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lol I say that but in actual fact when you add it all up Radke has been pretty consistent year on year, solid if you will
BCWWF
09-09-2006, 11:38 AM
Radke could very well be done for the season, but even if he is, he was one of the top pitchers in the AL for the two or three months that he pitched with the shoulder injury. He was more consistant than Johan in that time. It was just the most rediculous column I've ever read.
BCWWF
09-09-2006, 11:47 AM
By Rob Neyer
ESPN Insider
Archive (http://x.go.com/cgi/x.pl?goto=http://search.espn.go.com/keyword/search?searchString=rob_neyer&name=SEARCH_m_archive&srvc=sz)
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<!-- begin text11 div --><!-- begin leftcol --> <!-- template inline -->For much of the season, even as the Yankees were thriving despite the losses of Hideki Matsui (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=7042) and Gary Sheffield (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=4268), radio hosts were telling me the Yanks would be in trouble come October, because they simply don't have good enough pitching. Well, they still have the same pitching -- Cory Lidle (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=5806) notwithstanding -- which got me to wondering just how good (or not) their pitching really is. Here are composite stats of each playoff contenders' top three starters (who will get the vast majority of the innings in October) ...
IP BR/9 ERA
Twins 483 10.2 3.21
Tigers 528 11.3 3.75
Athletics 513 13.0 4.02
Yankees 554 10.9 4.06
ChiSox 541 11.9 4.39
</pre>The Twins look really good, thanks to Johan Santana (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=6441) and Francisco Liriano (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=7504) (and no thanks to Brad Radke (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=5337)). Obviously, we don't know if Liriano's going to be healthy enough to pitch in October. But if Liriano's not healthy, 1) the Twins probably won't make the playoffs, and b) if they do, Carlos Silva (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=6880) probably would go into the rotation, jumping the Big Three's ERA to 4.35, just fourth-best in the group. Granted, in the first round Santana would start twice … but eventually, if a team escapes the first round, its No. 3 guy is going to get his innings.
The Tigers, as you would guess, also fare well. But 1) their pitchers benefit from their ballpark, and 2) we still might reasonably wonder if Justin Verlander (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=7590) can hold up for seven months. I'm generally optimistic about young pitchers in October, as I've found no evidence that experience means beans in the postseason. But by season's end Verlander will be pushing 200 innings, and he's never come close to that sort of workload in his life.
Next come Oakland's Barry Zito (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=6394), Danny Haren (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=7172), and Esteban Loaiza (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=5368). (Why Loaiza rather than Joe Blanton (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=7461)? Because Loaiza's ERA since the All-Star break is 3.10.) They're good, and would be even better with a healthy Rich Harden (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=7180), who's supposedly coming along nicely and might be back in the rotation come October.
Then come the Yankees, and finally the White Sox. A year ago, White Sox starters posted the second-lowest ERA (3.75) in the American League, then breezed through October. This year they're seventh in the league, and behind the other postseason contenders.
I'm not going to argue in favor of the Yankees having the best starters in the postseason. They might, but they probably won't. Randy Johnson (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=4288)'s been spotty this season, Mike Mussina (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=4715)'s recovering from a (supposedly) slight injury, and Chien-Ming Wang (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=7502) is still proving to all of us that he can be highly successful without throwing the ball past anybody. But things are tough all over. Nobody's got Maddux-Glavine-Smoltz or Hudson-Mulder-Zito. Not this year.
And anyway, how many World Series did those two trios win, anyway? (That's a rhetorical question, of course; I know the answer is "one.") We've made some strides since I started doing this sort of thing, roughly 10 years ago. I have a pile of clippings on my desk, stuff I've been saving just this summer, and I'm amazed to see the extent to which sabermetrics have infiltrated the mass media. And then you read something like this, courtesy of Jeromy Burnitz (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=5061) and the Chicago Tribune: "But the facts say that at every level it's pitching first, then defense and then timely hitting."
Actually, the facts say that pitching and defense, taken together, are almost precisely as important as hitting (forget about timeliness). At every level, or at least every professional level. Sure, Jeromy Burnitz is just one man. But I suspect if you watched every game on TV, you'd hear this drivel at least once every day.
Pitching's a wonderful thing, and so is hitting. The Yankees, who play half their games in a pitcher's park, have scored more runs in road games than any other team in the league, and by a pretty hefty margin. Obviously, they can be beaten in October, just as they've been beaten in every October since 2000. But their pitching is just about as good as anybody's, and their hitting is better than everybody's.
<center><hr width="200"></center> • A number of kind people have sent me to this incredible Web site (http://www.baseballrace.com/), and now I'm sending you (if you choose to go). I don't have anything of my own to add. Just go play around for a few minutes, and tell me if you're not impressed at least a little.
• Something else I've got piled on my desk: clippings of articles and columns written before the season, predicting that MLB's new amphetamines policy would result in noticeably decreased offensive production and, as a consequence, noticeably decreased attendance (here's one memorable example (http://www.michaelsokolove.com/michael_sokolove/hottopic.htm), but just one of many). Still waiting to read the retractions.
• Everybody wants to know if the Tigers are going to blow their lead. They probably will not. And if they do, it probably will not matter. Because even if they play poorly down the stretch, it will matter only if both the Twins and the White Sox play particularly well. Not likely. According to this page (http://www.baseballprospectus.com/statistics/ps_oddspec.php) the Tigers still have roughly a 98-percent chance of making the playoffs, one way or the other.
• In fact, we probably already know, on Sept. 8, seven of the eight playoff teams. The National League East is decided, the Central is close, and the Dodgers and Padres are in great shape for the other two slots. Our best hopes for drama involve the Twins and White Sox and their season-ending series, and the Ryan Howard (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=7437)-led Phillies putting some pressure on whoever's running second in the NL West. Oh, and it looks like no pitcher in the National League is going to win 20 games, which hasn't happened in a full season since 1987, when Rick Sutcliffe led the NL with 18 wins. That's not dramatic, really. Moderately interesting, though (and the pundits will try to figure out what's different this year, even if nothing is).
• I thought the Indians were going to win the American League Central this season. Instead, they're in fourth place, with the 10th-best record in a 14-team league. They also have the fifth-best run differential in the league. You might think the Indians are bad and I was wrong. I prefer to think the Indians are unlucky and I was (mostly) right. And I'm picking them again next spring.
Senior writer Rob Neyer writes for Insider three times most weeks during the season. You can reach him via rob.neyer@dig.com, and his new book, "Rob Neyer's Big Book of Baseball Blunders," (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0743284917/sr=8-1/qid=1148389826/ref=pd_bbs_1/102-7832203-7432924?%5Fencoding=UTF8) is available everywhere.
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Does anybody else fail to see his argument here? Mark Buehrle, Jose Contreras, Jon Garland, Freddie Garcia and Javier Vazquez might not be having career years, but I would take them over Randy Johnson, Mike Mussina, Corey Lidle, Chin Ming Wang and whoever the last guy is any day of the week. I would say the Tiger's have a somewhat suspect pitching staff right now, but I would not say the Yankee's pitching staff is on par with the Twins, A's or even the White Sox come playoff time, and I am going to go out on a limb and say it won't be on par with the Tigers either.
YOUR Hero
09-09-2006, 12:06 PM
that's a homer article, no doubt
Buerhle, Vazquez and Garcia over Mussina and Wang? Get the fuck outta here, Mussina's been the American league's most consistent pitcher since the early 90's and Wang has pitched better than all of the Chicago rotation this year, Chicago pitching has been decidedly lacklustre, Jenks has also been pretty friggin average.
YOUR Hero
09-09-2006, 01:07 PM
Back to Ryan Howard.
Maybe he's not clean, but he's not been proven or suspected as on the juice. So until he is, he'd be the first clean player to potentially surpass Maris' mark.
Use you mind, and hypothesize!
Evil Vito
09-09-2006, 01:28 PM
<font color=goldenrod>I was bored so I did a write up for what I think will be the Mets' postseason roster:
-------------------------
Pitchers (12): Pedro Martinez, Tom Glavine, Orlando Hernandez, Steve Trachsel, John Maine, Billy Wagner, Aaron Heilman, Chad Bradford, Roberto Hernandez, Pedro Feliciano, Darren Oliver, Guillermo Mota
I’m really liking this staff. The rotation is very iffy of course, but I believe this bullpen can definitely step it up. Not sure who gets bumped from the rotation to the bullpen though. I really hope its Trachsel as we’d probably never need to use him…but I can see them sooner sending Maine to the ‘pen. El Duque could also go to the ‘pen, but I doubt it.
-------------------------
Catchers (2): Paul Lo Duca, Ramon Castro
Hopefully Paulie stays hot right through October. I’m not sure if Castro is even going to be able to come back, but I heard if he is ready it will be in time for the playoffs. If its not him it’ll be either Mike DiFelice or Kelly Stinnett, neither of whom will likely play.
-------------------------
Infielders (6): Carlos Delgado, Jose Valentin, Jose Reyes, David Wright, Julio Franco, Chris Woodward
The starting four infielders are all great but I really dunno what would happen God forbid an injury occurs. Woodward has been terrible but Willie has a mancrush on him. Franco was a great-pinch hitter early on but now he’s kinda meh.
-------------------------
Outfielders (4): Cliff Floyd, Carlos Beltran, Shawn Green, Endy Chavez
Chavez has been awesome this year, but Floyd is still gonna start unless he injures himself again. Either way, Chavez is the primary pinch-hit candidate and also has great speed. Beltran’s awesome, enough said. Chavez can also spell Shawn Green if he has some bad games.
-------------------------
The 25th Man: Kind of a toss-up here. Some would say Lastings Milledge is the favorite to win the final roster spot to give the Mets a right-handed outfielder, but Willie already said he wouldn’t use Milledge as a pinch-hitter only…possibly a pinch-runner and that’s about it. Plus, Woodward can fill in as the #5 OFer or anywhere else.
Michael Tucker or Ricky Ledee will get consideration just so they can add another lefty bat off the bench (probably the most sensical choice)…it’d probably be Ledee since he has the post-season experience.
The only other viable option is Anderson Hernandez, who has not only great speed but would be phenomenal for late-inning defense. Hopefully he'll never have to bat though, as he's an automatic out.
-------------------------
Obviously there's some big question marks here...but I'm more than happy with this team. Clearly one of the top teams in the league. The only real way I see them not making the WS is if they end up getting paired up with a team that has an awesome pitching staff.
Florida (never thought I'd say that) and Houston are the teams that would give me the biggest worries in a short series.</font>
Joey Slugs
09-09-2006, 01:44 PM
.Buerhle, Vazquez and Garcia over Mussina and Wang? Get the fuck outta here, Mussina's been the American league's most consistent pitcher since the early 90's and Wang has pitched better than all of the Chicago rotation this year, Chicago pitching has been decidedly lacklustre, Jenks has also been pretty friggin average.
:lol:
I'm going to just flat out ignore your comments about the starting pitching and move right on to the Jenks comment:
He is pretty friggin average? Are you high? I'll admit that he looked like shit last night, but that is due to some hip problems. He has 39 saves in 43 chances, which makes him 2nd in all of baseball. His 71 strikeouts puts him in the top 10 for all closers. He has only given up 5 home runs in 64 innings, which is good for another top 10 in all of baseball. His 3.78 ERA looks pretty human but it is harder to lower your ERA when you are a closer. If you go through a rough patch, you just have to stick it out. His Pre-ASG ERA was a solid 2.83.
Average? Not fucking close.
The Miz
09-09-2006, 04:44 PM
3.78 is pretty average for a closer. Yeah it's harder to lower your ERA, but if you're good it shouldn't be high to begin with.
1.30 WHIP is pretty average too. Can't use the "it's harder" excuse here because it's much easier for a closer to not allow baserunners.
The closers with more strikeouts than Jenks are Lidge, Saito, Putz, Wagner, Nathan, Ryan, KRod, Cordero, and Papelbon. The ones directly below him are Fuentes, Burgos, Gonzalez, Turnbow and Gordon. So if he's right in the middle of those two groups, what word would describe him well?
BCWWF
09-09-2006, 06:46 PM
As of right now, the Yankees and the White Sox have pretty similar starting pitching, neither is anything special. If it came down to the playoffs, I would expect the White Sox pitchers to perform more than I would the Yankees.
YOUR Hero
09-09-2006, 06:56 PM
execpt they don't start right now and for that matter the WSOX might not be in the playoffs.
The Miz
09-09-2006, 07:01 PM
Like Hero said, it's about who's hot going in. See: 1997/2003 Florida Marlins
DaveWadding
09-10-2006, 12:32 AM
WEBB 4 CY YOUNG
1 Hit CG SO vs. Cards tonight
BCWWF
09-10-2006, 03:34 AM
Boof for Twins No. 2 pitcher. It is shocking that behind Santana, Boof has been the best pitcher in the last two or three weeks, yet we haven't falled back in the wildcard. I think Liriano has a rehab start soon, and could be back in the majors late next week. I don't really expect him to be as good as he was, I have a feeling he will be timid or something, but if Boof, Baker, Garza and Chief Silva can get it done, I'd imagine Liriano will boost that no matter how effective he is.
Gertner
09-10-2006, 01:18 PM
Hey Miz Gustavo wanted me to ask you how he did last night and that Chacin > Blanton
Joey Slugs
09-10-2006, 02:02 PM
3.78 is pretty average for a closer. Yeah it's harder to lower your ERA, but if you're good it shouldn't be high to begin with.
1.30 WHIP is pretty average too. Can't use the "it's harder" excuse here because it's much easier for a closer to not allow baserunners.
The closers with more strikeouts than Jenks are Lidge, Saito, Putz, Wagner, Nathan, Ryan, KRod, Cordero, and Papelbon. The ones directly below him are Fuentes, Burgos, Gonzalez, Turnbow and Gordon. So if he's right in the middle of those two groups, what word would describe him well?
Closers should only be measured on S/BS. Would make Jenks the second best CP in all of baseball.
YOUR Hero
09-10-2006, 02:16 PM
whip
don't forget that.
Thing is stats never tell the whole story, a guy could throughout the season come in 10 times in the 8th and by giving up runs create a save situation and then save it. Also you get those saves where the guy pitches 1/3 of an inning and stuff, the Save stat itself is not the best judge of a closer imo, its just part of it
Closers should only be measured on S/BS. Would make Jenks the second best CP in all of baseball.
Any closer can have 40+ saves, but if they're earning those saves and giving up 1-2 earned runs each outing then they're just lucky.
BCWWF
09-10-2006, 06:10 PM
In a way, I don't want Liriano to come back just so I can take a shit in my hand and rub it in the faces of everybody who thought they were smart by implying the Twins had no chance of making the playoffs without him.
Santana goes 6.1 with no earned runs, Twins take 3/4 from Detroit, Chicago loses to Cleveland, THE AL CENTRAL IS TWO GAMES AWAY. But I guess I have no reason to get excited, because the Yankees have the best pitching in the league when the playoffs start.
RoXer
09-10-2006, 06:27 PM
Ick. A's play Minn and Chic next.
The Miz
09-10-2006, 11:14 PM
ONLY measured on S/CS? Are you fucking kidding me? So you'd take Player A over Player B?
A: 39/40 sv, 5.00 ERA, 1.50 WHIP
B: 35/40 sv, 2.00 ERA, 1.00 WHIP
If Jenks had a great ERA but so-so save totals you know you'd be making the opposite argument.
And you do realize giving up 2 runs in 1 inning of a 3 run game constitutes a save, correct? And giving up 1 run in 1 inning of a 1 run game does not?
BCWWF
09-11-2006, 12:28 AM
From a pure statistical point of view, that works, but it isn't flawless. Just for an example, say Kansas City had a closer with less saves/opportunities, and also a slightly lower ERA. I would still probably take Jenks, because even if he makes it interesting, he has proven throughout the whole year that he can save a ballgame. The Kansas City pitcher might have a lower ERA, but there is a major difference
between late innings and closing games. So I think it is stupid to completely rule that factor out of it.
That being said, to accurately throw Jenks out the window, I would rather see his stats in save situations rather than his stats overall. I know a lot of closers tend to give up runs in non-save situations.
The Miz
09-11-2006, 12:34 AM
Saying saves is a good stat is like saying wins is a good stat. Its completely team dependent. If Jon Papelbon gives up 1 run in a 2-1 game, that's a blown save. If Rivera gives up 2 runs in a 3-0 game, that's a save. Proving that you can "save games" means nothing. Proving that you can get guys out (WHIP) and not allow runs (ERA) does.
BCWWF
09-11-2006, 01:32 AM
There are plenty of guys who can get guys out and not allow a lot of runs in the eighth inning that can't in the ninth. I agree that it is team dependent for the most part, but if you are converting 95% of saves with an average ERA, I have to assume that you can get the job done when it really matters.
Joey Slugs
09-11-2006, 02:30 PM
ONLY measured on S/CS? Are you fucking kidding me? So you'd take Player A over Player B?
A: 39/40 sv, 5.00 ERA, 1.50 WHIP
B: 35/40 sv, 2.00 ERA, 1.00 WHIP
If Jenks had a great ERA but so-so save totals you know you'd be making the opposite argument.
And you do realize giving up 2 runs in 1 inning of a 3 run game constitutes a save, correct? And giving up 1 run in 1 inning of a 1 run game does not?
I'll take Player A any day of the week. Wanna know why? 4 more saves means 4 more wins for the team.
Yeah but 5 BS doesn't mean 5 losses to be fair
OssMan
09-11-2006, 04:41 PM
Gertner logic
Yknow I duno why people say things like "if i had to go on one stat", because nobody ever does, least of all a manager. I've just realised how stupid this whole argument is, its only relevent if you're talking about fantasy baseball at the end of the day, no manager worth a cent is gonna put a guy into the 9th inning of a 1 run ballgame when all he's seen of him is his ERA, S/BS and WHIP.
The Miz
09-11-2006, 07:12 PM
I'll take Player A any day of the week. Wanna know why? 4 more saves means 4 more wins for the team.
They're on different teams. It doesn't mean 4 more wins, all wins aren't save situations. Use your head. It's the exact same thign as saying a mediocre pitcher on a great team is better than a great pitcher on a mediocre team beacause of win totals.
The Miz
09-11-2006, 07:15 PM
Yknow I duno why people say things like "if i had to go on one stat", because nobody ever does, least of all a manager. I've just realised how stupid this whole argument is, its only relevent if you're talking about fantasy baseball at the end of the day, no manager worth a cent is gonna put a guy into the 9th inning of a 1 run ballgame when all he's seen of him is his ERA, S/BS and WHIP.
So you just guy how a player looks then. Not what they've actually done on the field. Good strategy
Jesus Shuttlesworth
09-11-2006, 07:48 PM
Papelbon > Jenks
The Miz
09-11-2006, 10:08 PM
Wow Frank Thomas homers in 6 straight games. He needs to be given serious consideration for AL MVP. Carried the A's for like 2-3 months when he was the only one on the team hitting. The pitching is the story but without Thomas the race is between Texas and LAAAAAAAAAAA.
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BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 25pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=33>2B</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 25pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=33>3B</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 25pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=33>HR</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 29pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=38>RBI</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 25pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=33>SB</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 25pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=33>CS</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 29pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=38>BB</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 29pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=38>SO</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 25pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=33>SH</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 25pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=33>SF</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 25pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=33>HBP</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 25pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=33>GDP</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 40pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=53>AVG</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 39pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=52>OBP</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 40pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=53>SLG</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 40pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=53>OPS</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 29pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=38>PA</TD></TR><TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; HEIGHT: 12.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" height=17>Frank Thomas</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>117</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>407</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>71</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>115</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>8</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>0</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>36</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>98</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>0</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>0</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>73</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>69</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>0</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>4</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>6</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>9</TD><TD class=xl27 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num="0.28255528255528256" x:fmla="=(E2/C2)">0.283</TD><TD class=xl27 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num="0.39591836734693875" x:fmla="=SUM(E2, L2, P2)/SUM(C2, L2, P2, O2)">0.396</TD><TD class=xl27 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num="0.56756756756756754" x:fmla="=SUM(E2,F2,2*(G2),3*(H2))/C2">0.568</TD><TD class=xl27 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num="0.96348593491450629" x:fmla="=SUM(S2,T2)">0.963</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num x:fmla="=SUM(C2,L2,N2,O2,P2)">490</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
But what about Jenks? He's got 39 SV in 43 chances?
BCWWF
09-12-2006, 12:03 AM
I agree with Miz for the most part, but I am just saying that you can't completely write off saves as a stat.
YOUR Hero
09-12-2006, 12:45 AM
you write off any stat
BCWWF
09-12-2006, 01:13 AM
It's funny how you purposely didn't capitolize that.
So you just guy how a player looks then. Not what they've actually done on the field. Good strategy
I said talking about one stat like you might one day have to make a snap world series clinching decision on it is bullshit.
wtf did you even read it?
Jenks got his 40th save last night folks, gave up 2H and 1ER. Kyle Farnsworth also picked up a save and didn't give up any runs...But seeing as I don't even know what i'm arguing for/against now i'll shut up:D
Gertner
09-12-2006, 09:42 AM
Hey Miz,
I actually talked to Joe Blanton and he wanted me to ask you how he's een pitching
Chacin> Blanton
Chris Carpenter for NL Cy Young?
I'd go with Carpenter for NL Cy Young. He's the best pitcher in a terrible pitching league. The only competition I think he has is Zambrano and Webb, but he is better than both of them.
He's been completely lights out recently. I think its gotta be between him and Webb
Dragon
09-12-2006, 09:08 PM
Nice, Matsui back in the lineup tonight. Has two hits in the 3rd inning already.
Stacked lineup as well.
Dragon
09-12-2006, 10:53 PM
Solid return, 4-4 with an RBI and a walk
Joey Slugs
09-12-2006, 11:05 PM
Why is Abreu getting 6 RBIs in the 1st breaking news on ESPN.com?
Evil Vito
09-12-2006, 11:59 PM
<font color=goldenrod>Mets getting smacked around by the Fish again :(
Imagine if they were to stay red hot, make the WS, and win it? :o
Think of how many millions the few retards who bet on them before the year in Vegas would make</font> :o
There would most likely not be another Marlins fire sale after this WS if it were to happen.
DaveWadding
09-13-2006, 12:26 AM
I'd go with Carpenter for NL Cy Young. He's the best pitcher in a terrible pitching league. The only competition I think he has is Zambrano and Webb, but he is better than both of them.
WEBBIE 4 CY
BCWWF
09-13-2006, 12:40 AM
Wow, the Twins are on fire. This is the kind of shit the White Sox had last year, where the hitting is SOOO timely. It's nice to have the luck on our side this time.
It's a good thing that the Yankees had a win though, because there isn't a big wildcard/division race going on right now or anything.
Fuck me what happened to Octavio Dotel?:|
Dragon
09-13-2006, 12:42 PM
Well, he has only pitched about 6 innings since the month he's been back, so hes bound to not be sharp.
Still, getting roughed up by the D-Rays is generally not easy
Good to see Mussina doing well though, again its against the D-Rays but he's been great all year regardless of the opponents so its definitely a plus going into the post season.
Joey Slugs
09-13-2006, 03:14 PM
Liriano only made it through 3 in his first start off the DL. Had to leave due to elbow pain. NOT a good sign for the Twinkies.
DominateR
09-13-2006, 03:50 PM
Wow, the Twins are on fire.
No offense, but I wouldnt mind at all if a few teams came and cooled their fire for about, oh i dunno, 17 GAMES, while Detroit catches fire once again and gets their AL Central lead back to something respectable like around 10-12 games would be nice.
RoXer
09-13-2006, 04:12 PM
Come on A's, take 1 from em.
RoXer
09-13-2006, 04:46 PM
Hey, good baserunning Mornaeu
FakeLaser
09-13-2006, 07:50 PM
Sucks about Liriano, they're talking about Tommy John surgery.
FakeLaser
09-13-2006, 07:51 PM
Also, if Webb finishes strong I think he'll win it. It'll probably come down to who has more wins between he and Carpenter.
BCWWF
09-13-2006, 09:31 PM
Yeah that is disappointing about Liriano. Huge game by Freddie Garcia today though, if the White Sox can get into the playoffs, they clearly have the most talented pitchers IMO. It's just the matter of getting into top form again.
The Miz
09-13-2006, 10:40 PM
Other than Contreras and Garcia who is that talented? Buehrle maybe? Garland is clearly a crap pitcher who had one fluke year and Vazquez is an NL pitcher. On a talent standpoint, I like the A's now that Liriano is out for the Twins. But only if Harden is healthy (he's expected to make 1-2 starts before playoffs), Zito/Haren/Blanton/Loaiza isn't that great.
Contreras > Zito
Garcia < Harden
Buehrle < Haren
White Sox vs. A's rotation is debatable, the bullpen isn't even close though. Street/Duchscherer/Calero/Kennedy is just sick.
BCWWF
09-14-2006, 12:55 AM
I don't think you are giving Buehrle enough credit, and I thought Garland was a fluke too, but he has been pretty respectable again this year.
BCWWF
09-14-2006, 12:56 AM
I dunno, I am kind of following the trend of mainstream media and not really giving the A's much of a chance, but I am not really sure why. Their pitching has made up for offense all year.
Joey Slugs
09-14-2006, 05:43 AM
Garland was a fluke? His numbers this year look pretty respectable to me:
<table class="yspwhitebg" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td style="border-right: 1px solid rgb(244, 245, 241); padding: 7px 0pt; background: rgb(226, 226, 226) none repeat scroll 0% 50%; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial;" class="yspdetailttl" align="center" width="60">W-L</td><td style="border-right: 1px solid rgb(244, 245, 241); padding: 7px 0pt; background: rgb(226, 226, 226) none repeat scroll 0% 50%; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial;" class="yspdetailttl" align="center" width="60">ERA</td><td style="border-right: 1px solid rgb(244, 245, 241); padding: 7px 0pt; background: rgb(226, 226, 226) none repeat scroll 0% 50%; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial;" class="yspdetailttl" align="center" width="60">K</td><td style="border-right: 1px solid rgb(244, 245, 241); padding: 7px 0pt; background: rgb(226, 226, 226) none repeat scroll 0% 50%; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial;" class="yspdetailttl" align="center" width="60">Walks</td><td style="background: rgb(226, 226, 226) none repeat scroll 0% 50%; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial;" class="yspdetailttl padded3px" align="center" width="60">WHIP</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-right: 1px solid rgb(244, 245, 241);" align="center">17-4
</td><td style="border-right: 1px solid rgb(244, 245, 241);" align="center">4.28
</td><td style="border-right: 1px solid rgb(244, 245, 241);" align="center">98
</td><td style="border-right: 1px solid rgb(244, 245, 241);" align="center">36
</td><td align="center">1.32
</td></tr></tbody></table>
Garland and Contreras have been CWS best this year, Garland's been pretty great in recent starts
The Outlaw
09-14-2006, 02:53 PM
Garland's stats (minus the W-L) are nearly identical to Gil Meche. Has he had a respectable year?
Garland's ERA is perfectly respectable, his WL stats are very good because he's on the second highest scoring team in the AL
And Meche plays for the Mariners:p
The Miz
09-14-2006, 07:31 PM
Garland is a #4 pitcher. Find me some #1, #2, or #3 pitchers with half as many strikeouts as innings. You don't have to strikeout guys to be a good pitcher, but ALL great pitchers strike guys out. Garland has never struck guys out, even in Fluke-Season-Hall-of-Fame candidate 2005, and that's why he never has been and never will be a great pitcher. Giving up less than 374634590 hits every year would help too.
And plus, he has zero saves, he doesn't help his team win as much as say, Bobby Jenks. But, he has 20-win potential.
Dragon
09-14-2006, 07:50 PM
I would put Chien-Ming Wang as a good #3 (decent #2). He certainly has been the #2 on the Yankees staff this year and he only has 65 SO while 200 IP. He goes deep into games most of the time and limits his pitch count with the fact that he doesn't strike many people out and gets the double play balls a lot. I would take him as a #2 or #3 on my team anyday even without getting the strike-outs.
The Miz
09-14-2006, 09:10 PM
Let's wait till Wang has more than one good season. I doubt he can have a ERA in the mid 3's over the next 5 or so years if he continues to strikeout so few.
The Miz
09-14-2006, 10:05 PM
Joey Slugs I can't decide what offends me more, the neg rep or the fact that you called me a prink
The only thing impressive about Garland is his wins.
DaveWadding
09-14-2006, 11:46 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2588223
PHOENIX -- In what became the Arizona Diamondbacks' signature moment, Luis Gonzalez joyfully hopped down the first-base line and into the hearts of Valley sports fans.
Gonzalez produced the most memorable moment in the nine-year-old team's history -- the bloop single off New York Yankees closer Mariano Rivera in the ninth inning of Game 7 that drove in the winning run in the 2001 World Series. It remains the state's only major sports championship.
Throw in his career batting statistics -- he's the team's all-time leader in hits (1,325), home runs (224) and RBI (772) -- and it's easy to see why Gonzalez became the club's most popular player.
But that's why it was so difficult for the club to say goodbye Thursday. During a breakfast meeting on a day off for the team, the Diamondbacks told the 39-year-old left fielder they will not bring him back for a ninth season in 2007.
Then they called a somber Chase Field news conference to break the news to everyone else.
"Obviously, this is a very difficult day for the organization," general manager Josh Byrnes said. "Gonzo's done about everything you can in this market as a player and as a person.
"Change isn't easy, but we feel very good about the cast that will continue to wear the uniform," Byrnes said.
Byrnes said Eric Byrnes, who has played center field this year, would become the club's everyday left fielder next season. Chris Young, who was recently promoted from Triple-A Tucson, will take over in center. Another rookie, Carlos Quentin, is penciled in for right field.
The club had not been expected to exercise its $10 million option on Gonzalez for 2007. But Gonzalez had said he would be open to discussing a new contract that would allow him to return for a ninth season in Arizona, even at a reduced price.
"I want to stay here," Gonzalez said this week. "There's no secret about that. I don't have any control over it."
Team officials said Gonzalez approached the club recently and asked if a decision could be made soon so he could begin saying goodbyes if he weren't in the team's plans. Managing partner Jeff Moorad, a former player agent who negotiated Gonzalez' present contract, said the club respected Gonzalez' wishes.
"I think more than anything, Gonzo desired clarity," Moorad said. "Would it have been our preference to wait until the end of the season? Of course. I think there was a legitimate need for clarification. We didn't want to play games or mislead our fan base or Luis.
"We'll miss Luis more than we can really express in words," Moorad said.
Gonzalez is expected to speak to reporters before Friday night's home game against Colorado.
The Diamondbacks have seven home games remaining, beginning with a three-game weekend series against Colorado Friday through Sunday. The team finishes the regular season with four games against San Diego Sept. 28-Oct. 1.
Though Gonzalez had held out hope that a new deal could be reached, team officials said they declined to open negotiations.
"This isn't a financial decision," Moorad said. "This is a decision about the long-term success of our ballclub."
Neither Moorad nor Byrnes would describe Gonzalez's reaction to the news. But Moorad said the organization asked Gonzalez to consider taking a position in the broadcast booth or in a coaching capacity after he retires.
"It's not an easy thing to end a relationship," Moorad said. "We made it clear to Luis this morning that there would be nothing better, in our view, than to have him come back to us at the end of his playing career, whenever that might be, and to be part of our organization for the long term, whether it's in the broadcast booth or whether it's on the field in some capacity."
The Diamondbacks acquired Gonzalez from Detroit after their debut season in 1998, and he went on to become the franchise leader in every major batting category. He hit 57 homers with 142 RBI in 2001.
Gonzalez is batting .277 with 15 home runs and 71 RBI this year.
On Tuesday night, Gonzalez became the oldest player in baseball history to hit 50 doubles in a season. He has 545 career doubles, 20th on the all-time list. Gonzalez has received a standing ovation after each milestone double at home this year.
Club officials know many fans won't be happy with the decision. But they hope fans will accept the team's long-range plan even as they're saying goodbye to a favorite player.
"This wasn't easy," Byrnes said. "Looking at a player of this magnitude, and how and when he parts ways with a franchise, there aren't many stories of a smooth transition."
Copyright 2006 by The Associated Press
___________________
Fuck I hate Eric Byrnes.
dablackguy
09-15-2006, 01:35 AM
Let's wait till Wang has more than one good season. I doubt he can have a ERA in the mid 3's over the next 5 or so years if he continues to strikeout so few.
I have to agree here. It would be fine if he didn't strikeout a ton, but he has to strikeout much more than he has. (65 in 200 innings) It cuts both ways, if he continues like that with no change he could continue to be good, or he could be Jake Westbrook. Its really a bit of luck involved.
I just hope Wang isn't another Chacon
RoXer
09-15-2006, 11:19 PM
So, wheres a good place for Gonzalez? He mentioned he wanted to be on a winning team, not on the Devil Rays. But I don't see any contending team that really needs him.
It's a shame too because he's got a few more good years left in him.
DaveWadding
09-15-2006, 11:21 PM
In purple & teal.
Oh...wait...:wavesad:
Jesus Shuttlesworth
09-15-2006, 11:24 PM
Papelbon offically shut it down for the season
Finishes with a .92 ERA...Guess theres a lot of talk of him becoming a starter next season.
weather vane
09-16-2006, 01:27 AM
red sox need to win both games tomorrow and twins need to lose
KEEP THE FAITH
BCWWF
09-16-2006, 04:09 AM
The ESPN headline said Papelbon wants to start next year, but didn't read the article. Probably makes sense, a good starter is probably more valuable than a good closer.
Evil Vito
09-16-2006, 09:54 AM
<font color=goldenrod>With the way Papelbon pitched this year I don't really see how you don't make him a starter. Do whatever you have to to keep him.</font>
YOUR Hero
09-16-2006, 12:32 PM
Gonzalez still has some pretty damned good numbers. I hope he continues to play.
( Gonzalez is batting .277 with 15 home runs and 71 RBI this year. )
Yknow I've never heard Gonzo come up in the steroid debate over the years, that season he had in 1999 was something else. I love the guy anyway so i'm not peaved:D
DaveWadding
09-16-2006, 04:16 PM
Yknow I've never heard Gonzo come up in the steroid debate over the years, that season he had in 1999 was something else. I love the guy anyway so i'm not peaved:D
you mean 2001? ;)
Yes:o
The year they (he!!!) beat us in WS, thankyou David.
Pretty ridiculous that I like the guy given what he did:-\
Hardkore Kidd J
09-16-2006, 08:15 PM
Papelbon offically shut it down for the season
Finishes with a .92 ERA...Guess theres a lot of talk of him becoming a starter next season.
The guy is really awesome but I'm not too sure about Papelbon being a starter. I mean if I was a Red Sox fan I would have a little bad feeling about a closer turning into a starter. I can't imagine it working out.Take my team I just can't see Mariano Rivera pitching 6-7 innings. And I can't really picture Papelbon doing it either. Pitching 1-2 innings as a closer is one thing it's a completely different story when they're asked too play 5 or 6 innings.
RoXer
09-16-2006, 08:38 PM
What
Wasn't he normally a starter though?
Hardkore Kidd J
09-16-2006, 08:48 PM
What
Wasn't he normally a starter though?
He was? If he was sorry. I have no idea what he was on the farm team before he joined the Red Sox.
YOUR Hero
09-16-2006, 09:09 PM
Here come the Blue Jays
RoXer
09-16-2006, 09:11 PM
The following people are not afraid of the Chicago White Sox if the Oakland Athletics have to face them in the playoffs:
RoXer
09-16-2006, 09:11 PM
Me
The Miz
09-16-2006, 09:41 PM
I like Oakland in the playoffs against Detroit and Chicago, a series with New York could go either way but I think Minnesota would destroy them. As long as they avoid the Twins they're good.
Jesus Shuttlesworth
09-16-2006, 10:24 PM
Yeah Papelbon was a starter before so its all gravy
I still like having a LIGHTS OUT closer after dealing with Foulke (even when he was good he was still giving up like pop outs to the warning track and shit and I cant take that) so they gotta address that sitatution, I bet the Red Sox spend a ton of money this season because the backlash from this medicore finish is definetly going to be big deal.
YOUR Hero
09-16-2006, 10:54 PM
there are no worthy free agent closers this off season. Wagner is about it and people state he couldn't handle the Boston scene. I dunno, if a rookie can, why couldn't he? Mind you, he's not the same guy he was 3 or so years ago.
BCWWF
09-17-2006, 12:25 AM
Starting pitchers out in the bullpen is something that should be done more often. Johan Santana and Francisco Liriano are two good examples, they got their control down in the pen and then were both dominant once coming out as starters. Then you have guys like Matt Garza and Scott Baker who have both stuggled trying to jump up to the majors as starters. It seems like it would make a certain amount of sense for more teams to try that.
RoXer
09-17-2006, 06:03 PM
Question: What is the record for most pitches in one AB?
YOUR Hero
09-17-2006, 07:39 PM
what did you just witness?
RoXer
09-17-2006, 07:47 PM
I dunno, what?
YOUR Hero
09-17-2006, 10:00 PM
huh?
I would assume if you're asking that question, you just witnessed a very long at bat.
RoXer
09-17-2006, 10:08 PM
Yeah like 13 pitches, but I'm sure theres more than that right?
OssMan
09-17-2006, 11:25 PM
There was one at bat a long time ago where this guy was really pissed off at his manager and back then I guess the managers had to pay for all the balls that were being used so this guy fouled off like 30 pitches just to make his manager pay
Joey Slugs
09-18-2006, 04:57 PM
I saw Matt Clement threw close to 20 pitches in an at-bat to Alex Cora in 2004. Cora hit a solo HR on the 21st pitch (I think).
I would imagine that the record has to be more than that. Maybe around 25-30 in one at bat during a regular season game. Do they even keep that stat?
BCWWF
09-18-2006, 08:40 PM
I'm sure it is somewhere, and The Miz is really late in telling us what it is.
DaveWadding
09-18-2006, 08:55 PM
I saw Matt Clement threw close to 20 pitches in an at-bat to Alex Cora in 2004. Cora hit a solo HR on the 21st pitch (I think).
I remember that.
Fenix122
09-18-2006, 09:07 PM
if the Mets don't clinch tonight i'm going to stab somebody....
Jesus Shuttlesworth
09-18-2006, 10:57 PM
The Portland Seadogs won the Double A Eastern League championship WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
OssMan
09-18-2006, 10:57 PM
Mets ho
OssMan
09-18-2006, 11:16 PM
hey David Wright and Jose Reyes high fived the fans in the front row after they clinched. I think they need a talking to
Nervous Ferret
09-18-2006, 11:49 PM
Lakewood BluClaws won the South Atlantic Division Championship the other day
'Claws > Seadogs
RoXer
09-19-2006, 12:17 AM
I'm not sure about the Tucson Sidewinders in the playoffs but they > than you
DaveWadding
09-19-2006, 01:31 AM
Fucking A. The Rox scored 20 runs tonight :eek:
Joey Slugs
09-19-2006, 03:28 PM
No mention of what the Dodgers did last night? Holy shit.
One of the greatest comebacks in history.
Jesus Shuttlesworth
09-19-2006, 06:27 PM
Nomar Garciaparra is the greatest baseball player to ever live
dablackguy
09-19-2006, 06:50 PM
Nomar Garciaparra is the greatest baseball player to ever constantly be injured
:)
dablackguy
09-19-2006, 06:53 PM
there are no worthy free agent closers this off season. Wagner is about it and people state he couldn't handle the Boston scene. I dunno, if a rookie can, why couldn't he? Mind you, he's not the same guy he was 3 or so years ago.
Gagne is a free agent this year along with these I'm pretty sure of:
Baez
Dotel(who's coming off injury but has closing experience)
I'm probably foorgetting someone, I think i am
Dragon
09-19-2006, 07:15 PM
All three of those are pretty risky closers to have.
Gagne could be a good investment if he gets healthy, Baez is just bad and Dotel is coming off surgery like you said.
Dotel has been pretty bad in the limited time he has been able to pitch this year but I think he is just rusty. He needs some innings and hasn't gotten them from Torre, he never gets used really which is a shame because he could have been a big piece of the bullpen this postseason for the Yanks.
Especially with Villone basically dead. Had an ERA under 3 the first 4 months and then August rolled around and the innings caught him to him and he had an ERA of 6.04. He's given up 14 ERs in 4 innings this month as well, I'm pretty sure he is done helping this team this year. I dunno, pretty sure all my posts now turn into rants about the way the Yanks bullpen is managed lol
Evil Vito
09-19-2006, 10:19 PM
<font color=goldenrod>Metssssssssssssssssss :heart:
Haha @ tonight's lineup:
SS Anderson Hernandez
CF Endy Chavez
LF Lastings Milledge
3B Julio Franco
1B Michael Tucker
2B Chris Woodward
RF Ricky Ledee
C Mike DiFelice
...the ultimate "starters have hangovers" lineup :o
yet despite this they are winning</font> :cool:
Crippla
09-19-2006, 10:51 PM
Subway series. Yankees beat Mets in a repeat of the 2000 World Series.
FakeLaser
09-19-2006, 11:20 PM
Subway series. Yankees beat Mets in a repeat of the 2000 World Series.
Yes.
Joey Slugs
09-20-2006, 12:01 AM
Subway series. Yankees beat Mets in a repeat of the 2000 World Series.
I certainly fucking hope not. If the Sox don't make it, I would like to see Oakland or Minnesota against the Dodgers.
BCWWF
09-20-2006, 01:38 AM
OMG .5
This is insane
Dragon
09-20-2006, 11:58 AM
Hopefully the Twins take over the division lead so we get the Tigers first round.
Crippla
09-20-2006, 05:13 PM
I certainly fucking hope not. If the Sox don't make it, I would like to see Oakland or Minnesota against the Dodgers.
Red Sox won't even make the playoffs this year.
Dragon
09-20-2006, 05:46 PM
The other colored Sox.
Crippla
09-20-2006, 05:48 PM
Thw White Sox will probably make the wild card, I think Detroit will fall and won't make the playoffs at all.
FakeLaser
09-20-2006, 07:33 PM
No way, Detroit and Minnesota are both in, one way or the other.
Dragon
09-20-2006, 11:30 PM
And the Yankees clinch the East with the Twins beating Boston.
Jesus Shuttlesworth
09-21-2006, 12:16 AM
:(
The Miz
09-21-2006, 12:49 AM
Feliz Navidad, Red Sox!
The Miz
09-21-2006, 01:09 AM
Ok, I seriously think Frank Thomas is the MVP of the AL. The amount of time he has single-handedly been the offense for them is ridiculous. He is also the only MVP candidate without an MVP level player(s) batting before or after him--Jeter has ARod and Giambi, Big Roidi has Manny, Dye has Thome and Konerko, Morneau has Mauer (Mauer being MVP level is a stretch but I( think Santana is way more valuable to the Twins than Morneau is anyway). Eric Chavez, Jay Payton and Nick Swisher are certainly above average players but not near the protection of the aforementioned guys. Also, he's been hottest at the end of the season. .329 AVG, 1.185 OPS, 10 HR in September.
Also Ortiz is a fag
BCWWF
09-21-2006, 01:42 AM
One of my friends today was asking me about who I thought should be MVP. I said Santana, of course he scoffed, but of the five guys (Dye, Ortiz, Jeter, Morneau, Santana) I think he is. So Santana is out since he is a pitcher, I still just couldn't say that Morneau is the MVP. I don't think he is the MVP of the Twins (Santana) and he isn't the best hitter in the league (Ortiz would probably still qualify for this I guess)
I am pretty sure Jeter will be the MVP. Morneau was one of the three best offensive players of the year this year (Ortiz, Hafner, Morneau - IMO), but the Yankees faught through all of that adversity and are such an amazing team that Jeter deserves the lifetime achievement award for being their best player (hint of sarcasm). I personally would rather see Jeter win it than Ortiz or Thome or A-Rod or one of those guys, but I would hardly call him the most valuable player in the American League.
Also, it is officially over for the White Sox now. The magic number for the Twins is at six with 11 games left. So if the Twins can win three of those and the White Sox lose three, it is over. I would be shocked if the Twins haven't clinched it by the last weekend. That also means that Detroit would have to completely fall off, likely lose 10-of-12 games to fuck this up.
The White Sox have underperformed throughout the whole second half, but excuses like a talented pitching staff and Detroit being a fluke have kept it close.
Joey Slugs
09-21-2006, 01:09 PM
Red Sox won't even make the playoffs this year.
You need to pay attention son, I'm a White Sox fan.
dablackguy
09-21-2006, 01:42 PM
I am pretty sure Jeter will be the MVP.
I hope not, he doesn't deserve it. The only reason anyone talks about him in the MVP race is because he plays in NY. If he played in KC or Minnesota or somewhere of that sort, no one would even mention him in the same breath as the MVP. Ortiz was right in a way, anyone could hit in that lineup. Not to say he's not talented, but its probably not hard to get hits when you have any combination of A-Rod, Giambi, Sheffield, Abreu etc behind you and Damon in front of you.
The AL MVP should probably be Justin Morneau, considering he's carried that team since about June. But it'll probably wind up being Jermaine Dye, who doesn't really deserve it as much, but will wind up getting it.
DominateR
09-21-2006, 05:41 PM
To all of you Detroit haters, I'd just like you to know that come the end of Oct. 1st, Detroit WILL be in...either as the Wild Card, or as the winners of the AL Central in the regular season...yes, Minnesota is only ½ a game behind, but all it would take would be about 5 nights where Minnesota loses and Detroit wins. I hope it doesn't come down to it, but if we have to rely on the White Sox to keep Minnesota at bay at the end of the season, then I wish them the best of luck
BCWWF
09-21-2006, 07:18 PM
I don't really get what you just said, but I really don't see the Twins losing five straight games anytime soon.
Crippla
09-21-2006, 07:32 PM
You need to pay attention son, I'm a White Sox fan.
Well I haven't read all of your posts or anything but the White Sox will probably get the Wildcard.
BCWWF
09-21-2006, 08:04 PM
I think they will make up 5.5 games in less than two weeks too :y:
Joey Slugs
09-21-2006, 08:26 PM
I think they will make up 5.5 games in less than two weeks too :y:
Um....
YOUR Hero
09-21-2006, 09:03 PM
BCWWF, is being sarcastic toward Crippla'
I too would state that Morneau is my candidate for MVP. Jeter has too much protection around him and even so, his numbers are not as impressive IMO as Morneau's. If the WSOX were in the playoffs, I'd be tempted to say Dye, same thing with Ortiz if the RSOX were in the playoffs. I just don't find Jeter's numbers all that impressive.
Crippla
09-21-2006, 09:08 PM
I can understand what you mean about Jeter and I still think the WSOX will make the wildcard and Detroit won't make the playoffs, Scot.
Joey Slugs
09-21-2006, 09:12 PM
BCWWF, is being sarcastic toward Crippla'
I know.
The Miz
09-21-2006, 10:01 PM
BCWWF, is being sarcastic toward Crippla'
I too would state that Morneau is my candidate for MVP. Jeter has too much protection around him and even so, his numbers are not as impressive IMO as Morneau's. If the WSOX were in the playoffs, I'd be tempted to say Dye, same thing with Ortiz if the RSOX were in the playoffs. I just don't find Jeter's numbers all that impressive.
What about Thomas? Numbers are jsut as good as Morneau's, on a playoff team... but he doesn't have the best pitcher of the 21st century on his team
BCWWF
09-21-2006, 10:43 PM
I don't know if you want to credit Cuddyer's improvement with playing inbetween Morneau and Mauer, but there is kind of an attitude that the Twins as usual don't have a good offense again. I don't know the statistics exactly, but in terms of batting average and those type, they were right up near the top. It is only the power numbers that the Twins are low in. So I wouldn't neccessarily say that Morneau is doing it in a weak lineup per se.
Jesus Shuttlesworth
09-21-2006, 11:59 PM
Ortiz breaks the Red Sox single season homerun record and Beckett throws 8 scoreless againest the Twins tonight. Good to see when they are out of it :(
Can't even watch baseball anymore I don't think, just makes me depressed
To all of you Detroit haters, I'd just like you to know that come the end of Oct. 1st, Detroit WILL be in...either as the Wild Card, or as the winners of the AL Central in the regular season...yes, Minnesota is only ½ a game behind, but all it would take would be about 5 nights where Minnesota loses and Detroit wins. I hope it doesn't come down to it, but if we have to rely on the White Sox to keep Minnesota at bay at the end of the season, then I wish them the best of luck
They'll be in, but they're out in the first round. Detroit is an average hitting team with above average pitching that won't help them because Oakland, Minnesota, and New York all have better pitching.
The Miz
09-22-2006, 07:15 PM
Harden is so key for Oakland. If he doesn't start or starts with a low pitch count against Minnesota they will be swept. Harden is the only pitcher on their staff who can beat Santana, and they're likely going to have to face him twice.
Gertner
09-22-2006, 07:40 PM
btw Miz have you checked Blanton's stats lately? none too impressive :)
OssMan
09-22-2006, 07:40 PM
jays arent gonna fade
Gertner
09-22-2006, 07:43 PM
Jays are gonna fuck up Boston like they usually do
YOUR Hero
09-22-2006, 09:59 PM
What about Thomas? Numbers are jsut as good as Morneau's, on a playoff team... but he doesn't have the best pitcher of the 21st century on his team
Yeah good point. I overlooked him for some reason.
BCWWF
09-22-2006, 10:13 PM
I think that the A's are kind of overlooked, like they are the worst of the likely playoff teams. I don't know if I agree with that, but I think because they are on the west coast and because the AL West is probably the weakest of the three divisions, he gets unfairly overlooked.
BCWWF
09-22-2006, 10:48 PM
Alright Twins, lets get the bad play overwith right now, can't let it carry into the playoffs.
RoXer
09-23-2006, 01:07 AM
Chris Young 8 innings into a no-no.
RoXer
09-23-2006, 01:15 AM
nvm :(
I was rootin for him too.
DominateR
09-23-2006, 01:16 AM
They'll be in, but they're out in the first round. Detroit is an average hitting team with above average pitching that won't help them because Oakland, Minnesota, and New York all have better pitching.
Time will tell, but I personally can see where Detroit would take it all this year--they've been waiting 19 years to get back to the playoffs, and are now only 2 games from a guaranteed playoff spot, regardless of whether they win the AL Central. It's time a Detroit team took some initiative and said "Enough is enough. 22 years without a title is too long. We're mad as hell and we're not going to take it anymore!", and then actually did what everyone is calling impossible, and that's winning the [World] Series this year.
Oh, and with Polanco being back in the starting rotation tomorrow's game @ KC (activated from DL today), he will give the Tigers a much needed kick in the pants from now through Oct. 1st, and quite possibly throughout their playoff run...
BCWWF
09-23-2006, 01:40 AM
The thing about Detroit is that they are a lot like the White Sox of last year, and if their starting pitching comes back a little bit they should be the favorites. The reason why Detroit was so amazing in the first half was because Verlander and Kenny Rogers and the rest of the guys were all unhittable. If the pitching is like it has been the last month or so, they are 1-and-out, but if it comes back they should win it all.
DominateR
09-23-2006, 02:03 AM
The thing about Detroit is that they are a lot like the White Sox of last year, and if their starting pitching comes back a little bit they should be the favorites. The reason why Detroit was so amazing in the first half was because Verlander and Kenny Rogers and the rest of the guys were all unhittable. If the pitching is like it has been the last month or so, they are 1-and-out, but if it comes back they should win it all.
But you completely missed my point. since mid-August when Polanco went on the DL, look at how poorly the Tigers have played WITHOUT JUST THIS ONE PLAYER. Now, I'm not gonna say that they haven't been producing as much offense as the should have in some of those games or that we havent had some sloppy gameplay or pitching. But I'd be willing to bet that Placido Polanco will be a MAJOR factor in the playoffs for Detroit IF he can stay healthy the whole time.
RoXer
09-23-2006, 03:06 AM
Impact player will provide an impact if he plays.
I'm willing to bet so too. :y:
BCWWF
09-23-2006, 04:31 AM
I think Bonderman, Verlander, Johnson and Rogers will be more important than Polanco if the Tigers make the playoffs.
The Miz
09-23-2006, 10:12 AM
btw Miz have you checked Blanton's stats lately? none too impressive :)
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BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>16</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>11</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>30</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>30</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>1</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>1</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>0</TD><TD class=xl27 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>184.0</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>227</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>97</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>17</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>56</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>100</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num="4.7445652173913047" x:fmla="=9*(K2)/I2">4.74</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num="1.5380434782608696" x:fmla="=SUM(M2, J2)/I2">1.54</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num="4.8913043478260869" x:fmla="=9*(N2)/I2">4.89</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num="1.7857142857142858" x:fmla="=N2/M2">1.79</TD></TR><TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; HEIGHT: 12.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" height=17>Gustavo Chacin</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>8</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>3</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>15</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>15</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>0</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>0</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>0</TD><TD class=xl27 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num="77.665999999999997">77.7</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>77</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>42</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>17</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>35</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>42</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num="4.8669945664769658" x:fmla="=9*(K3)/I3">4.87</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num="1.4420724641413232" x:fmla="=SUM(M3, J3)/I3">1.44</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num="4.8669945664769658" x:fmla="=9*(N3)/I3">4.87</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num x:fmla="=N3/M3">1.20</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
You were wrong about Chacin being better than Blanton, again. You were wrong about the Jays winning the world series, again, or even the Jays making the playoffs, again, or even being in the hunt the second half of the season. You were wrong about Toronto being better than Oakland, again. You have been wrong about everything you have ever said in your life. When will you realize this?
Evil Vito
09-23-2006, 10:12 AM
<font color=goldenrod>Ahh, it sure feels good to not have to be stressed about the Mets dropping 3 in a row again :cool:
They'd better end the season on a winning note though, need them to go into the playoffs hot.</font>
How the fuck have Seattle crept back up to nearly .500? If they were NL they'd probably be division champions by now
Apparently Sheff looked fairly decent at 1B last night. With Matsui and Sheff back, and presumably Giambi at DH, it looks like Melky will be taking a seat:-\
FakeLaser
09-23-2006, 01:22 PM
Sucks. Melky is by far our best defender out there. Damon has a decent glove (no arm) and Abreu is pretty good I guess (tentative though). Melky has a fucking cannon arm and is fearless though AND he's been hitting well. He's one of the guys who got us here.
Gertner
09-23-2006, 03:42 PM
<TABLE style="WIDTH: 586pt; BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=775 border=0 x:str><COLGROUP><COL style="WIDTH: 101pt; mso-width-source: userset; mso-width-alt: 4900" width=134><COL style="WIDTH: 25pt; mso-width-source: userset; mso-width-alt: 1206" span=7 width=33><COL style="WIDTH: 37pt; mso-width-source: userset; mso-width-alt: 1792" width=49><COL style="WIDTH: 29pt; mso-width-source: userset; mso-width-alt: 1389" span=2 width=38><COL style="WIDTH: 25pt; mso-width-source: userset; mso-width-alt: 1206" width=33><COL style="WIDTH: 29pt; mso-width-source: userset; mso-width-alt: 1389" span=2 width=38><COL style="WIDTH: 33pt; mso-width-source: userset; mso-width-alt: 1609" span=4 width=44><TBODY><TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 101pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; HEIGHT: 12.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=134 height=17></TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 25pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=33>W</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 25pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=33>L</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 25pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=33>G</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 25pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=33>GS</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 25pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=33>CG</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 25pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=33>SHO</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 25pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=33>SV</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 37pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=49>IP</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 29pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=38>H</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 29pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=38>ER</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 25pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=33>HR</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 29pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=38>BB</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 29pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=38>SO</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 33pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=44>ERA</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 33pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=44>WHIP</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 33pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=44>K/9</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; WIDTH: 33pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=44>K/BB</TD></TR><TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; HEIGHT: 12.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" height=17>Joe Blanton</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>16</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>11</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>30</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>30</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>1</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>1</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>0</TD><TD class=xl27 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>184.0</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>227</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>97</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>17</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>56</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>100</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num="4.7445652173913047" x:fmla="=9*(K2)/I2">4.74</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num="1.5380434782608696" x:fmla="=SUM(M2, J2)/I2">1.54</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num="4.8913043478260869" x:fmla="=9*(N2)/I2">4.89</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num="1.7857142857142858" x:fmla="=N2/M2">1.79</TD></TR><TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; HEIGHT: 12.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" height=17>Gustavo Chacin</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>8</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>3</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>15</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>15</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>0</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>0</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>0</TD><TD class=xl27 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num="77.665999999999997">77.7</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>77</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>42</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>17</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>35</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>42</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num="4.8669945664769658" x:fmla="=9*(K3)/I3">4.87</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num="1.4420724641413232" x:fmla="=SUM(M3, J3)/I3">1.44</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num="4.8669945664769658" x:fmla="=9*(N3)/I3">4.87</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-TOP: #c0c0c0; BORDER-LEFT: #c0c0c0; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c0c0c0; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num x:fmla="=N3/M3">1.20</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
You were wrong about Chacin being better than Blanton, again. You were wrong about the Jays winning the world series, again, or even the Jays making the playoffs, again, or even being in the hunt the second half of the season. You were wrong about Toronto being better than Oakland, again. You have been wrong about everything you have ever said in your life. When will you realize this?
after tonight, Chacin will have surpassed Blanton in era, further cementing the fact that he's better than Blanton
RoXer
09-23-2006, 06:19 PM
R0Xer1: oh man son of a bitch
R0Xer1: I just realized
R0Xer1: if the A's clinch, I'm going to have to buy a "2006 West Division Champs) t shirt
R0Xer1: and i dont have money :-(
R0Xer1: oh man
R0Xer1: if they win the WS
R0Xer1: I'll have to buy a bunch of shit
R0Xer1: damnit
YOUR Hero
09-23-2006, 07:35 PM
good thing you IM'd yourself that.
YOUR Hero
09-23-2006, 07:44 PM
If the Tigers make the playoffs, which they will, I'll be cheering them on all the way. Hero loves the underdog.
YOUR Hero
09-23-2006, 07:44 PM
PS, Burnett pitches tonight
Dragon
09-23-2006, 09:51 PM
Sucks. Melky is by far our best defender out there. Damon has a decent glove (no arm) and Abreu is pretty good I guess (tentative though). Melky has a fucking cannon arm and is fearless though AND he's been hitting well. He's one of the guys who got us here.
Yup, huge downgrade on defense with Matsui out there. Damon and Matsui have two of the weakest arms I have ever seen in my life. Not to mention Matsui never was the defensive wizard out there, seen him misjudge balls hit to him many times.
I can't even imagine how our defense will be out there when Damon/Matsui are in the tail end of their contracts.
YOUR Hero
09-23-2006, 10:41 PM
Guys, the AL is a very offensive league. Outfield defense is very low on the list of priorities. I would much rather have Matsui's bat in the lineup than Melky's defense. Besides, you can replace Matsui with Melky in a defensive moment of the game. As for Damon, well he's got a weak arm, but he gets a great jump/read off balls and catches many balls that other outfielders would not. That makes up for his weak arm. That's how I see it anyway.
Evil Vito
09-23-2006, 10:49 PM
I can't even imagine how our defense will be out there when Damon/Matsui are in the tail end of their contracts.
<font color=goldenrod>I'd wager that Matsui'll be DH'ing by that point</font>
BCWWF
09-23-2006, 11:01 PM
Yankees are going to fuck up all their chemistry and lose out in the ALDS.
WRITE IT DOWN
:shifty:
DominateR
09-24-2006, 12:04 AM
TIGERS 15, ROYALS 4, FINAL!
1 MORE WIN FOR DETROIT TO CLINCH THEIR FIRST PLAYOFF SPOT SINCE 1987!!!:drool::drool::drool:
But we're still gonna win the AL Central division title, and then take the pennant in the ALCS round of the playoffs, then the World Series. Oh it's true...:o:shifty::o
YOUR Hero
09-24-2006, 12:41 AM
Go Tigers. :y:
DominateR
09-24-2006, 12:56 AM
Go Tigers. :y:
Thanx 4 the support man, and your positive rep to me in your PM really helps greatly...I'm still not back at just 1 red dot yet, but I'll take being at 3 rather than 8 or 9 in the red anytime...:y: :cool:
Evil Vito
09-24-2006, 01:00 AM
<font color=goldenrod>Yeah I too will be pulling for the Tigers up until the WS if they have to clash with the Mets, my mom's b/f is a diehard Detroit fan plus its a fucking great story all around</font>
The Miz
09-24-2006, 02:19 AM
Detroit winning would suck because the already incredible amount of Jim leyland dick sucking would only multiply. It's getting tiring already
DominateR
09-24-2006, 02:37 AM
It wouldn't suck nearly as bad as a repeat of the 2000 New York (Yankees vs. Mets) Subway [World] Series ( :nono: ) tho...I've come to the conclusion that teams from N.Y. in baseball, especially the Damn Yankees, are evil...:yes:
Joey Slugs
09-24-2006, 03:40 AM
Since it doesn't look like the defending champs will make the playoffs... I will be silently rooting for the A's... and only because of Frank Thomas.
This is going to be a loooooooooooong offseason.
As far as I see it, the only guys that are guaranteed to come back next year are Dye, Thome, and Konerko.
This is going to suck. Serious.
At least the Bears have a good chance this year.
Gertner
09-24-2006, 09:57 AM
Another fine outing by Blanton
YOUR Hero
09-24-2006, 11:58 AM
Detroit winning would suck because the already incredible amount of Jim leyland dick sucking would only multiply. It's getting tiring already
If you look at all the teams that are in the playoffs, save for San Diego and Detroit (where I'm at) you hear tons of side stories and all that jazz. I hear nothing about Detroit, I hear nothing about San Diego. Through the whole season, people have been dismissing Detroit, very much like the WSOX where last year. You get lots of "yes but" when people talk about them. Shit, that there's the Padres. Nothing is spoken about them. In fact they are so overlooked that even I, a fan of theirs, completely forget about them.
BCWWF
09-24-2006, 02:55 PM
Detroit has gotten a lot of credit this year IMO, and a lot of people, including me, thought they were legit up until the last month or so. That might just be because we both play in the AL Central though.
To be honest, still the only teams that get a lot of coverage are the Yankees and Red Sox.
The Miz
09-24-2006, 03:04 PM
I don't mind Detroit coverage, it's much better than meaningless crap about ARod and Manny all the time. I just hate that all they ever talk about is Jim Leyland and how great he is. They don't attribute any of the success to the pitching, it's all because Jim Leyland waved his magic wand and "got them to play as a team" or some bullshit
YOUR Hero
09-24-2006, 04:09 PM
Now you know how many of us feel about hearing about Billy Bean... 'money ball'
BCWWF
09-24-2006, 04:35 PM
Lol. I remember when I said that Billy Beane was overrated and got attacked until I was bloody. I think he is one of the best GM's in the league, no doubt, but I think he could have signed some of his good players to longterm contracts before they were too expensive, a la Johan Santana in Minnesota for example. Now, after this season Joe Mauer and Justin Morneau will be locked up before they demand too much. That is why I think Terry Ryan is the best GM, Beane second.
Off tangent.
The Miz
09-24-2006, 04:50 PM
You are under the false impression that players are willing to sign contract extensions during the season. If you're Miguel Tejada and you're in the prime of your career with an MVP already under your belt, are you gonna sign Beane's so-so deal in the middle of the season or wait till after the season when Baltimore, Boston and Anaheim can all try to outbid eachother. The owners were not going to stretch the payroll to let Beane sign Tejada, and he was clearly more interested in money (Baltimore) than winning (Oakland). I don't know what more people wanted Billy Beane to do.
I will agree that he is overrated in the sense that he gets too much credit for the moves the A's made from 2001-2003. I think those moves were to the tribute of the team of Billy Beane, JP Ricciardi, Paul DePodesta, Dwayne Fuson etc. Now that those three guys are gone, Beane's moves haven't been nearly as good.
And Beane does way much more for the A's than Leyland does for the Tigers
BCWWF
09-24-2006, 05:37 PM
The Red Sox won the World Series once though, making Theo Epstien the best GM EVER!!!!!
Gertner
09-24-2006, 05:45 PM
Another win for Gustavo. Maybe he'll hold a pitching clinic during the off season and show Blanton how to finish a season strong :)
RoXer
09-24-2006, 06:11 PM
:)
RoXer
09-24-2006, 06:12 PM
That will be held after the A's hold a clinic on how to win a division
Gertner
09-24-2006, 06:41 PM
lol must be nice to play in a horseshit divison
RoXer
09-24-2006, 07:13 PM
We can't all be so lucky as the Blue Jays to have Baltimore and Tampa Bay in the same division.
RoXer
09-24-2006, 07:15 PM
Oh but theres New York and Boston too.
A's record against them: 12-6
YOUR Hero
09-24-2006, 07:20 PM
With todays loss, the Atlanta Braves have been eliminated from the playoffs for the first time in like 14 years. I've always kinda liked the Braves because of Dale Murphy and then in recent times Chipper Jones. Now I like a lot of teams over them, and it's about time to see fresh blood in the NL, but you can't but help feel sorry for a franchise that has so much success in the regular season, fail so miserably in the playoffs. All those years in the playoffs and only one World Series Victory.
BCWWF
09-24-2006, 07:22 PM
I am the same. I used to always like the Braves, but their time is done now.
Also, how long has Jamie Moyer been on the Phillies?
The Miz
09-24-2006, 08:08 PM
AL West > AL East. Baltimore and Tampa Bay are horshit. Only Seattle is horeshit in the west, that's half as many teams to beat up on. Oakland is absolutely better than Toronto no matter from what aspect you look at it. I'm sure Gertner thinks Toronto would win the west but people with brains realize this to be false.
RoXer
09-24-2006, 08:34 PM
http://i.a.cnn.net./si/multimedia/photo_gallery/0609/missed.it/images/missed_8.jpg
BCWWF
09-24-2006, 11:43 PM
I would say that Seattle is still > Baltimore and Tampa Bay
Jesus Shuttlesworth
09-24-2006, 11:47 PM
Yeah I honestly don't even know why you guys listen to Gertner anymore, he just says stupid shit to piss you off.
Jesus Shuttlesworth
09-24-2006, 11:48 PM
I am sure he is going to post now about how the Blue Jays are better than the Red Sox - even though the Red Sox shut it down about 5 weeks ago at this point.
YOUR Hero
09-25-2006, 02:15 AM
Stima, think Manny will be back with the BOSOX next year?
BCWWF
09-25-2006, 02:05 PM
I don't in a way, because I think the Red Sox are going to start a new generation with basically Ortiz from the World Series team, but at the same time, is anybody going to take on Manny? I could see him ending up somewhere like the Braves, the Angels or like randomly Philadelphia or something, but I think the Red Sox are going to get some new blood in there behind Ortiz.
FakeLaser
09-25-2006, 08:53 PM
I think Manny will actually be gone for once. Probably to the Angels for the Figgins/Santana/Shields package which would be pretty good for the Sox.
BCWWF
09-25-2006, 09:17 PM
Can you imagine how much Miz would love the Red Sox if they had Figgins? IMO that would be one hell of a deal for the Red Sox, Santana is a solid starter and Shields can help any bullpen.
FakeLaser
09-25-2006, 09:24 PM
That's the deal that was RUMORED would be put together for A-Rod (who isn't going anywhere most likely, unless he has the worst postseason of all time), so I'm assuming that's about what they'd offer the Sox. They'd take it, especially since Figgins kills the Yankees.
BCWWF
09-25-2006, 09:40 PM
The only place that A-Rod can be is the Yankees, IMO. It won't be any better playing really well for a bad team, because he still has his contract. I also don't see why a small market team would take him. He is a great player, but it would have to be a huge price for a publicity stunt by like Kansas City or Pittsburgh or Milwaukee.
Until he gets rid of that contract, he can only play in the biggest market.
Dragon
09-25-2006, 09:44 PM
Yeah, A-Rod won't be going anywhere. He has the no-trade clause and I can't see him lifting it really, no matter how much shit he gets in NY. I don't want to see him anywhere else either.
As for Manny, if he goes anywhere I think it'd be the Angels. A big bat is their biggest need, but I still don't know if the Red Sox would pull off a deal.
The Miz
09-25-2006, 09:53 PM
lol Manny/Figgins/Vlad. Like seriously worst defensive OF of all time
Jesus Shuttlesworth
09-25-2006, 10:04 PM
Yeah Manny will probably be traded since I just got one of those tshirt jerseys with his name on the back haha, always happens
The Miz
09-25-2006, 10:16 PM
I think/hope the Angels will be stupid enough to try to get Manny. Moreno is already putting pressure on Stoneman to make some big changes this offseason, most importantly to the offense. And I know Moreno would love Manny. I would imagine it would cost Ervin Santana, Joe Saunders and Dallas MacPherson.
As far as the rest of the Angels,
definately gone:
Tim Salmon
Adam Kennedy
Brendan Donnelly
Darin Erstad
Chone Figgins
BCWWF
09-25-2006, 10:37 PM
What is Darin Erstads deal? He has been linked in Twins rumors for a long time. I wonder if he could be like a defensive replacement first baseman or something.
Also, I just remembered the rumor from ESPN.com earlier this season that the Twins were going to trade Morneau for Koskie straight up.
The Miz
09-25-2006, 10:59 PM
Anyone who gives Erstad regular playing time is insane. He has had ONE good season in his career, and it was 6 years ago. He is useless with the bat, late-inning-defensive-replacement only.
samichna
09-25-2006, 11:00 PM
I am sure he is going to post now about how the Blue Jays are better than the Red Sox - even though the Red Sox shut it down about 5 weeks ago at this point.
BLUE JAYZ RULE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Jesus Shuttlesworth
09-25-2006, 11:06 PM
Now that I think about I don't think the Red Sox are going to trade Manny. I dunno why they would, he had a good season and its not like he was doing his typcial shithead stuff either so I don't know. Unless they can get really good pitching for him I don't really see the point.
Dragon
09-25-2006, 11:32 PM
What does he have left on his contract? Just two years I think? That would be the logical reason, trying to get something back for him with only two years left. Not even sure if it is two years but thats what I thought I heard.
Dragon
09-25-2006, 11:36 PM
With 4 at-bats tonight, Robinson Cano qualifies for the league leaders in AVG. He's at .342 now with Jeter right behind at .340
Cano has the better chance of catching Mauer because his AVG will go up more with a couple hits. But Mauer doesn't seem to stop hitting so it would be tough.
Jesus Shuttlesworth
09-25-2006, 11:38 PM
Yeah I think so, I dunno they gotta do something. Pretty disappointed about this past season (obviously) can't even watch the game cuz I just get depressed seeing positional players with #'s in the 60's
Dragon
09-25-2006, 11:44 PM
Gonna be pretty interesting to see what they do in the offseason. Gotta assume they will do some pretty big moves.
BCWWF
09-25-2006, 11:47 PM
Justin Morneau 3-run homer to ice it in the eighth, THE TWINS ARE GOING TO THE PLAYOFFS BABY!
Gertner
09-26-2006, 01:15 AM
I am sure he is going to post now about how the Blue Jays are better than the Red Sox - even though the Red Sox shut it down about 5 weeks ago at this point.
scoreboard
Gertner
09-26-2006, 01:16 AM
AL West > AL East. Baltimore and Tampa Bay are horshit. Only Seattle is horeshit in the west, that's half as many teams to beat up on. Oakland is absolutely better than Toronto no matter from what aspect you look at it. I'm sure Gertner thinks Toronto would win the west but people with brains realize this to be false.
Toronto would dominate the west :)
RoXer
09-26-2006, 01:27 AM
West: 17-18 :)
RoXer
09-26-2006, 02:07 AM
Oh fucking A's
Cooler Tom Schuler
09-26-2006, 03:01 AM
Joey RoXer, would you be interested in an AL postseason avatar bet? I know we have some Yankees and Tigers supporters around too to join in.
And yes, I'm operating under the assumption that Oakland won't choke and miss the playoffs.
RoXer
09-26-2006, 03:03 AM
Nah. After I have to switch to Cards or Cowboys or UofA
Enough about fucking Toronto already. They aren't making the playoffs just like the Red Sox, so their season isn't better than anybody else's.
Gertner
09-26-2006, 12:40 PM
We'll be back
Joey Slugs
09-26-2006, 01:35 PM
Congrats to the Tigers and Twins on making the playoffs. It was a tough fucking season in baseball's best division.
Jesus Shuttlesworth
09-26-2006, 05:13 PM
We'll be back
lol Red Sox just had one of the most disappointing finishes in like the last 6 years and still have a good chance of having a better record than the Jays.
The Miz
09-26-2006, 08:25 PM
jays arent gonna fade.
Jesus Shuttlesworth
09-26-2006, 11:40 PM
Gonna be pretty interesting to see what they do in the offseason. Gotta assume they will do some pretty big moves.
Yeah I dunno what they are going to do though
The Miz
09-26-2006, 11:49 PM
ok natureboycv
Tedy Bruschi
09-26-2006, 11:56 PM
The Yankees will win the AL hands down.
Tedy Bruschi
09-26-2006, 11:57 PM
I'm thinking a repeat of the Subway Series in 2000.
Jesus Shuttlesworth
09-27-2006, 12:30 AM
ok natureboycv
haha no but I mean, I really have no idea what possibles are even out there, I haven't heard much outside of a few trades involving Manny Ramirez which I don't see happening personally.
Joey Slugs
09-27-2006, 12:31 AM
My future "home" team is now only 1.5 GB from St. Louis. Watch out for the hot roll into the playoffs.
dablackguy
09-27-2006, 12:41 AM
haha no but I mean, I really have no idea what possibles are even out there, I haven't heard much outside of a few trades involving Manny Ramirez which I don't see happening personally.
To start, there's only a few places Manny could actually go because there are only a few places that can afford the money. I do think, if he gets moved, he's only going to one place:
The New York Mets.
They've wanted him in the past and probably still do. They're willing to deal with 'Manny being Manny' and most importantly can take on the money. It helps that Manny lives in NYC because he'd at least semi want to be here. The Red Sox would probably want some combination of prospects and major league players probably starting with Milledge and going from there, but that's a deal I could see being done.
As for the Sox, I really believe this was an anomoly year. Wells and Clement got hurt early. Wakefield and Trot Nixon got hurt later on (which goes 2 fold because they would have gotten Abreu if Nixon had gone down sooner) Beckett isn't going to give up 30 some odd home runs again. Schilling should be solid with Beckett, Wakefield, Clement and Papelbon/whomever is going to be the #5
YOUR Hero
09-27-2006, 01:51 AM
You guys that rag on Toronto 'fading' seem to have conveniently forgotten that they used AAA pitching far too much this season due to injuries.
BCWWF
09-27-2006, 02:04 AM
Assuming neither Toronto or Boston goes crazy in the offseason, I think they are both going to be pretty even teams next season. Toronto can add a FA to take Shea Hillenbrands money and hope AJ Burnett gets healthy. Boston will probably do some trading, but Beckett will be back and probably a bit better. It will be an interesting offseason in the AL East.
RoXer
09-27-2006, 02:04 AM
Woo Hooooo WoooHoHooooo
Woo Hooooo WoooHoHooooo
Woo Hooooo WoooHoHooooo
Woo Hooooo WoooHoHooooo
Woo Hooooo
Woo Hooooo
Woo Hooooo WoooHoHooooo
Joey Slugs
09-27-2006, 02:54 AM
Congrats RoXer.
RoXer
09-27-2006, 02:56 AM
Thank you. I did my best and I knew I would give it my all to help in this great achievement.
Joey Slugs
09-27-2006, 02:58 AM
:lol:
BCWWF
09-27-2006, 04:28 AM
Lol, that is what I said when all of my Chicago friends were saying that to me.
The thing is, I haven't met a White Sox fan who is an ass hole really. Like, the guys that I meet love the White Sox, they cheer them on, but it's not irrational. They have conceded that the team kind of fell apart, didn't make bad excuses, just said "next year." I have to respect that, especially coming from a place with a lot of Cardinals fans. When St. Louis loses out on the playoffs, they are all going to be such ass holes and have so many excuses. I will document them on here when it happens.
Cards fans can't get over the fact that they're no longer even remotely the best NL (let alone MLB) team anymore, despite still having the big names and the sunday night ESPN slots
Jesus Shuttlesworth
09-27-2006, 11:11 AM
Really? I heard stories when the Red Sox won the Series in St. Louis the Cardinals fans where like patting Red Sox fans on the back and shit. If St. Louis won the series in Boston, Cardinals fans would be getter there asses kicked on Lansdowne Street
Joey Slugs
09-27-2006, 01:11 PM
Lol, that is what I said when all of my Chicago friends were saying that to me.
The thing is, I haven't met a White Sox fan who is an ass hole really. Like, the guys that I meet love the White Sox, they cheer them on, but it's not irrational. They have conceded that the team kind of fell apart, didn't make bad excuses, just said "next year." I have to respect that, especially coming from a place with a lot of Cardinals fans. When St. Louis loses out on the playoffs, they are all going to be such ass holes and have so many excuses. I will document them on here when it happens.
Oh go fuck yo... :lol:
Yeah. There is nothing we can do but wait for next year. We still have a hell of a team but it got away from us. Plus... the Twins and Tigers played amazing fucking ball this season.
BCWWF
09-27-2006, 01:56 PM
The Cardinals fans have a reputation for being "great fans" in terms of at the games, like cheering for the other team on a good play and stuff, but people from St. Louis are really cocky and single-minded about their teams, and they are annoying as shit.
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