LOST Theories (will have spoliers)

[Jon Kano]

Or right before Ben knocks out the Arab guy in the Tunisian desert with a rifle butt -

'Oh, so you do speak English...'

[Jeritron]

Hurley throws a hot pocket at Linus and he just sidesteps it

[Ogen]

Suppose you're probably right, the more I think about it.

Just seems odd to me that they've never been addressed until now.

What do you guys think about the cabin? Is that evil-Jacob's lair? Or is it the one place evil Jacob can't access (due to all the ash, which we've seen repels the smoke monster to some extent)

And is it safe to say that Christian Shepard is evil-Jacob? Considering he was the one who convinced Locke that he'd have to die to bring everyone back.

I put Reacunt on ignore after the first spoiler ;)Im not that stupid. Also I am happy to say I called Locke being the smoke monster a long time ago.


But Locke isn't the smoke monster, Locke is dead. The guy that wanted to kill Jacob clearly has an ability to inhabit dead people on the island so he became Christian to make Locke go back and die before returning to the island so he could become Locke and make Ben kill Jacob as he was unable to himself.

Really hope they don't have him/it take over Sayid's body now though and use that to gain entrance to the temple as that wouldn't make much sense if hes been able to take over any body on the island he should have had a much easier time of it all. Hope its explained away that people have to arrive dead before he can take over or something.

[Jeritron]

The thing that is taking over Sayeed isn't the same as The Man In Black imitating Locke and Christian though, I don't think.

In the case of Locke and Christian, their form is used by the Man in Black, and they remain dead.

I gathered that Sayeed is slowly being turned into some kind of servant to The Man in Black, just like Claire has been

[XL]

That was my take on it too. We know that there is some kind of "war" being waged - more than likely between Jacob and MIB. Claire and Sayid have been "claimed" for MIB's side.

[Ermaximus]

They'll find a way to sway Claire over though. I hope.

As for this whole "infection", isn't that what Rousseau claimed got her team when they crashed there and that's why she killed them? Does this mean we could see Claire become the new Rousseau? I also would really like to know, who the fuck taught Claire to use a gun?

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Love the way they've swung the characters of Jack and Sawyer to start this season. Last season at this time Jack was a whiny bitch and Sawyer was his tough wannabe cowboy self.

[Jeritron]

Claire has been claimed. The asian leader told Jack.

I wonder if this infection has anything to do with the shots Desmond and the hatch workers before him took regularly.
I had chalked that up as some lie/experiment/placebo from the Dharma Initiative, but it may actually have meaning

[Supreme Olajuwon]

I don't know if there's any way to tell between those who are sick and those who are inhabited by the MIB. The only sick people we saw were the Frenchies, and we saw them attacked by the Monster only to be "released."

[Supreme Olajuwon]

It seemed to me that Claire showed some sort of surprise when she saw Jin. We've never seen any of MIB's incarnations show any emotion at all.

[XL]

Claire is not MIB. Nor is Sayid. MIB is "dressed up as" Locke on the other side of the island, more than likely making his way to the temple.

We're being told that Sayid and Claire have been "claimed", probably for the use of MIB but I don't think Claire/Sayid are in the same state as "Locke" or "Christian".

[Jon Kano]

Think there are going to be different 'claimed' types.

Claire has been 'claimed' yet she is not dead, she appears to be confused and going mad, kinda like Danielle did or was. The 'sickness'. When her team arrived, they got 'sick', one of those guys was taken by the monster and he had changed and tried to kill Danielle.

Then there's people like Charlie and Christian, who are dead and appear to be influencing people to do tasks. If someone else has been using Jacob's cabin, and Christian took Claire and she is now 'claimed', then there is some kind of line or difference between those who are dead and those who are not.

Then again, Walt appeared to Locke and saved him in the Dharma pit, and yet he is not dead, nor do I believe he could be 'claimed', after all he is 'special'. BUT then again, Jacob didn't 'claim' Walt or Charlie, I think his chosen primaries are the ones he touched in The Incident.

Flocke could be heading to The Temple, but I believe they picked early footage of the series to use in the trailer. If this is correct, I suggest he is on his way there, but ultimately arrives at the Barracks to coerce Sawyer into joining his side, since Sawyer is broken and full of dread and pain and harbors hate for Jack. I just got this feeling Flocke will home in on this and manage to get him on his side. But then Jacob did visit Sawyer and presumably 'claimed' him.

[Ermaximus]

On a quick side note, did anyone else notice that the female detective who went to Claire in the hospital was named Officer Breastmissin? :lol:

[Hanso Amore]

Im starting to think Claire died in the cabin when the Merc blew it up.

THen she came back much like Sayid and stumbles out only to dissappear.

That is why the others knew he was "infected". The waters may be some form of healing via Jacob, which didnt work since he was dead (Which is why thewater was colored) and the Man in Black/FLocke can bring people back from the dead with his power, but you become one of his people.

I imagine they dipped young ben in that same healing water.

[Hanso Amore]

MIB has some form of power over death.

He has appeared seemingly as the 2 dead bodies brought to the island. And those who died on the island he has "claimed"

[Jon Kano]

I imagine they dipped young ben in that same healing water.


When Ben was saved as a child by Richard, Richard told them his innocence would be lost forever. He would always be 'one of them'.



With the whole water thing, it's like sign that badness/the 'destiny' over free will aspect is winning - Flocke has a body, his army is growing, Jacob is dead, etc - there is this frame on the trailer where he takes a white rock off the scales, suggesting the dark rock/badness is winning.

I agree MIB has some kind of power, but I'm not sure it's with regard to taking control of them after they die. As the monster, he would 'judge' them, now believe it wasn't a matter of being judged, rather to see if they are able to be 'claimed', if they are, as Mikhail once put, 'flawed' and not on the list/Jacob's list.

[Buzzkill]

Yeah, my take is that when you're "infected" you're essentially becoming MIB's minion - not inhabited by him. He can only inhabit those who have died prior to coming to the island (Christian Shepherd, Yemi, Locke).

Also, Locke's body is still there, he wasn't reanimated like Sayid.

[Jon Kano]

Yeah that's one thing I'm kinda stuck on too.

I had a thought that there are two bodies because he has actually maybe focused more of his power and ability to actually inhabit his, with the ability to not only be seen and heard but also have human traits such as physical strength etc. I always found it odd that, as Christian, when Locke asked him for help in the frozen donkey wheel chamber, Christian couldn't/wouldn't physically help him up. Yet when Charlie slapped Hurley at the mental hospital, he felt it.

[Hanso Amore]

I think Christian wouldnt have helped because locke had to do it on his own, and therefore be banished on his own.

[Jon Kano]

No, he didn't refuse to help him push the wheel, he refused to help him up, as in come into physical contact with him period. Just rather curious about who he can take form of, and what limits those forms have.

I agree he wanted Locke to do it, as he told him the first time around HE had to, yet Ben ended up doing it, thus finding his loop hole.

[Jeritron]

Notice that MIB refuses to touch anybody, whereas Jacob touches everybody.

In the flashbacks where we see Jacob visiting the passengers at earlier points in their lives, he always touches them.

[thedamndest]

He punched and picked up Richard. But that might be because Richard is an Other.

[Jeritron]

I was mainly referring to his refusal to touch Locke, and Jacob's touching of everyone.

I never would have noticed that he deliberately touched everyone unless I had heard Damen Lindelof point it out.

[Jeritron]

There should be a Richard backstory episode pretty soon. It seems like next week the beach crew is going to meet up with the temple crew.

[thedamndest]

I'm glad. It feels like Sun and Lapidus have been standing on the beach forever.

[Jeritron]

I'm sure Lapidus sang Forever In Blue Jeans to keep everyone on the beach entertained

[Jon Kano]

There should be a Richard backstory episode pretty soon. It seems like next week the beach crew is going to meet up with the temple crew.

Yeah looking forward to that..

Every season we get the backstory of someone important who has been in it a while, yet we know nothing about.

Season 2 > Desmond
Season 3 > Ben
Season 5 > Jacob/MIB

Be good to see him arrive on The Black Rock in those chains.

[Jeritron]

Back stories are always exciting when they haven't been done.

I remember when I first watched the first season, after I caught on to the fact that each episode would give the backstory of a different character, it got really exciting to see who was next, and wonder when certain characters would get their episode

[Hanso Amore]

What if we seen MIB as evil.......and he in the ends turns out to be the one who is good

[Jeritron]

I thought that myself

[Requiem]

Yeah looking forward to that..

Every season we get the backstory of someone important who has been in it a while, yet we know nothing about.

Season 2 > Desmond
Season 3 > Ben
Season 5 > Jacob/MIB

Be good to see him arrive on The Black Rock in those chains.

Honestly, I still wonder if he was talking about the chains metaphorically. As in, he just killed Jacob.. so perhaps Richard is no longer immortal. 'Unbound' from his chains, so to speak.

[Reavant]

MIB has some form of power over death.

He has appeared seemingly as the 2 dead bodies brought to the island. And those who died on the island he has "claimed"

this

[Buzzkill]

Ok JUST THOUGHT OF THIS: What if MIB/Smoke Monster is at Jacob's bidding, and it is really Jacob who's interested in judging these people, then offing them if they don't meet his standards? Seems pretty dick of Jacob to bring all these people to the island with the knowledge that many will die

[El Fangel]

I am just going to make a small theory.

If you freeze frame anytime with the smoke monster, you will see someones face in it somewhere.

I think this may be

1) Souls of the dead
2) Memories of the dead
3) Both of the above
4) Anger of the dead

[Jon Kano]

I am just going to make a small theory.

If you freeze frame anytime with the smoke monster, you will see someones face in it somewhere.

I think this may be

1) Souls of the dead
2) Memories of the dead
3) Both of the above
4) Anger of the dead

Well, when smokey faced off with Eko in season 2 in the jungle, the pictures/faces of people inside the cloud were images of Eko's life, his past. The monster has the ability to see into the lives of anyone it want seemingly.

[El Fangel]

Well, when smokey faced off with Eko in season 2 in the jungle, the pictures/faces of people inside the cloud were images of Eko's life, his past. The monster has the ability to see into the lives of anyone it want seemingly.

Correct, however isnt Eko dead on the island? ;)

[Buzzkill]

What?

[El Fangel]

If you couldnt understand that I think the smoke monster is the embodiment of souls of everyone who has died on the island, I dont know how else I could explain it BK.

[XL]

Think you're a little off there, FA.

Well, maybe not off but you seem to be reading into something that others are understanding differently i.e. the images seen in the Smoke Monster.

From what we have seen (in the aforementioned scene with Eko and also when it "judges" Ben under the temple) the images we see in the Smoke are images from the person's past and therefore the things that they are being "judged" on. Ben sees all of the things leading up to the death of Alex for instance.

Ok JUST THOUGHT OF THIS: What if MIB/Smoke Monster is at Jacob's bidding, and it is really Jacob who's interested in judging these people, then offing them if they don't meet his standards? Seems pretty dick of Jacob to bring all these people to the island with the knowledge that many will die
On that line of thinking, I was having a few thoughts about the temple and the cabin.

We have been lead to believe that the cabin belonged to Jacob (by Ben and Illana pretty much confirmed it when she said "He hasn't been here for a long time"). In addition, when we saw the French guys during one of the flashes the Smoke Monster tries to drag one of them under the temple and that's where Ben goes to get "judged".

We see that the cabin is surrounded by ash and that the Others at the temple begin to use the ash to protect them from the Smoke Monster.

The presumption is that the circle of ash around the cabin was to protect Jacob, but why would Jacob need protecting from Smokey if he can't be hurt or at least killed by it? Is it more likely that the ash was to keep something from getting out?

Perhaps the temple belongs to the Smoke Monster? Perhaps Jacob took control of the temple and banished Smokey/MIB to the cabin? Perhaps we do have it backwards and Jacob isn't the good guy?

Is Jacob using MIB/Smokey to do his biding? Is MIB being kept there against his will? Is that why he wants it all to end so that he can go "home"?

[SlickyTrickyDamon]

So, Jacob is Willy Wonka. The Crash was his golden tickets, and he's looking for the one person willing to take over his role.

Jacob: I don't want to run this Island forever Charlie, and I really don't like feel like trying. Oh wait a second Charlie, you died, you blew up the Station that needs to be washed and sterilized! So, you lose, GOOD DAY SIR.........I SAID GOOD DAY!

The winner gets a lifetime supply of unanswered questions...

[Corporate CockSnogger]

So in this alternate timeline, Helen mentions Lockes dad coming to their wedding so you would assume they are on good terms. If that's the case I wonder how John ended up in the chair.

[SlickyTrickyDamon]

"The universe has a way of course correcting" Desmond.

It was probably his mom who pushed him off.

I was really suprised that we saw Helen at all. I thought her being dead in the real storyline was some sort of thing about Katey Segal not wanting to be in it.

[Reavant]

So in this alternate timeline, Helen mentions Lockes dad coming to their wedding so you would assume they are on good terms. If that's the case I wonder how John ended up in the chair.

the boss guy was calling him by a military term so im qassuming he was a soldier

[XL]

He called him that in Season 1 and we see him playing a war board game on his lunch break, Randy was taking the piss. Of course, in our alternate timeline he may very well have been a soldier.

At this point we don't know if we'll see the characters pre-flight stories so we may never know.

[Blitz]

Really feeling like MIB isn't quite as much of a villain as we might think. Think he's more of a gray area. Unless flat out everything he told Sawyer was a lie.

Also betting that the ghostly kid is Jacob's son.

[Ogen]

I thought ghost kid was Jacob reincarnated by the island or something

[Buzzkill]

Aaron? I mean, he would be 4 or 5 by now, and he's blonde - and that kid also looked a LOT like Claire

[Ogen]

He'd only be 3 surely, 3 years since they left the island after a little over 100 days on the island

[XL]

Ogen's right on this one.

[Loose Cannon]

when Locke threw the light stone into the water and said something of "it's an inside joke" my thought immediately went back to this scene

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[Jon Kano]

Think the main thing about Flocke seeing the kid was that it was that it reminded people of something bigger at play that everyone seems to have fogotten - The Eyeland IS a character. All the little weird things and coincidences are attributed to something bigger at work than simply Jacob and the MIB. The Eyeland is reminding MIB that there are rules, and whatever game/situation the series is leading too, it's got something to do with the remaining survivors as being possible candidates. I think Ben and Widmore were candidates, but like MIB stated in season 5, 'they come, they destroy, the corrupt'. Hurley, Jack, Kate, Sun, Jin, Sawyer and Locke are Jacob's A team.

Even though Locke is dead, after seeing that episode, I just got this hella crazy John Locke type feeling that in the alternate timeline, Locke is going to call Jack, get his legs fixed, and end up back on the Island with the rest of them.

Thought the 'inside' joke pretty good. Like how it illustrates the 'dark' side is currently outweighing the 'light' side.

Very good episode.

Cannot wait to find out Richard/Jacob/MIB's stories.

[Buzzkill]

He'd only be 3 surely, 3 years since they left the island after a little over 100 days on the island
Hmm just had a thought though. Don't children age differently on the island?

Like, when super-grown up Walt showed up or whatever. I don't really remember the specifics of all of that

[El Fangel]

I just realized how awesome walt and michael were :(

[Jon Kano]

Fuck Michael and Walt, Desmond is the best character yet to fully come back.

[El Fangel]

Holy shit, just thought of something. Since walt and michael are off the island do you think its possible he meet up with the losties and tell them what happened? As he would still know what happened.

[Requiem]

Huh?

[Jon Kano]

What? I don't get what you are saying.

Desmond is off-island in one reality, and off-island in the other. He can't tell the Losties what happened in the real reality because he cannot get back, unless he talks with Faraday's mother I guess. And in the other reality, well, it never happened.

[Requiem]

The things they keep showing aren't happening in the same timeline as the things on the island. They are more flashsideways, than flashbacks or flashforwards.

[Jon Kano]

I'd give up if you can't figure that out lol

[Hanso Amore]

Hmm just had a thought though. Don't children age differently on the island?

Like, when super-grown up Walt showed up or whatever. I don't really remember the specifics of all of that

The specifics were that real life actor walt grew the fuck up. Simple as that.

[Hanso Amore]

the boss guy was calling him by a military term so im qassuming he was a soldier

He called him that in the normal timeline too. Cause him and another loser would play some war board game on lunch break.

I like alternate Hugos confidence.

[Reavant]

He called him that in the normal timeline too. Cause him and another loser would play some war board game on lunch break.

I like alternate Hugos confidence.

well im assuming locke's past was different

[Jon Kano]

The entire reality is different, with similarities. It's not just a matter of the plane never crashing, its about the bomb going off, the Island sinking, and everything that happened after that in a butterfly effect fashion.

[Requiem]

Never thought of the fact that Locke could have become a cripple in a different way in the alternate reality.

[Hanso Amore]

Well lates say no island, no jacob altering their lives....

Kate shouldnt be a thief, Sawyer wouldnt be a bitter...him, and in theory Locke should be dead after his crippling fall.

I think it is a cop out to change their lives other than the events from the plane on, and perhaps where they were touched by Jacob.

[Jon Kano]

It's the bomb being detonated in the 70's that is what changed everything.

Pretty sure the bomb sunk the Island, which means from when the bomb went off, onwards; DHARMA, The Island, the people who would've come and gone, and their butterfly effect on the world - it all leads up and equals this distinct and different reality.

I don't really like it either, but hey.

[Requiem]

Something I noticed while rewatching the last episode today.

Helen tells Locke 'with your father' when talking about the wedding or something I believe. Could this mean that his father is alive, and is not at odds with him?

Could this mean he maybe didn't lose his legs the same way?

Also, I'm not so sure Kate is locked up for the same thing. Or at least, maybe she's not as guilty of a party this time around.

[Jon Kano]

Yes his father is prob alive, and yeah everything is different. It's the same with everyone, parts of their original story are now going to be similar, totally changed or twisted in some other way.

Really want to know the deal with Desmond. Either his story is totally different and maybe a lil happier, OR something different - like he still maybe 'unique' in the sense that still turning that fail-safe key, BACK in the original past, it still makes him special with regard to time travel/cause and effect/what he can remember. I got this feeling that he vanished on the plane in the first episode because he is still travelling randomly through time.

Regardless, in the new timeline if that is not true, did he STILL end up going on his boat race? what happened when he did and the storm he was in forced him to the island? or simply where it would be if it wasn't submerged?

[El Fangel]

What I mean is I think Michael and Walt are in the timeline that is off the island and will eventually meet up with one of the people who were still on the island when he left.

[Corporate CockSnogger]

Well we can be pretty certain they're not going to show Walt in that timeline as the actor is a lot older than his age would be on the show.

Also what's your point? It's a different timeline, if say Michael bumped into Hurley or Locke or whoever he wouldn't know him. Same way Hurley and Locke didn't know eachother.

[El Fangel]

I think you still have me wrong. Ill try to explain this out a bit better

At the start, the plane crashed on

Sept 22nd/2004

Lets say Micheal got off the island on Dec 22/2004 (3 months to the day later)

At the start of season 6, we see the Losties plane land at LAX, this would also be Sept 22nd/2004

What I am saying is what if someone that landed, Jack, Hurley, Sawyer, Jin were to meet up with him?

They have no knowledge of what happened to Michael on the island but Michael would remember as he was actually there.

Even simpler to explain, what if Michael when he left the island, left the islands timeline and went back to the off island timeline we see at the start of season 6.

It likely wont happen, but I think it would be interesting as we almsot all but forgot about Michael and Walt (who did play a but part in the first few seasons)

[Corporate CockSnogger]

Well Michael died when the freighter exploded.

But also, he wouldn't remember being on the island because in that timeline he has never been on the island, none of them have.

[Jeritron]

Michael would have no knowledge of that since it's an alternate reality stemming from 1977.

Michael was never actually there in the alternate timeline because the plane never crashed on the island to begin with

[Requiem]

lol and you are still wrong, so I'll explain it better.

They do not exist in the same reality.

Let me lay it out for you like this..

The Losties that they show LAND in LAX are in a DIFFERENT reality. Their timeline consists of different things happening since the 70's when the nuke went off.

When Michael came back, he was in HIS and (their) old reality. The one that started the whole thing and ended up with them crashing on the island. He could not go meet up with the Losties who landed at LAX because they do not exist in his reality. In his reality, they are all on the island currently at the temple with Samurai dude. The Losties at LAX exist in a different timeline, and there is likely a Michael in their timeline as well who does not recall the events of the crash. His life has been completely different up to this point as well.

We know he is not in 'another' reality, because he went back with Walt, who we clearly saw when Locke went to visit him.

[El Fangel]

Jesus, it was just a thought. :'(

[Requiem]

Just saying. Thought this was pretty obvious by the way they were showing things, and LOST isn't very obvious most of the time so it seemed pretty straight forward.

[El Fangel]

I forgot about Michael on the freighter to be honest.

I was just thinking what a mess it would create if he met up with the losties who landed at LAX.

[Jeritron]

I think the wiggle room for casually following the story of LOST ended somewhere in season 4

[Jeritron]

I forgot about Michael on the freighter to be honest.

I was just thinking what a mess it would create if he met up with the losties who landed at LAX.

It would be no different than Locke meeting Linus in the teachers lounge, or Rose at a temp agency, or any other character in any other walk of life.

They're alternate versions of themselves living new, but similar, lives in an alternate reality stemming from the explosion

[Requiem]

Really, Michael dying on the freighter doesn't have any significance to being in an alternate reality. He could have not died on the freighter, and he still wouldn't be able to go meet up with the Losties that landed at LAX.

[El Fangel]

It was a thought with nothing to really back it up

So back the fuck off asshole :mad:

[CSL]

Calm down Colts fans

[Jeritron]

Carrying information from one reality to another is a job for Tom Brady

[Corporate CockSnogger]

Oh and btw, I loved the scene with the smoke monsters point of view.

[El Fangel]

That was very cool. I love how things worked out in the alternate reality as well.

[Lock Jaw]

http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q223/Trrrath/BACK_TO_THE_FUTURE_II-313.jpg
Trying to figure out the plot of Lost.

[CSL]

Fuck that, they are the plot of Lost. It'll turn out in the last ep that Desmond is Marty McFly in a different body.

[Lock Jaw]

Desmond as Marty McFly
Doc Brown as The Island
Jules as Jacob
Verne as Smoke Monster

Everyone else is Biff.

[Loose Cannon]

you guys are confusing

[Reavant]

They will probably take the easy way out with not showing walt by saying him and michael never stepped foot on the plane to begin with because the islands existance caused events to happen where they were on it the first time and with no island in the alternate reality, who knows, walt might not even exist let alone get on the plane to begin with.

[thedamndest]

Walt killed a bunch of birds. I demand to know how he did that.

[CSL]

Well with Michael being confirmed as being in this season, I'd have thought we'd get to find out

[The Destroyer]

Have to wonder if the names on the cave wall have anything to do with the various lists of 815 survivors that the Others mentioned over the years.

I could swear that Locke's alarm clock made the same sound as the alarm in the Swan as well.

[Jon Kano]

It did make a similar sound the the hatch alarm, all these things are put in on purpose.

The 'lists' that The Others referred to do indeed stem from the list of names Jacob put in the cave - Pickett in season 3 refers to 'Jacob's list' but for some reason I think he said 'the doc wasn't even on it', maybe an inconsistency or maybe part of a plan.

[Hanso Amore]

Right, the list was for all the people in the tail section that were taken.

Maybe those lists we for all the non candidates to make them into others, while they needed to let the rest of the people play out their fates. Like jacob brought them all to the Island, but was saving the people whio were caught in the crossfire so to speak

[Buzzkill]

I like how everything is connecting to the Buddhist/Hindu themes of the show.

Rebirth/reincarnation, cycles of the universe/time, etc...

Seems like the candidates are the potential reincarnations of someone very important (not Jacob or Smokie, but higher up)

[El Fangel]

Interested in where Aaron is...

If Claire is on the island, where the hell is he at.

[FearedSanctity]

Kate gave him to Claire's mom right? Most likely there then

[El Fangel]

Jesus, I need to rewatch this.

How did Kate give him to Claires mom again?

[Lock Jaw]

With her hands.

[El Fangel]

Goddamn, want to punch you for that.

[Lock Jaw]

A lot of people tell me that on a daily basis. :$

[El Fangel]

Maybe if you werent such as ass.

Anyways, could you answer my question?

[FearedSanctity]

http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Whatever_Happened,_Happened

[El Fangel]

Much love.

[El Fangel]

I owe you more rep for this. Love this site.

[Jon Kano]

Right, the list was for all the people in the tail section that were taken.

Maybe those lists we for all the non candidates to make them into others, while they needed to let the rest of the people play out their fates. Like jacob brought them all to the Island, but was saving the people whio were caught in the crossfire so to speak

Just more lists than one.

The list for the tailies to be taken.

The list Ben ordered Goodwin and Ethan to produce.

Pickett's reference to Jack not being on a list.

Mikhail talking to Sayid, Kate and Locke about some on them not being on the list because they are 'flawed' and 'weak'.

Jacob's list in the guitar case.

And each list, each incident that lead everything to everything was calculated by the MIB and Jacob, for example The other's list in season 2; Hurley, Jack, Kate and Sawyer. MIB would form that list and want it carried out because it allowed, eventually all the events that lead him to finding his loophole. Jacob would of formed the list because with Sawyer and Kate crushing and hauling rocks on the Hydra Island, created the runway for the Ajira flight to land, brining his 'team' back.

So good. All of it.

[Shaggy]

Just a thought...has anyone on here ever tried to use "The Numbers" for the real lottery....

I heard something that after lost aired with those numbers that they became highly used in the lottery every week.

[El Fangel]

I have played them once.

[Blue Demon]

Maybe if you werent such as ass.

Anyways, could you answer my question?

He did...with her hands :roll:




:p

[Jon Kano]

DO NOT use these numbers in the lottery, you will open the box!

[El Fangel]

I didnt win.

[RoXer]

Besides, you would have to split it a bajillion ways

[XL]

I was thinking about Jacob's lists and his off-island meetings with our main cast a couple weeks back.

I though there might be something in the fact that he touched Kate and Sawyer at a very young age and Jack and Jin/Sun before they reached the island, he didn't touch Hurley or Sayid until after they had returned (to the "real world").

Were Hurley and Sayid not "first picks"? Did Jacob pick them cos others had already proven not to be "candidates"? Did he need to recruit them to help get his "first" picks back to the island.

Midly interesting that at the end of Season 2 Michael takes Jack, Kate and Sawyer to The Others (all people touched before the crash) but sent Hurley back as he was surplus to requirements. Strange bit of corolation there (with the exception of the Kwon's not being involved).

Mind you, Ben never spoke to Jacob so his list might have nothing to do with Jacob's/The Cave (unless Richard passed the list on).

[Jon Kano]

You do mean Jacob didn't touch Hurley and Sayid until after they returned to the real world right?


And here is the thing I think EVERYONE could be missing, and I actually think they are and the average viewer doesn't actually realise the significance of what's going on...

EVERYTHING that has happened, from the crash, to lists, to finding things, signs, missions and effects of everything that has happened are ALL results of BOTH Jacob and the MIB's planning and manipulation. Jacob knew he was going to be 'killed', he is if not one step ahead of the game, he is in unison with the MIB, with his own game plan being executed. MIB however seems to have no idea of Jacob's exact plans, but he knows something is going on since, 'they're coming' vexed him.

[Hanso Amore]

I dfont pay attention to when they were touched chronoligically, but what they were like at the time.

Each time he touched someone it set them on a path to the island, or at least kep them on the path.

Sawyer -Sets him on his path of revenge that takes him to Australia

jack - keeps him going as a doctor

Sayid - Saves his life by not being hit

Hate - allows her to continue her rebllious ways

Locke - saves his life and makes him live in a chair that takes him to his walkabout

and Hurley, who he literally sends to the island

[Requiem]

I dfont pay attention to when they were touched chronoligically, but what they were like at the time.

Each time he touched someone it set them on a path to the island, or at least kep them on the path.

Sawyer -Sets him on his path of revenge that takes him to Australia

jack - keeps him going as a doctor

Sayid - Saves his life by not being hit

Hate - allows her to continue her rebllious ways

Locke - saves his life and makes him live in a chair that takes him to his walkabout

and Hurley, who he literally sends to the island

I thought of Sayid as maybe... he LET the girl get hit.. maybe Sayid would have been paying better attention otherwise. So the girl was keeping him there.. and her dying led him to do different things.

[Jon Kano]

Yeah, but also other factors contribute to everything you have just mentioned. That's what I like about it - the fact that all these random and occurring chain of events have created this situation (the random/luck/cause and effect aspects of existence) and as well Jacob's/MIB's planning, coercion and will.

Like I with one example you made - Jacob does save Locke from death, and confines him to a chair, yet it was Matthew Abbonon that convinced him to go, who works for Widmore, who was exiled from the Island by Ben because Widmore was 'breaking the rules', an incident which stemmed from Ben refusing to Kill Alex as a baby, who was only there on the Island because the French team landed there, an arrival that Jacob could've allowed/planned to happen like he did with The Black Rock.

[Jon Kano]

I thought of Sayid as maybe... he LET the girl get hit.. maybe Sayid would have been paying better attention otherwise. So the girl was keeping him there.. and her dying led him to do different things.

Nadia had to die, Jacob knew she would, and he knew she had to. Because if he didn't, he wouldn't of had a reason to go back to the Island, and help the O6 regroup and return.

[Hanso Amore]

So perhaps the rule change from Widmroe to ben was passed down by MIB who had taken over the cabin...broken ash and all.

This is why ben never truly saw jacob

[Jon Kano]

Hmmmm....I dunno. I'm not saying I'm right by all means, but I just got this feeling Jacob's plan is the same as MIB's, which wouldn't make him too suspicious or aware of what he is able to do. So like, Ben never actually seeing Jacob, that was Jacob's will and wish from the beginning because he knew that if he had had contact with Ben, the events that lead them to this point wouldn't happen, and thus his eventual end game and potential 'win' would not have a chance of happening.

I have NO idea what the deal with the ash is at all. Other than the idea that it would make less sense if it were just 'ash', and that indeed, the ash Brom used in the tomb in the LA X episode and the ash used for the cabin is the ash of the dead. There must be something about the smoke monster, which is some kind of 'judging/death entity' that although is all about dead, is however hindered by the ash of the dead.

And with regard to the cabin, I had a thought a while ago that maybe we got it wrong, maybe the ash around the cabin wasn't to keep the monster out, but to keep it locked in the cabin. But then it's been free roaming since season 1. But then maybe the smoke monster is both Jacob and MIB, since although Eko said when he looked into it he saw darkness, whereas Locke said he saw a 'beautiful white light'. But again, that could've just been a ploy by the MIB as the smoke monster to lure Locke into a trap. But THEN at the same time, a plan like that wasn't part of his 'loophole' plan.

[Reavant]

alright wheres FA i wanna post some spoilers

[Corporate CockSnogger]

alright wheres FA i wanna post some spoilers

I don't think spoiling it for him will make any difference as he doesn't seem to actually have a clue what's going on anyway.

Anyway yeah, another solid episode but with not much overall happening I thought. These somewhat slower episodes seem to be setting everything up for a big finale though.

Although not one of the main mysteries of the show I really was hoping for a better solution to the Adam & Eve skeletons in the caves rather than their usual Hurley nod.

[Jeritron]

What's to say that's the solution?

Also, I don't get how the episode was uneventful. Some very big things happened. Much more is happening in these episodes than ever really happened before.

[Corporate CockSnogger]

I honestly don't think they'll necessarily answer about the skeletons and they'll just leave us to come up with our own interpretation, using what Hurley said. Then again I could be wrong.

I'm not saying it was uneventful, actually, I don't really know what I was saying. Don't get me wrong I still loved every moment of it. I just feel as though there's still plenty to answer and we're running out of episodes in which to do so.

[Jeritron]

Yea, I know what you mean. I think there's higher expectations for answers given it being the final season.
These episodes would be huge by season 4 or 5 standards even. For instance, the lighthouse was pretty big.
Generally they're just slowly pulling the curtain back on what The Island and Jacob are all about.

We've gotten an answer on the smoke monster already, and even some semblance of one for the numbers. The numbers are actually something they probably won't fully answer. They're just a significant set of numbers that continually occur in different places on the island, and why that happens is something to be kept a mystery.
The final candidates being listed as those numbers is probably the most meaningful usage of them yet, though.

I don't think there's really a shit ton of the old lingering mysteries left to deal with. Other than "what is the island" and stuff involving Richard.
I think the big questions are the ones that are currently being raised, and that's sort of evolving every week.
The whole story of the island, and Jacob/MIB is obviously a "mystery" that will take a long time to reveal. Plus the alternate reality. We have absolutely no idea where that's going, or how it will be resolved.
I have been noticing the subtle moments of deja vu, or shaky memory that the characters experience from time to time.

I'm drawing a blank right now. What were some of the big mysteries going into this season other than the smoke monster, Richard, and Jacob/MIB?

I guess the skeletons and numbers too, though like you said the skeletons might remain ambiguous. I think the numbers definitely will, and I'm cool with that.

[Corporate CockSnogger]

Yeah I pretty much agree with the majority of what you said there, I'm quite happy with some things being left to our own interpretations.

To go back to this specific episodes, the whole seeing Jacks house in the mirror thing was pretty interesting. Also I bet that Jacks son winds up being the son of somebody else we already know. Just seems a bit strange that they didn't even mention Sarah, and what with everybodys lives still intertwining I wouldn't be surprised if it's someone else we already know.

Oh and this season needs more Ben.

[Blitz]

Wonder what, if anything, would've been revealed at 108 degrees?

[Hanso Amore]

So here is a good question.

It seems like every "degree" on that dial goes to a number. So Jacob could watch his candidates. ANd we know each person has a number.

Jack was 23. They were going to turn it to 108. WHo is that? WHo is coming?

[Hanso Amore]

Wonder what, if anything, would've been revealed at 108 degrees?

beat me to it. I need to refresh

[Blitz]

Remember, the numbers add up to 108. Jacob said someone was coming to the island. Maybe someone who will unite the last of the candidates against Smokey?

[Hanso Amore]

Check this out

http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Candidates (http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Candidates)

SOme guy named Wallace?

[Reavant]

aaron maybe?.... also maybe the numbers are just the set collection of what the candidates numbers are put together.

[Jeritron]

Yeah I pretty much agree with the majority of what you said there, I'm quite happy with some things being left to our own interpretations.

To go back to this specific episodes, the whole seeing Jacks house in the mirror thing was pretty interesting. Also I bet that Jacks son winds up being the son of somebody else we already know. Just seems a bit strange that they didn't even mention Sarah, and what with everybodys lives still intertwining I wouldn't be surprised if it's someone else we already know.

Oh and this season needs more Ben.

Yea I figured that too. It's probably going to someone like Juliet

[Jeritron]

aaron maybe?.... also maybe the numbers are just the set collection of what the candidates numbers are put together.

The name Littleton is crossed out. This could be Claire, though.


The name Austen is not crossed out, but that's most likey Kate.

Either way, the name in question is at 108, and it's Wallace. If it's a new character of some kind, it's probably William Atherton aka Walter Peck.

[Loose Cannon]

Yea, I know what you mean. I think there's higher expectations for answers given it being the final season.
These episodes would be huge by season 4 or 5 standards even. For instance, the lighthouse was pretty big.
Generally they're just slowly pulling the curtain back on what The Island and Jacob are all about.

We've gotten an answer on the smoke monster already, and even some semblance of one for the numbers. The numbers are actually something they probably won't fully answer. They're just a significant set of numbers that continually occur in different places on the island, and why that happens is something to be kept a mystery.
The final candidates being listed as those numbers is probably the most meaningful usage of them yet, though.

I don't think there's really a shit ton of the old lingering mysteries left to deal with. Other than "what is the island" and stuff involving Richard.
I think the big questions are the ones that are currently being raised, and that's sort of evolving every week.
The whole story of the island, and Jacob/MIB is obviously a "mystery" that will take a long time to reveal. Plus the alternate reality. We have absolutely no idea where that's going, or how it will be resolved.
I have been noticing the subtle moments of deja vu, or shaky memory that the characters experience from time to time.

I'm drawing a blank right now. What were some of the big mysteries going into this season other than the smoke monster, Richard, and Jacob/MIB?

I guess the skeletons and numbers too, though like you said the skeletons might remain ambiguous. I think the numbers definitely will, and I'm cool with that.

yea, I AGREE. My wife keeps complaining that they are not answering anything. Yes, they are, but like you said, a lot of the little things from back in the day may never get answered.

Like did the Polar Bear thing from season 1 or 2 ever get explained. just a random one I had in my head.


I really enjoyed the last 2 episodes of this season. It's starting to come together nicely.

[Loose Cannon]

oh and does anyone else have a hard time remembering stuff from past seasons. I draw so many blanks.

Like last night I could not figure out how Aaaron got seperated from Claire in the first place?

[thedamndest]

They never really answered the polar bear thing. I think we're just left to assume that they were using them for experiments on the second island (the bear cages where they stashed Sawyer and Kate).

[Jeritron]

I always wondered if Polar Bears were used to turn the wheel, due to their ability to withstand cold temperatures.

I don't think anything indicates this was going on though. Dharama build around the wheel chamber, and didn't seem to be actually using it, but rather manipulating the pocket.

I guess they were just being used for tests. Maybe they were easy to acquire illegally in the area?
Maybe they just wanted to see how well they adapted to the climate?

Most likely it was probably the writers choosing them because they'd provide the initial mystery of "a polar creature on a tropical island. that's strange."

[Jon Kano]

Yeah you are correct, they were answered yonks ago. In the DHARMA videos from season 2, it explains they were experimenting with different animals and how they can adapt and live in different climates to that which they are used to. From the north and south poles in the cold, to the blistering heat of the Tunisian desert - the exit point of the frozen donkey wheel. Yes, they were caged on Hydra Island, but polar bears are like one of the most capable swimmers of the mammal species.

The newest episode was pretty good, nothing major though.

And yeah, I agree, things are getting answered all the time, but still in a LOST kind of fashion. Yes we now know about the 'candidates', but seriously, and I don't care, it was obvious from even when Locke made many of his famous 'destiny' speeches in the first season that they were all bought there for a reason, we know the reason is because they are candidates for something, that 'a war' is coming, that Jacob and MIB have great interest in these 'pieces' on their chess board. We we still don't know exactly what the battle is for - existence? good vs evil? fate vs free will? - everything most likely.

One idea I had today, was that after everything, Widmore is 'the good one'. I had this thought that if it really was the will of the island that Alex (as a baby) was to be killed, maybe it wasn't the will of the Island. What if it was the will of the MIB or Jacob? - if it was the will of the MIB, there would be a reason for it, as there would with Jacob. And if it were the will of Jacob, maybe it was so that a different chain of events concerning Ben and Widmore would've unfolded, which would ultimately change and effect the situation now, more specifically, the MIB's loophole. I dunno.

Despite the 'wallace' name. I still think it's Desmond or Widmore who are arriving to the Island. At least I hope it is.

[CSL]

Was saying from when we first heard of the Widmore/Ben 'battle' that I thought maybe/hoped Widmore would turn out to be the good one. Not so sure now.

[Jon Kano]

It's hard to say, and a lot to look at. He seems to know about Jacob and MIB. In the episode 'The Life and Times of Jeremy Benthom', he told Locke a 'war was coming' and if John wasn't back on the Island, the wrong side would win.

If he was on Jacob's side, he would know Locke was a candidate for Jacob and maybe that's why he wanted to help him. OR, he knew he would be killed and/or possessed by the MIB. Even though bad things have happened, and been asked of, anything could be of the will and wish of Jacob or MIB.

[El Fangel]

I think it will be Walt. He seemed somewhat special and I think its odd he was just written out. Plus the ominous way locke told him about the fight between light and dark in like the second episode. Walt had strange things happen around him. I think it will be him.

[Jon Kano]

The 'Wallace' name doesn't really mean anything anyway. It's the number that is important, and not so much in this context anymore since the mirrors were smashed by Jack. There is still a possibility that whoever is coming to the Island is NOT coming from either of their reality, dimension or planet.

Although he is not really a fave character of mine, I do love Jack's journey. How he is a man of science, through and through - yet we get these little moments of epicness and confrontation with himself and others where Matthew Fox really sells how his character is battling this thing inside of him where at first he denies the Island is even special - Season 1 finale, then the conversation with Locke at the Orchid during the Season 4 finale where Locke says, 'You know Jack, you know!' , there's this faint look of belief in his eyes. Then he begins to believe, and he comes back. And now, although he knows there is something special, he doubts that it's special enough for himself.

[CSL]

No way is it Walt

[Loose Cannon]

Yeah you are correct, they were answered yonks ago. In the DHARMA videos from season 2, it explains they were experimenting with different animals and how they can adapt and live in different climates to that which they are used to. From the north and south poles in the cold, to the blistering heat of the Tunisian desert - the exit point of the frozen donkey wheel. Yes, they were caged on Hydra Island, but polar bears are like one of the most capable swimmers of the mammal species.

The newest episode was pretty good, nothing major though.

And yeah, I agree, things are getting answered all the time, but still in a LOST kind of fashion. Yes we now know about the 'candidates', but seriously, and I don't care, it was obvious from even when Locke made many of his famous 'destiny' speeches in the first season that they were all bought there for a reason, we know the reason is because they are candidates for something, that 'a war' is coming, that Jacob and MIB have great interest in these 'pieces' on their chess board. We we still don't know exactly what the battle is for - existence? good vs evil? fate vs free will? - everything most likely.

One idea I had today, was that after everything, Widmore is 'the good one'. I had this thought that if it really was the will of the island that Alex (as a baby) was to be killed, maybe it wasn't the will of the Island. What if it was the will of the MIB or Jacob? - if it was the will of the MIB, there would be a reason for it, as there would with Jacob. And if it were the will of Jacob, maybe it was so that a different chain of events concerning Ben and Widmore would've unfolded, which would ultimately change and effect the situation now, more specifically, the MIB's loophole. I dunno.

Despite the 'wallace' name. I still think it's Desmond or Widmore who are arriving to the Island. At least I hope it is.


I don't know how you can remember all the past stuff and specific episdes. unless you read a lot through the Lost encyclopedia's or whatever. That's what I probably have to do when I have an hour to kill

[Jon Kano]

Because I am a geek for the show through and through. Think only the Sopranos has come as close as LOST. But ever since I saw the first season, it's like the show was made for me, like you know how there are songs you feel personify something big inside your head or from inside. I am also interested in philosophy, existence and mystery. This is the show for me. And I have seen every episode many, many times and I just seem to remember everything.

[El Fangel]

This may have already been mentioned but I just remembered something last night. The Valterzzi (sp?) equation said there was 100% certainty that the world would end in the next 27 years.

Wasnt that equation done in 1977? which would make the date the year 2004 (when the plane crashed on the island I think was Sept 22nd/2004)

I wonder if there is any reason to think that the guy who worked that out somehow foreseen the bomb going off in 1977?

Perhaps the bomb going off in 1977, just as the island moved through time helped cause the plane to crash on the island.

This is submitted to Kano for verification as he knows everything about the show including the color underwear kate wore in the last episode.

[Jeritron]

I don't know how you can remember all the past stuff and specific episdes. unless you read a lot through the Lost encyclopedia's or whatever. That's what I probably have to do when I have an hour to kill

I guess you just have to really be into it. Similar to how some wrestling fans can remember title histories and what happened in what months and years, and shit like that.

I pretty much remember everything from Lost, and I don't read about it. I've watched it all the way through twice though. I'm sure that helped.

[Jon Kano]

My mates (who watch it, which are not many) can't keep up when I go into detail about all the connections through different methods, studies and aspects of mythology...like the other day me and my friend were going over how Jacob touched all of his candidates (Locke, Jack, Kate, Hurley, Sayid, Sawyer, Jin & Sun at least) and he picked up on how Jacob handed Jack an Apollo candy bar. He referred to it as the same candy bar in the Swan food supply. But they didn't think it was worth thinking about the fact that the god Apollo is more often than now dipicted with a staff and arrow, two of the other Dharma stations. And they are right really, but I love stuff like that no matter how minor.

[Jeritron]

Kano, have you read The Stand?

[Jon Kano]

No but it rings a bell, I possibly either read it on one of the LOST literature references, or there's an article on 'grey goo' a doomsday scenario in which the whole nano-byte/machine/robot/smoke monster thing is similar to. Is it good?

[Jeritron]

Well, it's an amazing Stephen King novel. I suggest it. It's probably the biggest influence on Lost. Just the way the characters are approached, and the style. The plot too. The basic concept and a lot of the ideas going on now are hugely similar.
Damen Lindelof has mentioned it never leaving the writing room.

[Jeritron]

http://s2.hubimg.com/u/915025_f496.jpg

I think that image on the cover stirs up some obvious connections

[Jon Kano]

I'll consider buying it next time I am a' browsing.

Think it was YOUR Hero or Downunder who suggested reading Stephen King's 'Thinner'. I read it and loved it. And it's the only Stephen King book I have read.

[Jeritron]

Stephen King books are the greatest thing ever.

The Stand and The Dark Tower series are like his big epic stories. Then you obviously have dozens of other great novels and short story collections.
He's so much more than just horror too. It's drama, science fiction, epic. It's just really creative, I love it. I learned that his body of work exceeds the public perception of him, which is obviously grand to begin with.

But back to Lost, I suppose.

[CSL]

The Girl Who Loved Tom Gordon

But back to Lost, I suppose.

[Jeritron]

Stephen King loves Lost and the Red Sox. I love Stephen King

I've actually seen him a few times while at Fenway. His home isn't too far from my father's summer place in Maine either

[Hanso Amore]

This may have already been mentioned but I just remembered something last night. The Valterzzi (sp?) equation said there was 100% certainty that the world would end in the next 27 years.

Wasnt that equation done in 1977? which would make the date the year 2004 (when the plane crashed on the island I think was Sept 22nd/2004)

I wonder if there is any reason to think that the guy who worked that out somehow foreseen the bomb going off in 1977?

Perhaps the bomb going off in 1977, just as the island moved through time helped cause the plane to crash on the island.

This is submitted to Kano for verification as he knows everything about the show including the color underwear kate wore in the last episode.

No. THe Plane crashed because in 2004 Desmond didnt push the button because he was outside of the hatch killing that guy. THe charge then brought the plane down.

[CSL]

I get the impression FA has seen maybe 3 episodes of Lost, read some theories elsewhere and dived into this thread

[Reavant]

pretty much what he did in the nfl thread too

[El Fangel]

No. THe Plane crashed because in 2004 Desmond didnt push the button because he was outside of the hatch killing that guy. THe charge then brought the plane down.

Yes, was just thinking that the bomb going off during the time switch may have done something thats all. I know its because Desmond didnt push the button.

Though what makes me think this is that at the start of season 6, off island its presumably Sept 22nd/2004 as they landed at LAX in that timeline, so in that timeline did Desmond get to the button in time or was it something entirely different that brought the plane down originally.

I get the impression FA has seen maybe 3 episodes of Lost, read some theories elsewhere and dived into this thread

Nope, I have every single episode on my computer, I started watching them with an ex back in 2007 I think and Season 3 was just wrapping up on TV I believe. I got to the season 2 finale and stopped watching then downloaded season 3 and re watched the first two seasons before I continued then I downloaded the episode every week and added it to the season folder for season 4, After the end of season 4 I rewatched the episodes again before season 5 and now here we are at season 6 and I dont remember a whole lot of small details. I mean I do remember alot but some smaller things, like how Kate got Aaron I forgot, what the guy with the eyepatch was called, how Michael and Walt left (I believe in one of the small boats) and that Michael was on the freighter.



pretty much what he did in the nfl thread too

When did I ever claim to really know whats going on in the football thread? I watched a few games and got a basic understanding of the game but I still havent a sweet clue whats going on.

[XL]

Yes, was just thinking that the bomb going off during the time switch may have done something thats all. I know its because Desmond didnt push the button.

Though what makes me think this is that at the start of season 6, off island its presumably Sept 22nd/2004 as they landed at LAX in that timeline, so in that timeline did Desmond get to the button in time or was it something entirely different that brought the plane down originally.
In theory there is no button to push in the Alt Timeline. The bomb defused the pocket of energy that the Dharma guys accidentally tapped into to.

No pocket of energy means no button to press, means Desmond couldn't miss the button and cause the plane to crash...as it didn't cos it landed at LAX with Desmond on board. Meaning Des never even went to the island. Or so we are lead to believe.

You don't seem to be getting that the original timeline (from '77 to the plane crashing on 22nd Sept 2004) has nothing to do with the new Alt timeline (whatever happens between '77 and 815 landing in LA). People cannot crossover and meet people in the different timelines - as you thought could happen earlier.

[El Fangel]

Ah, thanks for the explanation there XL, as it makes alot more sense now.
I have the jist of whats going on, but god I have a horrible memory and cant seem to remember any of the important stuff.

[Danny Electric]

Randal Flagg.

[Jeritron]

Goddamn.


The episode was so-so, until the final 10 minutes. That was wild.

[Loose Cannon]

yea, final 10 minutes were amazing. just was going to post that. Sayid's "crazy" face when he told Ben off was incredible. what a heel turn!!

I can't wait for Jack, Jacob and Hurley to come to the rescue. going to be insane

[Reavant]

cant believe sayid killed the samurai dude and his translator

[thedamndest]

I know what you mean. We've had all these amazing revelations and this episode didn't really tell us anything new. The fight at the beginning was good. I also love that in the Lost universe Keamy is so evil he dies twice.

Looking forward to next week based on the teaser.

[Jeritron]

It was a great finish to the episode.

I marked out for the coalition of Lapidus, Sun and Linus coming in and saving Miles

[thedamndest]

I feel like every time we see Sun it's like beating a level in Mario and getting the "Congratulations, but your princess is in another castle!" message.

[Reavant]

i dunno.... this week was big for sayid... he was always trying to fight the "evil" man that he was and he finally gave in and embraced it

[Loose Cannon]

It was a great finish to the episode.

I marked out for the coalition of Lapidus, Sun and Linus coming in and saving Miles

yea, me too. The Miles/Lapidus reunion was great. Now where did Sawyer go? I thought he'd be with Locke and co

This season started off slow to me, but it's really picked up with this whole war and people choosing sides.

[Reavant]

so whos kate guna spread her legs for this season?

[RoXer]

Loved the Sopranos/eggs reference.

[Ogen]

yea, me too. The Miles/Lapidus reunion was great. Now where did Sawyer go? I thought he'd be with Locke and co

This season started off slow to me, but it's really picked up with this whole war and people choosing sides.

Not exactly many people left on the "good" side after half the temple joined Flocke and the other half were massacred.

[Jon Kano]

Pretty good episode.

Guess Sawyer is at MIB HQ or doing something for him while they make their way to wherever.

Be interesting to see how Kate and Claire pan out since she said she would kill her if what Jin told her about Kate raising her baby was true, yet Kate is a candidate for MIB also, and he will want to manipulate her maybe somehow.

I'm more concerned about this alternate reality. Really want to know where it is going. I mean it's cool to see all these 'dead' characters and cross-overs, but kinda needs to start either revealing what it's purpose is, or merging with the other reality - we are already 1/3 of the way through the series, and I don't want EVERYTHING to fall into place and be explained in one last episode really.

[Jeritron]

Pretty sure they promised the two timelines would end about halfway through the season, and it would focus completely on the main reality/Island storyline.

[Jon Kano]

Cool.

End it, make sense of it, merge it, I don't care. I do, but wanna see some epic on-island shit.

[Corporate CockSnogger]

As soon as I saw Omar asking Sayid to get in the car I knew we were gonna be seeing Keamy. Still marked out for it though.

[wwe2222]

Pretty sure they promised the two timelines would end about halfway through the season, and it would focus completely on the main reality/Island storyline.

Where did they say that? They have just pretty much stuck to not calling it an "alternate" timeline and that eventually the two timelines would somehow be reconciled, etc.

I dont think they mentioned that happening halfway through.

[RP]

BEN BETTER NOT DIE NEXT WEEK!

[Loose Cannon]

BEN BETTER NOT DIE NEXT WEEK!

no way, right when Ben's about to be executed, the Glass is going to break and Jack and Hurley are going to come driving in to Stone Cold Steve Austin music to make the save

[Buzzkill]

This episode was awesome. Didn't offer any massive revelations but it did a great job of advancing the story line throughout.

Don't really see why people are complaining.

[Requiem]

Yeah, one of my friend's complained that it wasn't as good of an episode because it didn't tell anything really.

I said "What? That was a badass episode.. Sayid had an epic fight with Dogen.. people were dying left and right. Keamy was back and got killed.. HOW WAS THAT NOT A COOL EPISODE?"

[Loose Cannon]

yes, exactly. Probably my fav episode this season. the one With Jack and Hurley and the Lighthouse is also a favorite.

I need some help from you guys on quesitons i can't quite figure out. maybe you can help


1) This Man in Black guy. So was it him that appeared as Jack's dad and as Sharron to Boun? And all these other "dead" people. Can he only take the form of dead people? Cause then that doesn't explain Walt and how he's appeared to Locke before.


2) Am I to assume now that Ben and The Others really were the good guys throughout all this? Did they know about the Man in Black and everything?

3) What about Whitmore and his group. He was out to get Ben, but if Ben was on Jacob's side all along, that would make Whitmore bad? ughhhh

4) Last one...WHERE THE FUCK IS VINCENT :mad:

[Ogen]

Wasn't Vincent in the jungle with Rose and Bernard

[Jon Kano]

yes, exactly. Probably my fav episode this season. the one With Jack and Hurley and the Lighthouse is also a favorite.

I need some help from you guys on quesitons i can't quite figure out. maybe you can help


1) This Man in Black guy. So was it him that appeared as Jack's dad and as Sharron to Boun? And all these other "dead" people. Can he only take the form of dead people? Cause then that doesn't explain Walt and how he's appeared to Locke before.


2) Am I to assume now that Ben and The Others really were the good guys throughout all this? Did they know about the Man in Black and everything?

3) What about Whitmore and his group. He was out to get Ben, but if Ben was on Jacob's side all along, that would make Whitmore bad? ughhhh

4) Last one...WHERE THE FUCK IS VINCENT :mad:

1 - I'm not too sure if this is totally correct. I don't like to read all the theory websites into too much detail until the season is done. Make my interpretations more interesting to figure out. But yes, the MIB used Jack's fathers body to manipulate certain choices and events caused and effected by anyone who saw them. He abducted Claire in the 4th season and 'infected' her.

He also posed as Christian to get Locke to think he was working for Jacob, when really, 'someone else' had been using Jacob's cabin, as Ilana pointed out.

Not too sure about all the other people. Yemi to Mr. Eko is a big example - it could've been The Island being representing Yemi as Eko's last chance to redeem himself, as a kind of 'last chance', yet when he confessed nothing and said sorry for nothing, the smoke monster killed him. That might of been The Island's way of allowing the MIB to act on his duty or something. Or it could've been the MIB since Eko's death lead to Locke 'finding his way', which inevitably lead to the situation were at now.

Always wondered about Walt appearing to Locke. Again, think it was either The Island, MIB or even Jacob. Whoever it was, they knew what effects would occur when Locke got out of the pit.

2) Yes and no. Ben never met Jacob, not knew of the MIB and he doesn't seem to know at all what the whole meaning of the Island, Jacob or the MIB is. He was just taking orders from Jacob handed down by Richard, in the form of lists, tasks etc. Richard said to Locke when he gave him Sawyer's file in season 3, that Ben was wasting The Other's time on trivial things like childbirth (women not being able to give birth) when he realised how special Locke was to the Island. This makes me think Ben did have a real leadership role in what they did. So I guess it's down to interpretation. Ben was/is and can be a bad guy, but really, he was working with and for Jacob, so he is also good. Then you have to look at each individual person too, like Pickett, he was a prick/bad guy kinda.

Also, Richard wasn't told by Jacob at all as to the real reasons for what they were doing. Seems as though Jacob was very reluctant to tell them anything, which is apt since it mirrors his philosophy of being all about free will and choice, whereas MIB is all about manipulation and the allure of having a chosen destiny. I really feel for Locke in this respect because he started to believe in himself and something big so much. Looking back when MIB as Christian asked Locke 'why he was here?' in the cabin, and Locke replied, 'I'm here because I was chosen' it's like although he believes its for a good reason, its the complete opposite.

3) The thing with Widmore is that he ordered Keamy and his men to get Ben, and torch the Island. That was Keamy's orders. Yet there is evidence that Widmore is/was right and good. When he told Ben to kill Alex as a baby, he claimed it was because of the will of the Island. Yet Ben challenged him on that point that if it were true, Widmore should have no problem doing it. If it was the will of Widmore (for whatever reason, I can't tell) then it would be good to know why? - maybe to frame/or put Ben in a bad light anyway because he and Ben didn't see eye to eye. OR if it was the will of the Island, it would have something to do with something more important, something I can't really think of right now - maybe to not have the events that happened, happen.

But then Widmore really did seem to know what was going on in the episode 'The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham' - he said a war was coming to the Island, and if John Locke wasn't back on the Island, the wrong side will win. Now he could've known Locke would die, and that the MIB could inhabit his body, and he wants the MIB to win, and have some kind of reward. OR, he really did want Locke back there, to lead and to have the right/good side win. I don't know.

But Widmore and Desmond are a very interesting thing for me. I can't wait to see what happens.\

4) He was last seen when Sawyer found Rose and Bernard on the beach in 1977 timeline. I assume he was Rose and Bernard's pet now, and that wherever they are/were, he is too.

[Jeritron]

Where did they say that? They have just pretty much stuck to not calling it an "alternate" timeline and that eventually the two timelines would somehow be reconciled, etc.

I dont think they mentioned that happening halfway through.

Oh I was just imagining things then.

Nah seriously though I know that Damen Lindelof said it. It was this summer, so I would say Comic Con?

P.S. He didn't technically say alternate universe. I just used that term. He was talking about what this seasons storytelling device would be, without revealing it (ie flashbacks, flashforwards, time travel)
He said it would be something different and new, but would only last for half the season and it would all come together into one for the first time, moving to the finale.

[Jeritron]

"Like, a third of the way in [to the season], I would guess we are going to [settle] into one time frame, and it will be very linear—no more flashbacks, nothing. It will be on the Island and sort of a final conflict to the end," said Fox.

http://www.eonline.com/uberblog/watch_with_kristin/b128606_matthew_fox_tells_us_how_lost_ends_how.html

That's a quote from Mathew Fox. I heard Damen Lindelof talking more or less about the same thing in another interview

[wwe2222]

http://www.eonline.com/uberblog/watch_with_kristin/b128606_matthew_fox_tells_us_how_lost_ends_how.html

That's a quote from Mathew Fox. I heard Damen Lindelof talking more or less about the same thing in another interview

well there you go. I stand corrected. Apologies

[Loose Cannon]

Thanks Kano for taking the time to type all of that :y:

You answered a lot of questions. You actually sprung to mind another question I meant to ask as well. When we are talking about the "infected" here. What is the infection exactly? Is it a pyscological infection or what? How is MIB infecting them? I never quite understood this.

But yea, I am also curious about where Whidmore and Desmond will end up in this final season.

[Jon Kano]

The whole 'infected'/sickness thing, there are different versions or instances of what is supposedly out there....

The first time the idea of infection come up was with the French woman in season 1, she claimed it had infected her team and she was forced to kill them. In season 5 we saw the smoke monster take one or some of her team into the ruins and underground, and kill others. Robert I think was his name, he came back to the beach and appeared to be friendly to the French woman (this is when Jin was time shifted back to when they arrived and she was still pregnant), but he wanted to kill her. So wherever he went, he was either 'infected' or possessed by the MIB whether he had died or not, like Sayid or Claire. So since he wanted her dead, he was infected, acting in the interest of the MIB, for what reason I don't know....maybe to actually kill Alex, her unborn child? An attempt that might of been re-attempted when Widmore claimed it was the will of the Island for the child to be killed. I believe what we are being told about him wanting everyone dead is true.

Then in Season 2 with Desmond. Kelvin claimed there was an infection out there, so he wore the suit. But then he and we saw that it was bollocks because the suite had a tear and he was really venturing out to fix Desmond's boat. But Desmond still injected himself everyday up until he killed Kelvin I think. The same injection Ethan gave Claire and her baby. Not forgetting the 'QUARANTINE' notices on the Swan hatch door, and even the Arrow station with the tailies.

But what's going on now, to do with Claire and Sayid - I don't know exactly how it works, but with Sayid - 'he was dead for 2 hours' according to Hurley, and then was back - think it's something about them dying, and the MIB able to control them. And I always thought....that when Keamy's men shot a rocket at Claire's house in Dharmaville in season 4 and she was hurt, and Sawyer saved her, although it was moments after it happened and Sawyer found her, what if that explosion actually killed her? she vanished into the jungle and found her 'father', who was really the MIB very easily. Maybe the MIB 'took her' and started to poison her soul straight away when she died then and there. It's just an idea.

If she did not die, it must simply be that with enough manipulation and power, the MIB can begin to 'claim' people's soul. And if they are weak enough, or tempted by what they perceive to be good (Claire, her father and the promise of Aaron. Sayid, the promise of Nadia) then they are 'amenable for coercion' (a term that undercover cop used to describe Locke, who would eventually become the ultimate pawn).

So yeah, with regard to what kind of infection it is - it's like supernatural psychological I guess. It's about being able to exploit people's emotional/spiritual characteristics and manipulate the physical (dead body theory). How he is infecting them? - still don't actually know what he is, in the simplest idea, I guess he and Jacob are two entities on a completely different and higher plane of existence to mere mortals. It will be interesting to finally find out what they are, how they became 'trapped' in this whole service to the Island thing. Not forgetting the Island itself. The MIB saw that kid who told him about breaking the rules, so MIB is not the know all and end all to this whole mystery, which is pretty fuckin sweet.

Least that's my take on it at the moment. Even with a theme with the sickness/infection, there's a lot to think about and wonder what the deal is.

[Reavant]

I like Kano's style here

[Loose Cannon]

Kano is my Lost wikipedia site. ok, so at least we don't know yet on what this infection really is yet. It's just something that causes people to get demented or whatever

[Blue Demon]

Any one else notice Jack in the hospital when Sayied went into the Hospital to check on his brother in law? They walked past each other in the hall way

[XL]

I don't wanna sound like I'm bitching too much but I don't feel like I'm as "into" the final season as I expected I would be.

I mean, yeah we're getting answers but are they the ones we've waited 6 years for?

At the moment they seem to have neglected how the rest of the mythology they have built up through Seasons 1 -5 will fit into the overall story. How did the Dharma Initiative find the island? Do people like Alvar Hanso or Charles Widmore still matter to the story? How are the numbers (which are now connected to our main characters) relevant to the computer in the Swan hatch? And so on.

Is it all gonna come down to the fact that Jacob brought everyone to the island as potential candidates? Or are his candidates made up of random people that have happened across the island? We now understand that Jacob has been watching the candidates live their off island lives, was it necessary for everything to happen just to get his "Top Picks" there?

Did he bring or allow the DI to come to the island so that they would tap into a pocket of energy, so that a station containing a button would need to be pressed every 108 minutes and then bring Desmond to the island so that he could one day miss pressing the button and bring down the plane containing Jack, Sawyer, Kate, et al?

I just hope that the writers retrace their steps a little to bring it all together.

At this point I have to believe they will.

[XL]

Aside from the above, this episode left me with one major query: WHAT THE FUCK IS WITH THE ASH?

We've been led to believe that the ash around the cabin was keeping something out (if it was to protect Jacob) or keeping something in (MiB?) - although contray to a post I made a couple weeks back...if MiB was trapped in the cabin, we wouldn't have "seen " the monster as early as the Pilot episode.

Recently we saw Braum try to protect himself from Smokey with a circle of ash and the monster using alternate methods (a stone pillar) to remove him from the cirlce so he could attack him. We've seen Illana collect some more ash and we saw the Others at the temple protect themselves with a big circle of ash when they learned of Jacob's demise.

In last night's episode we saw Flocke/MiB stand outside of the temple at the line of ash, where he sent Claire in to do his biding, presumably because he couldn't cross the ash line. Then we find out that it was Dogen that was keeping him out!!!

So, not the ash? Or was it somehow a combination of the ash and Dogen?

They seem to give us something (in this case the "fact" that Smokey can't cross the ash) and then take that from us. Which leaves us with yet another question to be answered (or an older question to be re-answered).

Perhaps I'm just getting a little impatient with it all now.

[Loose Cannon]

another great episode. I'm a Ben fan and a Richard Alpert fan, so I really liked this one. Jack finally came to believe that he's on the island for a purpose. Ben almost getting swayed to the dark side and then having a change of heart was great. And I've always been a sucker for those slow motion reunions at the end of certain episodes with that same song playing in the background.

And then Whidmore :cool: to end it. Classic. Can't wait till next week

[thedamndest]

Desmond must be coming soon, right?

[Corporate CockSnogger]

Was desperately hoping it was Desmond in the submarine instead of Widmore. Or even that they'd put their differences aside or something and come together.

[Loose Cannon]

oh yea, and that was interesting to know that Frank was suppossed to pilot 815 and then Ben goes the island got him in the end anyway

[Corporate CockSnogger]

We've known that Frank was supposed to pilot flight 815 since back in series 4 when we first saw him

[Reavant]

Aside from the above, this episode left me with one major query: WHAT THE FUCK IS WITH THE ASH?

We've been led to believe that the ash around the cabin was keeping something out (if it was to protect Jacob) or keeping something in (MiB?) - although contray to a post I made a couple weeks back...if MiB was trapped in the cabin, we wouldn't have "seen " the monster as early as the Pilot episode.

Recently we saw Braum try to protect himself from Smokey with a circle of ash and the monster using alternate methods (a stone pillar) to remove him from the cirlce so he could attack him. We've seen Illana collect some more ash and we saw the Others at the temple protect themselves with a big circle of ash when they learned of Jacob's demise.

In last night's episode we saw Flocke/MiB stand outside of the temple at the line of ash, where he sent Claire in to do his biding, presumably because he couldn't cross the ash line. Then we find out that it was Dogen that was keeping him out!!!

So, not the ash? Or was it somehow a combination of the ash and Dogen?

They seem to give us something (in this case the "fact" that Smokey can't cross the ash) and then take that from us. Which leaves us with yet another question to be answered (or an older question to be re-answered).

Perhaps I'm just getting a little impatient with it all now.

it has to do with the balance.... dogen was the on the side of the scale that was good. so mib couldnt cross the ash to his side or else it would disturb the balance. same with the dude trying it in the temple. with dogen dead, the ash doesnt work anymore.

[wwe2222]

Desmond must be coming soon, right?

we can only hope. The past 2 seasons have been lacking in the Desmond department

[Jon Kano]

RECON -

Shit this episode was awesome, possibly my fave so far!

Although it was only one episode, I loved all the correlations and similarities and references to previous events and situations; how Widmore's camp is the new Othersville with the sonic fences and how the Hydra island in the new crash site.

Some other things...

- Claire holding Kate's hand, must be like how Jacob's touch is a gift, think Claire was channeling MIB's super manipulation powers.

- Sawyer has a whole lot of conning on his mind, still think he will turn face before the end when he realises what is really going on.

- Really want to know what MIB's real plan is. I believe it IS to kill everyone and once he and what he represents wins the almighty battle of dark vs light, whatever presents itself surely must be what the Island is all about.

- Sayid seemed to be on heroin this episode.

- Trying to figure out what is behind the locked door in the sub; Desmond?, another bomb?, Jacob's body/remains?, porn?


Did I mention this was a fucking good episode!?

[Blitz]

I find it interesting, that, as far as I can tell anyways, Fake Locke has yet to lie about a single thing, or at least not squirmed away from the truth (IE why he told Claire the Others had Aaron).

[Jon Kano]

Yeah that was what I forgot to mention! Yeah I noticed this when Sawyer asked about the people at The Temple. I DID think he was going to lie though.

The thing is, it's not what we know he has told the truth about as such, it's what we don't know what he could be or is lying about.

He does seem more appealing to the goals and motives of the characters, and us watching the show getting answers. He gives answers quickly, presents himself with a somewhat believable past - but he does represent manipulation, the dark, the corrupt and has the ability to instill beliefs and hope of destiny into people, people like Locke who is dead, Sayid who is claimed and compremised, Claire who is claimed and insane.

Sawyer though, who although is only looking out for himself and out to get off the Island, he is good, he isn't claimed and he is a candidate.

Jacob, he is all about choice, allowing the individual to truly gain purpose and earn some kind of destiny through faith in something else as well as themselves. And at the same time, we have these characters, and every character has and does exhibit signs of both.

[Hanso Amore]

I think after the episode Ben has been following MiB not Jacob.

ben overthrew widmore, killed the Dharma who Jacob has a truce with, then exiled Whismore. then later he has Ben make Saywer clear a runway so Akira can land on it, to then take MiB home.

Ben devoted himself to jacob but follow the MiB thinking it was Jacob ( break in the ash ring allowed MiB to take over Jacobs cabin

[Hanso Amore]

I think this episode almst seals MiB as the goof guy but cast as the bad guy

[Buzzkill]

Don't think there is going to be any "good" or "evil" in the end. Things are not so...black and white, so to speak

[Jon Kano]

I think after the episode Ben has been following MiB not Jacob.

ben overthrew widmore, killed the Dharma who Jacob has a truce with, then exiled Whismore. then later he has Ben make Saywer clear a runway so Akira can land on it, to then take MiB home.

Ben devoted himself to jacob but follow the MiB thinking it was Jacob ( break in the ash ring allowed MiB to take over Jacobs cabin

It is a sound theory and makes sense but I don't think that the fact that certain things and events occurred were all part of MIB's plan or totally just for his benefit.

Ben was tainted from the get go by MIB or the Island when he was saved in The Temple as a child. He overthrew Widmore because he couldn't prove that it was the will of Jacob that baby Alex died by doing it himself. He did kill DHARMA but was ultimately groomed and supported by Richard who was in communicano with Jacob. The list and acquisition of Jack, Sawyer and Kate was based on Jacob's order, at least if your theory of Ben breaking the circle of ash is correct. Besides that flight ultimately landed team Jacob onto the battlefield anyway (They're coming).

Everything that happened didn't always go according to either Jacob's or MIB's liking, but I think Jacob and his team will be the underdogs until the very end, he seems to be down and out but I think he has a bigger more profound and effective plan in the works.

Got to remember what Jacob said to MIB on the beach when the Black Rock arrived, 'It only ends once, anything that happens before that, is progress'. Each version of events on Island, off Island, in the past, present and future are 'progress' and this time round will obviously be, where 'it ends'.

[Jon Kano]

Don't think there is going to be any "good" or "evil" in the end. Things are not so...black and white, so to speak


http://eyeoftheisland.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/locke_backgammon.jpg

http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/lostpedia/images/7/79/5x16_Jacob_and_nemesis.png

http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/lostpedia/images/b/bb/Aande_stones.jpg

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/lostpedia/images/a/a3/Bunny2.jpg

http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/lostpedia/images/d/d4/Timer_normal.JPG

[Penner]

This show is like MADE for you isn't it Kano

[Loose Cannon]

RECON -

Shit this episode was awesome, possibly my fave so far!

Although it was only one episode, I loved all the correlations and similarities and references to previous events and situations; how Widmore's camp is the new Othersville with the sonic fences and how the Hydra island in the new crash site.

Some other things...

- Claire holding Kate's hand, must be like how Jacob's touch is a gift, think Claire was channeling MIB's super manipulation powers.

- Sawyer has a whole lot of conning on his mind, still think he will turn face before the end when he realises what is really going on.

- Really want to know what MIB's real plan is. I believe it IS to kill everyone and once he and what he represents wins the almighty battle of dark vs light, whatever presents itself surely must be what the Island is all about.

- Sayid seemed to be on heroin this episode.

- Trying to figure out what is behind the locked door in the sub; Desmond?, another bomb?, Jacob's body/remains?, porn?


Did I mention this was a fucking good episode!?

Yea, Great Episode. I am loving the Sawyer character right now, especially after this one. He's all over the place. I know it's a minor thing, but I thought it was awesome when Sawyer caught that Zoe girl in a lie and pulled the gun out on her. That's classic Sawyer. Locke/MIB is a sneaky SOB and I think you're right in that eventually he is going to turn on his "clan" and off them all.

lol @ Sayid. he was fucked out of his mind

[Hanso Amore]

Yeah no shit. Sayid is fucking GONE.

You know how the side flashes are like "Life without Jacob"? Well look at Sawyer. Still looking for revenge, but he is a good guy without him, and with Jacob he is a hate filled scum bag.

[Hanso Amore]

I do like the references and shit.

LeFluer as the code word :)

[Buzzkill]

http://eyeoftheisland.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/locke_backgammon.jpg

http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/lostpedia/images/7/79/5x16_Jacob_and_nemesis.png

http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/lostpedia/images/b/bb/Aande_stones.jpg

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/lostpedia/images/a/a3/Bunny2.jpg

http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/lostpedia/images/d/d4/Timer_normal.JPGI know, that's what I was referencing. But I highly doubt that its going to be as simple as that.

Two contrasting ideals/philosophies? Sure. But straight up good and evil? No chance.

[Hanso Amore]

Also, how about Locke seemingly planting the seed in Kate to kill Claire?

[Optimus Bone 69]

Claire's kid is the dead Locke

[Requiem]

Anyone else as excited as me for next week's episode?

FINALLY GET TO FIND OUT WHO RICHARD ALPERT IS I AM SO HAPPYYYYYYYYYYY

[Requiem]

Also, I think Terry O'Quinn is going to be a shoe-in for an Emmy for this season's performance.

[PapaGeorgio]

Also, I think Terry O'Quinn is going to be a shoe-in for an Emmy for this season's performance.

That though crossed my mind during watching this last episode too.

[Hanso Amore]

Locke has tits

[XL]

Locke is the tits
Better.

[Buzzkill]

Yeah can't fucking wait for the Richard Alpert episode. Definitely a "holy grail" of LOST episodes.

But I really REALLY can't wait for the smoke monster flashback episode (episode 15 I think it is)

[Impact!]

Where do you guys find the info on whose the main star in the upcoming eps?

[PapaGeorgio]

I know on Wikipedia they had a listing of who it is centered around. They don't have it for every episode but got it for a few. Like in 2 weeks thing Hurley is main g.

[thedamndest]

For the Richard episode they showed a clip after the last one.

[Jakob Synn]

For the Richard episode they showed a clip after the last one.

I'm so fucking excited for this episode. I mean, I thought I was excited to finally see a Sawyer centric episode this season, this announcment got my panties so fucking wet.

[Loose Cannon]

well that pretty much explained/confirmed a lot. The zoom in on MIB/Locke at the tail end was awesome.

[Jeritron]

That episode was fantastic. Not only the best of the season thus far, but one of the best of the series.

[Blue Demon]

Indeed it was...explained a lot

[Blitz]

Solid episode, no real shockers in terms of Richard's origins, but it was nice to see Nestor Carbonell take center stage for once. The final scene was pretty great.

I want more of Richard's life on the island, doubt we'll get much though. Also need more Titus Welliver so badly. Man is great.

[thedamndest]

I would like a lot more on Lapidus. I know we're not really getting flashbacks besides Richard, but I feel like he's been just along for the ride the entire time. There must be some reason he survived besides keeping Sun company and asking questions to help clarify things for the audience.

[Hanso Amore]

I would like a lot more on Lapidus. I know we're not really getting flashbacks besides Richard, but I feel like he's been just along for the ride the entire time. There must be some reason he survived besides keeping Sun company and asking questions to help clarify things for the audience.

Agreed


There is a reason he was supposed to be on that flight, and that reason led him to the island

[Jon Kano]

It was a good episode.

One thing though, how come we had Richard arriving on The Black Rock at night, crashing into the statue, when in The Incident episode (season 5), The Black Rock is visible from the Island during the day, on calm seas?

[wwe2222]

It was a good episode.

One thing though, how come we had Richard arriving on The Black Rock at night, crashing into the statue, when in The Incident episode (season 5), The Black Rock is visible from the Island during the day, on calm seas?

Cause a storm came that night and crashed the ship on the island.

[Loose Cannon]

It was a good episode.

One thing though, how come we had Richard arriving on The Black Rock at night, crashing into the statue, when in The Incident episode (season 5), The Black Rock is visible from the Island during the day, on calm seas?

yea, I thought that too, but like the guy above said, a storm probably came up quickly at night. Even though we and Jacob/MIB could see the ship during the day, it was probably still very far out to sea. They could of been hours away from the Island, even though it looked close

[Ogen]

Plus if the islands as mythical as it all seems I've no real problem with Jacob just pulling a storm out of his arse to pull the ship in.

[Jon Kano]

Grrr, I don't like inconsistencies like that. It was clearly the middle of the day, the sea was calm and The Black Rock was not far off.

I also find it disturbing how Richard, the oldest of Jacob's allies and who should know the most and believe the most, was so easily swayed to change his mind to join MIB, even after Jack proved they were there for a purpose with the fuse going out.

Still, it was a good episode and all.

[wwe2222]

Grrr, I don't like inconsistencies like that. It was clearly the middle of the day, the sea was calm and The Black Rock was not far off.

I also find it disturbing how Richard, the oldest of Jacob's allies and who should know the most and believe the most, was so easily swayed to change his mind to join MIB, even after Jack proved they were there for a purpose with the fuse going out.

Still, it was a good episode and all.

Given the circumstances, I think Richard just lost it. You see how people who watch the show react when they think the show has no meaning, let alone how someone would react if that was actually their life.

[Loose Cannon]

Grrr, I don't like inconsistencies like that. It was clearly the middle of the day, the sea was calm and The Black Rock was not far off.

I also find it disturbing how Richard, the oldest of Jacob's allies and who should know the most and believe the most, was so easily swayed to change his mind to join MIB, even after Jack proved they were there for a purpose with the fuse going out.

Still, it was a good episode and all.

Yea, but you got to think it could still be the middle of the day and they could still be 10 hours away from shore. Remember, it was like 1867 or whatever. Boats were slow as hell back then. I go fishing a lot on motor boats and we go way out into the ocean. We could still see the shore from where we are, but it still takes 2 hours to get back in. Plus ocean storms come up very quick on you. It could be clear as hell one minute and then 15 minutes later be pouring rain and lightning

So I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt with that one

[Jon Kano]

OK fair play, just for the sake of the viewer, who most likely is not familiar with the whole fishing trade/sea scene, it just confused me as to why they did it what way.


Some other things I got from the episode -

- MIB spoke of 'him' or 'it', or something which lead me to believe it wasn't actually he himself who took Richard's wife. Although he IS the smoke, did he suggest something else controls him when he is smokey? if this is true (what he suggested), do you think it is the truth? I find it hard to believe since this season he has seemed to be able to choose when he transforms, where he moves and who he kills etc.

- Just remembering the meeting Sun had with Widmore back in season 5, about them both wanting to kill Ben. Maybe his arrival is not totally unknown and that will have some kind of bearing on what happens.

- Cannot wait until Jack sees Lock/MIB.

- Who you think, at this point, will become the new Jacob if that is the way the story goes? - I have been thinking about it, and I keep coming back to Jack. Everyone else could simply go back or have some kind of definite ending. Jack as the new Jacob, and Locke still as the MIB, together for eternity. But then I still also think Jacob wants Jack to kill MIB.

- MIB told Richard to put the knife into Jacob's chest, as in a sure way to kill him. I wonder what Sayid did wrong to the MIB in 'Sundown'? Surely it can't simply be because he said hello before he did it?

[Blitz]

- MIB told Richard to put the knife into Jacob's chest, as in a sure way to kill him. I wonder what Sayid did wrong to the MIB in 'Sundown'? Surely it can't simply be because he said hello before he did it?
Most likely. MIB said don't let him say one word or it's too late.

Know what the most intriguing part of the ep was for me? At the beginning, when Ben was talking about Fake Locke, he said something along the lines of "He's not quite Locke". Could just be Ben being Ben, or else maybe there's more Locke leftover in MIB than it seems.

[Hanso Amore]

OK fair play, just for the sake of the viewer, who most likely is not familiar with the whole fishing trade/sea scene, it just confused me as to why they did it what way.


Some other things I got from the episode -

- MIB spoke of 'him' or 'it', or something which lead me to believe it wasn't actually he himself who took Richard's wife. Although he IS the smoke, did he suggest something else controls him when he is smokey? if this is true (what he suggested), do you think it is the truth? I find it hard to believe since this season he has seemed to be able to choose when he transforms, where he moves and who he kills etc.

- Just remembering the meeting Sun had with Widmore back in season 5, about them both wanting to kill Ben. Maybe his arrival is not totally unknown and that will have some kind of bearing on what happens.

- Cannot wait until Jack sees Lock/MIB.

- Who you think, at this point, will become the new Jacob if that is the way the story goes? - I have been thinking about it, and I keep coming back to Jack. Everyone else could simply go back or have some kind of definite ending. Jack as the new Jacob, and Locke still as the MIB, together for eternity. But then I still also think Jacob wants Jack to kill MIB.

- MIB told Richard to put the knife into Jacob's chest, as in a sure way to kill him. I wonder what Sayid did wrong to the MIB in 'Sundown'? Surely it can't simply be because he said hello before he did it?

I dont think the same rules apply to MIB and Jacob.

MiB said last night that Jacob took his body and humanity. So that makes me think he is always smokey, but just assumes the look of a human. SO plunging a knife into him wouldnt kill him, which is what Dogen knew, he sent Sayid to be killed.

MiB is definitely lying to people. He finds those who are most desperate and prays on their loss, promising what they desire most but cant have to get them to do his will. If Jacob cant bring back the dead, no one can, so MiB is lying to get himself off the island.

Sayid, Richard, Claire. All missing a lost loved one (though Aaron is alive).

I think MiB "scanned" richard when he was in the ship, and saw a means to gain control. So he then appeared as Isabelle, and made Jacob out to be the Devil.

The boat destroying the statue is fucking BS. Wood on Stone and the wood wins?

[Hanso Amore]

Most likely. MIB said don't let him say one word or it's too late.

Know what the most intriguing part of the ep was for me? At the beginning, when Ben was talking about Fake Locke, he said something along the lines of "He's not quite Locke". Could just be Ben being Ben, or else maybe there's more Locke leftover in MIB than it seems.

I just think that is normal lost writing being cryptic.

Its not "Quite" Locke. It looks like him but it isnt him.

[Jon Kano]

I kinda hate the fact that real Locke is dead. He was my fave character.

MIB getting Richard to do his bidding and kill Jacob nearly kinda worked, I'm sure is he prayed on the right person in time, Jacob would've been killed. MIB working his plan with the plane crash, the course of events, time travel, gaining Locke's body really was a mission and a half.

Also, there is still rules for him to follow, and the Island having its own entity. Can't forget the small boy who came to MIB talking about the rules and that 'he can't kill him'. Still keep thinking that it was MIB who killed Jacob by pushing him into the fire and breaking the rules.

[wwe2222]

The boat destroying the statue is fucking BS. Wood on Stone and the wood wins?

You also need to consider the power of the wave that was carrying the Black Rock and struck the statue.

According to Lostpedia, the Statue is estimated to be about 200 feet tall...so yeah, thats a pretty big wave.

[Requiem]

Might have been MIB that caused the wave. Anyone think of that? After all, why would Jacob want to break his own statue? Might have been more of a 'diss' to Jacob on the MIB's part. lol