of the Cubs prospects end up sucking anyway.

Cubs fans like to complain, whether it be something good or bad, we always find something to complain about.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

Half the people in Chicago are crying because the Cubs got Matt Garza. Crying in anger because they traded 3 of their top 10 prospects.

As a Cub fan, I'm happy with the trade. Most of the Cubs prospects end up sucking anyway.

Cubs fans like to complain, whether it be something good or bad, we always find something to complain about.

We'll see what they are like once they win a World Series. They have a lot to complain about. I feel kinda sorry for the Cubs and the fans.

[glanville6]

We won't see what its like to win a World Series...because they won't.

I'd like to see maybe another move by the Cubs this offseason...a second baseman maybe. Don't know who is available.

[Vox Populi]

Do you know what type of free agent Andruw Jones is? Is he A or B?

Andrew Jones hasn't been a type A free agent for quite a few years now, and if memory serves, he doesn't even qualify as a type B.

EDIT - just checked; he's neither. He'd cost the Yankees (or whomever) no compensation.

[glanville6]

Just a valuable roster spot

[Vox Populi]

It's funny because it's true.

[YOUR Hero]

The Rays had plenty of starters as well, so they're dealing from their strength. Price, Shields, Davis, Niemann, and Hellickson is still an impressive rotation.
Yup,
Problem is people don't know thesse names yet and think the Rays now have no pitching. They have pitching. If the Yankees or Red Sox have an off season the Rays will be a strong wild Card contender.

[Innovator]

People wanted Hellickson to get a start last postseason. Kid is good.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

I gotta say Tampa really scares me . With all this young pitching Tampa will be good for years to come. That's kinda why I don't want the Yankees to give away a great package for some great guy at the trade deadline. I want the Yankees to be filled with a bunch of young pitchers as well.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Let the record show that Hardkore Kidd J just said he wants the Yankees to be more like the Devil Rays.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

Let the record show that Hardkore Kidd J just said he wants the Yankees to be more like the Devil Rays.

I have never thought about that. But, you gotta admit it is sometimes a good strategy to have a lot of young pitchers on your team. It really does depend on how good the young pitcher/player is . Truth be told I think home grown talent is better sometimes.

I never really meant it that I want to be more like the Rays. I just think it's better sometimes to have a bunch of young promising players.

I think the Rays are gonna strike it big with this Chris Archer kid. I see big things from him.

[Skippord]

CarGo signed his contract today

:heart:

[DaveWadding]

Half the people in Chicago are crying because the Cubs got Matt Garza. Crying in anger because they traded 3 of their top 10 prospects.

As a Cub fan, I'm happy with the trade. Most of the Cubs prospects end up sucking anyway.

Cubs fans like to complain, whether it be something good or bad, we always find something to complain about.

Cubs fans are funny. They complained when the Cubs traded DeRosa to Cleveland and got nothing in return (Chris Archer). Now they trade Archer for Garza and they treat him like he's the second coming. I doubt any of the other guys (save Lee, maybe) would have had an impact on the Cubs future. IT's not like they dont have a good catcher in Soto and aren't locked up in the outfield with big contracts into eternity.

[ClockShot]

Brad Penny to the Tigers. 1-year, $3 mil.

[Vox Populi]

Confusing decision there at best. That whole "let's go sign a make-good contract with an American League team" approach didn't exactly go so well for Brad Penny last time around.

[Splaya]

Great deal for the Tigers

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>So, we're in mid-January. How would you grade your favortie team's offseasons?

Despite the relative lack of moves, I'm actually giving the Mets a solid B so far. They've stuck to the plan in not overpaying for players. If Omar was still in office, he probably would have handed out a regrettable 3 or 4 year deal. They got a new front office, new manager, haven't given out any multiyear deals except a 2-year deal for DJ Carrasco which is for basically no money. All of their acquisitions thus far can fill a need in the Opening Day roster, including both of their Rule 5 picks. I like it.

I'm certain they'll add an extra starter before the season begins (hopefully Chris Young) and possibly a lefty reliever (Beimel?) although Feliciano, Choate, and Ohman's deals kinda fucked up the market. A veteran reserve outfielder is also possible, but really not necessary. Nick Evans and Jason Pridie are probably serviceable enough.

Plus, as far as I'm concerned - the offseason isn't over until that Opening Day roster is set. There's a very good chance that Oliver Perez and Luis Castillo are getting released on cut down day, which automatically adds at least half a letter grade.</font>

[parkmania]

<font color=goldenrod>So, we're in mid-January. How would you grade your favortie team's offseasons?

</font>

I grade the Pirates a Z.

Not only is it the lowest letter in the alphabet, it's what the fans catch when they go to the games.

[ClockShot]

All-Time Saves leader Trevor Hoffman calls it a career.

601 career saves, a 2.87 ERA and 1133 strikeouts in 1089 1/3 innings for the Marlins, Padres and Brewers. Not bad for 18 seasons of work.

[ClockShot]

So, we're in mid-January. How would you grade your favortie team's offseasons?

I'll give the Yankees a B-

Not getting Cliff Lee really hurt them. The Hammer is back for another 2 seasons, and Jeter got re-signed for 3 more seasons for a little more than he should have gotten. But I can live with it. Feliciano will do nicely in the bullpen.

News came out today they're making a run a Justin Duchscherer. Missed all of 2009 and started 5 games in '10 before his hip gave out. Cashman had to do something. Either he's tired of waiting for Pettitte's decision, or it finally dawned on him that Nova and Mitre as the 4 and 5 starters would suck. Throw him a low-risk contract and I'll be happy because time is running out.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

I'll give the Yankees a B-

Not getting Cliff Lee really hurt them. The Hammer is back for another 2 seasons, and Jeter got re-signed for 3 more seasons for a little more than he should have gotten. But I can live with it. Feliciano will do nicely in the bullpen.

News came out today they're making a run a Justin Duchscherer. Missed all of 2009 and started 5 games in '10 before his hip gave out. Cashman had to do something. Either he's tired of waiting for Pettitte's decision, or it finally dawned on him that Nova and Mitre as the 4 and 5 starters would suck. Throw him a low-risk contract and I'll be happy because time is running out.

Yeah, but Nova does deserve to be the fifth starter at least. I think we may be able to tread water until the trade deadline. I give their offseason a C.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Give the Reds a B+. They had little money to work with and they lost Arthur Rhodes, but they kept Arroyo, they upgraded at shortstop, and I love love love the Bruce contract.

[MVP]

I'll give the Red Sox an A-. I'm thrilled with almost all of the moves they've made this off-season from acquiring Gonzalez to signing Crawford, Jenks, and Wheeler. The only negative for me is that Gonzalez hasn't been signed to a contract extension yet, but that may happen in March or at the beginning of the season.

[Innovator]

C- for Yankees. I would have given them a D but I approve of keeping Gardner over spending money for Crawford.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

C- for Yankees. I would have given them a D but I approve of keeping Gardner over spending money for Crawford.

I am truly confident that the trade deadline will be A-. The Red Sox by far had the greatest off season.

[Aguakate]

<font color=goldenrod>So, we're in mid-January. How would you grade your favortie team's offseasons?

</font>


My favorite team is the Cubs.

They got Carlos Pena...Matt Garza...Quade's the Manager...

...I don't know.

I'll give them a C.

[Skippord]

Rockies get an A. Locked up their two best players. Re signed De La Rosa. Signed Wigginton to back Helton up and Jose Lopez is a good pick up. Lindstrom as well. Also they're working on signing Ubaldo Jimenez to a long term contract.

[Triple Naitch]

Yankees should get a higher grade from you guys for not freaking out and overpaying for an average player after losing out on Lee and Crawford.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

Yankees should get a higher grade from you guys for not freaking out and overpaying for an average player after losing out on Lee and Crawford.

I don't think they ever wanted Crawford. Amazing enough from what I read Brett Gardner is their Carl Crawford . I like Gardner a lot so....... But, Lee I was so sure the Yankees would get him. The Free Agent pool was a little shallow so I figured that we'd at least trade for a pitcher.

[Emperor Smeat]

I doubt Crawford was a top priority but he was on the list of players to get or consider depending on what occurred to the Lee sweepstakes. Yankees definitely wanted Lee as their first major signing (not counting resigning Jeter or Riveria).

Crawford would have been their next priority but they spent too much time going after Lee that all they could do was attempt to drive up the price to retaliate when Red Sox kept driving up the prices on players Yankees wanted. Red Sox managed to make the Yankees spend almost $80 million on just keeping Jeter and Riveria when Yankees kept saying they wanted to spend much less than both of their asking prices.

[Damian Rey]

SAN DIEGO PADRES

Traded Adrian Gonzalez to Boston for RHP Casey Kelly, 1B Anthony Rizzo, OF Raymond Fuentes, and INF/OF Eric Patterson.

Trading you best offensive player hurt, but it was the lesser of two evils when you're market doesn't allow for the type of deal Boston is going to hand him. They got two very, very good pieces in Kelly and Rizzo, who could be apart of the team as early as 2012.

Traded for and extended shortstop Jason Bartlett through the 2012 season with an option for 2013. Big time upgrade. Everth Cabrera showed he is still in dire need of developing, and Bartlett is a massive, steady upgrade over both an inexperienced Cabrera and Jerry Hairston, Jr., who saw a ton of time at short last year with injuries to Cabrera.

Signed 2nd baseman Orlando Hudson to a 2 year, $11mil. deal. Again, another strong upgrade over last year's opening day suitor, David Eckstein. Hudson is not only younger, but is head and shoulder a much better overall player than Eckstein.

Signed RHP Aaron Harang to a one year deal. Welcome home Aaron. He is a good candidate for a bounce back year considering he'll be pitching half his starts in the most pitcher-friendly park and division in baseball.

Signed RHP Dustin Mosley. Mosley will likely be the swingman for the Padres, pitching long relief for the most part but also being available for the spot start if necessary.

Signed 1B/OF Brad Hawpe to a one year, $3mil. deal. Hawpe is the likely the opening day first baseman, and prior to last year, was a very, very solid middle of the order hitter for Colorado. He's only 31, and if healthy, a return to form is not unlikely.

Traded for OF Cameron Maybin. Maybin is still only 24 years old, is projected as 5 tool prospect, and even if he puts together a year similar to CF Mike Cameron's 2 year run with the Padres, it's not only a huge upgrade, but a huge win in the trade seeing as they only dealt two relief pitchers who were not huge role players in last year's 90 win season.

They've also acquired a slew of backup catchers, but none are shoe-ins for the backup role just yet.

Grade: B-

They addressed the glaring holes they had up the middle in with Bartlett, Hudson, and Maybin. They stocked the farm system with 3 of the BoSox's top 10 prospects, 2 of which are going to be good to great players in the near future. They filled out the rotation with a reliable innings eater. And they signed a guy who is coming off one bad year, and is a solid segue into either Anthony Rizzo or Kyle Blanks taking over in 2013 with Brad Hawpe.

The only negative this year has been the loss of Adrian, but they did the best you could hope for, and I'm glad they traded for younger, high ceiling players who are a year or two away rather than risking two draft picks who may or may not pan out.

[Damian Rey]

C- for Yankees. I would have given them a D but I approve of keeping Gardner over spending money for Crawford.

They would have been better off spending on Crawford. He's ten times the player Garnder is.

[Damian Rey]

Give the Reds a B+. They had little money to work with and they lost Arthur Rhodes, but they kept Arroyo, they upgraded at shortstop, and I love love love the Bruce contract.

The Bruce contract and the Arroyo extension are great, but I'm not seeing Renteria as much of an upgrade of Cabrera. Seems more like a lateral move if Renteria can stay healthy.

[Damian Rey]

I'll give the Yankees a B-

Not getting Cliff Lee really hurt them. The Hammer is back for another 2 seasons, and Jeter got re-signed for 3 more seasons for a little more than he should have gotten. But I can live with it. Feliciano will do nicely in the bullpen.

How is that a B? They lost out on their on their most desired free agent in Lee, and while Mo and Jeter being brought back are not bad moves, the team itself is not better than it was at the beginning of the off season.

I'd call the Yankees losers this off season. Outside of signing guys, who realistically weren't ever going anywhere, they didn't do anything to significantly upgrade.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Sounds like Pettitte might pull a Clemens. He's informed the Yankees that he hasn't retired, but he won't be ready by Opening Day if he does end up pitching.</font>

[Damian Rey]

<font color=goldenrod>Sounds like Pettitte might pull a Clemens. He's informed the Yankees that he hasn't retired, but he won't be ready by Opening Day if he does end up pitching.</font>

Pettitte is great and everything but I don't think the Yankees should sit around and wait on him if he's not going to push himself to be ready for Opening Day. may be time to go a different direction.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

Pettitte is great and everything but I don't think the Yankees should sit around and wait on him if he's not going to push himself to be ready for Opening Day. may be time to go a different direction.

The Yankees are not gonna be waiting for him. Pettite has told the Yankees to go a different direction. And Cashman isn't gonna be hounding him about it just get duchscherer and we're all set until the trading deadline at least.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

The Bruce contract and the Arroyo extension are great, but I'm not seeing Renteria as much of an upgrade of Cabrera. Seems more like a lateral move if Renteria can stay healthy.

Well actually according to Walt Jocketty, the Reds are going to have Paul Janish as their starting SS heading into spring training with Renteria coming off the bench and subbing every few games. Even though we all know Dusty loves his veterans, I'm inclined to believe Janish is going to get a decent amount of innings since he's the team's best fielder.

And if Janish can hit well enough that he can stay in the lineup, having Renteria as a pinch hitter is going to be huge.

[SammyG]

Dodgers: added some Hawksworth pitcher from the Cards, Juan Uribe,and Jon Garland.

I love our rotation. Kershaw, Billingsley, Lilly, Kuroda, Garland. Our hitting is terrible, though. We need a power hitting 3rd baseman or Left Fielder.

Grade: B-

[Loose Cannon]

pitching will kill the Yanks this year. there's no way around it. I am not liking this year at all right now. I could just see this year being the kind of year where injuries pile up and shit just happens. I think they will be in the race of course, but right now thier pitching staff is too weak to carry them. I don't trust AJ at all.

[Triple Naitch]

Ryan Howard on his bum ankle.

"I still get a little bit of stiffness every once in a while," he said. "I'll take it now and see what happens in Spring Training. I'll just continue to look after it and take care of it. Those kinds of things linger, like the Cranberries."

[Splaya]

LOL love Ryan Howard.

On the topic, I give the Tigers a B+. We resigned Magglio, signed Victor Martinez, got Benoit. If Zumaya stays healthy, I will totally love the bullpen. Signing Brad Penny was good too.

[Damian Rey]

Dodgers: added some Hawksworth pitcher from the Cards, Juan Uribe,and Jon Garland.

I love our rotation. Kershaw, Billingsley, Lilly, Kuroda, Garland. Our hitting is terrible, though. We need a power hitting 3rd baseman or Left Fielder.

Grade: B-

That divorce is killing the Dodgers right now. And as a Padres fan, I'm all for it.

This year might be Billingsley's last shot to prove whether or not he's going to live up to all the hype he's had as a Dodger.

Left field is a blackhole for them right now.

[SammyG]

Divorce killed us more last year than it will this year. Payroll went up 20 mil. We'll be fine. But yeah, definitely need LF help. Jay Gibbons... ugh.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Yanks sign Rafael Soriano. 3 years, $35 million

Kyle Farsnworth to the Rays

2 good moves for the Yanks</font>

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Actually not really. $35 million is a fuckload for a setup guy, but it the Yanks so its no biggie. I forgot they lose a DRAFT PICK for it. Pretty desparate.</font>

[Innovator]

Farnsworth is on a team we'll see 18 times?

YES

[Damian Rey]

Divorce killed us more last year than it will this year. Payroll went up 20 mil. We'll be fine. But yeah, definitely need LF help. Jay Gibbons... ugh.

Yea...but realistically what else is out there? Free agent crop is pretty barren and I don't know what kind of farm system depth they have and if it would be enough to trade for a younger left fielder.

[SammyG]

The fact that Posednik might start scares me.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

Actually not really. $35 million is a fuckload for a setup guy, but it the Yanks so its no biggie. I forgot they lose a DRAFT PICK for it. Pretty desparate.

Soriano is a good closer and I was a little angry that they wouldn't bolster their bullpen just because of a draft pick. All though I'd prefer a starting pitcher. I guess D-Rob and Joba aren't quite the 8th inning guys you had in mind eh Cashman?

[Innovator]

Joba, if he isn't packaged for someone, has LONG RELIEF written all over him.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

Joba, if he isn't packaged for someone, has LONG RELIEF written all over him.

Watch if a NL team signed him he would be a stud there. I think he'd be a great starter elsewhere.

[Innovator]

He might be one of those guys who needs to be in a small market without a media and Inno calling for his head when he goes 3.1 IP 8 R 12 H

[Supreme Olajuwon]

1 month till pitchers and catchers report :love: :love: :love:

[Triple Naitch]

The fact that Posednik might start scares me.

He's not on the team any more.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>I'm kind of surprised Podsednik hasn't found a team yet tbh. I think he's looking for 1 year, $3 million or something like that but the longer he waits until camp the more that number will go down.

I think he'd be the perfect kind of guy for the Mets to grab as their 4th OFer. Speed and defense are crucial for the fill-in guy.</font>

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Jeff Francis signs with the Royals for one year. Not sure of the dollars yet, but I'd guess it's something like $1-2 million guaranteed with an extra million or 2 in incentives.

I think Chris Young may have been waiting for Francis to go off the board, so I hope the Mets throw an offer his way now.</font>

[Triple Naitch]

Podsednik has had a good couple of past seasons. I think he'll wind up in Anaheim.

[ClockShot]

Man, we didn't need Soriano. And that is way too much money.

And this come like 1 week after Cashman said he wasn't giving up the pick.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

Man, we didn't need Soriano. And that is way too much money.

And this come like 1 week after Cashman said he wasn't giving up the pick.


There must be a trade in the horizon. Someone must have wanted Joba and or D-rob in a package for a starter. That's the only way you can make sense out of it. Having Feliciano, Joba, D-rob, and Soriano is to many 8th inning guys. There's gotta be some trade.

[MVP]

Soriano has an opt-out clause after this season and the next one, so the Yankees may not even have to pay him all of that ridiculous set-up man money if he decides he wants to actually close on a different team.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Mets sign Willie Harris to a minor league deal with a Spring Training invite.

Fuck yes. Now he can't kill the Mets by making a ridiculous game-ending catch for the other team. Probably has the inside track for one of the backup outfielder spots.

Second time this week that the Mets have brought in a guy on a minor league deal with a ST invite where I think they will actually be on the Opening Day roster (the other being Taylor Tankersley as a lefty specialist).</font>

[Innovator]

I'm all for getting Soriano. Lots of games were lost last year because there wasn't a bridge to Mariano.

[ClockShot]

Grant Balfour to the A's. 2-years, 8.1 mil with a club option for '13.

Jim Thome goes back to the Twins. 1-year, $3 mil. with incentives based on plate appearances.

Not much left on the market. Pavano is probably going back to the Twins, Manny is still out there, only about a month and a half before pitchers and catchers fly out for spring training.

[SammyG]

oh thank god Posednik is not with us anymore. That's how much I didn't give a shit about him.

[parkmania]

If Pods isn't signed by opening day, he'll come to the Pirates. They are the last hope for career rehabilitation.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Was watching a re-run from yesterday of an MLB Network series - "The Top 10 Right Now". Each episode they go over a different position and list the top 10, well, right now.

The episode I watched was on left fielders. Was funny to watch because they never stated the criteria or who was voting.

10. Raul Ibanez
9. Carlos Lee
8. Jason Bay
7. Martin Prado
6. Delmon Young
5. Matt Holliday
4. Carl Crawford
3. Carlos Gonzalez
2. Josh Hamilton
1. Ryan Braun

lol @ it clearly being based 100% on offense. Prado making the list despite a grand total of 3 appearances in left field during his career

Mitch Williams and Kevin Millar agreed with the 8-10 picks despite them having down years. Can't really see how Soriano didn't fit into that discussion. They both agreed that Hamilton should be #2 but argued for like 5 minutes about who should be #1 between CarGo and Braun.

MW: "There is NO WAY that Carlos Gonzalez isn't the best left fielder right now."
KM: "He had a good year, but look at Braun's track record."
MW: "The name of the show is RIGHT NOW!"</font>

[Skippord]

that made me love Mitch Williams even more than I already did

[SammyG]

Sports fans! I love you all, I am retiring officially from TPWW.

[Damian Rey]

Sports fans! I love you all, I am retiring officially from TPWW.

Did we miss something? What's with the retirement?

[Triple Naitch]

See you when the Lakers win again. :wave:

[ClockShot]

So Albert Pujols gave the Cardinals until spring training to work out a new deal with him. If not, he's gonna become a free agent after this season.

Do you believe him?

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>No. I can buy that he wants to have a deadline for a new deal before putting it aside and focusing on the season, but after the season he'll re-sign with the Cardinals.

The Cards literally have no choice in the matter. When his career is over he might be a Top 5 player of all time. Gotta keep him even though he may want 10 years and, dare I say, $300 million.</font>

[Supreme Olajuwon]

So Albert Pujols gave the Cardinals until spring training to work out a new deal with him. If not, he's gonna become a free agent after this season.

Do you believe him?

Leverage. That's all that is and nothing more.

[Droford]

I'll give the Os a B-

New and Improved infield of Reynolds/Hardy/Roberts/Lee
New closer in Kevin Gregg, and bullpen help in Accardo

But no veteran starting pitcher and they lost Ty Wigginton who I feel would have been nice as a bench player with his versatility but it was pretty obvious he was leaving.

The offense should be greatly improved and if the pitching is as effective as it was late last year under Showalter then I might be wrong about wanting a veteran SP.

[Hanso Amore]

I honestly think Pujols will take a Mauer like deal. I dont see him wanting to go anywhere else. Just seems like the type of guy that wants to stay with one team his whole career.

[ClockShot]

Reds give their MVP Joey Votto a 3-year, $38 mil. extension.

[Emperor Smeat]

Ever since A-Rod was able to get a $300 million deal, Pujhols agent has been using that against the Cards who want to give him a big deal but nothing that long.

No way he'd actually leave the Cards but him as a DH in an AL club could solve the problem of the later part of the years since all he'd need to do is hit.

[Damian Rey]

Hanso's got it right, me thinks. Pujols means a lot to that town, but I think the Cards mean a lot to Albert as well. I think he's worth ARod money, and he will likely be a top 5 all time player if he continues his pace and stays healthy.

I don't think he's going to take a major discount though. He could easily command $25mil per year over the next 5 to 7 years.

[Hanso Amore]

How is he just now getting to a big deal? Isnt this like his 11th season? Shouldnt he have it the market already?

[Hanso Amore]

I mean, what kind of contract is he on now? He was an MVP at the point his arbitration years should have been up, why no big deal then?

[Triple Naitch]

Cards locked him up way early in his career. Kinda like what the Rockies are doing now with CarGo and Tulo. He signed an 8-year $111 million contract in '04.

[Aguakate]

I don't know why, but I look at Albert Pujols, and he's a great hitter, don't get me wrong, terrific ballplayer...but he looks to me like a hitter that will have one of his usual big seasons one year, and then the year after that will start to get injuries and will start to slow down, and basically all of a sudden, "overnight" is you will, is going to be worn out and age quickly. Similar to what has happened to Manny Ramirez, and what happened to Sosa.

[Damian Rey]

I don't know why, but I look at Albert Pujols, and he's a great hitter, don't get me wrong, terrific ballplayer...but he looks to me like a hitter that will have one of his usual big seasons one year, and then the year after that will start to get injuries and will start to slow down, and basically all of a sudden, "overnight" is you will, is going to be worn out and age quickly. Similar to what has happened to Manny Ramirez, and what happened to Sosa.

Sosa isn't anywhere near the caliber of ball player Pujols is. And yea, what you described is pretty much how it works when a player is entering their mid 30s.

He's still just 31. Outside of minor elbow issues, he hasn't really battled much injuries in his career and has played at least 143 games every year of his career. Moving him to 1st base has only prolonged his career as he won't have the wear and tear he would've endured playing the outfield or 3rd base.

I think he's going to be extremely productive for the next 5 years. Once his hits 35 and beyond, the numbers will undoubtedly drop off, but that doesn't mean he's going to all of a sudden fall of a cliff.

[Aguakate]

Sosa isn't anywhere near the caliber of ball player Pujols is. And yea, what you described is pretty much how it works when a player is entering their mid 30s.

He's still just 31. Outside of minor elbow issues, he hasn't really battled much injuries in his career and has played at least 143 games every year of his career. Moving him to 1st base has only prolonged his career as he won't have the wear and tear he would've endured playing the outfield or 3rd base.

I think he's going to be extremely productive for the next 5 years. Once his hits 35 and beyond, the numbers will undoubtedly drop off, but that doesn't mean he's going to all of a sudden fall of a cliff.

I think he will. I dont know why, I just feel it.

[Damian Rey]

I think he will. I dont know why, I just feel it.

Think he will what? Fall of a cliff offensively? I really have my doubts. He won't be having 45HR seasons in 6 or 7 years, but he will still be a middle of the order threat, IMO.

He's just one of those players that comes around a couple times a generation that, when healthy, becomes one of the greatest ever. And he is going to be the most prolific homerun hitter since ARod.

[McLegend]

There is no way Pujols is 31.

[Aguakate]

There is no way Pujols is 31.

Looks like he is, it says he was born January 16, 1980. He certainly looks older than 31, and if it wasn't for the fact he went to High School and College in the States, I would think there was something fishy.

[DaveWadding]

Cubs trade Tom Gorzelanny to the Nationals for 3 prospects.

[ClockShot]

Cubs trade Tom Gorzelanny to the Nationals for 3 prospects.

Poor Tom drew the short straw.

[Vox Populi]

Gorzelanny's got really good makeup, but hasn't yet put it together consistently at the big league level. Low risk, high reward potential here, especially when you consider that he's under team control until 2014.

[ClockShot]

Jason Giambi goes back to the Rockies on a minor league deal. He'll get $1 mil. if he makes the team out of spring training.

Yankees and Andruw Jones are close to a 1-year deal. :(

Brian Fuentes to the A's on a 2-year deal.

[Triple Naitch]

A's are quietly having one of the better offseasons.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>There it is. Mets sign Chris Young, pending physical.

Mike Pelfrey, R.A. Dickey, Jon Niese, Chris Young, Chris Capuano (or Dillon Gee)

I honestly like that rotation more than I like last year's Opening Day rotation which included Santana. That's how happy I am to see Maine and (presumably) Perez gone.</font>

[Hardkore Kidd J]

Jason Giambi goes back to the Rockies on a minor league deal. He'll get $1 mil. if he makes the team out of spring training.

Yankees and Andruw Jones are close to a 1-year deal. :(

Brian Fuentes to the A's on a 2-year deal.

Why are you sad about Andruw Jones on a 1 year deal? For one it's not like he is gonna be a starter. I think if Jones signs he will be a bench guy. And besides it's only a 1 year deal.

[Innovator]

"Hey remember when Andruw Jones was a force in the World Series against us? Let's get him"

"Wait wasn't that 96?"

[ClockShot]

Why are you sad about Andruw Jones on a 1 year deal? For one it's not like he is gonna be a starter. I think if Jones signs he will be a bench guy. And besides it's only a 1 year deal.

I'd rather give Golson a chance.

3G coverage in the outfield when Swisher needs a day off.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

I'd rather give Golson a chance.

3G coverage in the outfield when Swisher needs a day off.

Personally I would of preferred Golson or the other CC as the 4th outfielder myself. But, I'm sure all 3 of them will have their chance in the outfield.

[ClockShot]

Other than some arb. signings here and there, Gil Meche has decided to hang them up.

[Dragon]

Not sure why anyone would be upset about Andruw Jones. Pretty much what Thames is except he can actually play the outfield. Not like he once could but still a million times better than Marcus Thames.

[Loose Cannon]

Gil Meche retires @ 31. dam. very young

[Droford]

Detroit DFA'ed Armando Galarraga to make room for Brad Penny, and supposedly the Orioles are interested.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

Not sure why anyone would be upset about Andruw Jones. Pretty much what Thames is except he can actually play the outfield. Not like he once could but still a million times better than Marcus Thames.

He's better then Kearns too right? That's why I don't understand how people can be upset. I am just a little pissed that Golson or Curtis aren't given a shot.

I think the Yankees should look into Armando now. We are gonna need another pitcher.

[Splaya]

He's better then Kearns too right? That's why I don't understand how people can be upset. I am just a little pissed that Golson or Curtis aren't given a shot.

I think the Yankees should look into Armando now. We are gonna need another pitcher.


We will trade you Galragga for Granderson and Joba :shifty:

[Hardkore Kidd J]

We will trade you Galragga for Granderson and Joba :shifty:

You can take Joba. We don't even want anything for him just take him.:lol:

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Remember when Yankee fans were fellating Joba not too long ago?</font>

[Innovator]

Remember the Mets?

[Gertner]

Jays sign Jon Rauch for 1 year. If Chad Cordero is decent I kinda like our bullpen although I don't know just having Purcey as our only lefty. Dotel, Rauch, Frasor, Purcey, Camp, Janssen is better than I thought this bullpen would look. LOVE our offence this year. The Jays may hit more home runs than they did last year.

C: Arencibia
1b: Lind
2b: Hill
SS: Escobar
3b: Bautista
DH: Encarnacion
LF: Snider
CF: Wells
RF: Davis

Eric Chavez worked out for the Jays. If the Jays sign him and put him at 3rd and move Bautista to RF the Jays have the potential to have every player hit double digits in home runs.

[Damian Rey]

They'd need Bautista to pretty much repeat last year if they want to hit more homeruns, and objectively, I don't see that happening.

Dodgers picking up Thames was an okay move. It will, at the least, give them an opportunity to platoon him and Jay Gibbons and keep Tony Gwynn Jr. out of the lineup.

[Gertner]

I'm calling this now: Encarnacion will hit 35. He's so friggen strong and if he ever develops consistency he can hit 35. Remember though, Lind's power numbers were down, as were Hill, plus Arencibia has a ton of power, and Snider can easily hit 20-25.

[glanville6]

Gil Meche retires @ 31. dam. very young

He'll be back. He'll get the itch.

Glad Sean Marshall is locked up for two more years with the Cubbies.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Edwin Encarnacion will be lucky to hit 35 singles next year. He's garbage. Sorry.

[Miotch]

I think I'm going to make it a point to participate in the TPWW baseball threads this year.

Sup people?

[Supreme Olajuwon]

who is your team of rooting preference

[ClockShot]

And the Yankees sign Andruw Jones. Thanks to the Soriano signing the 40-man is now full so someone is getting bounced to make room for Jones. :mad:

Let's see if he can do what Marcus Thames did last year. That guy was money well spent.

[Innovator]

FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK

[Triple Naitch]

Hey Yanks fans. What do you think about Cashman saying publicly he didn't want to sign Soriano?

[Aguakate]

Hey Yanks fans. What do you think about Cashman saying publicly he didn't want to sign Soriano?

Cashman feeling a little free nowadays, huh?

When George was in charge, he'd never have said that, 'cause he'd be fired on the spot.

...he IS right, however. Soriano shouldn't get paid "Mariano Rivera money".

[ClockShot]

Hey Yanks fans. What do you think about Cashman saying publicly he didn't want to sign Soriano?

More power to him. I don't think the fanbase in general wanted Raffy Soriano signed.

[Aguakate]

More power to him. I don't think the fanbase in general wanted Raffy Soriano signed.

That's what I dont get. They fight with Jeter over money, yet they go out and sign Soriano for what, $15Mil a season?

[Emperor Smeat]

I've heard Soriano was more of a reaction signing to all the news of the Red Sox improving a lot with their new players and loosing out on the Lee/Crawford and other big name races when the media and fans expect the Yankees to sign anyone they want.

Carl Pavano was rumored to be signed by the Yankees again until Minnesota gave him a 2nd year on his deal. This is a player the fans hated the first time and sort of liked then back to hated the 2nd time with the team.

Cashman was considering Pavano while rejecting Soriano while Hank wanted Soriano and rejected Pavano initially.

[ClockShot]

That's what I dont get. They fight with Jeter over money, yet they go out and sign Soriano for what, $15Mil a season?

I was alright with 3-years, $45 mil. Cashman was the guy who kicked it up to a little over $50 and that was no big deal.

What you're missing is that president Randy Levine was the guy who wanted Soriano. And since President is a few rungs above General Manager on the executive ladder, you kinda don't have a choice but to take orders.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>MLBN just listed David Wright as the 6th best 3B in baseball. WTF

Leiter and Millar both said he should be higher. They're right. Putting Beltre ahead of him is a joke.</font>

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>I also think it's pretty ridiculous that Levine and Hank went over Cash's head. Don't really see the point in having a GM if you're just gonna make signings he doesn't think should be made.</font>

[Miotch]

who is your team of rooting preference
The Twins of Minnesota

[Droford]

I cant believe the Os are on the verge of signing Vlad.

Really wanted him in 2003, didnt get him and now hes a washed up has been so "HEY, COME TO BALTIMORE!"

ugh

[Hardkore Kidd J]

I cant believe the Os are on the verge of signing Vlad.

Really wanted him in 2003, didnt get him and now hes a washed up has been so "HEY, COME TO BALTIMORE!"

ugh

Weird I thought Luke Scott was doing a pretty good job as a DH. Either 2 things will happen Vlad will play the Outfield or Scott would play in the Outfield. I don't think I'm the only one who thinks it should be the latter.

Okay, Droford I got a question for you , who would you rather sign with the Orioles , Vlad or Manny?

[Triple Naitch]

Vlad won a silver slugger last year.

[screech]

Love Vlad

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Angels trade Mike Napoli and possibly Juan Rivera to the Blue Jays for Vernon Wells

The fuck?</font>

[Triple Naitch]

whoa

[Loose Cannon]

RAPE

[Miotch]

The Rays just signed Manny AND Damon. Jesus.

Who fucked themselves worse today, Anaheim or Tampa?

[Emperor Smeat]

I thought Damon wanted to stay with Detroit after he gave that speech about him wanting to stay in Detroit and help the "younger" players while taking less money.

Of course he really didn't want to go back to Boston (or New York) but it makes his speech a bit worthless now.

At least Tampa Bay was smart enough to give both players heavy incentive-laced contracts so if Manny starts to goof off, he hurts his chances at gaining more money.

[Gertner]

I can't believe my Jays got rid of Wells's contract. Friggen awesome. We needed help at catcher and Napoli can flat out mash. Rivera will be a decent stopgap until Gose is ready.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

The Rays just signed Manny AND Damon. Jesus.

Who fucked themselves worse today, Anaheim or Tampa?

I'm actually kinda worried about Manny and Damon on the same team. The Yankees will be fine but hitting wise they have gotten better. I'm guessing Damon is gonna be the Left Fielder. Manny is most likely gonna be DH. I thought Manny was gonna sign with the Pirates or something.

[ClockShot]

I can't believe my Jays got rid of Wells's contract. Friggen awesome. We needed help at catcher and Napoli can flat out mash. Rivera will be a decent stopgap until Gose is ready.

I was gonna say that.

A.A. is a fucking genius now for unloading that contract, although the talk of Toronto sending the Angels money is still up in the air.

ManRam and Damon to the Rays.......didn't see that coming. Kinda pissed the Yankees gotta see Ramirez for ANOTHER 18 games this season.

[Gertner]

A.A is doing a very under-rated job. Dealt an aging Gonzalez for Escobar, dealt Brandon League for Morrow who was killer stuff, got good value for Halladay (Drabek looks awesome and I've heard nothing but great things from D'arnaud and Gose), rebuilt the farm system and now just fleeced Anaheim. From what I heard no money is going to Anaheim. Even moves like trading for Miguel Olivo just so he could get a draft pick when he signs elsewhere is so smart. Really excited to see where this team is headed as they finally have some direction after Ricchardi fucked it up.

[Vox Populi]

In late breaking news, the Tampa Bay Rays have invited Mark Bellhorn, Doug Mirabelli, Pokey Reese and Dave McCarty to Spring Training.

[Droford]

Weird I thought Luke Scott was doing a pretty good job as a DH. Either 2 things will happen Vlad will play the Outfield or Scott would play in the Outfield. I don't think I'm the only one who thinks it should be the latter.

Okay, Droford I got a question for you , who would you rather sign with the Orioles , Vlad or Manny?

neither

Seriously, theres no need to retread Albert Belle/Sammy Sosa crap again signing washed up sluggers to contracts so fans of the Orioles can watch whats left of their careers fall off the cliff in a car crash. Vlad might of have won a Silver Slugger last year, big whoop.

Luke Scott finally adjusted to being the fulltime DH last year after being used as a DH and OF in 09. Im perfectly fine with the Pie/Jones/Markakis OF considering the other improvements theyve made.

[Nightwing]

Manny Ramirez, and Johnny Damon to the Rays.

Damon gets $5.25MM for one year, Ramirez gets $2MM

Decent pickups if they can perform, but Ramirez is on the quick decline so.

[Gertner]

Damon was bad last year in Detroit. He's a waste of money.

[Damian Rey]

Damon put up solid numbers. They're not bringing him in to carry the team. Just to try and help bolster the top of the lineup.

Manny DH'n every day is going to extend his season and maximize his value. I don't think anyone doubts that can still hit. The problem has been keeping him healthy, and playing left field everyday for the Dodgers wasn't helping.

I think Manny will do fine so long as he's motivated.

And, boy, what a terrible off season for the Angels. They missed out on their two top free agent choices in Beltre and Crawford. Then they give up some cheap, steady offense in Napoli for an overpaid Vernon Wells.

[Gertner]

Detroit fans didn't like Damon. I'm from the area and people constantly bitched about him. He's slowed down and has no arm and his numbers aren't great. If Manny is the dh then I don't know where the hell Damon will play.

[Vox Populi]

Damon will play in the outfield regularly despite the fact that he's been a bit of a mess defensively for quite some time now. They're not paying him close to 5.75 mil plus attainable incentives to ride the pine, as the Rays would never do such a thing, and he's less of a defensive liability than Manny.

[Gertner]

That doesn't say much.

[Vox Populi]

No, it really doesn't.

[Hanso Amore]

Word is The jays traded Wells to free money up to give a huge contract to batista...who will surely drop off the face of the earth.

[screech]

If I'm a Rays fan I think I'd rather have Manny in the field than Damon.

[Gertner]

The Jays are going to spend the money on the draft since they have 7 of the first 80 picks. I doubt Bautista will make anywhere near as much as Wells since A.A throws money like he throws manhole covers.

[Vox Populi]

If I'm a Rays fan I think I'd rather have Manny in the field than Damon.

Damon has a terrible arm, but has speed and range at his disposal, has a general idea how to go about playing his position, and doesn't make mental mistakes. I'd take that over Manny's once average at best arm and no positives in those other categories.

Damon should probably be a designated hitter at this point in his career, but would need to play the field if he had a teammate who more needs to be a DH at this point in his career. Manny Ramirez is definitely one of those someones.

True story - Johnny Damon is closer to a Hall of Famer than most people realize. The 10 players through age 36 that his career lines most resemble include 4 Hall of Famers, Tim Raines (who probably should be one himself), and Pete Rose.

[screech]

I've seen Damon make his fair share of mental mistakes in the field. I'm not really sure how they're gonna play it, though. Will they switch between DH/OF?

[screech]

Would be pretty hilarious to see Manny and Damon platoon LF.

[Damian Rey]

I wouldn't call Damon a HOF'er. He just seems like a guy who has kinda stuck around past his prime and accumulated stats rather than just flat out being dominant during his prime.

And Screech, you DO NOT want Manny in left field. Coming from a San Diego Padres fan who got to see Manny play left field for the Dodgers, he is absolutely horrendous. Not a good sight to see.

As for Bautista, I don't think one fluke year should earn him some huge contract. This is what got Riccardi in trouble. he handed Alex Rios and Wells these over bloated contracts for one elite offensive year and it came back to bite him and ultimately cost him his job.

If I'm the Jays, I see what Bautista does this year, and use it as a gage for the future. He's not going to hit 50 plus home runs. Every home run minus one went to left field. You would think he's going to get pounded on the outside third of the plate till he proves he can go with the pitch for power.

[screech]

I know Manny isn't great, but Damon is awful too. Almost a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation there.

[Triple Naitch]

There's a lot more ground to cover in Tropicana than Fenway. Damon is better suited for there. Although Manny played better off the green monster better than anybody else has in a while.

[Gertner]

I wouldn't call Damon a HOF'er. He just seems like a guy who has kinda stuck around past his prime and accumulated stats rather than just flat out being dominant during his prime.

And Screech, you DO NOT want Manny in left field. Coming from a San Diego Padres fan who got to see Manny play left field for the Dodgers, he is absolutely horrendous. Not a good sight to see.

As for Bautista, I don't think one fluke year should earn him some huge contract. This is what got Riccardi in trouble. he handed Alex Rios and Wells these over bloated contracts for one elite offensive year and it came back to bite him and ultimately cost him his job.

If I'm the Jays, I see what Bautista does this year, and use it as a gage for the future. He's not going to hit 50 plus home runs. Every home run minus one went to left field. You would think he's going to get pounded on the outside third of the plate till he proves he can go with the pitch for power.

Bautista is in arbitration right now so I imagine he'll get 1 year 10.5 mill, play out the year and A.A will go from there.

[Vox Populi]

There's a lot more ground to cover in Tropicana than Fenway. Damon is better suited for there. Although Manny played better off the green monster better than anybody else has in a while.

Manny directly benefited from an almost impossible level of luck in regards to playing left at Fenway. He had a fairly ridiculous number of balls take improbable bounces right to him while an inexperienced, clueless or poor runner tried to stretch out a double. His immediate predecessor was Troy O'Leary, who played left substantially better. His immediate follow-up was Jason Bay, who committed all of one error in his year and a half in Boston (including a goose egg in '09) and who had nearly twice as many assists in '09 - mostly legit, non-wall aided assists at that - than Manny averaged during his time in Boston.

Manny being such a piss-poor overall outfielder and Johnny's spaghetti arm have to be one of the key reasons why many Red Sox fans continue to hold Trot Nixon in an insanely high regard. Nixon was certainly well above average defensively, but standing next to those two in the outfield, he looked like the next coming of Willie Mays.

[DaveWadding]

Iteresting day in D'Backs land today. Acquired Armando "PG" Galarraga from Detroit for a couple middling minor leaguers and re-signed the best hitting pitcher I've ever seen, Micah Owings.

[OssMan]

nats got todd coffey fuck yeah

[Skippord]

If I'm a Rays fan I think I'd rather have Manny in the field than Damon.
I think I would rather have a ham sandwich in the field than either of them

[Damian Rey]

Bautista is in arbitration right now so I imagine he'll get 1 year 10.5 mill, play out the year and A.A will go from there.

That's a good point. If Bautista has another good year, and I'm talking 30 plus homers, someone might buy into him and overpay the Jays in prospects. I think Bautista's biggest value for the Jays comes at the trade deadline if he continues to hit well.

[Damian Rey]

Manny directly benefited from an almost impossible level of luck in regards to playing left at Fenway. He had a fairly ridiculous number of balls take improbable bounces right to him while an inexperienced, clueless or poor runner tried to stretch out a double. His immediate predecessor was Troy O'Leary, who played left substantially better. His immediate follow-up was Jason Bay, who committed all of one error in his year and a half in Boston (including a goose egg in '09) and who had nearly twice as many assists in '09 - mostly legit, non-wall aided assists at that - than Manny averaged during his time in Boston.

Manny being such a piss-poor overall outfielder and Johnny's spaghetti arm have to be one of the key reasons why many Red Sox fans continue to hold Trot Nixon in an insanely high regard. Nixon was certainly well above average defensively, but standing next to those two in the outfield, he looked like the next coming of Willie Mays.

The funny thing about Jason Bay is that he is not considered a good outfielder. He's average at best from what I've gathered.

In Padres news, GM Jed Hoyer signed Jorge Cantu to a one year, $850,000 contract pending a physical. I love this signing. Gives the Padres a solid right handed bat off the bench who can cover 1st and 3rd base for guys who don't particularly hit well against LH pitching. Not to mention, the potential for the numbers he could produce is worth way more than $850k.

Looks like the biggest question mark for the Padres going into spring training is who gets the 5th spot in the rotation.

[ClockShot]

Adam LaRoche's little brother Andy goes to the A's on a minor league deal with an invite to spring training.

Jorge Cantu to the Padres on a 1-year deal.

[screech]

Manny played so well off the monster because he just waited for the ball to come to him. Loved watching him play there.

[Gertner]

That's a good point. If Bautista has another good year, and I'm talking 30 plus homers, someone might buy into him and overpay the Jays in prospects. I think Bautista's biggest value for the Jays comes at the trade deadline if he continues to hit well.

I agree 100%. The Jays should be ready to make a run at around 2013. Bautista by all account should be tailing off. The Jays should deal him for some young position players.

[Innovator]

Tampa's outfield could be the worst defensively now.

[Gertner]

Jays deal Mike Napoli to the Rangers for Frank Francisco and cash.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Better bolt down the chairs at the Skydome.

[ClockShot]

Jays deal Mike Napoli to the Rangers for Frank Francisco and cash.

Wow. Napoli couldn't even take his shoes off before A.A. flipped him.

But for Crazy Frank Francisco? Doesn't make sense.

[ClockShot]

Wandy Rodriguez stays in Houston. 3-years, $34 mil.

[Damian Rey]

I agree 100%. The Jays should be ready to make a run at around 2013. Bautista by all account should be tailing off. The Jays should deal him for some young position players.

Could be even sooner considering the pitching pieces they still have. Ricky Romero, Brandon Morrow, Kyle Drabek (coming soon) etc. Not to mention, Arancibia looks like he's the guy this year, though he should've been getting Buck's ab's last September. They got a young shortstop who, if he changes his attitude, could blossom into a very good line drive hitter with solid d. It'll be interesting to see how the Jays do this year.

[Damian Rey]

The Rangers look like they're going to run away with the division. Again. Napoli is prob. gonna DH for them. With a returning middle infield that's only getting better, an upgrade at third in Beltre, and another year of Hamilton/Cruz in the OF, the Rangers are looking better and better.

My only question concerning them is where does Micheal Young play? Mitch Mooreland is surely their opening day first baseman. Can Young move to left, or is there another player blocking him there? Pretty nice problem for the Express and co. to have.

[Damian Rey]

Just read breifly that GM Brian Cashman expects Jeter to be in centerfield by the time his current deal runs out. I thought the outfield would be an option, but CENTERFIELD? His range is already dimished. Centerfield is a very range-driven position. I'd say a corner spot for the Captain is a more appropriate move when the time comes.

[Emperor Smeat]

ESPN had the stat that Jeter, while winning a Gold Glove, costs about 61 defensive runs in a season which is #1 worst in MLB and #1 worst in AL. Only reason they never moved Jeter from SS when they got A-Rod was due to potential fan backlash and they don't have anyone of a Jeter-quality to replace him at SS without upsetting Jeter.

Cashman also said Red Sox are better than the Yankees and that Mariano is the best Yankee he's seen during his time with the team (he's soured on Jeter last few years).

[Jeritron]

I don't know what's going on with Cashman and the Steinbrenner's over there but it sounds like a fucking mess and getting worse

[McLegend]

First off let's be fair. Mariano Riveria is the best Yankee of Brian Cashman's era. Since when did Cashman grow a pair btw? He's been really quiet these last few years, and now for him to suddenly come out and say these things is rather interesting.

Also there is no way Jeter is going to move to Centerfield. That's never happening.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Prolly just trying to steal focus from the Red Sox and Phillies. Notice how nobody's talked about them since Cashman opened his mouth.

[Jeritron]

True. Or maybe they're just not getting along and Cashman's airing the dirty laundry? Either way it seems tense.

[MVP]

Apparently the Red Sox tried to acquire Jose Bautista during the winter meetings, but an agreement was never reached which is what motivated them to sign Carl Crawford. I think the Red Sox are better off now, not that I'm opposed to the team having Bautista on the team, but having Bautista for possibly one season as opposed to Crawford for the next eight is no contest as to which makes them better off.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>First televised ST game a month from today</font> :love:

[Damian Rey]

Apparently the Red Sox tried to acquire Jose Bautista during the winter meetings, but an agreement was never reached which is what motivated them to sign Carl Crawford. I think the Red Sox are better off now, not that I'm opposed to the team having Bautista on the team, but having Bautista for possibly one season as opposed to Crawford for the next eight is no contest as to which makes them better off.

Crawford offers more value, in my opinion. He's a prototypical 2 hitter, and in that lineup and ballpark, is going to be dangerous. Bautista is a fluke as far as I'm concerned. if he goes out and hits another 30 HR while hitting around .250 I'll give him some more credit but one year does not equal a trend.

Back to the Yanks and Jetes...maybe Cashman is tired of being dragged around. he takes an awful lot of abuse in the media, and anytime the team doesn't win, it comes down to him with the blame. Though he should be held responsible to an extent, it's not as if he's the one out there playing.

Jeter at shortstop is horrendous. He has to be one of the most overrated defensive players in the last 10 years. The gold glove is a joke voted on by managers. If you're popular, as Jeter is around the league, then you will win the award.

I'm sure the COULD HAVE found a better option at short, but have chosen not to. That could come back to hurt them in the end. ARod should have been at short from day one. Fan backlash can piss off. ARod was by far the better player on both sides of the ball.

Oh well. I think Jeter will get moved to LF or RF by 2013 and the Yankees will have either traded for or signed a better defensive option.

[Innovator]

Yankees sign Bartolo Colon to minor league deal.

Really? Why are we picking up everyone who was good 12 years ago?

[DaveWadding]

because the Yankees wish they could go back and be as good as they were 12 years ago?

[ClockShot]

Yankees sign Bartolo Colon to minor league deal.

Really? Why are we picking up everyone who was good 12 years ago?

SWB is gonna be fun to watch this season. Mark Prior, Bartolo Colon, Kei Igawa's last season................:shifty:

[Innovator]

Might have to make a trip to Scranton this year.

[MVP]

Hey, maybe the Yankees will sign Mike Hampton too.

[Innovator]

I hear Cashman is looking at Mo Vaughn.

[Emperor Smeat]

Forget Mo Vaughn, Julio Franco is the better option.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Yankees sign Bartolo Colon to minor league deal.

Really? Why are we picking up everyone who was good 12 years ago?

Which one are you talking about? Jeter, Rivera, Pettitte, or Posada?

[Gertner]

Wow. Napoli couldn't even take his shoes off before A.A. flipped him.

But for Crazy Frank Francisco? Doesn't make sense.

The Jays bullpen going into this season had Jon Rauch and Octavio Dotel battling for the closer spot. Not good. Plus, our only consistent arms left via free agency(Downs) and the bullpen sucked to begin with. Napoli was just going to take time away from Arencibia.

[Gertner]

Could be even sooner considering the pitching pieces they still have. Ricky Romero, Brandon Morrow, Kyle Drabek (coming soon) etc. Not to mention, Arancibia looks like he's the guy this year, though he should've been getting Buck's ab's last September. They got a young shortstop who, if he changes his attitude, could blossom into a very good line drive hitter with solid d. It'll be interesting to see how the Jays do this year.

Hechivarra is a young ss in the wings as well. The Jays tops prospects are sooooo young though. Any sooner seems unrealistic,

[Innovator]

Which one are you talking about? Jeter, Rivera, Pettitte, or Posada?
1 out of 4 ain't bad right?

[Damian Rey]

Hechivarra is a young ss in the wings as well. The Jays tops prospects are sooooo young though. Any sooner seems unrealistic,

We will see. I'm def. rooting for them. They can swing it. But like you said, the bullpen is a question and they need their young starters to emerge.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

Crawford offers more value, in my opinion. He's a prototypical 2 hitter, and in that lineup and ballpark, is going to be dangerous. Bautista is a fluke as far as I'm concerned. if he goes out and hits another 30 HR while hitting around .250 I'll give him some more credit but one year does not equal a trend.

Back to the Yanks and Jetes...maybe Cashman is tired of being dragged around. he takes an awful lot of abuse in the media, and anytime the team doesn't win, it comes down to him with the blame. Though he should be held responsible to an extent, it's not as if he's the one out there playing.

Jeter at shortstop is horrendous. He has to be one of the most overrated defensive players in the last 10 years. The gold glove is a joke voted on by managers. If you're popular, as Jeter is around the league, then you will win the award.

I'm sure the COULD HAVE found a better option at short, but have chosen not to. That could come back to hurt them in the end. ARod should have been at short from day one. Fan backlash can piss off. ARod was by far the better player on both sides of the ball.

Oh well. I think Jeter will get moved to LF or RF by 2013 and the Yankees will have either traded for or signed a better defensive option.

I'd rather give Nunez a shot. Eduardo Nunez was the kid who did a good job at third base while A-rod was out. I think A-rod got hurt and Nunez took third base. He is said to have high hopes at Shortstop and the Yankees have high hopes for him. He was kinda the differance maker in the Cliff Lee trade they asked for Montero AND Nunez and the Yankees said no. Now, had they caved and traded both of them Yankees may have gotten Cliff Lee last year.

It all depends on what happens the Yanks have gotten ourselves into a hole. They may need to make a Blockbuster trade at the deadline. And if they do and Nunez has to be traded then so be it. But , at this point I say we use him when/if Jeter moves to the outfield.

[Damian Rey]

I'd rather give Nunez a shot. Eduardo Nunez was the kid who did a good job at third base while A-rod was out. I think A-rod got hurt and Nunez took third base. He is said to have high hopes at Shortstop and the Yankees have high hopes for him. He was kinda the differance maker in the Cliff Lee trade they asked for Montero AND Nunez and the Yankees said no. Now, had they caved and traded both of them Yankees may have gotten Cliff Lee last year.

It all depends on what happens the Yanks have gotten ourselves into a hole. They may need to make a Blockbuster trade at the deadline. And if they do and Nunez has to be traded then so be it. But , at this point I say we use him when/if Jeter moves to the outfield.

Just looked up Nunez' minor league numbers. He's not very impressive. At all. Doesn't draw a ton of walks, has zero punch in his bat, and his OBP is very reliant on his batting average. I don't think he's the answer long term. He's only 23, and will be 24 this year, so there's a chance, but I don't think he's going to be anything more than a light-hitting utitlity guy at best.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

Just looked up Nunez' minor league numbers. He's not very impressive. At all. Doesn't draw a ton of walks, has zero punch in his bat, and his OBP is very reliant on his batting average. I don't think he's the answer long term. He's only 23, and will be 24 this year, so there's a chance, but I don't think he's going to be anything more than a light-hitting utitlity guy at best.

Granted, he may need some progress. And I'm just judging him from what his Major League appearance was. He was there for 30 games and he was pretty good for the injured A-rod. I wanna see what he can do in a full season instead of just 30 games. I don't think there's any short stop I really want. That's not gonna cost a fortune.

Andrus : He will never be traded I am pretty confident of that.

Hanley: As much as I like him and he's still young

I think different then you do. IMHO Ramiro Pena is a light hitting utility guy nothing more. It's not that I don't want a good shortstop it's just that good young short stops aren't very easy to come by. We have a few short stop choices. And Jeter won't be going to the out field this year and maybe not even next. I think in a couple of years he will be a suitable replacement. A lot of progress can happen in a few years. But, like I said if he and Ivan Nove and/or Montero need to be traded for a starter then so be it. I think we'd be fine with Sanchez and Romine. Sanchez I don't think is ready yet though. He's only like 19.

[ClockShot]

A's are working on a trade with Seattle to aquire Chone Figgins for Kevin Kouzmanoff. A third team, possibly the Blue Jays might get involed as well.

Why would Oakland go after Figgins who had that fluke year in '09 and that big contract the M's gave him because of it?

[Damian Rey]

A's are working on a trade with Seattle to aquire Chone Figgins for Kevin Kouzmanoff. A third team, possibly the Blue Jays might get involed as well.

Why would Oakland go after Figgins who had that fluke year in '09 and that big contract the M's gave him because of it?

Because Billy Beane is one of the most overrated GMs in all of baseball and is constantly getting fleeced on trade deals?

[Damian Rey]

Granted, he may need some progress. And I'm just judging him from what his Major League appearance was. He was there for 30 games and he was pretty good for the injured A-rod. I wanna see what he can do in a full season instead of just 30 games. I don't think there's any short stop I really want. That's not gonna cost a fortune.

Andrus : He will never be traded I am pretty confident of that.

Hanley: As much as I like him and he's still young

I think different then you do. IMHO Ramiro Pena is a light hitting utility guy nothing more. It's not that I don't want a good shortstop it's just that good young short stops aren't very easy to come by. We have a few short stop choices. And Jeter won't be going to the out field this year and maybe not even next. I think in a couple of years he will be a suitable replacement. A lot of progress can happen in a few years. But, like I said if he and Ivan Nove and/or Montero need to be traded for a starter then so be it. I think we'd be fine with Sanchez and Romine. Sanchez I don't think is ready yet though. He's only like 19.

You may think different, but the numbers are what they are for Nunez. He has very little punch in his bat. He's not a bad piece, but his minor stats haven't shown that he's particularly exceptional in any one area.

And he's turning 24, and has still yet to be given a chance at an everyday spot and it's likely he's not going to at this point. I don't think there's any faith behind him at all from Yankee brass. They'll get another shortstop through either trade or fee agency, but I HIGHLY doubt Nunez is the answer there, short term or long.

Pena and Nunez are pretty much the same type of player. Nunez has more speed and more pop (not saying much), but niether look like they're going to be anything more than what they are.

Yanks could, and will do a lot better when the time comes. Also, if the Mets don't resign Jose Reyes, I'm betting the Yankees are a top suitor.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

You may think different, but the numbers are what they are for Nunez. He has very little punch in his bat. He's not a bad piece, but his minor stats haven't shown that he's particularly exceptional in any one area.

And he's turning 24, and has still yet to be given a chance at an everyday spot and it's likely he's not going to at this point. I don't think there's any faith behind him at all from Yankee brass. They'll get another shortstop through either trade or fee agency, but I HIGHLY doubt Nunez is the answer there, short term or long.

Pena and Nunez are pretty much the same type of player. Nunez has more speed and more pop (not saying much), but niether look like they're going to be anything more than what they are.

Yanks could, and will do a lot better when the time comes. Also, if the Mets don't resign Jose Reyes, I'm betting the Yankees are a top suitor.

I don't mind Jose Reyes. I like Reyes. The main problem is why be so quick to move Jeter out there? Now, I am guessing by the time Jose Reyes is a free agent it's gonna be next year. Now, Gardner, Curtis, and Swish have been doing a good job in the Outfield in my personal opinion. So I am in no rush to get Jeter out there when they are doing a good job. You are probably right I just really prefer Home Grown talent.

[Damian Rey]

I don't mind Jose Reyes. I like Reyes. The main problem is why be so quick to move Jeter out there? Now, I am guessing by the time Jose Reyes is a free agent it's gonna be next year. Now, Gardner, Curtis, and Swish have been doing a good job in the Outfield in my personal opinion. So I am in no rush to get Jeter out there when they are doing a good job. You are probably right I just really prefer Home Grown talent.

I love homegrown talent but there are certain positions that are tough to get it right at, and shortstop is one of them.

If (bigIF) the Yankees somehow manage to sign Reyes, I'd say the writing is on the wall for Bret Gardner. He's a great player to have and fill a role, but if moving him out of left to slot Jeter there and bring in Reyes at short becomes an option, he's the odd man out.

The reason I'm so quick Jeter in the outfield is the cold hard fact that he is the worst defensive shortstop in baseball right now, and that he's not helping the Yankees playing a position he's no longer capable of playing. It is the Yankees' best interest to get him out of the position asap.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>I would cry if Reyes went to the Yankees.

That being said, if he goes back to his 2008 form he's going to want Crawford money, and Alderson doesn't seem like the type to spend a fuckload on one guy.</font>

[Innovator]

Fuck Jose Reyes.

[Tb1]

<iframe title="YouTube video player" class="youtube-player" type="text/html" width="640" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/zC52rkgkNgU" frameborder="0" allowFullScreen></iframe>

[RoXer]

A's are working on a trade with Seattle to aquire Chone Figgins

no:(

[RoXer]

please no

[YOUR Hero]

Jeters wins Gold Glove, is called worst SS in league. Should be moved to the OF.


yummmmy

[Damian Rey]

Gold Glove, for all intents and purposes, is a joke. It's voted on by managers. It's not like an RBI or homerun title that is based on numbers.

I'm not saying he's terrible because I'm a Jeter hater. I'm saying he's terrible because he is.

[Emperor Smeat]

Albert Pujols will reject any trade the Cardinals might consider for him between now and the end of next season since he has a No-Trade clause.

He wants his mega-money deal either from the Cardinals or another team if he becomes a free agent. Cardinals can only get 2 draft picks should he leave unless he breaks the no-trade clause.

[Damian Rey]

I doubt he breaks it. Honestly, there are not a whole lot of teams that are going to be able to dole out the type of deal Albert is worth. Realistically, the Cardinals are not one of those teams, but they almost have to sign him.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

I think the Cards are gonna have to sign him. Problem is can they do it for A-rod money? Maybe Pujols would take a pay cut and year cut so he could stay on the Cards. All though I don't expect a 10 year contract . I expect maybe 7 or 8 year contract.

[Aguakate]

I can't see the Cardinals not signing Pujols...somehow they will. He just means so much to the team, to the St Louis area, etc.

[Triple Naitch]

Martin Luther King III is leading a group that wants to buy 50% of the Mets.

[Damian Rey]

The problem with signing Pujols is that the Cards are not a large market team, and giving $25 to $30mil to a team that, realistically, is going to be sitting around $80mil per year, and already owes Matt Holiday a boat load of money, is really going to handcuff them down the line.

The only way I see it working is if Albert accepts a deal similar to Ichiro's in Seattle, where Ichiro will be getting paid long after his contract is up.

[OssMan]

Wish players would just stay on their teams

[ClockShot]

Word going around is that CitiField gets the All-star game in 2013.

I just saw it on the ESPN ticker, so take it for what it's worth.

[Droford]

I would be interested in Pujols to the Orioles, but I doubt that they would put the money up. If they are able to be competitive this year maybe they would. Its just good to know that theres no way the Red Sox or Yankees will end up with him.

[Damian Rey]

Word going around is that CitiField gets the All-star game in 2013.

I just saw it on the ESPN ticker, so take it for what it's worth.

God dammit. Petco fucking park has been open since 2004. It is one of the most beautiful parks in all of baseball. Not trying to knock Citi Field, as it is a lovely upgrade over Shea, but come the fuck on.

The weather here in San Diego is perfect come the All Star game.

[Hardkore Kidd J]

I would be interested in Pujols to the Orioles, but I doubt that they would put the money up. If they are able to be competitive this year maybe they would. Its just good to know that theres no way the Red Sox or Yankees will end up with him.

Trust me I don't really want Pujols on the Yankees anyway. He is like Joe Mauer. Joe Mauer needs to stay with the Twins while Pujols needs to stay with the Cards. And the Cardinals are good competitors so he doesn't need to go anywhere to get another ring. Truth be told if I was going for a DH I'd likely choose Fielder actually. But, unfortunately it doesn't look like the Yankees will be looking for a DH for a little while.

[MVP]

The Red Sox signed Adrian Gonzalez to an 8 year, $167 million contract. :cool:

[ClockShot]

The Red Sox signed Adrian Gonzalez to an 8 year, $167 million contract. :cool:

Where'd you hear this?

[ClockShot]

Justin Duchscherer to the O's.

Alexei Ramirez stays with the White Sox. 4-years. $32.5 mil.

Yankees sign Freddy Garcia to a minor league deal.

[Vox Populi]

Where'd you hear this?

He didn't.

[Dragon]

Garcia seems like a decent option as the 5th starter for the Yankees. He's obviously not gonna go out there and dominate but he can still put up some decent games.

Looking at his stats from last year he actually had more quality starts (18) than any pitcher the Yanks had besides CC. With the Yankees offense behind him and that bullpen following him he could win a decent amount of games next year if he repeats that performance and just throws up some average outings.

[MVP]

Where'd you hear this?

It was reported on NESN during the "Red Sox Town Hall" show with Francona, Theo Epstein, and Larry Luchino. I couldn't find it anywhere else though so now I don't know if it's official yet.

[Innovator]

Continuing their quest to win the 2003 World Series, the Yankees sign Freddy Garcia to a minor league deal. Just need to lock up Mark Mulder and they'll have one hell of a rotation.