LOST Theories (will have spoliers)

[wwe2222]

I know I'm owed a fiver (British slang for five English pounds) from a mate who only watched season one where he met Locke's character was gonna turn out to be a creepy pervert who would commit at least one rape on the show.

still 3 episodes to go!

[Lock Jaw]

I know I'm owed a fiver (British slang for five English pounds) from a mate who only watched season one where he met Locke's character was gonna turn out to be a creepy pervert who would commit at least one rape on the show.

Come on, who DIDN'T think he was gonna turn out to be some creepy pervert pedo old man at the beginning of the show?

[Blitz]

Having re-watched the episode (I missed a little on the first airing), I'm probably 90% sure Frank's not dead. And that he will come out of nowhere in the finale to fly the plane home.

[Hanso Amore]

Franks death ios on par with as shitty an exit as Ilana.

Plus, a water tight hatch like that weights a few hundred pounds, and the pressure it takes to rip it off is enough to kill a man 10 times. I think they killed him off, but didnt want his death to be such a big event that it took away from the season 1 characters.

[Corporate CockSnogger]

They really should've at least mentioned him on the beach at the end. For now I am just going to assume he is dead, but will not be even 1% shocked if he turns up alive at some point.

[wwe2222]

He was there to keep open the possibility of flying the plane home.

I know he had a weak death, but you cant give everyone a heroic death scene, sometimes people are just unfortunate.

Plus, as Hanso said, you didnt want it to overshadow the Jin/Sun/Sayid death scene. Would have been nice if someone asked about him though. He looked so happy when they got to the plane and thought he could fix it too.

He will be missed though.

However, I am glad they have narrowed the field down significantly.

[Ermaximus]

He was there to keep open the possibility of flying the plane home.

I know he had a weak death, but you cant give everyone a heroic death scene, sometimes people are just unfortunate.

Plus, as Hanso said, you didnt want it to overshadow the Jin/Sun/Sayid death scene. Would have been nice if someone asked about him though. He looked so happy when they got to the plane and thought he could fix it too.

He will be missed though.

However, I am glad they have narrowed the field down significantly.

And then there were 9. Who knew Miles would outlive the other 3 from the freighter? I figured it would've been Daniel. :(

[wwe2222]

And then there were 9. Who knew Miles would outlive the other 3 from the freighter? I figured it would've been Daniel. :(

Speaking of people remaining, I love how it breaks down...

People who were born/controlled the Island
Widmore
Ben
Richard
Miles


Survivors of 815
Jack
Kate
Sawyer
Hurley

People with superpowers
Jacob
Desmond
MiB

[Corporate CockSnogger]

Nutjobs
Claire

[wwe2222]

Nutjobs
Claire

oops, forgot about Claire

[Ermaximus]

People Everyone forgot About
Rose
Bernard

[wwe2222]

People Everyone forgot About
Rose
Bernard

Ah, they don't count. Unless they become important all of a sudden

[Ermaximus]

Ah, they don't count. Unless they become important all of a sudden

I swear if they kill MIB and end up being pilots, I'm going to be pissed.

[Corporate CockSnogger]

I thought it was obvious that Rose was the oracle off Matrix and she will help combine the two universes.

[Reavant]

Im willing to bet that the origins of jacob and the mib are a parallel of the story of Kane and Abel or a type of god vs. the devil in that the island is the gate of hell, and jacob or the candidates are the gatekeepers keeping the mib in.

Now that someone brought it up, it would make sense that sawyer could become the next mib. Now I know he isnt evil and has done heroic things, but in a lot of archetypal stories, a hero can become a villain by going through too much and not dealing with the adversity that has been but on him. I think all he needs is for a few more shitty things to happen to him and jack to be the indirect/direct cause of it and they will be enemies on the level of mib and jacob.

[wwe2222]

Im willing to bet that the origins of jacob and the mib are a parallel of the story of Kane and Abel or a type of god vs. the devil in that the island is the gate of hell, and jacob or the candidates are the gatekeepers keeping the mib in.

Now that someone brought it up, it would make sense that sawyer could become the next mib. Now I know he isnt evil and has done heroic things, but in a lot of archetypal stories, a hero can become a villain by going through too much and not dealing with the adversity that has been but on him. I think all he needs is for a few more shitty things to happen to him and jack to be the indirect/direct cause of it and they will be enemies on the level of mib and jacob.

Being responsible for the deaths of 3 major characters should weigh very heavily on his conscience.

[Hanso Amore]

Or MIBs mom sacrifices him to the island....Someone has to "eat" the evil to contain it, a la Diablo or Green Mile. MIB never wanted the job, so Jacob has to keep him in line.

MIB is just a man that wants to go home, but was pulled into a role he never watned, keeping evil at bay.

Thats my new theory.

[Hanso Amore]

Like thats why he said he had a crazy mom. She threw him to the wolves to become keeper of evil.

[Hanso Amore]

Humans for all life have been coming to the island to seal away evil. Evil prevented childbirth so they built a statue of tawaret.

Jacob and MIB were brought aschildren to the island society. MIB is forced to take in theevil, snaps and kills everyone except JAcob whom he cant. He dedicates himself to get off the island, so JAcob spends the rest of his life bringing people to the island to stop him.

[Jon Kano]

Really goin wild with this ancient civilisation/jacob/mib ideas here, its good, but I dunno if such a detailed story can fit and work at this late in the whole story.

The more I have been thinking about how it ends, the more I am leaning to it all being resolved off Island, despite the fact I want a resolution on Island. I have got this feeling when the realities merge, or however this ends, its the new alternate reality that is going to be the time/place/existence where they all end up afterwards.

[Jeritron]

Im willing to bet that the origins of jacob and the mib are a parallel of the story of Kane and Abel or a type of god vs. the devil in that the island is the gate of hell, and jacob or the candidates are the gatekeepers keeping the mib in.

Now that someone brought it up, it would make sense that sawyer could become the next mib. Now I know he isnt evil and has done heroic things, but in a lot of archetypal stories, a hero can become a villain by going through too much and not dealing with the adversity that has been but on him. I think all he needs is for a few more shitty things to happen to him and jack to be the indirect/direct cause of it and they will be enemies on the level of mib and jacob.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Stand

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/9/96/The_Stand_cover.jpg/200px-The_Stand_cover.jpg (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:The_Stand_cover.jpg)

[Loose Cannon]

Im willing to bet that the origins of jacob and the mib are a parallel of the story of Kane and Abel or a type of god vs. the devil in that the island is the gate of hell, and jacob or the candidates are the gatekeepers keeping the mib in.

Yes on Kane and Abel. This is exactly what I think.

[Jeritron]

I'm not sure if it will be flat out hell. I don't think they'd commit to a particular religion. The ancient cultures seemed to liken the whole thing to Egyptian theology of an underworld, with MIB being Cerberus and Jacob possibly being Tawaret or Anubis.
It makes sense that modern dwellers would liken it to hell, and God vs Satan.

[Jon Kano]

Wasn't Anubis the god of war? of the dead? I could see Jacob representing the dead more because of the whispers and other religious/mythological elements of the show.

But yeah, I don't think it's going to be a flat out 'heaven vs hell' kind of scenario. Jacob and MIB been likened to Kane and Abel is not something new I'm afraid to say.

DHARMA called the smoke monster the Cerberus system, Cerberus of course is said to guard the underworld, represented by the Island I guess or where it leads.

The hieroglyphics that appear on the DHARMA countdown timer when the button is not pressed translate as 'Underworld'.

All these ideas and likenesses are all valid and have substance, that is what is so good, it all applies, but at the same time they have not stuck to one specific route/possibility.

[Jeritron]

I think they should keep the nature of the mythos a mixture of all things, and open to interpretation. If they go specificially with Judeo-Christian ideas it kind of takes away from other things, and takes the mythology out of it's own world.
It should be it's own thing, and conventional religiions are perhaps different cultures ways of trying to understand the real and unique island.

[loopydate]

a hero can become a villain by going through too much and not dealing with the adversity that has been but on him.

"You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain."
- Harvey Dent

"(Unintelligible guttural noises)"
- Batman

[wwe2222]

new podcast is up if anyone is interested

http://spoilerslost.blogspot.com/2010/05/official-lost-audio-podcast-episode-615.html#axzz0nHXiCe5t

[Reavant]

I think they should keep the nature of the mythos a mixture of all things, and open to interpretation. If they go specificially with Judeo-Christian ideas it kind of takes away from other things, and takes the mythology out of it's own world.
It should be it's own thing, and conventional religiions are perhaps different cultures ways of trying to understand the real and unique island.

it doesnt really matter.... every single religion including the ancient ones, have all the same archetypes in them, good/evil, light/dark, sun/moon. Its all really the same it just differentiates by the name given.

every religion has a gaurdian of the underworld and someone who is in it that either wants out or runs it.

[Jeritron]

Very true. That's sort of the reason why I want it to be it's own mythology. Even if it corresponds to various other religions and myths, I think Lost should have it's own mythology

[XL]

Maybe Jacob/MiB is what all religion is based on. Just different interpretations by what become all the different religions.

Dunno how they'd represet that though

[Hanso Amore]

This was all a dream while they went to mars.

[Jon Kano]

<object width="640" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/vHgS8WUxkjE&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/vHgS8WUxkjE&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385"></embed></object>

Called it way back in the episode we first saw him, the kid must be Jacob as a young kid, MIB & Jacob: KIDS.

[Hanso Amore]

Indiginous people, called it

[Jon Kano]

I am an other.

[Jon Kano]

Shit goin down tonight!!

I can't stay up late enough to catch it but fo sho I'll be back here same time tomorrow to comment. ENJOY GUYS!!!!

[wwe2222]

Im hoping its a great one and this thread is very busy tomorrow

[Loose Cannon]

can't wait for this one

[PapaGeorgio]

Had a dream about Lost last night, pretty excited for this episode, hoping it delivers. It better answer a lot of fucking questions and not just be boring and average.

[wwe2222]

Have to be honest...that was a huge letdown

[PapaGeorgio]

Agree. Pretty much done with Lost. Was super excited for this episode and it wasn't much of anything. Sorry if I don't care about some stupid ass light. Should have quit this when I got fed up during season 3 and stopped for awhile. Only 3 and a half hours of Lost left though, will finish it up. Think it'll take a lot for those episodes to leave me satisfied and glad I stuck with it. Hell last weeks episode with all those deaths I just didn't care. Dunno.

[wwe2222]

Im not done with Lost by any means, just a little letdown for this episode. I was hoping for a little more Island history.

[Hanso Amore]

That was a complete pile of shit.

We get "answers" but not explanation.

[Blitz]

Knew this was gonna happen after this ep. People are never happy in this situation.

[Blitz]

But goddamn, does the main through line of Lost ever seem to be "Parent's fuck ya up good".

[wwe2222]

But goddamn, does the main through line of Lost ever seem to be "Parent's fuck ya up good".

Or perhaps the theme is dont have kids cause they make ya crazy. Seriously though, I cant think of one character who didnt have parent problems. Charlie maybe?

[Loose Cannon]

I can see the argument where people might think this episode had nothing in it, but I really liked it. I love how this episode confirms that the person the audience assumed to be the all knowing being of the island throughout the series really doesn't really presume to know all the answers. Jacob took a leap of faith and trusted his "mother" in eventualy taking her spot as the protector. He didn't completly understand what exactly he was protecitng, but in his heart he felt he was doing what was right. Sound familiar?

Then we have the MIB. The person who we thought was the MIB in his original form really wasn't such a bad guy after all. He was just curious and wanted answers. So now we see that Smokey just took his form after he went into the tunnel. And Smokey goes back long before Jacob and his brother. I am assuming the real mother appearing to Jacob's brother was the Smoke Monster and that "It" took out that whole camp.

But my favorite part of the episode was that ending. The whole sequence cutting to Jack, Kate and Locke was amazing. I think that was the 1st or 2nd episode, right? It made me think look how far we've come from back then and where we are right now knowing so much more about the island. Really loved that.

[wwe2222]

I can see the argument where people might think this episode had nothing in it, but I really liked it. I love how this episode confirms that the person the audience assumed to be the all knowing being of the island throughout the series really doesn't really presume to know all the answers. Jacob took a leap of faith and trusted his "mother" in eventualy taking her spot as the protector. He didn't completly understand what exactly he was protecitng, but in his heart he felt he was doing what was right. Sound familiar?

Then we have the MIB. The person who we thought was the MIB in his original form really wasn't such a bad guy after all. He was just curious and wanted answers. So now we see that Smokey just took his form after he went into the tunnel. And Smokey goes back long before Jacob and his brother. I am assuming the real mother appearing to Jacob's brother was the Smoke Monster and that "It" took out that whole camp.

But my favorite part of the episode was that ending. The whole sequence cutting to Jack, Kate and Locke was amazing. I think that was the 1st or 2nd episode, right? It made me think look how far we've come from back then and where we are right now knowing so much more about the island. Really loved that.

Alot of people seem to hate when they flashback like that, but I thought it was cool here. It was such a long ways ago and more of an "innocent" (for lack of a better word there) time in the show

[Loose Cannon]

yea, exactly. Innocent, good way to put it. we knew nothing back then and all of us had some many different theories going through our heads.

[wwe2222]

It was the same way I felt at the end of last week when the four finalists were on the beach and they took a moment to break down finally. It was just a small scene where they were alone and it was like years of what they had been through all came rushing forward. Totally different scenes but they made me feel the same way.

[PapaGeorgio]

I liked the little flashback scene. Didn't care about the Adam and Eve storyline really, but thought it just flowed well and was a good reflective scene. Will give the eps that.

[Lock Jaw]

That was probably the worst episode of Lost I can recall.

I'm not complaining that we didn't get more answers, or more explanations or whatever. The episode was just written in such a way that it moved incredibly slowly and painfully to give the few points that it had to give.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

I kept debating myself in my brain about whether or not it was Allison Janney playing the mother. First I was like oh yeah def her but then later I was like no way def not. Shoulda gone with my instincts,

[Jon Kano]

OK well I did stay up in the end and I did watch it.

Mmmmm....

I thought it was a good episode. But I feel as though it's been misplaced this far down the line, I feel as though it should've been in season 5, but it really didn't have a space there, I dunno.

Still didn't explain anything about what the Island is, how 'Mother' came to be and how she knows all about the rules and what needs to be done.

Nothing about the statue which I thought we would see.

I feel as though these holes will be revealed in the finale, maybe.

So the MIB in season 6....I assume it is totally the smoke monster mixed with the memories and nature of Jacob's brother, since his body is now in the caves. Same with Locke, his body is in the ground, but the MIB seems to know Locke's entire existence.

And all the stuff about 'good people' and being flawed and killers doesn't apply as much as I thought since 'Mother' and 'Jacob' are murderers.

One big thing... how in the blue hell did 'Mother' burn the whole village and kill everyone?

[Corporate CockSnogger]

Yeah I wasn't overly impressed by this episode in all honesty. And it's not often I would say that about Lost, but I was looking forward to this episode for weeks. I still thought it was a decent episode, but not for the 3rd to last episode ever, and I was definitely expecting more clear cut answers, but ah well.

I'm full of flu though so that could generally be making me think negatively.

[wwe2222]

Its not that I was really alot of expecting huge answers or reveals, its the episode was done very poorly I felt.

[Buzzkill]

I hope everyone upset about the lack of answers realizes that if they had given a more concrete explanation of what the island "is" or what the statue is you would be just as disappointed, right?

Any technical explanation would just come across as completely absurd. I feel a lot of people have unreasonable expectations.

I thought this episode was just fine, maybe a little slow but still interesting

[Jon Kano]

I don't think so mate. At this point I am just wanting to know what is what. Been watching it for 6 years and with 2 episodes left, it is now at the point where getting some answers, some definition of what has kept us glued for the whole time is required to make the journey complete. Its been great, all the cliffhangers, the slow build ups where things are gradually revealed. But I feel as though ANY answer, as long as it's true to the nature of the show, is what is needed to make the puzzle complete. No one makes a puzzle and destroy it before the final few pieces are in place.

I don't mind if there is a degree of mystery left, but too many corners are being cut I feel at the moment. If you compare the pace of season 1 or 2 to this one - I dunno, they coulda spread this season out by another half at least. And again, fair enough that's the way LOST has gone and I love it, but I also want answers.

Even in that one episode, things are shown and revealed but it doesn't correlate to what we have seen....

who finished the construction of the donkey wheel after the well was filled back in? How come it was frozen in the season 4 finale?

I dunno, we'll see how the finale ends up I guess.

[Reavant]

I hope everyone upset about the lack of answers realizes that if they had given a more concrete explanation of what the island "is" or what the statue is you would be just as disappointed, right?

Any technical explanation would just come across as completely absurd. I feel a lot of people have unreasonable expectations.

I thought this episode was just fine, maybe a little slow but still interesting

stop being such a buzzkill.... I WANT ANSWERS

[Loose Cannon]

I also found it interesting last night that Jacob's brother can see the dead like Hurley can

[XL]

I am assuming the real mother appearing to Jacob's brother was the Smoke Monster and that "It" took out that whole camp.
I kinda figured that Jacob throwing his brother (why did they never mention his name? Did she never give him one?) into the light was what released the black smoke monster.

[Loose Cannon]

yea, I just actually thought about that this morning and I think that is correct. I originaly assumed it was the Monster appearing as the original mother to Jacob's brother, but yea, "It" was not released yet. So it must of been the other 'mother'

[Jon Kano]

I don't think the monster took out the camp since it wasn't released at that point, and why would he? the camp were men of greed and badness, it's kind of people.

[Jon Kano]

OK I wrote that out then went to get a drink and posted it so ignore it.

Still, how did she take out the whole camp?

And there is also something else that is interesting that I have overlooked. The smoke monster as an entity wants to leave the Island, as does the MIB as a person - combined, and it's one determined 'thing'. Yet Jacob has appeared in all of the candidates lives at some point - so how and why is Jacob able to leave willy nilly?

[wwe2222]

Im not necessarily looking for answers as to how things work, but rather why...For instance...

I know what the Statue of Tawaret is. Its a statue. Fine. I want to know who put it there and who built the temples.

I dont want to know how the circle of ash protects you from the monster, but why is it ash. Why isnt it a circle of carrots?

I am fine with supernatural explanations of things, but I want to know how we got from Jacob kills his brother, fast forward 2,000 years to them sitting on the beach.

That is such a huge timeframe to not see in what has become the focal point of the show.

[Loose Cannon]

I am just assuming that the protector of the island has a shit load of powers and can take out an army if they wanted to at any time for a greater cause.

Lot of assuming with this show

dunno about Jacob leaving. Again could be just a thing the protector of the island can do.

[XL]

Yeah. That's one of the thngs I expected to find out in this last episode (Jacob coming and going). It is odd how they've shown the actual MiB (can we pick a name for him now?) and Smokey to have the same motive in leaving.

If it was Jacob's job to protect the light - and he fucked it up - what's did his job become? Keeping smokey on the island?

Did the light become the Smoke Monster? Or was the light keeping the monster at bay? WTF was the light anyway?

How did the mother destroy the village/kill the people and fill the well in by herself? How did the well get fixed and the wheel positioned if 1) it was filled in and 2) the very people who's idea it was (and everyone that knew about the idea) died shortly thereafter?

And we still don't know who built the temple and statue? Just what is the Black Smoke? What's the deal with dying in child birth. etc, etc.

A lot to cover in these last couple episodes.

[Loose Cannon]

I am fine with supernatural explanations of things, but I want to know how we got from Jacob kills his brother, fast forward 2,000 years to them sitting on the beach.

That is such a huge timeframe to not see in what has become the focal point of the show.


Well the guy you see sitting on the beach with Jacob is the SMoke Monster appearing as Jacob's brother.

[Jon Kano]

Also...

And this is an observation into a possible continuity/timeline error...


As Richard's ship is approaching with Jacob and MIB on the beach...MIB asks Jacob if he has any idea how badly he wants to kill him, to which Jacob answers yes. He then states that one day he will find his loop hole, supposedly so he can leave....So from this we know he wants to kill Jacob and that he wants to leave.

Fast forward to some time later when Richard's ship has arrived and all the events of 'Ab Aeterno' have happened and Jacob is sitting with MIB once again...

Jacob: So you tried to kill me?

MIB: You expect an apology?

Jacob: No, I guess I'm just wondering why you did it?


Things like this just seem like they made a mistake, or have I made a mistake?

[Reavant]

i think you have the instances reversed... i think when richard got there was the first time he tried to kill jacob

[Reavant]

that ship approaching was the french people... there was a huge storm going on when the black rock approached

[wwe2222]

Well the guy you see sitting on the beach with Jacob is the SMoke Monster appearing as Jacob's brother.

?? So this is the first time they have seen each other in 2,000 years? It doesnt make any sense.

Im going to assume MiB cant leave the Island because he suffered a fate worse than death, where he is ultimately trapped as this smoke monster.

Did going into the glowing cave release some sort of ancient evil and thats why Jacob is there? The mother made it seem like they were there to protect the energy source while Jacob says he is there to keep the smoke monster from leaving. So which is it?

[Jon Kano]

Well the guy you see sitting on the beach with Jacob is the SMoke Monster appearing as Jacob's brother.

Yes this is true, but I think part of Jacob's brother still exists. Every scene we have seen him in, esp with Richard, you can tell he is playing the same character, and not just some supernatural smoke entity. I dunno, could be wrong, but when they converse, he comes off as being the guy who really is Jacob's brother. If he was JUST the smoke monster surely his language, gestures would be something alien like?

MIB also recites the exact same thing 'Mother' says about people who come to the Island, 'they come they destroy...etc', it could be the monster 'accessing his memories' like it did with Locke.

Also, when he talks to Richard, he says he was robbed of his humanity and his body. Could just be the actual monster using that as a means of manipulation.

But yeah, too much to cover and answer I think. I think the finale will be awesome don't get me wrong, but I can see a degree of disappointment on the horizon with regard to answers. And answers are important now.

[wwe2222]

that ship approaching was the french people... there was a huge storm going on when the black rock approached

No, the ship approaching is the Black Rock. The Statue is still intact during the first MiB/Jacob scene. We know now that it was the Black Rock that crashed into it.

To the point about the conversation...I think Jacob knows MiB wants to kill him, but was sort of saying..."So, you really did try to kill me" as in, you werent just talk, you really tried to do it you SOB.

[Jon Kano]

that ship approaching was the french people... there was a huge storm going on when the black rock approached

Na man, not got it wrong...

Them on the beach (The Incident, season 5) was def before when they sat on the log with the bottle of wine (Ab Aeterno, season 6).

It was NOT the french people. They came after.

http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100327152205/lostpedia/images/d/da/Normal_theincident012.jpg

But yeah, I consider the whole dark and stormy vs daylight and calm thing a big fuck up. I think they decided as they got to that point that they would change it and have the ship destroy the statue - I mean everyone was saying it was 'days away from the Island still' - fuck off it's as clear as daylight how close it is, a mile or two at the most. And a wooden ship up against dense stone statue, and the statue falls? come on!

[Jon Kano]

?? So this is the first time they have seen each other in 2,000 years? It doesnt make any sense.

Im going to assume MiB cant leave the Island because he suffered a fate worse than death, where he is ultimately trapped as this smoke monster.

Did going into the glowing cave release some sort of ancient evil and thats why Jacob is there? The mother made it seem like they were there to protect the energy source while Jacob says he is there to keep the smoke monster from leaving. So which is it?


Yeah here is my current take....

The white light that Mother said needed to be protected is 'the heart of the Island' and what it is, is something that is inside every man - I think it takes the right man or right person to 'have it' or guard it in this case. If the wrong type of soul claims it, the power becomes darkness and evil. Mother thought MIB was special, in a good way. He is the 'Bad Twin' of the two.

[Loose Cannon]

?? So this is the first time they have seen each other in 2,000 years? It doesnt make any sense.

Im going to assume MiB cant leave the Island because he suffered a fate worse than death, where he is ultimately trapped as this smoke monster.

Did going into the glowing cave release some sort of ancient evil and thats why Jacob is there? The mother made it seem like they were there to protect the energy source while Jacob says he is there to keep the smoke monster from leaving. So which is it?

what makes you think it's the first time they've seen each other in 2000 years?

Yea, the cave/light thing I am trying to make sense in my head. To me, it's like if someone (a corrupt human) who is not pure went into the cave, it releases the monster. Dunno, it's a reach, but I'm thinking along those lines

[wwe2222]

Yeah here is my current take....

The white light that Mother said needed to be protected is 'the heart of the Island' and what it is, is something that is inside every man - I think it takes the right man or right person to 'have it' or guard it in this case. If the wrong type of soul claims it, the power becomes darkness and evil. Mother thought MIB was special, in a good way. He is the 'Bad Twin' of the two.

I could go with that theory. I would assume thats what is happening, but its a little jumbeled.

I hope we get a little more in depth on this. This episode would have served better earlier in the season I think.

[Jon Kano]

This episode would have served better earlier in the season I think.

Yeah that is what I think also.


In my pervious post I mentioned the phrase 'Bad Twin'.

Unless you read about it or actually did the Lost Experience game you will not know...

Apparently the guy who got sucked into the turbine engine thingy in the very first episode is a guy called Gary Troupe, who was an author, who wrote a book 'Bad Twin'. A little nod and foreshadowing of things to come

Have a read..

http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Gary_Troup

[Loose Cannon]

Yes this is true, but I think part of Jacob's brother still exists. Every scene we have seen him in, esp with Richard, you can tell he is playing the same character, and not just some supernatural smoke entity. I dunno, could be wrong, but when they converse, he comes off as being the guy who really is Jacob's brother. If he was JUST the smoke monster surely his language, gestures would be something alien like?

MIB also recites the exact same thing 'Mother' says about people who come to the Island, 'they come they destroy...etc', it could be the monster 'accessing his memories' like it did with Locke.

Also, when he talks to Richard, he says he was robbed of his humanity and his body. Could just be the actual monster using that as a means of manipulation.

But yeah, too much to cover and answer I think. I think the finale will be awesome don't get me wrong, but I can see a degree of disappointment on the horizon with regard to answers. And answers are important now.


this is one I am going to disagree with you on and I hope they answer this fully. I think MIB completely died in last night's time. I think the Smoke Monster took over his looks and everything else about him. Like his character. I think the SMoke Monster has the power to do this.

[wwe2222]

this is one I am going to disagree with you on and I hope they answer this fully. I think MIB completely died in last night's time. I think the Smoke Monster took over his looks and everything else about him. Like his character. I think the SMoke Monster has the power to do this.

So you think the Smoke Monster is a completely different entity, sort of the bad twin if you will to the Island's glowing light? Possible, but I still go back to what the mother said about suffering a fate worse than death.

[Loose Cannon]

yes, I think the Light and the Smoke are the two higher things, not Jacob and his brother.

[Jon Kano]

this is one I am going to disagree with you on and I hope they answer this fully. I think MIB completely died in last night's time. I think the Smoke Monster took over his looks and everything else about him. Like his character. I think the SMoke Monster has the power to do this.


Yeah I dunno I got nothing serious to go on other than the fact whenever it's been the MIB or Locke, it's like there are times where as if it seems they are two entities, like Venom, a symbiotic force which takes over, but doesn't completely overtake who it 'claims'. Do you think it's a coincidence that as Locke, the monster yelled out 'Don't tell me what I can't do', or that as Jacob's brother he recites the exact same thing 'Mother' said to him as a child? or that the MIB and the monster both want to leave? MIB to find his home, which he explains as Locke, and the monster to 'end everything'?

I dunno, if I am totally wrong about that, then like I said, the monster at least is able to acess and harness the memories/life of whoever it takes the form of.

[wwe2222]

Yeah I dunno I got nothing serious to go on other than the fact whenever it's been the MIB or Locke, it's like there are times where as if it seems they are two entities, like Venom, a symbiotic force which takes over, but doesn't completely overtake who it 'claims'. Do you think it's a coincidence that as Locke, the monster yelled out 'Don't tell me what I can't do', or that as Jacob's brother he recites the exact same thing 'Mother' said to him as a child? or that the MIB and the monster both want to leave? MIB to find his home, which he explains as Locke, and the monster to 'end everything'?

I dunno, if I am totally wrong about that, then like I said, the monster at least is able to acess and harness the memories/life of whoever it takes the form of.

Well im wondering if the monster is trying to humanize his wishes by saying he wants to go home as a way to get sympathy. Perhaps he just wants to leave and wreak havoc.

[Jon Kano]

yes, I think the Light and the Smoke are the two higher things, not Jacob and his brother.

The thing is, why would the darkness, the opposite of 'the light' originate from the light?

And do we even know that that light in the cave is the only one of it's kind? There are pockets of energy/light all over the Island, do we know for sure that is the only one that is truly special and overall more important? - It pretty much seems like the same light/energy as the one in the Swan and the one down the well.

[Jon Kano]

Well im wondering if the monster is trying to humanize his wishes by saying he wants to go home as a way to get sympathy. Perhaps he just wants to leave and wreak havoc.

Yeah I think that is the overall goal of the monster. It was released/manifested by a darkened/troubled soul and so its like 'the game is on' from that point on. If it leave the Island, then it becomes defiant and absolute and will end existence.

Yet it was/is also the goal of Jacob's actual brother. And while he is now sentenced to a suffering worse than death, what true benefit would it be to him if HE left if it meant the unmaking of existence?

[Jon Kano]

Jesus, my head is spinning. This is just once aspect of the show, so much more to cover and sort out, I really hope it works.

[wwe2222]

Jesus, my head is spinning. This is just once aspect of the show, so much more to cover and sort out, I really hope it works.

But then why not give Jacob's brother a name?

This leads me to my next point...Jacob's brother constructed the donkey wheel, but never completed it.

As we have seen, later civilizations seemed to have worshipped the smoke monster. I wonder if he appeared to them as a God, offered them protection, and instructed them to finish the wheel, in hopes of moving the Island and getting off it.

[Jon Kano]

That's a good theory, and one that must be close to being correct.

I just don't know where to go with it, I mean what does it mean if we don't find out? to me it's kinda a bad thing.

[wwe2222]

That's a good theory, and one that must be close to being correct.

I just don't know where to go with it, I mean what does it mean if we don't find out? to me it's kinda a bad thing.

They have said they would answer some questions, but not within the context of the show.

What they should do is release some sort of book or something that is written like an archeological journal or something about the history of the Island.

[Jon Kano]

Yeah I guess that would be cool, but nothing compared to seeing it on screen. I expect that not everything will be explained, but this being the last season, I'm thinking maybe instead of the alternate reality, we should've gone back to flashbacks but on-island flashbacks. I dunno, depends how cool, good and significant the ending to the way they have gone turns out.

[wwe2222]

Yeah I guess that would be cool, but nothing compared to seeing it on screen. I expect that not everything will be explained, but this being the last season, I'm thinking maybe instead of the alternate reality, we should've gone back to flashbacks but on-island flashbacks. I dunno, depends how cool, good and significant the ending to the way they have gone turns out.

Agreed...this could all be moot in a week and a half if the ending blows us away. I would have loved a few Island flashbacks or at least one episode devoted to a flashback of the entire Island's history.

[wwe2222]

Also, young MiB saying his game came from Across the Sea reminded me of that Family Guy sketch of movies where characters on screen say the name of the movie in the movie.

[Jon Kano]

LOL yeah come to think of it that happens a lot in LOST, can already think and remember several:

- Live together, die alone
- three minutes
- Enter 77
- man of science, man of faith
- Every man for himself

[wwe2222]

LOL yeah come to think of it that happens a lot in LOST, can already think and remember several:

- Live together, die alone
- three minutes
- Enter 77
- man of science, man of faith
- Every man for himself

Man Behind the Curtain, Incident....Yeah it happens alot but for some reason it just stuck out to me last night, haha. Maybe it was the kid's delivery of the line.

[Jon Kano]

I might of mentioned this before, but I'll mention it again.

I don't think there is a chance in hell they would release it or even make it - but I bet within a certain amount of time, somewhere out there a LOST fanatic who knows his editing and who would dedicate the time and effort will one day make a chronological version of LOST and put it up for torrent download. I would be one of those who download it just for a different viewing experience.

[Hanso Amore]

So I dont agree that the brother "Released" the smoke monster and they arent the same.

They Are one in the same.

Jacobs fate worse than death is to be stripped of his mortal body and live forever trapped on the island as a smoke monster.

He still cant harm Jacob even as SMokey as the rules dont let brothers hurt each other. He still is the same guy, with the same crazy mother stories, looking to leave the island and go across the sea.

[Hanso Amore]

Anyone notice the Mother said the same line about humans as MIB did in his first appearance about them corrupting and fighting?

[Jon Kano]

Anyone notice the Mother said the same line about humans as MIB did in his first appearance about them corrupting and fighting?

Yeah I have mentioned it like twice :D

[Hanso Amore]

LOL fuck me

I scanned this thread quick whilst I ate my lunch!

[Jon Kano]

I think the game changed when he went into the water cave though.

'Mother' said to Jacob that she must let him (his brother, the MIB) leave because it is his choice, so even though he doesn't know how, it appears as though he can leave. And the consequences were that one of her chosen guardians, the one she favored up till then, was not up to the job.

Then when Jacob's brother becomes the smoke monster, it became more about 'evil' escaping the Island (the wine bottle/cork/Island analogy) and spreading into the world/universe.

It's like two separate characters, becomming one, who have the same goal.

The more I think about the evidence, the more it does suggest that MIB, Jacob's brother is still very much part of the smoke monster/Locke - all the stuff he said to Richard about 'the devil' taking his body and his humanity. Sure he was the rotter of the two brothers, but he didn't seem totally corrupted - he felt remorse and upset when he killed his mother. And then the speech he gave Sawyer in 'The Substitute' about knowing what it was like to feel pain, and betrayal etc.

[Jon Kano]

FUCCCCCKKK just passed 10k, oh well my tribute post is on the way. Glad is was a LOST post (I guess).

[XL]

I was about to bring up the fact that Smokey can't kill Jacob pointing to Smokey and Jacob's brother being one and the same...but what about the fact that we saw his body!?

I guess the monster could "strip" someone of their character, but it seems to me that they would have had to be alive to do this - unlike Locke/Christian.

I think the problem a lot of us are having is that we didn't expect to be theorizing on this stuff with so little time to go. They have a lot to answer in the time remaining - I fear a lot will go unanswered.

For instance, how do they cover the stuff with "Jacob's Cabin"? Who was living there? Who said "Help me!" when Locke was there? Who was sat in the rocking chair?

I figured stuff like that would be covered in "Across The Sea" - I thought as Jacob/His brother/Smokey had been there so long we would see a lot of the history explained. Now we have to hope they cover this in the time remaining.

[wwe2222]

I was about to bring up the fact that Smokey can't kill Jacob pointing to Smokey and Jacob's brother being one and the same...but what about the fact that we saw his body!?

I guess the monster could "strip" someone of their character, but it seems to me that they would have had to be alive to do this - unlike Locke/Christian.

I think the problem a lot of us are having is that we didn't expect to be theorizing on this stuff with so little time to go. They have a lot to answer in the time remaining - I fear a lot will go unanswered.

For instance, how do they cover the stuff with "Jacob's Cabin"? Who was living there? Who said "Help me!" when Locke was there? Who was sat in the rocking chair?

I figured stuff like that would be covered in "Across The Sea" - I thought as Jacob/His brother/Smokey had been there so long we would see a lot of the history explained. Now we have to hope they cover this in the time remaining.

I dont think there is any way they are getting to Jacob's cabin. Its a shame cause its been visited in seasons 3, 4, and 5.

I think Ilana saying "someone else was using it" is all we are going to get with hit. We will have to theorize what happened with it. I think it was the MiB, Im just not sure how it relates to him moving about the Island.

Part of what I was hoping for last night was to see the Jacob/MiB struggle over the course of thousands of years

[Jon Kano]

I was about to bring up the fact that Smokey can't kill Jacob pointing to Smokey and Jacob's brother being one and the same...but what about the fact that we saw his body!?

I guess the monster could "strip" someone of their character, but it seems to me that they would have had to be alive to do this - unlike Locke/Christian.

I think the problem a lot of us are having is that we didn't expect to be theorizing on this stuff with so little time to go. They have a lot to answer in the time remaining - I fear a lot will go unanswered.

For instance, how do they cover the stuff with "Jacob's Cabin"? Who was living there? Who said "Help me!" when Locke was there? Who was sat in the rocking chair?

I figured stuff like that would be covered in "Across The Sea" - I thought as Jacob/His brother/Smokey had been there so long we would see a lot of the history explained. Now we have to hope they cover this in the time remaining.

Yeah totally agree. Its has just got to that point now, and it has only really become apparent after that episode.

Yeah see things like this make me lean more to the idea that they really didn't think about what they were doing at the time and how it would impact later on what they eventually decided would be the story.

Here is my breakdown of trying to answer that...

Ben never actually met Jacob, and as we know, his base/home was the chamber underneath the statue. However, Ilana knew to go to the cabin to look for Jacob. But upon finding it saw that the circle of ash had been broken, and that someone else had been using it....so through that we could assume that someone, at some point trapped the smoke monster inside the cabin....but then again, the smoke monster has been rampant throughout the Island since episode friggin 1!! - so none of that really makes sense at all :(

Ben was surprised when things in the cabin started going crazy - and we did hear the voice - so something was present there even if it was Ben trying to trick Locke. The guy in the chair was played by one of the crew members on the LOST production team, can't remember where I read that, but it was an interview and they showed the guy on set - either way, it was a totally different guy to that of the guy who plays Jacob and Christian. It just doesn't make sense. Even in the context of LOST, its too much of a web of inconsistencies to be.

But yeah, seriously, there is too much to explain, and the stuff they have not explained it very significant to the story.

I dunno, it could all work I guess.

[XL]

Well yeah, you've stated what we know and what's assumed to explain it...it'd be nice to know for sure what the deal was/is.

I guess these could be seen as big McGuffins in the bigger picture. The hatch was the most important thing to us in S1, finding out who The Others were was the biggest mystery of S2, etc. but those things seem so inconsiquential to the story now.

[Hanso Amore]

SMokey has said that jacob took his body and made him the way he is...so that explaisn why he has a dead body, he is now a spiritual being.

The ash maybe didnt keep things in the cabin but rather out....then somehow the ashes were broken, and smokey moved into the cabin to pretend to be jacob to Ben and falsely lead the others.

[XL]

Just thought, was the knife that MiB had/used to kill his mother the same knife that Dogan gave to Sayid to kill Smocke?

[Jon Kano]

It was! Its a certain kind of Roman soldier weapon they all had. I actually have the exact replica in my room I got in Greece years ago lol.

[Jon Kano]

The ash maybe didnt keep things in the cabin but rather out....then somehow the ashes were broken, and smokey moved into the cabin to pretend to be jacob to Ben and falsely lead the others.

We actually have not had any evidence where we saw or it was suggested that The Others were ever deceived by the MIB. Jacob only spoke to Richard, probably in his statue chamber.

That's the thing, only Locke and a small other handful of people were under the impression it was Jacob in the cabin. And those people were not any of The Others, just the losties.

[wwe2222]

We actually have not had any evidence where we saw or it was suggested that The Others were ever deceived by the MIB. Jacob only spoke to Richard, probably in his statue chamber.

That's the thing, only Locke and a small other handful of people were under the impression it was Jacob in the cabin. And those people were not any of The Others, just the losties.

We know Richard knew where Jacob was. Ben clearly didnt but pretended he did, and the Others I dont think had any idea where Jacob lived.

So really you have Locke who thought Jacob lived there, Hurley who knew someone was there but not really who, and Ilana's Group who went there for Jacob but quickly figured out it wasnt him.

On top of all of it, you have Horace who built the cabin.

If you watch the sneak peak for next week...semi spoiler warning I suppose....

Hurley gives the bag of ashes to young Jacob in the jungle, so maybe we will find out a little more about the ash

[XL]

Been doin gsome reading, there is a school of thoughtthat Mother = Monster.

I have to admit, when she first appeared to find Claudia by the stream the scene was all to similar to when the smoke appeared behind Eko as he was drinking from a stream. Then there was the way that she told Claudia that she would find any other people that had arrived at the island. And of course the way that the village was destroyed, people killed and - most oddly - the well filled in.

When she warns Jacob that going into the Glowing Cave of Death (and life, and rebirth) is a fate "worse than death" that she is speaking from experience?

To counterpoint this, we see the light in the cave go out when MiB is sent down there by Jacob, presumably this would have happened if Mother had gone down there. Does the light come back? We've seen it when Locke/Ben turned the Donkey Wheel so perhaps!?

[Jon Kano]

We know Richard knew where Jacob was. Ben clearly didnt but pretended he did, and the Others I dont think had any idea where Jacob lived.

So really you have Locke who thought Jacob lived there, Hurley who knew someone was there but not really who, and Ilana's Group who went there for Jacob but quickly figured out it wasnt him.

On top of all of it, you have Horace who built the cabin.

If you watch the sneak peak for next week...semi spoiler warning I suppose....

Hurley gives the bag of ashes to young Jacob in the jungle, so maybe we will find out a little more about the ash

Horace did built the cabin, but it was most likely the MIB who posed as him in the dream/vision Locke had where he was cutting the tree down. Horace/MIB needed Locke to find the cabin so he could then pose as Christian and tell him to move the island. And although Ben did it, it was Locke who he meant, which he told him in the well in season 5.

Maybe it was and is Jacob's plan to have the good guys believe it was his cabin so it lead to to and through the course of events that occurred. I have always kinda believed Jacob's plan is to make it seem as though the MIB is one step ahead (it was like he let Ben kill him in a way) when really he has an ace or two up his sleeve, like Desmond and the alternate universe, which I doubt MIB is aware of or what it could have happen.

Also my reply to spoiler...

Young Jacob is not Jacob though, pretty sure its the Island or some kind of higher being/force. Jacob is dead.

[Hanso Amore]

Ben brought Locke to the cabin stating thats where Jacob lived....so ben might have actually thought of Jacob as being there. Thats why when Locke heard "him" ben was upset at the idea of losign power, and shot Locke

[Loose Cannon]

holy shit, I leave for a couple hours and there's like 20 new posts

[Johnny McNasty]

I love this show. Thought the history of Jacob and not Jacob was well done. I like that Lost has its own mythology now, and isn't something taken literally from some other source. Really can't believe their is only two episodes left. :(

[XL]

Ben brought Locke to the cabin stating thats where Jacob lived....so ben might have actually thought of Jacob as being there. Thats why when Locke heard "him" ben was upset at the idea of losign power, and shot Locke
Yeah, we know that Ben never got an audience with Jacob and judging by this reaction when whoever it is in the cabin goes apeshit, he's never spoken to anyone there.

[Loose Cannon]

here's my problem with the guys saying Smoke Monster and MIB are is basicaly the same thing. I mean, yea, there is a lot of evidence that points to that, but....

How long has this Smoke Monster existed on the island? It seems like it was there as long as the island's been there. And then we have to ask how long the island has been there? Becuase the Smoke Monster didn't just appear with MIB. It was there well before MIB was even born.

At least that's my take on it. They really need to show DAY 1 this island existed. lol

[Hanso Amore]

Why do you assume smokey existed at any point prior to MIB going into the light? there is nothing to support that.

[XL]

It's just guesswork again. It could be that the Monster wa being held by the light and was released when MiB went into the cave. It could be that the Monster is somehow a manifestation of what was in MiB's heart. Etc, etc, etc.

This is why it's frustrating. We shouldn't be speculating to this degree at this point.

[Miotch]

Most people here hated last nights episode, right? (I can't be bothered to read through another lost thread today)

[Requiem]

No, 'most people' did not hate last night's episode. I take it that's your way of telling us you did though?

[HankScorpio]

the bottle that Jacob's mother poured from to make Jacob the protector, was that smashed by MiB later (timeline) in an earlier episode? If so, how will they make the final candidate the new protector?

[XL]

I'm not so sure the drink had anythng to do with handing over the reigns, seemed needlessly ceremonial to me. I think you just have to accept the role of your own accord.

[Jon Kano]

Again, I have said this a lot, but this battle, this resolution is 'the end', not just in the sense of the show, but 'It only ends once, anything that happens before that is just progress' - sure its very likely there will be a new Jacob and maybe a new antagonist to that, but ever since he said that on the beach, I dunno it's like this is the deciding battle.

Whatever the smoke is, 'evil', this is the first time the evil has managed to find a loophole and is in a position to leave actually leave. Widmore, Jacob and Hurley have all said that if MIB/smokey/evil leaves the island, then everything is over, everyone is dead, existence ends etc and that is the case. This is the final battle. So even if there is to be a new Jacob out of the candidates, that doesn't mean they will carry on guarding the Island necessarily, it could mean that that chosen one is the only one who in the end can kill/destroy/trap the evil for good.

[Miotch]

No, 'most people' did not hate last night's episode. I take it that's your way of telling us you did though?

I did, but that's not my way of telling you so. The two other forums I post on have the general consensus that last night's episode was trite and awful. It seems out of place in what has been a fantastic run of shows.

[XL]

Anyhow, this'll all be over in a week and a half!!

[Miotch]

Just hope that it's not a disappointing finish.

[Jon Kano]

Amen.

I'll be honest, I'm worried.

[wwe2222]

Rewatched the episode tonight. Better when I didn't have as high expectations.

Something was amiss though with jacob becoming the protector. The mother seemed up to something. I'm not sure she didn't want jacob to throw his brother down that hole.

Also, regarding the outrigger chase and who is on the boat....

If you want to know if or when its going to pop up...



We aren't going to see it----confirmed by carlton and damon

[Loose Cannon]

Why do you assume smokey existed at any point prior to MIB going into the light? there is nothing to support that.

well there's always been good vs evil since the begininning of time. And I think this has to hold true with the island. I could totally be reaching here, but I think Smokey got trapped at somepoint and then was released by MIB again.

I don't really see them going back to the past anymore though, so I dunno

[PapaGeorgio]

Yeah my thoughts were more along Loose Cannons. MIB released him. Hence why MIB physical body is separate from Smokey.

[Hanso Amore]

Im not trying to continue a counter argument deal her

But good vs evil isnt part of the show,

they are really playing up Light vs dark

Same thing....? Sort of, but without the moral ties

So a guy like ben can be light.....but its fucking ben

[Hanso Amore]

and more to the point, good vs evil for all out mankind really doesnt pop up in lost, seems like all humans or "peopl" are evil....

[XL]

Been doing some reading, there is a school of thoughtthat Mother = Monster.

I have to admit, when she first appeared to find Claudia by the stream the scene was all to similar to when the smoke appeared behind Eko as he was drinking from a stream. Then there was the way that she told Claudia that she would find any other people that had arrived at the island. And of course the way that the village was destroyed, people killed and - most oddly - the well filled in.

When she warns Jacob that going into the Glowing Cave of Death (and life, and rebirth) is a fate "worse than death" that she is speaking from experience?

To counterpoint this, we see the light in the cave go out when MiB is sent down there by Jacob, presumably this would have happened if Mother had gone down there. Does the light come back? We've seen it when Locke/Ben turned the Donkey Wheel so perhaps!?

Something was amiss though with jacob becoming the protector. The mother seemed up to something. I'm not sure she didn't want jacob to throw his brother down that hole.

[wwe2222]

I would have to agree with you XL. Im not sure how she managed to drag MiB back up the well, kill everyone, and fill in the well by herself. Especially when she told Jacob she was "tired"

[wwe2222]

couple lost links...

LOST game on Jimmy Kimmel (pretty funny) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_8JBYlNTf-Q


Interview with D+C on Across the Sea (some people may have a problem with what they say)

http://www.hitfix.com/blogs/whats-alan-watching/posts/exclusive-interview-lost-producers-damon-lindelof-and-carlton-cuse-talk-across-the-sea

[Loose Cannon]

Im not trying to continue a counter argument deal her

But good vs evil isnt part of the show,

they are really playing up Light vs dark

Same thing....? Sort of, but without the moral ties

So a guy like ben can be light.....but its fucking ben

good vs evil was a poor choice for words. let's go light vs dark. but my main point is still that light vs dark was probably there since the beg of the island. like I said, I am probably reaching, but I doubt they will ever go way back anyway

[Jon Kano]

I don't think we should focus on the definitions of whether we say good vs evil, dark vs light, there is already too much to figure out.

The fact is, both are supported.

Dark vs Light with the whole backgammon thing from like the first episodes with Locke talking to Walt, when Locke said he saw a bright light when he saw the monster and when Eko said he saw dark. Tons more...

And then with the whole good and evil thing....been said LOADS through the show about people being 'good' and worthy etc....and more recently with Dogen speaking of Locke being evil incarnate and how there is evil parts to the good. Not to mention Jacob referring the Island to being the cork of the wine bottle that keeps evil at bay.

Both choice of words are valid for different reasons, and because of that just makes it all the more complicated which is what its all about really.

[Loose Cannon]

great point on the mother. didn't even think of that. she made Jacob drink that stuff though, so if she was a Monster, you would think that stuff was bad

[Jon Kano]

OMG come on are we really gonna go there? at this point?

[Loose Cannon]

YES LOL

fuck, what if all this time it's actually been Jacob that's really the "bad" guy here and Smokey is the one that's actually good.

[Jon Kano]

Ugh, lol, seriously? you think they would do a 180 like this this far into the game and after everything that have flat out told us, hinted at, alluded to and suggested? at this point?

I hope to god they don't do ANYTHING like that. Come too far, remembered and followed too much and it just wouldn't be a good thing at all.

[Loose Cannon]

ah christ, didn't even realize this theory is being discussed. I can honestly see this happening with this show. dunno wtf this guy is talking about though here with kittens.


http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100224154853AA2roYd

[Jon Kano]

Ugh, I'm staying out of this one. I'll be VERY VERY surprised and disappointed if this whole thing does a 180 like that at the end. Too much has happened in EVERY sense to have such a 'twist' occur and be of a good quality/idea/outcome for the story.

[wwe2222]

The Protector of the Island seems analogous to the person pushing the button. It seems as whenever the "other" people get too close to reaching the powers of the Island, they are wiped out. Much like pressing the button resets the EM in the Hatch.

We know the following people have been wiped out on the Island:
MiB's original people
DHARMA Initiative
People who built the temples/statues

It seems this mass genocide (as explained in the interview I posted above) repeats itself on the Island as these people get closer and, presumably, greedier to find that power.

[Jon Kano]

Swear Faraday said that the detonation of the bomb would render the pocket of energy and all other sources of that energy inert. So unless that one in the cave is something special than the other ones, it's all gone.

[Reavant]

yea but faraday also didnt think that they would go on still living on the island so...

[wwe2222]

Swear Faraday said that the detonation of the bomb would render the pocket of energy and all other sources of that energy inert. So unless that one in the cave is something special than the other ones, it's all gone.

That depends on what the result of the Hydrogen Bomb was. If you think the bomb was always the "Incident" at the Swan Site, then you know Faraday was obviously wrong.

If you think the bomb created the alternate timeline, then he was right.

[wwe2222]

By the way, I know alot of us are unhappy with some of the explanations of these mysteries, however I am still going to miss theorizing about everything with people.

[Jon Kano]

By the looks of things there will be plenty to still talk about, let alone the finale itself :)

[Loose Cannon]

and it's been the Mother and Jacob that wiped out MIB people and DHARMA. dunno about the statue people.

[Jon Kano]

That depends on what the result of the Hydrogen Bomb was. If you think the bomb was always the "Incident" at the Swan Site, then you know Faraday was obviously wrong.

If you think the bomb created the alternate timeline, then he was right.

Yeah see this is another thing I can't figure out. What was is the first time round then?

Because whatever it was, it still enabled the hatch to be built with the computer/button etc,

[Corporate CockSnogger]

One other thing I really wanted answering, was why Jack, Sayid, Kate and Hurley were sent back to 1977 when they returned to the Island, yet Sun, Ben, Frank etc stayed in the present (2007). Really wish they had a reason behind that other than it being conveniant.

[wwe2222]

One other thing I really wanted answering, was why Jack, Sayid, Kate and Hurley were sent back to 1977 when they returned to the Island, yet Sun, Ben, Frank etc stayed in the present (2007). Really wish they had a reason behind that other than it being conveniant.

My theory was that it was Jacob's doing and they were sent there to be protected from MiB, while Sun stayed in 2007 to keep separate. Kind of like how the President and VP dont wouldnt fly on the same plane. Just in case anything happens, someone survives.

After Ben stabs Jacob, Jacob tells MiB "they're coming"

[XL]

I think for us to explain why we're not giving him a name veers too far into the territory of explaining things that we don't feel the need to explain.

I think that sums up the writers take on things pretty well. We won't get his name, we won't get an answer to who was shooting at the outrigger during the time shift, etc.

Reading that interview they seem very resentful of their audience. Especially Damon Lindeloff (sp).

[Jon Kano]

I don't know if I fully like or agree with them on that.

Sure it's great to have some mystery and some unknown element to the whole saga. But sometimes I get the feeling that they did just fuck around as they went on without thinking it through just so at the time they could give us something new and different, and something we will never see again. And at the time, were lead to believe all things that happen, especially the weird and unexplained had/has a purpose. Now it just seems as though it was for nothing. I mean why include things like that and take up valuable story and screen time, when it has no real effect or significance. Shit like that is what you do with written stories and books, not a show that has a limited amount of time to tell a story. I dunno, maybe its just me being bitter about it. But still.

[Jon Kano]

One other thing I really wanted answering, was why Jack, Sayid, Kate and Hurley were sent back to 1977 when they returned to the Island, yet Sun, Ben, Frank etc stayed in the present (2007). Really wish they had a reason behind that other than it being conveniant.

I think it was the island that did this.

It was the MIB's plan and loophole to have Locke leave the island, and come back dead with those who had left. But that outcome was also in part due to the things Jacob did and part of his plan also. So I think the island, as an entity gave them both a kind of advantage and chance for each team (Jacob Vs MIB) to win. Jack and co sent back to drop the bomb and create the alt timeline, and MIB/Ben to kill Jacob and continue with their path.

[Requiem]

Keep in mind that for a while, they didn't know WHEN the show was going to end. Then, when they got word of how many seasons it would have, they 'finished' it, so to speak.

[Impact!]

I get this vague feeling that the final two on the island will be Jack (Jacob) and Claire (MIB)...

[Requiem]

Claire, really?

I guess, she could be driven crazy by not getting Aaron back. But I thought they were really playing up this whole Jack vs. Sawyer thing really well. It has built up nicely to leave Sawyer as new MIB.

[RoXer]

http://cdn.wg.uproxx.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/magnets.jpg

[wwe2222]

Claire, really?

I guess, she could be driven crazy by not getting Aaron back. But I thought they were really playing up this whole Jack vs. Sawyer thing really well. It has built up nicely to leave Sawyer as new MIB.

Agreed. Plus its Claire. If they do indeed end the show with two new replacements, Sawyer will have so much more of an impact than Claire.

[Jon Kano]

Claire, really?

I guess, she could be driven crazy by not getting Aaron back. But I thought they were really playing up this whole Jack vs. Sawyer thing really well. It has built up nicely to leave Sawyer as new MIB.

Yeah but only with his current desire to leave because of Juliet etc.

His character has rough edges in morality sure, but they all do. Overall Sawyer is a good guy and is like the new Jack, he does believe, he just doesn't know it, I don't think he represents the new host for MIB, it would also mean he has to die.

If John Locke is not brought back when the realities merge on Island, and they do end up keeping the Island's function of people coming going, I think it will be Locke/MIB and Jack who serve as the protectors/representatives of light/dark.

[Ogen]

That was fucking shit, that episode should have explained loads of stuff. Garbage.

[Ermaximus]

That was fucking shit, that episode should have explained loads of stuff. Garbage.

I'm sure they had a valid reason for not answering everything, but in a way, yes you're right because now it brings up even more damn questions. Most importatnly, wtf is that "light" and why did Smokey come out of it after the unamed brother of Jacob fell down into the light?

[Jon Kano]

While I don't and won't say I hate is, it was prob the worst LOST episode in my opinion. Even the Nikki and Paulo episode was better.

[Ermaximus]

While I don't and won't say I hate is, it was prob the worst LOST episode in my opinion. Even the Nikki and Paulo episode was better.

:rofl: That's pushing it man. Those 2 were about as useless of characters as Artz and Frogurt.

[Jon Kano]

The characters were terrible.

But the episode was pretty good.

- How they were actually the ones who found the Peal station and didn't tell anyone will be the ultimate reason for them being twats but it was a decent 'shock'.

- Sawyer was funny in the episode.

- Was a good story of how they trusted and loved each other but fucked it up over something like diamonds.

- Getting buried as she opened her eyes was cool.

[Blitz]

People are never ever going to get the answers they want. How far does it have to go to satisfy you? Where did the light come from? What is the exact nature of it? How did Mother make them ageless? Why is the island there in the first place? These are all far too deep questions, in the sense that it takes way too much time to explain them.

I think it was a good episode in terms of better expanding on the characters of Jacob and MIB, and that's the important part. The characters are what make us love the show, not the mysteries, because if we don't care about the characters, why would we engage with them trying to solve the mysteries?

With all the hype surrounding this ep, you had to know it was gonna disappoint. People spend so much time theorizing over the show that they get hurt when it turns out none of their theories are true, or that the reality is much simpler. Fuck just enjoy the ride, don't get your panties in a knot because the end of the show isn't living up to the exact idea of what you thought it'd be.

[Corporate CockSnogger]

Whatever man, I'll be sticking to my theory that the whole show revolves around Vincent til the final second!

[Jon Kano]

Yeah people care a about the characters, of course. But we have ALL their stories pretty much answered, it's done.

The Island is a character, that was the main selling point that got the show made, and with that, a large portion of the interest and popularity of the show. They go hand in hand. The characters are interesting because of who they are, but they are also special and on a special place that has its own history. Jacob chose those people because they are special and were meant to be part of the Island.

If the answers to what the island is is answered, then I believe the others answers to other hard questions will be answered, and even if they are not, they will at least make sense and still leave a cool bit of mystery with regard to the context of the show.

We have been promised answer since the show started, and yeah, we have been given some, but not of massive importance.

I still have faith in the writers and the show, and I understand what you are saying. But you have to understand its not that the ending isn't living up to what we expect, its just that its not giving anything to satisfy the interest and mystery towards ANY answer, at all, which is the main problem.

[Ermaximus]

People are never ever going to get the answers they want. How far does it have to go to satisfy you? Where did the light come from? What is the exact nature of it? How did Mother make them ageless? Why is the island there in the first place? These are all far too deep questions, in the sense that it takes way too much time to explain them.

I think it was a good episode in terms of better expanding on the characters of Jacob and MIB, and that's the important part. The characters are what make us love the show, not the mysteries, because if we don't care about the characters, why would we engage with them trying to solve the mysteries?

With all the hype surrounding this ep, you had to know it was gonna disappoint. People spend so much time theorizing over the show that they get hurt when it turns out none of their theories are true, or that the reality is much simpler. Fuck just enjoy the ride, don't get your panties in a knot because the end of the show isn't living up to the exact idea of what you thought it'd be.

I'm actually with you Blitz, I quite liked the episode as it was something different than the norm and showed us the MIB was once good, but he more or less lost his innocence and merely just wanted what all normal men want. Answers! I don't see how that made him evil. If anything Jacob could be considered just as evil for having killed his brother.

What got me was how only Jacob's brother could see the dead, but nobody else can. Sound familiar?

I'm sure there is more to it, and we won't find out everything there is to find out before it's all said and done. I'm excited that we get 3 1/2 hours of Lost next week tbh.

[Jon Kano]

I'm actually with you Blitz, I quite liked the episode as it was something different than the norm and showed us the MIB was once good, but he more or less lost his innocence and merely just wanted what all normal men want. Answers! I don't see how that made him evil. If anything Jacob could be considered just as evil for having killed his brother.

What got me was how only Jacob's brother could see the dead, but nobody else can. Sound familiar?

I'm sure there is more to it, and we won't find out everything there is to find out before it's all said and done. I'm excited that we get 3 1/2 hours of Lost next week tbh.

That is all correct but all of that raises more questions and contradictions about stuff we have been shown and found out since the start.

Jacob is a murderer, and therefore 'tainted'.

MIB could see dead people, but we still dont know if its certain people who are 'blessed' or the will of The Island who allows certain people to be subjected to the dead.

[Requiem]

Just kinda thought of something..

What if their fake mother had to make there really be a reason to defend the island.. like maybe she wasn't sure she'd sold Jacob on it, but she was running out of time, so she had to give him a purpose.. so she knew MIB would kill her, and she knew what Jacob would do to him. Kinda twisted in a manipulative sense, you could say. She is obviously not really 'good', what with killing their mother.

Of course, over time, maybe Jacob really came around to it and understood that there was something more to the island. But maybe that first bit is just what it took?

[Jon Kano]

Thing is, Jacob didn't kill his brother thinking about it, didn't she say she made it to be that way.

He looked like he died from that blow to the head, but having him go into the cave as soon after, he might not of actually been dead. Either way, him going into the cave was something she did say Jacob had to not let happen, he was meant to protect it and not go in there.

[Reavant]

Now that is has been said, I think its going to be Jack and claire left on the island and sawyer leads everyone else off.

We all think Jack is going to be the new jacob, but who else wants off the island more than claire? It makes sense that she will be the new mib trying to escape while jack keeps here there.

[Jon Kano]

Why do people think Claire is going to be the new MIB? and how?

[Reavant]

im thinking it will mirror the original jacob/mib in the end. Jack-wanting to stay becaus he needs to protect the island, claire being "infected" and wanting desperately wanting to get off the island to see aaron

[Jon Kano]

But we don't know protecting the Island is what Jack is supposed to do. He is there to do something important yes, but it could be anything.

The realities are going to merge, or the alt reality is going to affect the Island reality in some way or vice versa. Even if Claire is made the new MIB and the rest get off - where does that leave the alt reality? I think either it's there to bring someone back to the Island, or its there to take them off and back to the lives they were supposed to of had. If its the latter case, Claire will be and have Aarron anyway.

I still can't shake the feeling that this is 'the end', as in whatever happens, I don't think the Island will need protecting anymore or even have a conflict of dark vs light. It only ends once, and the time for that is the finale.

[Ermaximus]

I wouldn't be 1 bit suprised at this point if the remaining survivors were all somehow related to Jacob/MIB in some freaky fucked up kind of sense. MiB can see the dead, Hurley can see the dead. Jacob was picked to protect the island, Jack will most likely be chosen to protect the island. MiB lost his innocence as a child, Sawyer lost his innocence as a child. It's fucking crazy when you stop to think about it.

Shit, I just realized that they are the only 3 candidates left. FFS.

[Corporate CockSnogger]

Gonna agree with Kano on this one in that the whole "it only ends once" thing makes it seem as though this will be the end of all the island protection stuff.

I can see something happening where after it's all over Jack still wants to stay and protect the island or whatever, but then Kate convinces him to just come back home to the real world because the island doesn't need protecting anymore or something like that.

[Ermaximus]

Gonna agree with Kano on this one in that the whole "it only ends once" thing makes it seem as though this will be the end of all the island protection stuff.

I can see something happening where after it's all over Jack still wants to stay and protect the island or whatever, but then Kate convinces him to just come back home to the real world because the island doesn't need protecting anymore or something like that.

Maybe the island will just vanish for good after the end? Maybe they'll find the light somehow and get smokey back into the light causing the balance to off set or something and it's all said and done so they all leave on Locke's back and the island vanishes?

[Jon Kano]

I wouldn't be 1 bit suprised at this point if the remaining survivors were all somehow related to Jacob/MIB in some freaky fucked up kind of sense. MiB can see the dead, Hurley can see the dead. Jacob was picked to protect the island, Jack will most likely be chosen to protect the island. MiB lost his innocence as a child, Sawyer lost his innocence as a child. It's fucking crazy when you stop to think about it.

Shit, I just realized that they are the only 3 candidates left. FFS.

yep, down to 3, unless Desmond is a secret back up plan :D

How can anyone be related to Jacob or MIB when they never left the Island? Well Jacob did, but as far as we know, didn't fuck anyone lol

I don't think it will happen too much now, but I remember I once though Jack eventually would leave with his father alive. Cus back then I thought since his body wasn't found he was alive (resurrected by Jacob) and Jack said he was going to Sydney to bring back his father.

[Jon Kano]

Maybe the island will just vanish for good after the end? Maybe they'll find the light somehow and get smokey back into the light causing the balance to off set or something and it's all said and done so they all leave on Locke's back and the island vanishes?

Yeah that is a good probability.

Whatever the Island is, its not actually an Island, like it is, but it's physical and actual representation is obviously the 'front', the first layer or whatever it is, and wherever it really came from, I assume it has the ability to still travel through space and time. God knows where is has been, or where it could go. We could see it move again to somewhere crazy like space or another dimension to that of Earth.

[Ermaximus]

For a while there I thought maybe the light and what have you was supposed to be the garden of Eden, but I don't think Lost would go that route tbh. I could be wrong though.

[Jon Kano]

Yeah as we all discussed previously on LOST, the show has, will and does allude to various religious, mythological etc believes and stuff, but will prob not ever directly say it is definitely this or that. It did look garden of Edenish to be fair.

[Requiem]

Yeah, the whole theme was very Edenish. Light could essentially be the tree of life, saying it was the 'source' and what not. It represented temptation, pretty much.

[Jon Kano]

Probably just a really big flood light though. Or whatever was in the briefcase Jules was carrying around in Pulp Fiction.

[Hanso Amore]

Not agreeing it will be Jack and Claire...


But they are siblings like the current regime.

[Reavant]

I wouldn't be 1 bit suprised at this point if the remaining survivors were all somehow related to Jacob/MIB in some freaky fucked up kind of sense. MiB can see the dead, Hurley can see the dead. Jacob was picked to protect the island, Jack will most likely be chosen to protect the island. MiB lost his innocence as a child, Sawyer lost his innocence as a child. It's fucking crazy when you stop to think about it.

Shit, I just realized that they are the only 3 candidates left. FFS.

kate killed her mom right?

[Ermaximus]

kate killed her mom right?

I don't think so. I think she killed her step-dad and then killed her friend/potential lover on accident?

[Buzzkill]

Na man, not got it wrong...

Them on the beach (The Incident, season 5) was def before when they sat on the log with the bottle of wine (Ab Aeterno, season 6).

It was NOT the french people. They came after.

http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100327152205/lostpedia/images/d/da/Normal_theincident012.jpg

But yeah, I consider the whole dark and stormy vs daylight and calm thing a big fuck up. I think they decided as they got to that point that they would change it and have the ship destroy the statue - I mean everyone was saying it was 'days away from the Island still' - fuck off it's as clear as daylight how close it is, a mile or two at the most. And a wooden ship up against dense stone statue, and the statue falls? come on!
Pretty sure it was the 1,000,000 tons of water that destroyed the statue, not the wooden ship.

And as we've seen in the Lost universe, the weather can change very, very, very quickly

[Jon Kano]

Pretty sure it was the 1,000,000 tons of water that destroyed the statue, not the wooden ship.

And as we've seen in the Lost universe, the weather can change very, very, very quickly

They still made the point that the ship hit it and it was destroyed, and even so...the force and power of 1,000,000 tons of water pushing a wooden ship into thick stone...the ship ending up about as wrecked as it would've been if it was just in the ocean?... would be like throwing a beer bottle at a wall. But still I guess I'm nip picking, yet it is one of the answers I wasn't so impressed with.

[wwe2222]

I don't think so. I think she killed her step-dad and then killed her friend/potential lover on accident?

correct... Her friend got shot by the police when Kate was trying to escape the hospital and he was in the car with her.

[Jon Kano]

Its a sneak peak from next weeks......


<object width="640" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/zBsygvaz1MI&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/zBsygvaz1MI&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385"></embed></object>


HA HA maybe Desmond is indeed a candidate!!!

Also, I got a new sneaky suspicion that we may have a 3 way split in the finale - What's going on on the Island, the alt reality and the more flashes back to when MIB turned into smokey to when the black rock arrived when they were on the beach.

[Lock Jaw]

http://topcultured.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/anti-locke-brakes.jpg

[Loose Cannon]

HAHAHA

[Loose Cannon]

Its a sneak peak from next weeks......


<object width="640" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/zBsygvaz1MI&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/zBsygvaz1MI&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385"></embed></object>


HA HA maybe Desmond is indeed a candidate!!!

Also, I got a new sneaky suspicion that we may have a 3 way split in the finale - What's going on on the Island, the alt reality and the more flashes back to when MIB turned into smokey to when the black rock arrived when they were on the beach.


Jacob is acting rather heelish there. :shifty:

[Jon Kano]

Jacob is acting rather heelish there. :shifty:

Shit you just made me realise I posted the wrong sneak peak.

Jack makes a reference in the following other sneak peak about it could be 'one of his rules' as to why MIB didn't execute Desmond himself...

<object width="640" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/2nw7CvdfqtA&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/2nw7CvdfqtA&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385"></embed></object>

Could it be perhaps that Desmond is a candidate after-all?


Ugh, and with the other clip, young Jacob and Hurely - I don't think I can even fathom how to theorise that. Jacob is dead, he has already been seen on Island, by Hurley and now we see him as a youngster, why? and why did MIB see Jacob as a youngster with blood on his arms? it just doesn't make sense. Why is Hurley seeing him as a youngster now? - Unless its MIB and he has a new plan? OR its The Island?

I assume the ash can be used to maybe bring him back to life, or trap MIB in some form or fashion at some pivitol point maybe.

[Loose Cannon]

I can't make out what Sawyer and Jack both say to each other in thier last lines in that clip.

[Loose Cannon]

oh nevermind, I got it now. Sawyer says "I killed them, didn't I. had to listen to it like 6 times

[Jon Kano]

'I killed them didn't I?'

'No. He did'

[PapaGeorgio]

Hope we get more crappy CGI underwater island to be honest. Also it's not gonna be like Jack and Sawyer are new Jacob/MIB or any combo of that really. You know why? Cause that's too fucking obvious. As lame as lost has been lately, and as much as I hate it right now. They will definitely do something different than what you expect. Unless of course "you" are that asshole know it all nerd elitist friend who will obviously get like 10% of the finale correct and therefore have gotten 100% correct, cause 10% is close enough. Still waiting for my Vincent flashback episode.

[XL]

Why does someone need to replace MiB/Smocke?

The way I see it, MiB/Smocke is ended/killed/trapped by whatever means which means we don't need a replacement Jacob or Mib/Smocke isn't ended/killed/trapped and we only need a replacement Jacob - not a replacement MiB.

In that scenario it'd come down to Jack and "Locke" - the 2 men that have had oppsosite ideologies throughout the show.

[wwe2222]

Jack and Sawyer are looking old.

[Jon Kano]

lol smocke

[wwe2222]

Carlton Cuse is on the Bill Simmons report on espn.com if anyone cares

[Jeritron]

Why does someone need to replace MiB/Smocke?

The way I see it, MiB/Smocke is ended/killed/trapped by whatever means which means we don't need a replacement Jacob or Mib/Smocke isn't ended/killed/trapped and we only need a replacement Jacob - not a replacement MiB.

In that scenario it'd come down to Jack and "Locke" - the 2 men that have had oppsosite ideologies throughout the show.

Yea I thought the last episode pretty much hammered home the fact that the smoke monster was a unique occurence, and not a role to be filled like Jacob.
He's apparently the result of touching the forbidden fruit. A cursed figure. I don't think he was filling a role, or has intentions of having his role filled.

Jacob seems to be next in a line of guardians, preceded by mother and possibly relieved by one of the characters.
I have come to terms with the fact that explaining where his powers, or mother's powers come from, just serves to raise more questions. That's the mythology of it. Allow it. How is God "God"? What's the point in trying to explain that in detail?
I will admit I am curious about what the exact specifications of their powers are, or what happens at every unaddressed point in time, but that's natural.
I sort of expected to see Jacob react to Smokey's birth, and touch on that a bit. But that is just something that occurs offscreen. The metaphsyical aspect of the show is perfectly okay with me. There is no way of logically explaining the smoke monster, or Jacob's godly powers, and any of the islands properities without writing a fictional science book. They just have to say "this is that." I'm happy with that. We saw where The Smoke Monster came from, and understand his motives.
All that matters is that those characters have been given their backstory. We know how MIB became The Smoke Monster, and how Jacob became the Guardian. We have a loose understanding of the island that will likely get some more "light" shed on it.

Remember when George Lucas gave us a biological explanation of how the force works? Everyone hated it. A little mystery and fictional faith is good.

Also, I love the fact that they haven't given the MIB/Smoke Monster a name.

[Jeritron]

could care less about the outrigger chase. What's the big deal with that? It's just a cool overlap in the time loop. It'll be fun to speculate on who was involved, but if it didn't effect what is occuring in the timeline now, it obviously didn't have major consequences.

[Jeritron]

I was loving last weeks episode, and then the Smoke Monster transformation seemed abrupt and underscored. I thought about it for a while, and realized it was right the way it was. That's how it should be, really. What would a 10 minute powerpoint by Jacob explaining his powers do? The problem with things that get as big and involving as Lost, is that everyone's got their visions and opinions of how things should be. Expectations become mythical in status.

[Jeritron]

I want to go back and watch the episode again this weekend too. I need to re-listen to the stuff Mother says about the cave of light, and how that relates to Jacob's explanation of the island as a cork in a bottle.

[wwe2222]

Not to raise expectations, but this week's episode is supposed to be pretty awesome according to early reviews from people who went to whatever event they had last week with the composer for Lost.

[wwe2222]

I was loving last weeks episode, and then the Smoke Monster transformation seemed abrupt and underscored. I thought about it for a while, and realized it was right the way it was. That's how it should be, really. What would a 10 minute powerpoint by Jacob explaining his powers do? The problem with things that get as big and involving as Lost, is that everyone's got their visions and opinions of how things should be. Expectations become mythical in status.

You cant explain powers like that. I dont know how one could even do it. There always has to be some mystery to the supernatural or else it just devalues it.

[Jeritron]

I'm in a good position though, because all along I've sort of purged myself of questions. I watch avidly to find out what's going to happen, but early on I taught myself that I was in it for the ride, and the characters/mythology, not the prize.
I probably got to be that way in the second or third season really. I really haven't been anything but pleased with what they deliver.
I'm glad I'm not as concerned with theories and everything fitting. I feel as though at this point, I've gotten what I wanted from that. I never had a real opinion on what I wanted everything to be anyways, I just wanted more Lost.

I've learned to expect quality, and not much more than that. I have things I'd like to see happen, and wouldn't like to see happen naturally, but as long as the story is given justice and they do good by what they have done for the past 6 years, that's fine with me.

I'm glad to hear that they've made a conscious effort to put the mythology stuff to rest at this stage, and focus in on the characters and current plot for the finale.
The mythology and mystery has been given plenty of answers, I feel. I am good with most of it. I like that some of it can be talked about for ages. That's what makes mystery and mythology compelling.
It's the characters and story that needs resolution, not the exposition.

[Jeritron]

One thing I can't help but "expect" is more resolution for the real Locke. I don't want to go in focusing on that happening, because it may not. And maybe it shouldn't. I will have to see how the story unfolds, and how it all fits in the end before I can judge that. I just can't help but have the desire and suspicion that he's coming back. I don't want to hinge my enjoyment of anything on that though, since it very well could fit into a plan we haven't seen unfold yet.
We shall see.

[wwe2222]

I'm in a good position though, because all along I've sort of purged myself of questions. I watch avidly to find out what's going to happen, but early on I taught myself that I was in it for the ride, and the characters/mythology, not the prize.
I probably got to be that way in the second or third season really. I really haven't been anything but pleased with what they deliver.
I'm glad I'm not as concerned with theories and everything fitting. I feel as though at this point, I've gotten what I wanted from that. I never had a real opinion on what I wanted everything to be anyways, I just wanted more Lost.

I've learned to expect quality, and not much more than that. I have things I'd like to see happen, and wouldn't like to see happen naturally, but as long as the story is given justice and they do good by what they have done for the past 6 years, that's fine with me.

I'm glad to hear that they've made a conscious effort to put the mythology stuff to rest at this stage, and focus in on the characters and current plot for the finale.
The mythology and mystery has been given plenty of answers, I feel. I am good with most of it. I like that some of it can be talked about for ages. That's what makes mystery and mythology compelling.
It's the characters and story that needs resolution, not the exposition.

:y: well said The mythology means nothing if I didnt care for the characters so much

[Jeritron]

I've thought it's been awesome how they've managed to continually attach more and more meaning to "the numbers" without giving a flat out explanation or reason for them. They're just a meaningful pattern of numbers that arise in key situations of the show, and it's meaning is open to coincidence vs fate.
I thought having it ultimately culminate as the candidates was a huge payoff.

[wwe2222]

Agreed, especially that I thought we were done with the numbers headed into the season.

It also ties in really well with the Valenzetti Equation about saving the world, which is what we were told they originally were (through the Lost Experience)

[Lock Jaw]

Screw this "Lost Experience". If it isn't in the show then it is irrelevant to me.

[wwe2222]

Screw this "Lost Experience". If it isn't in the show then it is irrelevant to me.

Ok

[Lock Jaw]

You're supposed to say "Thanks for your take".

[wwe2222]

You're supposed to say "Thanks for your take".

Thanks for your take

[Jeritron]

I hope we hear Hollywood and Vines in the finale

[Jon Kano]

Na Dharmacide, Locke of the Island or Desperate Desmond.

[Loose Cannon]

pregaming

[Jon Kano]

VERY EXCITED for tonight's ep.

Desmond is one of my top 3 characters and I cannot wait until him and Jack have a lil catch up. Not that I fully expect this to happen.

[Loose Cannon]

Jacob's a fucking heel. I know it.

[Jon Kano]

I don't want to see such a twist tbh.

[Loose Cannon]

nah, I think we're safe as this episode progresses.

[Loose Cannon]

Jack Shepard

"I'll Do It" :love:

[Jeritron]

Awesome awesome episode.

Question- MIB's main goal is to get off the island, but now Jacob is saying that they must protect The Light from him.
I know he looked for the light for years, but why would he be trying to find it? Doesn't he just want to leave?

[Hanso Amore]

Maybe he needs to go back into the tunnel to leave?

Or at least into the light the same way?

I am pissed with the way characters are just going out without fully learning about them. grrrrr.

[Jeritron]

I thought he just wanted to flat out leave the Island, but maybe that was his way of trying to kill the candidates?
Like I said, I'm a bit unclear right now as to whether he wants to leave the island or steal the light. It seems as though those are two different things, and it's really a matter of what's at stake

Maybe Jacob just meant they need to protect the light from him in case he wants to use it?

[Hanso Amore]

Well after last week I truly feel he thinks of the light as his way off the island, expecially after going into it. He has to Kill Jacob and stop the candidates so that no one is protecting the light.

The Plane/Sub was just a way to get everyone together to be killed.

IMHO

[Jeritron]

but he also wants to destroy the Island now? Although that sounds like more of a reaction to what Whidmore told him.

[Jeritron]

Also, MIB recruited Ben by promising him he could have the Island once he was gone. Then he tells Ben flat out that he wants to destroy the island now.
Sweet deal...

I need to rewatch the episode, because I'm pretty confused on what the fuck MIB's motive is right now. The antagonists overall motive is a pretty important thing

[Reavant]

I think the game changed when widmore said something to smock

[Loose Cannon]

well tonight's episode confirmed that MIB going into the tunnel is where the smoke monster originated. so that answers that.

Jeri, like Hanso was kind of saiyng, I think maybe MIB/Smoke/Locke has to go back into the tunnel to get his release if you want to call it that. But now he wants to destroy everything anyway.

So now my question is what or who was the mother protecting the light from in the first place because there was no Smoke Monster. Was thier some other "evil?" ugh


Can't wait for Desmond's plan to come to fruition

[Lock Jaw]

The other evil is Vincent.

[MoFo]

When is it shown for you fuckers in U.S?

What episode are you on over there?

[Loose Cannon]

the final episode is Sunday

[MoFo]

So we are like 2 weeks behind in the U.K?

Fuck, I need torrents.

[Jeritron]

So now my question is what or who was the mother protecting the light from in the first place because there was no Smoke Monster. Was thier some other "evil?" ugh




I think it was just protecting it from anyone. That includes the ancients, Dharma, and of course the MIB.
MIB became the monster, but he wasn't really a threat until he killed Jacob. He couldn't hurt Jacob and Jacob was there to protect against him.

[RoXer]

What a horrible ending for Richard

[Corporate CockSnogger]

Amazing episode. Loved Ben and Desmond throughout.

So like, did Richard die or what?

[Lock Jaw]

I don't think Richard is dead. Jack will probably release him from his "life forever" thing in the finale.

What I want to know is where Miles got off to. Thought he went into the closet with Widmore.

[Corporate CockSnogger]

Miles "took his chances running through the jungle". I wonder what part he's going to play in the finale, seems kind of like the odd one out in all of this.

Ben shooting Widmore gave me a throbbing erection

[loopydate]

"He doesn't get to save his daughter."

[wwe2222]

"He doesn't get to save his daughter."

Im glad they wrapped up the Ben-Widmore storyline like they did. Ben absolutely took advantage of the situation in (Michael Cole alert) VINTAGE Ben fashion.

[XL]

So we are like 2 weeks behind in the U.K?

Fuck, I need torrents.
You might be, but we're not.

The ep shown in the US on a Tuesday night is shown a Friday, so last's night episode will be on this coming Friday. The finale is on Sunday in the US and will be shown on the usual Friday slot over here.

All in all, the UK has been 3 days behind the entire series.