NFL 2007 Offseason Thread

[King Steve]

Who is Sammy Morris and what positions?
Running back. Meh, he won't be splitting yards like Dillon. I see him more as a backup.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Nice Patriots got Adalius Thomas soliddddd

Picking up Brady and Morris alright moves too, looks like they will going wideout and MLB or CB with their first two round picks

Unless they end up signing a veteran wideout, then they'll probably go defense with both first round picks

[MTH15]

The Patriots are doing good now, as well as the Broncos. Meanwhile then Falcons signed 1 person and Joey Porter and Joe Horn are on the market. They need help at both postions. I'm still waiting for them to make a big move by trading Schaub or signing a big name person.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

I could definitely see Wes Welker becoming a star if he goes to the Patriots. He seems like a perfect fit in that no-name receiving corp and he's a pretty talented pro for a 5'9 white kid.

[MTH15]

How long does this FA stuff go on?

[ClockShot]

It's official. Jake Plummer has retired.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=plummerretirement&prov=st&type=lgns

[OssMan]

JAKE "THE SNAKE" PLUMMER

[MTH15]

Damn Jake. Well he had a very good career. I think he had at least a couple of good years left on him.

[weather vane]

he'll be back

[MTH15]

He might pull a Micheal Jordan. I dont see that in football a lot though. And while I was in the kitchen I head the ESPN News team say something about Joey Porter Cincinatti and Miami.

[Gonzo]

Damn Jake. Well he had a very good career. I think he had at least a couple of good years left on him.

He was quite average to be honest.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Randy Moss to the Patriots?

Not a fan of the deal unless he changes his ways of being a shithead

Doubt it'll happen anyway

[SammyG]

Moss is most likely to go to Green Bay.

[Crimson]

Thomas Jones to the Jets...good move there. I liek the BradJohnson and Leonard Davis signings to Dallas, hopefully Davis doesn't continute being a bust. Now we can concentrate on db's in the draft.

[SammyG]

Ugh, Rams sign B.J Sander as a punter. WTF, is Turk not coming back? God damnit, Sander sucks. Last season he played he averaged like 39 yards a punt.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Wow Thomas Jones to the Jets is a real nice move for NY, only losing a second round pick for him.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Lance Briggs wants out of Chicago now too

[Nervous Ferret]

Thomas Jones sickkkkkkkkkkkk. I thought for sure Chicago wouldn't trade him after Benson got hurt in the SuperBowl.

Still got a pick in the 2nd round cause it was Jets 37th overall for Jones and the 63rd pick.

[weather vane]

k why did miami trade welker? why did we cut mcmichael?

tell me now

[VonErichLives]

k why did miami trade welker? why did we cut mcmichael?

tell me now

They had no choice in Welker, he was going to sign a "poisin pill" contract with the Patriots, with a clause like seattle "Contract becomes gauranteed if he plays more then 5 games in the state of Florida" and the Pats rather then doing that and waiting a week (incase Miami did it and worked out a trade for him) gave the 2nd round pick they'd lose anyway and threw in a 7th.

As for McMichael, I assume to get the money to sign Joey Porter.

There's talk the Pats are talking to Stalworth, there is also the talk that Stima mentioned that Belicheck really liked Moss and thinks like Dillon if he comes here he'd be fine with Brady and crew around him and being on a winner (when the Vikes were good he was fine). That being said, the Raiders want a 1st round pick and they wont get that from NE.

Kevin Curtis fired his agent, who the pats don't like dealing with, I'd like the see Curtis here, was hoping all along to see that.

[Loose Cannon]

T Jones baby. I love that guy. Awesome.

[RP]

Isnt Cedric Benson still in the hospital from when Bob Sanders knocked him the fuck out in the Superbowl?

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Porter to the Dolphins is pretty big

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

I don't understand guys like McGahee or Thomas Jones only being worth a 2nd or 3rd round pick

[Nervous Ferret]

.

[RP]

McGahee is worthless. Thomas Jones is in the Warrick Dunn, Tiki Barber class. Underappreciated.

[SammyG]

Is it football season yet? :(

[VonErichLives]

McGahee is worthless. Thomas Jones is in the Warrick Dunn, Tiki Barber class. Underappreciated.

I'd put TJ with Dunn, but I'd put Barber over them.

I think a main reason players are getting less are picks are considered more valuable these days. The day of a seasoned Vet being worth a 1st round pick are over, every 1st round pick is considered to be an nfl player with the upside of being "the best".

for TJ, he's been in the league 8yrs, altough he split carries in 4 of the first 8 seasons and was injured in one of them, so he's a young 8yr guy, only had full-time duty for 3yrs.

as for McGahee, he's put up decent stats in Buffallo, only 3yrs of playing I wouldn't write him off yet. The issue with him is he's a young player making demands (aren't they shopping him at his request?) Also, most teams haven't forgotten that his agent tricked a bunch of teams on draft day (He pretended he was healthy and claimed Belicheck was scouting him, when Belicheck was really there to see someone else).

Also, with top RB's putting up 1,500-2000yds these days, 1,000-1,200 isn't what it used to be value wise.

[Nervous Ferret]

Jets signed Kenyon Coleman DE from Dallas. Don't really know anything about him other than Mangini liked him. :$

[Gonzo]

McGahee is worthless. Thomas Jones is in the Warrick Dunn, Tiki Barber class. Underappreciated.

Tikibear :'(

[OssMan]

lol pretty sure if tiki played 2 more years hed be top 5 all time. frick

[RP]

UNDERAPPRECIATED

DO YOU KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS?

[VonErichLives]

UNDERAPPRECIATED

DO YOU KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS?

no quote, so who are you asking?

[ClockShot]

A few big names made some moves today.

RB Jamal Lewis and the Browns agree to terms.

WR Joe Horn and the Falcons agree to terms.

QB Patrick Ramsey and the Broncos agree to a 2 year deal.

From yesterday:

Besides the big Thomas Jones trade, QB Joey Harrington and TE Randy McMichael are out at Miami.

Bye Bye Reuben Droughns, second spot for you.

Looks like Vick will have that Wideout he finally needs. Horn and Lelie should work out well.

Not feeling too good about my broncos right now. I was hoping we make a move for Brad Johnson, but Dallas got to him first.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

No love for the Daniel Graham signing? He is a real good TE, tough to see him leave the Patriots but I saw it coming.

[el fregadero]

Still got Benjamin Watson though.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

And David Thomas...I think he is gonna break out and be pretty good.

Patriots signed Kyle Brady too, dunno just gonna be the 3rd tight end. They got some dude they drafted last year who is suppose to be like a tight end/h-back type but he was never even dressed for one game last year so I have no idea.

[el fregadero]

Brady is pretty much an O-lineman as well.

[weather vane]

Miami signing Joey Porter is so unreal! I wish we would trade for an o lineman or a decent backfielder.

[Mr. Monday Morning]

Looks like Vick will have that Wideout he finally needs. Horn and Lelie should work out well.

Lelie's a free agent, he won't be sticking around.

No love for the Daniel Graham signing? He is a real good TE, tough to see him leave the Patriots but I saw it coming.

Dunno, it seemed like Scheffler was coming on really well towards the end of last year. Unless they're going to a 2 TE set?

[weather vane]

Lelie signed with San Fran.

[Mr. Monday Morning]

See, told you so :shifty:

[CNM]

Dunno, it seemed like Scheffler was coming on really well towards the end of last year. Unless they're going to a 2 TE set?

They use a bunch of 2 TE sets, especially against the 3-4. Graham's blocking will be huge for our running game. In short yardage situations last year it sucked.

[Mr. Monday Morning]

True but would they run it like the majority of the time? It kinda makes sense I guess, gives Cutler more protection and with the zone blocking they don't really need a fullback most times anyway.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Graham is one of the best blocking tight ends in the NFL, so he is perfect fit if they have another recieving TE coming along. He can catch the ball too though, his numbers just declined due to the emergance of Ben Watson in New England.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Kyle Brady is a virgin.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Oh yeah and Willis McGahee is a Raven.

[OssMan]

hey the ravens might have a running back finally.

[SammyG]

Rams sign Minor.. that ex-Dolphin Running back. Meh.

[Mr. Monday Morning]

They're also signing McMichael

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

lol Bills draft Willis McGahee, thus pissing off Travis Henry and bolts outta Buffalo...then they wait a year til McGahee gets healthy only to trade him in his prime for two 3rd round picks and a 7th rounder.

On top of that they lose Nate Clemens and London Fletcher off their defense...about the only thing they had going for them last year.

Pretty bad when the best thing you have to fall back on is the fact that your QB didnt play totally out of control last season.

[Crimson]

Yea, Bills suck

[SammyG]

Wooo, I like the McMichael signing. He should be awesome for us! We signed some safety from the Bears named Johnson too. Is he any good?

[SammyG]

We need to improve our defense though... :( our offense is just fine.

[Nervous Ferret]

Jets sign Darian Barnes, he went to my high school

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Fuck you Jerry Reese. Seriously, fuck you.

You've seemingly been asleep at the desk as all the good FAs are getting snatched up. Need I remind you that we still have a massive void at left tackle, our defense is still broken down, and we currently have DERRICK WARD as our backup RB.

If you don't sign Rhodes, then you are basically saying fuck you to the fact that we still have a ton of talent yet you basically want 2007 to be a rebuilding year.</font>

[Jerichoholic]

Jets signed Kenyon Coleman DE from Dallas. Don't really know anything about him other than Mangini liked him. :$

He was kind of a Parcells pet project that never really busted out, but he adds really good depth, GOOD PICK UP.

[DrA]

You know what, about 65% of these free agents are going to end up either on injured reserve, on the bench, or playing like a statue of a piece of shit.

Free agency prepares a team for week one of the season and week one only. After that, injuries kick in and teams realize that they are just as awful as they always are.

If it was up to me, there wouldn't even be a free agency. All of this flip flopping around that players and teams do gets annoying real quickly. If anything else, the teams that keep most of their players and are not so aggressive during free agency are the ones that do better during the regular season.

[RP]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2792972


crap

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

The Raiders??

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

You know what, about 65% of these free agents are going to end up either on injured reserve, on the bench, or playing like a statue of a piece of shit.

Free agency prepares a team for week one of the season and week one only. After that, injuries kick in and teams realize that they are just as awful as they always are.

If it was up to me, there wouldn't even be a free agency. All of this flip flopping around that players and teams do gets annoying real quickly. If anything else, the teams that keep most of their players and are not so aggressive during free agency are the ones that do better during the regular season.
Do you even like the NFL? All you do is complain about shit

[SammyG]

Rhodes to the Raiders. wow.

[OssMan]

haha let Rhodes go to the raiders. if he wants money fine, he's never winning a superbowl again in that shit hole though

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Giants acquire Reuben Droughns in exchange for Tim Carter

Eh. Droughns kinda sucks but in a reduced role he should be better off. Plus it gets rid of Tim Carter. Happy days</font>

[VonErichLives]

You know what, about 65% of these free agents are going to end up either on injured reserve, on the bench, or playing like a statue of a piece of shit.

Free agency prepares a team for week one of the season and week one only. After that, injuries kick in and teams realize that they are just as awful as they always are.


Using that argument then they should get rid of the Draft and Trades...

Injuries is a risk every team and every player has and the teams that happen to stay healthy tend to do better.

If Manning tears his ACL week #1, does Sorgi lead the Colts to the Super Bowl?

On the Flip side, in 2001, if Bledsoe doesn't get injured, Brady doesn't start (yet) do the Patriots win the super bowl with Bledsoe?

Who knows!?!

That being said, NFL free agency is the best due to the salary cap and general team revenues that keeps all teams competitve, it's the main reason it's typically and even playing field and it's not uncommon to see a team miss the playoffs one year and go deep in the playoffs the next.

[RP]

If Manning tears his ACL week #1, does Sorgi lead the Colts to the Super Bowl?



Depends on what quarter the ACL tear happens. If it happens in the first half of the first game, we may go undefeated and winning the Superbowl.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Is Sorgi the guy who got choked out by a Ohio State linebacker and he couldnt call the plays for the rest of the game? I think it was him, it was definetly a Wisconsin QB but it might have been a different one.

[RP]

That was a big nigger choking him though.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

It was actually a white dude...

Really cheap shot though

[RP]

No i think he was black. I posted a picture of it once.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Nah definetly white, I remember his name and number for some reason lol..Ryan Reynolds #44

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Actaully Robert Reynolds my B

[RP]

http://images.ibsys.com/2003/1013/2549328_200X150.jpg

Yah thats possibly white skin.

I dunno. Poor Jim.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

http://media.scout.com/Media/Image/8/80808m.JPG
There's Sorgi's boy!!

[RP]

Yah that guy is probably packing Zesty Chicken Bowls at Taco Bell while Sorgi is getting a Superbowl ring for warming the bench for the Superbowl Champs.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

He is probably beating his kids or something

[Hanso Amore]

How can you say the Bills suck for losing Clements, Fletcher and McGahee. I am a Bills fan, and I don't go by the ratings on Madden.

Clements is not worth the money he got. The bills were smart to not give it to him. He is barely worth half of that. It sucks losing a player but they have to field the best team they can, and they cant do that with all that money put into a CB. They run a Cover 2 d, where you can get by without a top flight corner.

Fletcher is a 32 year old MLB on a team with one of the Worst Run ds in the league. Obviously he is not cutting it. He makes a ton of tackles......5 yards down the field. TheBills plan on wither moving Crowell inside or draftign a MLB. They want ot get bigger, younger and faster up the middle. Whats the problem with this?

and McGahee.....What is good about him. He has never ran for more than 1200 yards. He has 2 seasons averaging less than 4 yards a carry, and his career mark is 3.9. He takes plays off, he wants Top 5 Money or he will hold out, and he never fully healed. He was a shitty pick by the former GM that Marv Levy is trying to fix. Let the Ravens have him,. With their old Line, he wont be any better, and maybe people will see how shitty he is.

[weather vane]

Bills are going to be brutal.

[Hanso Amore]

Bills are going to be brutal.


How so? They were a 7-9 team last year and they are only going to be better. Just because Madden Ratings are high on lost players doesn't mean shit.

They started 3 rookies on D, and 1 on offense. Those guys are only going to be better. They lost a Starting CB, but have a great Young Core, like the colts, that fit in perfectly in the Cover 2. His loss will barely be seen other than on paper. They started 2 rookie safeties, whom combined for 200 tackles. They are great in run support and good, getting better in Coverage. Whitner is going to be a pro bowl safety. He was amazing last year. Ko Simpson was an amazing SEC player who fell because he was Raw. He has all the physical Tools to be the next Brian Dawkins, he just needs to come around on the mental side of the game, which he did last year. he is progressing amazingly. They have Ashton Youboty from OSU who missed most of the year because his mother died and he was inactive throughout the whole preseason. He was dubbed a top 15 pick by Kiper, and he fell to the Bills. He is going to help greatly in replacing Clements.

Then The Bills went out and signed 3 lineman to possibly start on Oline. Their biggest weakness the last 5 years has been Oline, and they made huge steps in makign it a strength.

London Fletcher Hurts. I was all for letting him go, he is old, too expensive, and he makes 0 tackles for loss, 0 sacks, and he makes all his tackles way too far down field. He will be missed though, he was a great leader.

Once more, Mcgahee is a bum. The Bills are goign to either go into next year with Chris Brown/Corey Dillion and a 2nd round back in a deep draft, or they are going to Draft Marshawn Lynch. Both huge upgrades over Willis. He is the most over-rated back in the league. Im a Bills fan and I have been sayign that for years, They should have never drafted him.

After the Draft, the bills will have field their holes. They are an up and coming team. They will once again this year be in the race for the Wildcard until the end. I don't think they will make it, but I know they will improve on a solid 7-9 year. With all the Jets and Pats Fans around here the bills should get more respect. Last year the Bills played amazing games against both teams. Especially the Jets. You guys should be the first to admit the Bills are a great young team.

The Bills and Titans are the teams that are going to upset some people. Pats still own the East, at least for another year :)

[Supreme Olajuwon]

He is probably beating his kids or something
you joke but he actually got suspended from the Titans a game this year for hitting his wife

GO BUCKS

[RP]

Every team in your conference got better and the Bills got alot worse. Nate Clements might not deserve that much money, but dude deserves to get paid and despite the system he played in, he's a top 5 corner back easily. McGahee was worthless, but sad part is, worthless was lot better then you have now.

Hell the Dolphins got 10x better letting Joey Harrington go alone.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Reading your post is like watching NFL Films only showing the good highlights from the season lol

Also, I don't think anyone was calling McGahee a probowler but I dunno who is going to run the ball now (If Corey Dillon is the answer then good luck with that, better hope when they draft Lynch that he isn't a bust) Also, it is pretty hilarious to see a team a draft a guy in the first round, watch him sit out a year, while at the sametime pissing off your current one number back so bad that he leaves the team, just to trade the guy 3 years later.

I am struggling to see where they got better though, they probably just stayed the same. Whitner will be a player, but I'm not too sure about Youboty.

It is the NFL, so maybe some crazy shit could go down, but I think its gonna be Miami vs Buffalo battling for the basement of the AFC once again.

[Hanso Amore]

Clements is nowhere near a top 5 CB. I can name 10 right now that are better than him.

And why is it Funny to watch them draft a guy then trade him 3 years later. We have a New GM, New Coach, new everything. Marv Is getting rid of the shit left over from Donahoe and making his team.

As for McGahee, I'm happier with A Train as our Back. He averages more yards a carry, runs harder, and actually knows what down it is.

Addition by Subtraction. The Bills lost a few starters and Signed a few. We basically traded a 32 Year Old MLB that is on his way out to Washington for a great young Guard who fills our biggest Need. We let an overpriced CB walk and traded our RB. How can you say we are worse at RB when we havent even finished the Offseason. I will bet my house that The Bills RB by committee out rushes Thomas Jones, Ronnie Brown and McGahee. Not Maroney though, hes too much a beast.

The Bills are essentially doing what the Pats did a few years back. Trading away and getting rid of their older overpriced players, and getting the guys that fit their system, and building the team through the draft.

I don't remember any tears when Tebucky, Bledsoe, or Milloy left NE.

What about when the Colts let their ACTUALLY GOOD starting RB walk....They still were SB favorites.

Im not saying the Bills are nearly the team the colts are, Im saying that they arent going to be worse because of it.

[RP]

Colts didnt let Edge go. He left. He wanted alot of money and obviously it was a pretty damn good decision letting him go. Rhodes and Addai were beasts this year.

Name 10 CB's better then Nate Clements.

[RP]

And Nick Harper doesnt count.

[Hanso Amore]

Nate Clements wanted alot of money just like Edge. Your making my points for me. Clements = Edge. Same situation, but somehow because it involves the Bills it is different?

Nathan Vasher
Rashean Mathis
Ike Taylor
Champ Bailey
Dunta Robinson
Deangelo Hall
Asante Samuel
Chris McCallister
Ronde Barber
Ty Law
Dre Bly
Al Harris
Mike Mckenzie
Lito Sheppard
Nnamdi Asomugha
Even Charles Woodson


All of those are guys I would love over Clements. I dotn know why everyone thinks he is good. He doesnt force turnovers, he gets burned all the time, he takes plays off, and he gives up more yards per attempt than any starting CB in the AFC. He is no where Near a Lockdown Corner. He has had a few good games in his career that have made him. He shutdown Chad Johnson Once....Then he turned around and have up 250 yards to Chris Chambers. He couldnt even shut down a single one of the Patriots sad WR core last year, theyate him alive.

[RP]

Nate Clements wanted alot of money just like Edge. Your making my points for me. Clements = Edge. Same situation, but somehow because it involves the Bills it is different?

Nathan Vasher
Rashean Mathis
Ike Taylor
Champ Bailey
Dunta Robinson
Deangelo Hall
Asante Samuel
Chris McCallister
Ronde Barber
Ty Law
Dre Bly
Al Harris
Mike Mckenzie
Lito Sheppard
Nnamdi Asomugha
Even Charles Woodson


All of those are guys I would love over Clements. I dotn know why everyone thinks he is good. He doesnt force turnovers, he gets burned all the time, he takes plays off, and he gives up more yards per attempt than any starting CB in the AFC. He is no where Near a Lockdown Corner. He has had a few good games in his career that have made him. He shutdown Chad Johnson Once....Then he turned around and have up 250 yards to Chris Chambers. He couldnt even shut down a single one of the Patriots sad WR core last year, theyate him alive.

How the hell is Clements and Edge the same situation cause they want money? Clements is a shutdown corner. So what the guy had a bad game. Its probably the second toughest position to play in football. It happens. Edge was a running back. Running backs are a dime a dozen. They come and go all the time. Theres a reason why Denver traded Clinton Portis ( a top 5 running back ) for Champ Bailey straight up. Bailey was a shut down corner and shutdown corners dont come along as often. Clements had 3 picks 2 forced fumbles 2 recovered 56 tackles 16 assisted and 20 passes deflected with 1 TD. Those are pretty good number for a cornerback. I dont think he deserved all that money, but its a huge loss for Buffalo.

[RP]

Nathan Vasher
Rashean Mathis
Champ Bailey
Lito Sheppard
Deangelo Hall
Asante Samuel
Chris McCallister


Those are the ones that are his level. The rest arent as good. Samuel ,Mathis and Sheppard are right about even. Vasher probably even also. and Hall is probably shouldnt be on the list cause he gets burned more then he makes a play. Bailey and McCallister are probably the best of all.

[Mr. Monday Morning]

Nathan Vasher
Rashean Mathis
Ike Taylor
Champ Bailey
Dunta Robinson
Deangelo Hall
Asante Samuel
Chris McCallister
Ronde Barber
Ty Law
Dre Bly
Al Harris
Mike Mckenzie
Lito Sheppard
Nnamdi Asomugha
Even Charles Woodson


Gonna have to disagree with those, but whatever

[Mr. Monday Morning]

k, RP beat me to it. I'd say Barber is better at this point than McAllister though, who is really slowing down now. Completely agree about Hall though, he is all hype.

[Hanso Amore]

No love for Al harris. I read an article with quotes from like 4 different WRs saying he was the hardest to play against. Chad Johnson has said several times that he is the best coverage CB he has ever played.

I still think all those guys are better than Clements, I even though that while we still had him.

[McLegend]

Apparently the Patriots signed Donte Stallworth.

This is a terrible.

[VonErichLives]

Apparently the Patriots signed Donte Stallworth.

This is a terrible.

I'm mixed on this, but I still go with "in Bill we trust" till he proves otherwise.

or I should say Bill & Scott (Scott Pioli VP of player personel)

he's young, he's 6ft tall which makes him one of the bigger WR the Pats have had in a while.

Krisp could tell us more, but if I remember the knock against him in NO's was he didn't like to pratice, that wont work in New England. But there is a good vertran core around him and he's on a super bowl contender, so hopefully he pulls it together because he does have good skills.

[McLegend]

I'm mixed on this, but I still go with "in Bill we trust" till he proves otherwise.

or I should say Bill & Scott (Scott Pioli VP of player personel)

he's young, he's 6ft tall which makes him one of the bigger WR the Pats have had in a while.

Krisp could tell us more, but if I remember the knock against him in NO's was he didn't like to pratice, that wont work in New England. But there is a good vertran core around him and he's on a super bowl contender, so hopefully he pulls it together because he does have good skills.
No this is good for the Patriots.

It's not good for the Eagles. A healthy Donvann McNabb and a heathly Stallworth would have been a very good combination.

[RP]

So did they just pay the money Branch was asking for to Stallworth?

[RP]

I guess Stallworth is about 10 million cheaper, but i mean the bonus is extreme for Stallworth, not as much for Branch. And how hard could it be to come to some terms. You're only 9 million apart. Maybe up the bonus a bit and save yourself some yearly salary? I dunno. I dont claim to be a expert on that managing the cap just seems odd .

I cant believe the Colts couldnt pay Rhodes 2 year 7.5 mil. Insane, but we are up against the cap.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

3.5 mil a year is a lot of money for a backup RB when you've gotta pay big money for both your #2 WR and your TE. Colts definitely did the right thing.

[VonErichLives]

So did they just pay the money Branch was asking for to Stallworth?

The main issue with Branch wasn't the amount of money he wanted.

The main issue with Branch was he wanted to cancel the last year of his contract and have the new one start. The Patriots don't do that, had Branch said, let's sign a new contract that starts after this one finishes in a year, the Pats probably would have kept him, but with few exceptions they keep certain "policies" the same accross the board no matter if you're Brady, Seymore or Larry Izzo.

[Nervous Ferret]

Nate Clements wanted alot of money just like Edge. Your making my points for me. Clements = Edge. Same situation, but somehow because it involves the Bills it is different?

Nathan Vasher
Rashean Mathis
Ike Taylor
Champ Bailey
Dunta Robinson
Deangelo Hall
Asante Samuel
Chris McCallister
Ronde Barber
Ty Law
Dre Bly
Al Harris
Mike Mckenzie
Lito Sheppard
Nnamdi Asomugha
Even Charles Woodson
Justin Miller
:shifty:

[OssMan]

I think Al Harris is probably bottom 10 all time. He gets praise from Bill Maas every 2 seconds for being a "playmaker" because he has long hair and takes huge risks which land him a nice interception and also make his interception-to-get burned for a 55 yard TD ratio stand at about 1:10.

[OssMan]

so putting nate clements on the same level as al harris isnt really doing a lot for you there MatthewAllenHanso

[MTH15]

I'm so glad we signed Joe Horn

[Hanso Amore]

so putting nate clements on the same level as al harris isnt really doing a lot for you there MatthewAllenHanso

Very Good point! Good Job. I bet you feel good.

Except I said Al Harris is better than Nate Clements, and this my statement that he is the best would only FURTHER my point, making everything you said completely fucking retarded.

Try this new fad out, it is called reading, it is all the rave

[Hanso Amore]

How the hell is Clements and Edge the same situation cause they want money? Clements is a shutdown corner. So what the guy had a bad game. Its probably the second toughest position to play in football. It happens. Edge was a running back. Running backs are a dime a dozen. They come and go all the time. Theres a reason why Denver traded Clinton Portis ( a top 5 running back ) for Champ Bailey straight up. Bailey was a shut down corner and shutdown corners dont come along as often. Clements had 3 picks 2 forced fumbles 2 recovered 56 tackles 16 assisted and 20 passes deflected with 1 TD. Those are pretty good number for a cornerback. I dont think he deserved all that money, but its a huge loss for Buffalo.

If Running backs are a dime a dozen and Shutdown corners are so amazing why would the Skins send away Bailey? They gave up the Best corner in the league for a top 5 back. To be it sounds more like Running backs are more important. If the COlts Had Bailey as their starting CB but had a chump like Kevan Barlow as RB instead of Rhodes/Addai would they have won the Super bowl?

Running backs touch the Ball more than anyone, sans QB. If you have a Game changer you win, plain and simple. The colts haev crap for CBs, the Chargers, CRAP. But they have a game breaker at RB and that is mroe important than a shutdown corner.

Clements and Edge are the same. Their teams let them walk because they wanted more than that team was willing to pay. NO difference. Their team chosee to let them walk and replace them with draft picks/vets.

How many MVPs have been corner? How many are in the hall of fame? How many teams sign a free agent corner win more games because of that player alone?

Now ask those questions about RB.

In today's NFL you can get by with an average RB or corner. But the best RBs win games for their teams, and there is a huge difference between Tomlinson/Johnson and Leon Washington. More so than between Bailey and David Macklin.

You can throw numbers out all over the place. 3 Picks, 56 tackles. But not everything about football can be broken down on paper. How many tackles did he miss? How many times was he burned? Blown Coverage? How many extra yards did a running back get because of his lack of aggressive run stopping?

Numbers aren't everything. You can measure worth on Numbers alone.

[OssMan]

Very Good point! Good Job. I bet you feel good.

Except I said Al Harris is better than Nate Clements, and this my statement that he is the best would only FURTHER my point, making everything you said completely fucking retarded.

Try this new fad out, it is called reading, it is all the raveyou seem to be a big fan of people making points for you. i should try that out

"I [am retarded]" - MatthewAllanHanso

dude! you're making my point for me! cut it out!

[OssMan]

good to see you flipping out about me trash talking Al Harris though

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

I personally do not think Clements is that good either, but who do they have to replace him? Youbouty? Just because they made the right decision of not signing him to that stupid contract, it doesn't mean its not gonna hurt to lose him.

Thanks to the NFL rules committee making it so you can't even breathe on a wideout, cornerback are a devalued position in the NFL anyway (Take a look at the two coaches who where on the committe at the time of those rules being put into place, and you'll see why)

They better hope they get lucky and draft some really good players, because they are going to be depending on a lot of rookies this year.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

I'm sure Bills fans used this same rationale to justify letting Antoine Winfield go too.

[Gonzo]

I'm quite interested to see how the draft plays out for the Giants. The only acquisition we've made is Reuben Droughns. We're probably moving David Diehl to LT, but other than that we do have some positions to fill that possibly we could have made better moves on.

Maybe they'll let one of our young guys play in place of LaVar and Carlos Emmons. We've had some guys waiting in the wings for years that have shown great promise.

[SammyG]

Rams should be pretty good. SHOULD BE.

[MTH15]

So Should the Falcons, and Depending on the Raiders offseason them too.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

The Raiders? They are still going to suck

[SammyG]

Great pickup by the Pats in getting Stallworth. Pats are running circles around every other team in Free Agency.

[RP]

If Running backs are a dime a dozen and Shutdown corners are so amazing why would the Skins send away Bailey? They gave up the Best corner in the league for a top 5 back. To be it sounds more like Running backs are more important. If the COlts Had Bailey as their starting CB but had a chump like Kevan Barlow as RB instead of Rhodes/Addai would they have won the Super bowl?

Running backs touch the Ball more than anyone, sans QB. If you have a Game changer you win, plain and simple. The colts haev crap for CBs, the Chargers, CRAP. But they have a game breaker at RB and that is mroe important than a shutdown corner.

Clements and Edge are the same. Their teams let them walk because they wanted more than that team was willing to pay. NO difference. Their team chosee to let them walk and replace them with draft picks/vets.

How many MVPs have been corner? How many are in the hall of fame? How many teams sign a free agent corner win more games because of that player alone?

Now ask those questions about RB.

In today's NFL you can get by with an average RB or corner. But the best RBs win games for their teams, and there is a huge difference between Tomlinson/Johnson and Leon Washington. More so than between Bailey and David Macklin.

You can throw numbers out all over the place. 3 Picks, 56 tackles. But not everything about football can be broken down on paper. How many tackles did he miss? How many times was he burned? Blown Coverage? How many extra yards did a running back get because of his lack of aggressive run stopping?

Numbers aren't everything. You can measure worth on Numbers alone.

The skins traded Bailey for a few reasons. One, they were loaded at defensive back. Two, they spend money like they dont have cap rules. So if for somereason there DB's didnt pan out, they'd find another DB. There's serviceable running backs ( like dominick rhodes ect ) and then theres SUPERSTAR running backs that change games in a matter of seconds. Like Clinton Portis. And theres maybe 4-5 SUPERSTAR rb's. It was an easy trade for them.

If we had Kevin Barlow, and only Kevin Barlow, he'd run for 1200 yards and 8-10 td's easily. Why? Cause out offensive line is probably the best in the league. Thats pretty much why. Thats why letting Edge go wasnt that hard. I dont have a Jeff Saturday avatar for nothing . :cool:

As far as Supreme. The big thing in the league now is Running Back platoons. Thats what we had here in INdianapolis. Now considering it helped win us a Superbowl, its kind of dissapointing that we didnt spend that extra cash to keep him. But i dont think its a horrible loss cause i've said it before. I think Joseph Addai could be as good as Emmit Smith. And i really do mean that. He reminds me of Emmit Smith so much.
If Kevin Barlo

[Mr. Monday Morning]

Great pickup by the Pats in getting Stallworth. Pats are running circles around every other team in Free Agency.

Yeah right. The Vikings signed BOBBY WADE.

[VonErichLives]

There are really only two "game changing" RB's in the NFL right now.

Tomlinson & Johnson, possible Alexander but it depends on how he comes back from injury.

The production of a RB depends on many factors, play calling, OL, etc..

A shut down CB changes the game, a CB capable of going 1-on-1 with the best WR's in the league and take them out of the game, forcing the offense to run or go to other WR/TE's is huge.

Team do trade for, draft and highly value Shut Down CB, the difference between the top CB and top RB is there are more top RB's.

After the top 2/3 RB's the rest are good but not game changing.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Clement is not a game changing CB though

I think you guys are overrating Clement by A LOT, he is a little above average...he isn't Champ Bailey or something

Like I said though, the cornerback has been devalued a lot thanks to Mike Martz and Tony Dungy pushing for the "re-enforcement" of certains rules which benefit wideouts.

[BCWWF]

It would be insane if Moss goes to the Packers. People there already hate him and people in Minnesota still love him. You know he'd do something hilarious.

He came back to Minnesota for a preseason game this year and was pretty normal. After the game he was saying how he liked Minnesota and was upset he couldn't do something for the fans, but he doesn't like the Vikings organization. If he was on the Packers though, it would be different.

Shit, if Moss is going to move he has to come back to Minnesota. We need him more than the Packers, and we actually liked him.

[MTH15]

Now I'd usually spam the hell outta that saying the Falcons should have him and what not. But we got Joe Horn. And the Raiders can be good. Just like the saints. Draft and free agency/trade can get them deep into the playoffs.

[Hanso Amore]

Clement is not a game changing CB though

I think you guys are overrating Clement by A LOT, he is a little above average...he isn't Champ Bailey or something

Like I said though, the cornerback has been devalued a lot thanks to Mike Martz and Tony Dungy pushing for the "re-enforcement" of certains rules which benefit wideouts.


Word. Clements is above average at best.

I still think that RBs are more important than CBs. A Lockdown corner shuts down one reciever, and because of this Teams started using more 3 and 4 reciever sets and started usign TEs as weapons. You can Lockdown harrison onyl for Clark and Wayne to kill you. a RB can wear down an entire D.

[RP]

Clement is not a game changing CB though

I think you guys are overrating Clement by A LOT, he is a little above average...he isn't Champ Bailey or something

Like I said though, the cornerback has been devalued a lot thanks to Mike Martz and Tony Dungy pushing for the "re-enforcement" of certains rules which benefit wideouts.


They pushed for enforcement of the rule. Not re-enforcement. The rule wasnt being called. Get your facts straight.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Its a gay rule, even you RP can admit that

[RP]

11 straight post season quarters between the Colts and the Patriots with no pass interference called on New England until this years AFC Championship game when it was called ( wrongly ) on Ellis Hobbs.


Saying that anyteam from any era defended any group of wide recievers for 11 straight quarters with not one pass interference is rediculous. EVEN YOU sTiMa34 can admit that.

[D Mac]

Kansas City Chiefs President Carl Peterson announced on Monday that the club has agreed to terms of a three-year contract with unrestricted free agent LB Donnie Edwards.


SWEET

[MTH15]

I dont get restricted free agency.

[VonErichLives]

11 straight post season quarters between the Colts and the Patriots with no pass interference called on New England until this years AFC Championship game when it was called ( wrongly ) on Ellis Hobbs.


Saying that anyteam from any era defended any group of wide recievers for 11 straight quarters with not one pass interference is rediculous. EVEN YOU sTiMa34 can admit that.

No it really isn't.

That being said, you're correct it was re-enforcment of the rule, same thing that happened in the mid 80's and will probably happen in another 10-20 years.

The rule does need to be called, but they need to let the refs "let them play" to some extent.. it should be somewhere inbetween, which is where it's slowly getting back to and then a few years after that you'll have WR's being mugged again and whoever has the top offense at that time will complain and they'll re-enforce the rule to the point that breathing on a player is called.

[Hanso Amore]

I dont get restricted free agency.

Drafting team gets first shot at a player after their first contract runs out.

The Drafting team can off them 3 amount of money that they can not refuse, kind of like them picking up an option.

Once they offer a tender, other teams can offer that player a contract for any amount. The Drafting team then has a chance to match that offer. If they match they get the player, not matter where he goes. IF they dont match, the team that signed the player away has to pay compensation depending on the level of the 3 tenders they got.

High Tender = First round pick
Middle tender = Pick equal to the one that player was drafted
Low= No Compensation.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

11 straight post season quarters between the Colts and the Patriots with no pass interference called on New England until this years AFC Championship game when it was called ( wrongly ) on Ellis Hobbs.


Saying that anyteam from any era defended any group of wide recievers for 11 straight quarters with not one pass interference is rediculous. EVEN YOU sTiMa34 can admit that.
I am failing to see why that is such a shocking stat?

Also, is that even including illegal contact calls?

[MTH15]

Thanks MAH, So if teams make trades before the draft including draft picks, dont you have to wait till the draft to hear about it.

[Mr. Monday Morning]

No?

The Patriots sent a 2nd and 7th to Miami for Welker like what, less than a week ago?

[RP]

I am failing to see why that is such a shocking stat?

Also, is that even including illegal contact calls?


Comon. If illegal contact would have been called, New England would have one less Superbowl.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

lol alright

Actually the only rule you could say that about would be the tuck rule

Which I am able to admit was a bad rule, unlike a Colts fan boy defending Illegal Contact rule

[Supreme Olajuwon]

If the Kimo Rule was in effect before the playoffs last year the Steelers would've never won the Super Bowl. But it wasn't so they did.

[Hanso Amore]

Thanks MAH, So if teams make trades before the draft including draft picks, dont you have to wait till the draft to hear about it.

No, they can do it at any point.

However, the alot of trades happen draft day is that is when 99 percent of Pick for Pick trades happen, as the boards are clearer and you know what pick you need to get who you want. Also, Workouts go on until then, so it is not until the draft is upon us that teams have their boards finished

[RP]

lol alright

Actually the only rule you could say that about would be the tuck rule

Which I am able to admit was a bad rule, unlike a Colts fan boy defending Illegal Contact rule


you're a fan boy

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

I know you are but what am I?

[RP]

Tom Brady's baby sitter

[Kris P Lettus]

I'm mixed on this, but I still go with "in Bill we trust" till he proves otherwise.

or I should say Bill & Scott (Scott Pioli VP of player personel)

he's young, he's 6ft tall which makes him one of the bigger WR the Pats have had in a while.

Krisp could tell us more, but if I remember the knock against him in NO's was he didn't like to pratice, that wont work in New England. But there is a good vertran core around him and he's on a super bowl contender, so hopefully he pulls it together because he does have good skills.
He has the ability to be great.. Big, super fast, and makes great cuts but his problems holding on to the ball always held him back.. We used to call him "Stone Hands".. I mean, the way he drops balls I'm suprised the Falcons didn't go after him instead of "Hollywood".. Stallworth has the ability to be great but he prolly never will be..

I am sad about losing Horn though.. I understand why he left and even why he went to the Falcons, but it still sucks.. He wanted money and to be a number 1 WR and with guys like Colston, Henderson, Copper, James, Lewis, and even Reggie, we really don't need him..

:(

He's gonna catch hell coming back into the Chocolate Thunderdome next year..

I haven't been able to keep up with all the happenings due to work but I heard we got a safety and OLB from the Bengals, and a TE from San Fran.. Any other shit I'm missing??

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

I thought Horn got cut?

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Stima and VEL I dunno what you guys know about Kelley Washington but if he gets on the field which I don't think he got a fair opportunity to do in Cincinnati then he's going to be a serious threat for the Patriots next year. And of course you also get this:

<object width="425" height="350"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/xMuvjLcuvTI"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/xMuvjLcuvTI" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"></embed></object>

[Kris P Lettus]

I thought Horn got cut?

Yes..

Because he wants too much money, is old, and has been hurt for most of the past two seasons..

Heard a rumor that we are going after Drew Bennett..

Also, I don't know if this has been dscussed but Tank Johnson is now serving 4 months for a probation violation from the 2005 gun arrest..

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Supreme I hope you are right about Washington, I was a bit surprised by the signing since he hasn't really done anything...but I guess it is tough to get on the field when you got 2 probowl wideouts ahead of you on the depth chart.

[Crimson]

Bennett already went to the Rams didn't he?

[Mr. Monday Morning]

Yup

[Mr. Monday Morning]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=rZxNeFLuY98

4 NerF

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>And there goes Cato June to the Bucs</font> :mad:

[Nervous Ferret]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=rZxNeFLuY98

4 NerF:$ I have actually been looking for that for like 2 years, I was watching the draft when it was on :o

[Nervous Ferret]

WE WANT SAPP
WE WANT SAPP
The New York Jets select, from Penn State, tight end Kyle Brady

groannnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>1983:

"Jets take, with the first round pick, quarterback..."
Lone voice in audience: NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!</font>

[RP]

<font color=goldenrod>And there goes Cato June to the Bucs</font> :mad:


I'm not totally broken up about that. I wanted to keep Harper more then June. Freddy Keiaho is ready to step up.

[VonErichLives]

WE WANT SAPP
WE WANT SAPP
The New York Jets select, from Penn State, tight end Kyle Brady

groannnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn

you can find busts with a lot of teams, especially in the 80's, now most 1st round picks work out to some extent.

It's just always funnier with the Jets since the drafts in NY and all the fans are there.

My most memorible Pats bust was trading down and taking a OL or TE, I honestly forget his name and the only thing he ever did in his career was catch a TD for the Jets to beat the Pats, on the flip side the pick the Pats delt to SF was used for Jerry Rice.

Best Draft momemnt ever was Mel Kiper and Bill Polian.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

lol WE WANT SAPP WE WANT SAPP

[MTH15]

Oh. i just thought that because there are so many trades on trade day involving draft picks. Any more big names that hav'nt been signed/traded for yet?

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Wow someone just told me about Kellen Winslow being out for the '07 season because of a microfracture and his career is in doubt? WHAAAAT

[SammyG]

wtf? I have not heard of this.

[SammyG]

Rams sign the Panthers LB Draft, and Mike Rumph.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Given Joey Porter's latest instance of being a bitch, I'd just like to take this time to remind everyone that Joey Porter is a huge bitch.

[Mr. Monday Morning]

Wow someone just told me about Kellen Winslow being out for the '07 season because of a microfracture and his career is in doubt? WHAAAAT

Yeah I just read a little something about it. Apparently the surgery he had when he crashed his bike was bothering him for most of last season, and he needs some sort of procedure to induce scar tissue to heal over and kind of hold it together. Apparently if that happens it's doubtful he'd be able to play at NFL level.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Surprised it isn't a huge headline on EPSN or CBSSportsline or something

Just heard Stokley is going to the Broncos, interesting pick up if he could actaully stay healthy

[Skippord]

:cool:

[Crimson]

Great...there goes my Winslow jersey.

[OssMan]

Redskins trading Archuleta to the Bears for...................a draft pick! probably a 5th round pick or something hahaha

[SammyG]

Archuleta fucking sucks these days anyway.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Not really, he had one bad year in a system he should never been in in the first place.

Also I think it was a 6th or 7th round pick

I wonder if the Redskins got the pick because they want to use their other picks to move up and get Calvin Johnson

[Hanso Amore]

Not really, he had one bad year in a system he should never been in in the first place.

Also I think it was a 6th or 7th round pick

I wonder if the Redskins got the pick because they want to use their other picks to move up and get Calvin Johnson


They dont have any picks. All they have is a 1st, they traded all their other first day picks.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

haha idiots, I thought they might have some.

Johnson would be huge with the current offense they got, too bad.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

I bet since Kellen Winslow's out the Browns will take Johnson now

[CSL]

<font color=white>Look's like David Carr is done.</font>

[RP]

I think 10 years from now Adrian Peterson will be the best player to come out of this draft.

[FearedSanctity]

Falcons trade Schaub to Texans. Good, now I don't have to hear about how great Schaub is and people guessing which team would trade for him. Granted I haven't seen much of him, but statistically, he kinda sucks. Isn't he that guy that ran into a ref on a sneak? Pretty sure it was


http://nfl.com/nflnetwork/story/10078226

[OssMan]

haha are the texans retarded...david carr is an awesome qb. like he is actually good, not just a "get the job done" guy. he is a really good QB and would be Pro Bowl with like 20 other teams.

and LOL at the Skins getting a 6th. i posted that as a joke, thinking they were more likely to get a 2nd or something. So glad I hate the skins, best team to hate ever

[Mr. Monday Morning]

Falcons trade Schaub to Texans. Good, now I don't have to hear about how great Schaub is and people guessing which team would trade for him. Granted I haven't seen much of him, but statistically, he kinda sucks. Isn't he that guy that ran into a ref on a sneak? Pretty sure it was


http://nfl.com/nflnetwork/story/10078226

He showed flashes of real promise though. The other year he nearly beat the Pats pretty much by himself when he filled in for Vick. But, we'll see how he does without an offensive line in front of him. Gotta think the Vikings are looking long and hard at Carr right now, I can't imagine the Texans won't cut him eventually.

[RP]

I cant believe they drafted Mario Williams over Reggie Bush.

[CSL]

Regarding Winslow, from the Browns site:

He said he was as surprised as anyone to hear of an Internet report that made its rounds Monday saying Winslow would miss the 2007 season.

"I don't even know where that came from - I don't know who said that," he said. "But I love to prove people wrong. That's fuel for me.

"I'll be back. People continue to count me out, and that lights my fire."

[Supreme Olajuwon]

maybe he should stop lighting things on fire and actually try and play football for a while

[The Miz]

Jerramy Stevens

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Woulda been better if Winslow ended that interview with IMA FUCKIN WARRIOR!!!

[RP]

http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20070313/capt.1199402c8a8a4749abd67633cf6a519a.seahawks_stevens_arrest_pn101.jpg

[SammyG]

Hahahah

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Holy shit Schaub got a $48 million deal including $7 mil guaranteed.

The hype machine works.

[FearedSanctity]

Broncos trying to trade Wilson, and then possibly move D.J. Williams to MLB :-\

Love the idea of Williams playing more though, just dunno how well he'd do taking over for Al

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

I think DJ Williams could handle playing in the middle

Al Wilson always did work againest the Patriots though, I hope they do trade him.

[FearedSanctity]

Broncos linebacker Al Wilson is in New York taking a physical.
If he passes, there seems a good chance Wilson will be the Giants' new weak-side linebacker. The Eagles and Lions were both believed to still be in the mix Thursday, so it's unclear if a deal will immediately go down.

Source: Rotoworld

[SammyG]

Marshall retiring. Marshall was awesome, did so many good things for us. May he have a great life after football.

[Mercury Bullet]

Carr officially released by the Texans.

Great job on their part. :roll: When you have an offensive line that gives up a million sacks the issue is with the QB, obviously.

Carr will be a Pro Bowler on any team that can put even a mediocre line in front of him.

[Mercury Bullet]

Maybe he'll be picked up by the Raiders. Raiders keep the #1 pick and take Calvin Johnson. Instant offensive production and huge turnaround for the worst team in recent NFL history.

[weather vane]

The Texans are the worst franchise in sports. Fuck they did everything wrong.

On another note the Dolphines better not sign Trent Green.

[Mercury Bullet]

The Texans are the worst franchise in sports. Fuck they did everything wrong.

On another note the Dolphines better not sign Trent Green.

Absolutely, it's like they sit around in meetings and someone says, "Okay, how can we fix this team?"...and someone replies, "Better yet, here's and interesting approach, how can we make this team even worse?"

And the Dolphins don't need to add another beat up QB.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

If I was the Raiders I'd sign Carr and take Calvin Johnson #1 overall

[MTH15]

Bout time we traded Schaub. Now we get Landry and own

[weather vane]

If I was the Raiders I'd sign Carr and take Calvin Johnson #1 overall

Exactley. Carr is a good QB. Manning or Brady would bebad with the Texans o line. Raiders sign Carr and get Calvin and look out. That would be a total turn around forthat offense.

[RP]

yah lets forget about his 69 career interceptions.

[Mercury Bullet]

yah lets forget about his 69 career interceptions.

Like he had time to drop back and make his reads behind that offensive line. It was throw or die, sometimes both.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>Al Wilson has failed a physical, making a trade unlikely

Fucking hell.</font> :mad:

[Mr. Monday Morning]

Like he had time to drop back and make his reads behind that offensive line. It was throw or die, sometimes both.

And things would be different if he was playing for the Raiders how, exactly?

[DrA]

I don't know why people think that the Raiders should take Calvin Johnson with the number one pick. If Randy Moss and Jerry Porter underperformed on that team, what makes you think that a rookie receiver will do any different?

They need to get a quarterback first and foremost and then start thinking about building up a young offensive line that can protect the young QB. Adding another wide receiver at this point will not be benefitial to them at this point.

[Mercury Bullet]

And things would be different if he was playing for the Raiders how, exactly?

Don't get me wrong, the Raiders offensive line is horrid too. But, they are not as bad as the Texans. The Raiders have a handful of their own improvements to make too, its not like Carr is the one and only answer to all their problems.

And as far as Moss and Porter, Porter has never been very good, just a ot of hype that never panned out. Moss is on the downside of his career and has been so frustrated playing on a terrible team he played like he really didn't give a crap all of last season. Just watch his facial expressions and the effort he put forth on any given play. Calvin Johnson appears to be a better prospect than Porter, and should not have the baggage of Moss.

[Mercury Bullet]

And any QB needs receivers to throw to. With Moss and Porter on the way out, what do they have left? Is Curry going to be putting up 1,000 yards next year as the go-to guy?

[DrA]

Take a look of all of the big name guys that were picked in the top ten or so in the last five years: Roy Williams, Braylon Edwards, Larry Fitzgerald, Andre Johnson. In their three plus years in the NFL, not one of these guys has ever even played in a playoff game.

You guys can go on about how this guy is the greatest thing ever, and he quite possibly might be. However, even if he does rip it up beginning his rookie year, which is not at all a guarentee, that does not mean that his team will be ripping it up as well. I can't think of many situations where a team was great just because one receiver on the team was.

[MTH15]

I agree with DrA. You need more than a wide receiver to have a complete team. Look how much work the Saints did last year. They got Drew Brees, Reggie Bush, and Marques Houston as a sleeper pick. If the Raiders draft Calvin Johnson I think he'll be just like those receivers. Good players on a bad team. If the Raiders draft Jemarcus Russel it might inspire Randy to play like he used too. They need to concentrate on their needs instead of just going for a star player.

[OssMan]

Yeah man the Saints are a bad team man

[Skippord]

<font color=goldenrod>Al Wilson has failed a physical, making a trade unlikely

Fucking hell.</font> :mad:
Al :love:

[weather vane]

Take a look of all of the big name guys that were picked in the top ten or so in the last five years: Roy Williams, Braylon Edwards, Larry Fitzgerald, Andre Johnson. In their three plus years in the NFL, not one of these guys has ever even played in a playoff game.

You guys can go on about how this guy is the greatest thing ever, and he quite possibly might be. However, even if he does rip it up beginning his rookie year, which is not at all a guarentee, that does not mean that his team will be ripping it up as well. I can't think of many situations where a team was great just because one receiver on the team was.

Who is saying that Calvin Johnson will make a team win the Super Bowl? All anybody is saying is that he is going to be a good reciever and will help a stuggling offense. No wide receiver has ever btought a ateam to the playoffs so why would any of those guys be any different?

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Are the Raiders going to take a offensive lineman with the first overall pick?

I doubt it..they already used a high pick on a lineman a few years ago (and he isn't even that good really) They could trade down, but if I was the Raiders I would try to sign Carr and draft Johnson. You say the offense sucked but who was throwing the ball to them? I don't know, I think Carr can be pretty good in the NFL. You have to take in account he was the first QB EVER for the Texans, so the career stats are obviously going to be skewed. Not to mention he was playing for a organization that drafted a highly overrated defensive end over guys like Reggie Bush, Vince Young and Matt Leinart. So naturally you can't think they where making a lot of other good personal moves (IE signing a QB who has started like 4 games in his career to a huge contract)

Out of the wideouts DrA listed they are all real good NFL players except for Edwards, who hasn't really developed fully yet but even so he is still above average IMO. That is a stupid target though because that is a terrible sample, how many teams in the last few years have had a top 3 or 4 pick and made it to the playoffs? Not a whole hell of a lot.

[FearedSanctity]

Al :love:

Don't get too happy. I've read that since Denver's really only trying to trade him because of money, that if they can't, they may just outright cut him :-\

[Mr. Monday Morning]

Yeah the Broncos overspent muchly in free agency

[MTH15]

I was watching path to the draft yesterday and it had a special on sleeper picks. Tony Hunt the running back for Penn State seems like hes gonna own :)

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Take a look of all of the big name guys that were picked in the top ten or so in the last five years: Roy Williams, Braylon Edwards, Larry Fitzgerald, Andre Johnson. In their three plus years in the NFL, not one of these guys has ever even played in a playoff game.

You guys can go on about how this guy is the greatest thing ever, and he quite possibly might be. However, even if he does rip it up beginning his rookie year, which is not at all a guarentee, that does not mean that his team will be ripping it up as well. I can't think of many situations where a team was great just because one receiver on the team was.
Yeah but if you apply that same logic to the QB position, there have been 10 QBs selected in the top 10 since 2000 and only Mike Vick has actually won a playoff game so the success has not been much better and it's a lot more expensive.

[Kris P Lettus]

I agree with DrA. You need more than a wide receiver to have a complete team. Look how much work the Saints did last year. They got Drew Brees, Reggie Bush, and Marques Houston as a sleeper pick. If the Raiders draft Calvin Johnson I think he'll be just like those receivers. Good players on a bad team. If the Raiders draft Jemarcus Russel it might inspire Randy to play like he used too. They need to concentrate on their needs instead of just going for a star player.

NFC Championship bad..

[Mr. Monday Morning]

I don't think he worded it right, he meant good players on a bad team in reference to DrA's post - i.e. Roy Williams, Edwards, Fitzgerald etc. Even if he is a Falcons fan he'd have to be pretty deluded to say the Saints are a bad team.

[DrA]

It depends on how you look at it. I don't think anyone will disagree with me when I say that Oakland's number one priority at this point is quarterback, as keeping Andrew Walters at that position will most likely result in disaster.

Really, Oakland's defense was not that bad last year, and the youth that they have at most positions with Thomas Howard, Fabien Washington, Michael Huff, and so on and so forth, should help them to progress even next year. On the offensive side, they were probably the most disorganized and abysmal team put out on the field since I can remember. While everything on that side had failed, it was mainly the fault of that offensive line combined with a lack of stability at quarterback that led to what Oakland was last year.

Offensive line is a position that you can build up relatively easily in the latter parts of the draft, so having your first pick be put on Joe Thomas would seem to me to be a waste. The question then becomes if you want to draft a quarterback to develop, or sign a veteran like New Orleans did last year. Of all the quarterbacks in the draft, JaMarcus Russell seems to have the best upside, but only if his environment permits him to be. David Carr would bring experience and potentially a quick fix to Oakland's problems, but don't forget that Oakland has been bringing in free agent quarterbacks for the last five or so years with little to no success. In my opinion, Carr going to a team like Oakland would be no better a situation than if he were to stay in Houston. David Carr would be more efficient on a team like Carolina, a team that is already good and does not put all the stress on him to win a game.

If I were Oakland, I would just go ahead and draft Russell and end that stigma of signing one free agent quarterback after another, which in the end will delay their chances of truly being any good. Russell probably would not be effective right at day one, but in two or three years he is Oakland's best shot at having a quarterback the calibre of Daunte Culpepper or Donovan McNabb at this point.

[DrA]

Calvin Johnson would fit better with a team like Tampa Bay, a team that has absolutely no explosiveness on the offensive side of the ball at all. That's where he's going to end up anyway.

[MTH15]

Oh no I meant the Saints used to be bad but they picked up some good additions and are good now. My bad I did reword that wrong. Thanks MR. :love:. My point was

BAD TEAM + GOOD PLAYER THAT ISNT NEEDED= BAD TEAM. Thats like
A good WR means nothing if you have a terrible QB. Cause trust me Aaron Brooks is terrible.

[The Miz]

Oakland will suck in 2007 no matter if the QB is Russell, Carr, or Walter and no matter if the WR's are Moss, Johnson, Porter or whoever. It's not like they're one player away from being a contender. I think they should probably sign David Carr and draft Calvin Johnson, if Carr pans out then great if not theres always the 08, 09, and 10 drafts where hopefully QBs with more potential than JaMarcus Russell and Brady Quinn will be available. Calvin Johnson seems to me to be the safest pick and the most likely to be a superstar, you don't pass a guy like that up to draft a lesser talent just because you have a hole at that position. The fact that their OLine is Sims/McQuistan/Newberry/Grove/Gallery pretty much guarantees their offense will be shit again no matter who is throwing. Keep builidng that defense and try to get better Olinemen, Johnson-Porter is a pretty awesome WR duo, trade Moss and hope to find a QB through future drafts or free agency.

[MTH15]

The Raiders are always gonna suck to me. I just cant visualize the Raiders being...Good.

[Nervous Ferret]

They were in the SuperBowl like 3 years ago man

[MTH15]

I forgot about that shit, damn lol. Well I mean from here on. 4 years ago seems like a long ass time ago compared to how bad they are now.

[Kris P Lettus]

The Saints have always been an AWESOME team..

WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT?!?

[OssMan]

The Saints have always been an AWESOME team..

WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT?!?the raiders

[Boomer]

I'm pretty sure the Falcons would love to keep Calvin away from the Bucs somehow. I would love for the Raiders to take him, or for the Falcons to trade up to get him.

I think the draft is wide open. Landry might go earlier to Minnesota, so I have no idea what the Falcons have in mind. But with 12 draft picks (that's counting expected compensatory picks), and 3 in the first 44 picks or so, I'd say they are in pretty good position for a good draft.

[Kris P Lettus]

Oh no I meant the Saints used to be bad but they picked up some good additions and are good now. My bad I did reword that wrong. Thanks MR. :love:. My point was

[DrA]

Can anyone tell me about all of these defensive linemen in the draft this year? I can't really distinguish anything about Jamaal Anderson or guys like that really.

[Skippord]

Don't get too happy. I've read that since Denver's really only trying to trade him because of money, that if they can't, they may just outright cut him :-\
Kill my buzz :'(

[MTH15]

If Landry is gone Falcons will draft Adrian Peterson. Yes I think its stupid, but oh well. And for our 2nd I think we should should get Brandon Meriweather. Or for our 8th Reggie Nelson. But that wont happen.

[Nervous Ferret]

Clearly the Jets know something that the people down here don't.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Can anyone tell me about all of these defensive linemen in the draft this year? I can't really distinguish anything about Jamaal Anderson or guys like that really.
Alan Branch for Michigan is fucking huge

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

mth, its highly unlikely that Peterson will be around at pick 10, and if he was they would taking him OVER Laundy.

Also what are you talking about with 8th they should take Nelson? What does that even mean? Reggie Nelson will probably be somewhere in the mid-20's in the first round, so Falcons won't be getting him. Merriweather could slip into the 2nd round, I dunno when the Falcons pick but they could have a shot at him.

[Mr. Monday Morning]

Can anyone tell me about all of these defensive linemen in the draft this year? I can't really distinguish anything about Jamaal Anderson or guys like that really.

Amobi Okoye is 19 years old and built like someone about 5 years older, apparently. He also entered college at 14, if I remember right.

-edit- nope, 16

[Mr. Monday Morning]

Actually what am I even doing, <a href="http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/sub/mockdraft.html">this</a> is about the most comprehensive mock draft site out there, has a good little bio for each of the projected 1st rounders.

[MTH15]

Falcons traded Texans Matt Schaub and 1st round pick for
1st round pick
2nd round pick
2nd round pick 08.

I hope we get Landry

[Butch]

Eagles have traded Darwin Walker and a conditional 2008 draft pick (said to be round 7) to the Bills for Takeo Spikes and Kelly Holcomb.

Great piece of business, Spikes will start instead of Dhani Jones and Holcomb fills our need for a third quarterback and holder. Although it's sad to see Walker go, the signing of Montae Reagor a few days ago means he was expendable.

[Mr. Monday Morning]

I dunno what the Bills are thinking tbh. They now have virtually no good players on defence, apart from maybe Schobel. McGee might as well be a return specialist as he's not that great a corner. There's some young kids there who have potential but really, they've pretty much lost all their defensive veterans in one-offseason. Crazy.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Bad team getting worse

Also, was just looking a random mock draft and saw Jon Beason going to the Colts with the last pick in the first round. That would be a great pick up for them, he reminds me a lot of Cato June except he is a much better tackler

[OssMan]

who the fuck is darwin walker and why is he worth Takeo Spikes?

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Lance Briggs and the Bears first rounder to the Redskins for their first rounder

Wonder if it's gonna happen

[The Miz]

My mock

1. OAK - JaMarcus Russell, QB, Louisiana State
2. ARZ (from DET) - Joe Thomas, OT, Wisconsin-Madison
3. CLE - Adrian Peterson, HB, Oklahoma
4. TB - Calvin Johnson, WR, Georgia Tech
5. DET (from ARZ) - Patrick Willis, ILB, Mississippi
6. CHI (from WAS) - LaRon Landy, FS, Louisiana State
7. MIN - Brady Quinn, QB, Notre Dame
8. ATL - Gaines Adams, DE, Clemson
9. MIA - Levi Brown, OT, Penn State
10. HOU - Leon Hall, CB, Michigan

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Arizona and Detroit swapped picks?

And you think Willis is gonna go that high? I've seen a lot of mocks with him going to the Patriots at 24

[The Miz]

Nah I'm saying I predict ARZ is gonna trade up to draft Thomas, Detroit probably wont pick Willis but I think hes the best ILB in the draft and the best fit for them. Probably pick Quinn or something retarded

[SammyG]

Going to Seattle for the Rams/Hawks game there. WOOO

[VonErichLives]

Lance Briggs and the Bears first rounder to the Redskins for their first rounder

Wonder if it's gonna happen

The league should just take the football operations away from Snyder and let someone who knows what they're doing run it.

You're going to trade down from the #6 pick for a guy who wont play for the defending nfc champs because he wants more money and by the way, doesn't and hasn't ever played in the defensive system you run...

Snyder is an idiot... a rich idiot but still and idiot!

[OssMan]

i know! n i love it! let them have briggs! thats almost a guaranteed bust right there.

[Gonzo]

Haha I know the Redskins buy players every year and they just never amount to shit.

[SammyG]

Adam Archuleta. Didn't they give him like 35 mil

[Gonzo]

Yeah, great example of a system player getting fucked over by the Redskins.

[SammyG]

When do the complete schedules come out?

[Kris P Lettus]

A couple of things:

I will be rocking this

http://www.fansedge.com/Images/Product/31-98/31-98814-f.jpg

in a few days..

Also, I'm working with Deuce on Friday so I'm gonna get a ball signed..

WOOOO

Finally, my dad is working with Drew Brees next week so I gave him my Brees jersey to get signed (which is why I ordered the Sam Mills jersey).. I originally wanted a white Will Smith one but love the throwback..

Who Dat??

[Mr. Monday Morning]

When do the complete schedules come out?

Early April

[OssMan]

A couple of things:

I will be rocking this

http://www.fansedge.com/Images/Product/31-98/31-98814-f.jpg

in a few days..

Also, I'm working with Deuce on Friday so I'm gonna get a ball signed..

WOOOO

Finally, my dad is working with Drew Brees next week so I gave him my Brees jersey to get signed (which is why I ordered the Sam Mills jersey).. I originally wanted a white Will Smith one but love the throwback..

Who Dat??are you gonna get your left ball signed by Deuce's lips?

[Kris P Lettus]

Way to steal my joke, assman..

[Kris P Lettus]

I went and bought a "vintage" NFL Nike ball but forgot to buy a paint pen.. I had to settle for a metallic sharpie.. Looks ok, but kind shitty next to my Joe Namath ball because of the pen situation.. Deuce was super cool.. Got a few pics with him, which I'll have up in a few days..

Who Dat??