Ratings Thread

[Sepholio]

Wonder what huge announcement/HAWT free agent he'll have on for us next week to try and win the ratings war?

[Mr. Nerfect]

Bo Dallas. We’ve got a few months until Nick Nemeth can come out and swivel his hips around, finally free and finally able to be good now.

[Mr. Nerfect]

I said Bo Dallas, but I probably should have gone with a different Social Outcast. Heath Slater’s Impact Wrestling/TNA/GFW deal has expired and he’s now a free agent. But, I’m not going to lie…this one could actually be a game-changer.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Ronda Rousey is probably still technically under contract or has some sort of no-compete, but she’s a “big star” Tony would probably try to lure if he could.

[xrodmuc316]

So Collision, with a main event they could have sold at least 150,000 PPVs for, that they gave away for free didn't even get 500,000 viewers. And Tiny wants us to believe he is a good businessman :rofl::rofl::rofl:

[Mr. Nerfect]

I mean, it’s not a surprise. They’ve fucked around fans so much. Kenny Omega is the most overrated wrestler ever (usurping Triple H). The build was terrible for a match you knew was coming for, I dunno…ABOUT A FUCKING YEAR! Not sure if doing longest reigning champion stories is a good idea when you’ve got Roman Reigns and Gunther on the other side. Plus, not caring about this match was probably a big indicator to wrestling fans that they don’t care about AEW.

[Mr. Nerfect]

We’re due for another meltdown. Come on, Tony — coke on.

[xrodmuc316]

832,000 for the massively hyped Dynamite featuring Tiny Khan telling us we can signup to buy tickets for a show 8 months from now. Time to sign a new toy wi...OH RIC FLAIR SIGNED A MULTI YEAR DEAL WITH AEW WOOOOOOOOOOOO GAME CHANGER!!!!!

[Sepholio]

AEWOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

[Mr. Nerfect]

Fucking lol

[Vastardikai]

832,000 for the massively hyped Dynamite featuring Tiny Khan telling us we can signup to buy tickets for a show 8 months from now. Time to sign a new toy wi...OH RIC FLAIR SIGNED A MULTI YEAR DEAL WITH AEW WOOOOOOOOOOOO GAME CHANGER!!!!!

AEWTF...

[Mr. Nerfect]

804k for Dynamite. More like Trynarite. Like trynarite the ship.

[Mr. Nerfect]

It’s not even news that AEW does under 850k now.

[Splaya]

I think the better prediction is when will AEW crack one million again.

[xrodmuc316]

I think the better prediction is when will AEW crack one million again.

Never

[Mr. Nerfect]

Serious prediction: Jan 3 2024 for the aftermath of Worlds End + the “payoff” to the MJF contract storyline.

[Ben Rodrigues]

Where does MJF fit in within the WWE? I imagine hes got to come in as a heel.

[Sepholio]

Antihero if where MJF needs to be. The asshole everyone loves.

[Destor]

Thats a baby face

[Mr. Nerfect]

It’d be cool if he was in the Royal Rumble. Could be a great debut if he is the last guy eliminated by Cody. OR, just go totally nuts and have him win. MJF gets to tease Cody about interrupting his story. Roman vs. MJF has got…potential. It’d be the fastest rise for anyone, that’s for sure.

That’s unnecessary though. But I see MJF as a value add to Raw, giving more people that reason to watch.

[Ben Rodrigues]

Antihero if where MJF needs to be. The asshole everyone loves.

Is that what he is now? From the limited clips I've seen it seems quite cringey.

[Ben Rodrigues]

It’d be cool if he was in the Royal Rumble. Could be a great debut if he is the last guy eliminated by Cody. OR, just go totally nuts and have him win. MJF gets to tease Cody about interrupting his story. Roman vs. MJF has got…potential. It’d be the fastest rise for anyone, that’s for sure.

That’s unnecessary though. But I see MJF as a value add to Raw, giving more people that reason to watch.

I guess if they're going with Roman vs Rock then that lines up.

Yes. That show needs help. Anyone but Seth.

[Mr. Nerfect]

I think they’re about to get Orton and Punk in to help them out.

[Ben Rodrigues]

I think they’re about to get Orton and Punk in to help them out.

Will they acknowledge him as the lineal AEW Champion? Maybe that's how we get the belt off Seth.

[XL]

I think Orton comes back to join Cody’s team in War Games. Not holding out much hope for a Punk return.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Will they acknowledge him as the lineal AEW Champion? Maybe that's how we get the belt off Seth.

Nah, I think they totally no-sell AEW.

[rez]

Nah, I think they totally no-sell AEW.

https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/191/035/135.png

[Ben Rodrigues]

Nah, I think they totally no-sell AEW.

Eh, likely. For the best, winning the secondary world title would be a step down.

[Mr. Nerfect]

You might get a reference to it being a useless piece of tin and him wanting to win his first real championship in over a decade or something.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Dynamite continues to go down in the ratings while the lead-in remains virtually the same.

[Destor]

Thread looks open to me

[xrodmuc316]

Thread looks open to me

Sorry, should have said archived, like AEW's audience, participation in this thread setting record lows!

[xrodmuc316]

Do you think people here still love CM Punk now that he went back to the E? He is drawing better ratings nowadays :rofl:

[Mr. Nerfect]

CM Punk is doing the best babyface work of his career.

[Mr. Nerfect]

NXT got 957k viewers without LA as a market, since they were covering the wildfires there. Tony Khan and Dave Meltzer grieving right now.

[Bad News Gertner]

I missed this thread

[The Rogerer]

My love for you is like a truck Dave Meltzer
Would you like some making fuck Dave Meltzer

[Bad News Gertner]

WWE and Fightful are claiming 2.6 million views for Raw on Netflix and 4.9 Worldwide

[drave]

SHAMBLES!!!!1!

[Mr. Nerfect]

WWE and Fightful are claiming 2.6 million views for Raw on Netflix and 4.9 Worldwide

That’s an outstanding number. I guessed something like 3.2 million worldwide. 4.9 million is something like 1.7% of Netflix subscriptions. And apparently that doesn’t count total viewers, so it could be closer to 6 million people watching.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Eerily quiet on Dynamite MAX numbers.

[Mr. Nerfect]

AEW is back! 679k viewers.

[XL]

Is 4.9m impressive? Across the world?

[xrodmuc316]

Is 4.9m impressive? Across the world?

It is better than the 60,000 reported on Max for Dynamite :rofl:

[Mr. Nerfect]

It is better than the 60,000 reported on Max for Dynamite :rofl:

There’s no way it’s that high.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Is 4.9m impressive? Across the world?

It doesn’t sound like a lot, but I think it’s a solid number. I was predicting about 3.2 million for them. About 60% of the audience in the US. Most people would have already been watching. About 2 million in the US for Raw.

4.9 million is about 1.6% of Netflix subscribers worldwide.

Being generous to AEW, divide that by 3 to get a proportionate AEW number. I doubt they’re getting 1.6 million on Max lol. And that’s ignoring 10 million people.

[Destor]

4.9 mil is very low by netflix standards. Theyve canceled shows for 5 mil. I wouldnt panic though. Several markets cant watch raw on netflix yet so its not the full picture. As the contracts come up the number will grow.

This shouldn't need to be said but Raw in no way is competing with AEW for anything other than fake internet points and any comparison between the two is as moot as comparing RAW to AWA reruns on espn 2.

For comparison squid games season 2 topped the most recent netflix chart at over 26 million views. 4.9 million would be out be outside of the top 10 by 2.6 million.

[Destor]

And it is fairly surprising how low that initial number is. Cable should have been a significant limiter on views the same way nfl numbers on netflix have been able to be so massive. 25 mil or whatever that number was.


I didnt expect 20 million but 8 definitely. I thought low end top 10. And im certain netflix did too. Im sure theyre feeling the pressure to move eyeballs. Likely theyre going to do some hotshotting to drive up new viewers. Luckly hot shots leading into mania is traditional so no one will notice.

[xrodmuc316]

Global | this week
Top 10 Shows overview
Ranking Views
01
American Primeval: Limited Series
2 14,300,000
02
XO, Kitty: Season 2
1 14,200,000
03
Missing You: Limited Series
3 5,600,000
04
Raw: 2025 January 13, 2025
1 3,700,000
05
Jerry Springer: Fights, Camera, Action: Limited Series
2 3,500,000
06
XO, Kitty: Season 1
5 3,100,000
07
The Night Agent: Season 1
13 2,400,000
08
The Walking Dead: The Ones Who Live: Season 1
1 2,300,000
09
I AM A KILLER: Season 6
1 2,300,000
10
Castlevania: Nocturne: Season 2
1 2,300,000

That is from Netflix, so if 3.7 million for the 2nd week was 4th, now sure where you are getting 4.9 million would be 2.6 million away from even cracking the top 10.

[Destor]

Took me a minute but I see how you got that list. Youre sorting by series on Todum yeah? That excludes events and films. Im also going off of RAWs debut where they got the 4.9

[Destor]

(Theyre down from the debut btw. Didnt realize that. I only track the number every week or two. I was waiting for the finals to come out on tuesday to follow up.)

[Mr. Nerfect]

I can’t imagine anything on Netflix getting that many viewers. The US still has more cable subscribers than Netflix ones, yeah?

[Mr. Nerfect]

If hot-shotting at this time of year is traditional and no one will notice, what’s the point of doing it for Netflix? They’d be doing it anyway. :p

[xrodmuc316]

Took me a minute but I see how you got that list. Youre sorting by series on Todum yeah? That excludes events and films. Im also going off of RAWs debut where they got the 4.9

That list says 3.7 Million, from Netflix.com, week 2. That is shows only though, that is correct. They don't have a shows and movies list, but there were 4 movies that did more views, so Raw would be 8th overall if they had that list option.

[Mr. Nerfect]

It would be compared to shows anyway. If they get the PLE deal after Peacock, I can see WrestleMania and the like being compared to movies.

[XL]

It doesn’t sound like a lot, but I think it’s a solid number. I was predicting about 3.2 million for them. About 60% of the audience in the US. Most people would have already been watching. About 2 million in the US for Raw.

4.9 million is about 1.6% of Netflix subscribers worldwide.

Being generous to AEW, divide that by 3 to get a proportionate AEW number. I doubt they’re getting 1.6 million on Max lol. And that’s ignoring 10 million people.

I’m not taking about the number as a comparison to AEW.

Most likely me not having a firm enough grasp on the viewership but I thought the point of being on Netflix was the huge potential audience. Less than 5m and less than 2% of potential audience seems really disappointing.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Lol, only my last paragraph compares it to AEW. When you consider the existent Raw audience in the US, figure in that it’s going to be more popular there than anywhere else (about 60%, as I said), then the numbers they’re getting are great.

I don’t know what percentage of Netflix subscribers watching pro-wrestling people expected. 2% seems like a generous amount to me, realistically speaking.

And this is why I compared them to AEW. What do you think 600k out of 60 million homes is? They weren’t going to get 10 million homes watching Raw live.

[The Rogerer]

I was predicting about 3.2 million for them. well you are always wrong...

[drave]

NETFLIX IN SHAMBLES!

[xrodmuc316]

NETFLIX IN SHAMBLES!

But, muh demos?

[The Rogerer]

Lol, only my last paragraph compares it to AEWDon't know why you'd do that anyway. Max streaming is supplimental to it's screenings, completely different scenario to WWE's complete worldwide transplant to Netflix.

AEW's Max viewing figures are probably negligable given that it hasn't had much effect on TV ratings. It just stands to make Max a viable service for people who don't have cable in the future.

[Mr. Nerfect]

But, muh demos?

How can we determine whether this thing is a success until we know how many 49 yr old men are watching?

[drave]

MUH DEMONS IN SHAMBLES!!!!1!!!1

49 YEAR OLD MEN IN SHAMBLES!!!!!!!


wrasslin in SHAMBLES!!!!

[Mr. Nerfect]

MUH DEMONS IN SHAMBLES!!!!1!!!1

49 YEAR OLD MEN IN SHAMBLES!!!!!!!


wrasslin in SHAMBLES!!!!

Wrestling is fine, despite AEW’s best efforts.

[xrodmuc316]

AEW sucks. There is not a single interesting thing on their shows. I don't watch anymore, but still read the results for Dynamite. I don't even bother to do that with Collision. Nothing happens ever, and gymnastic routines that are called "Bangers" but advance nothing at all.

Knowing how many people want out and are being refused and just kept locked away in Tony's vault is poetically funny. All the original bluster about AEW treating wrestlers good unlike that evil WWE turned out to be complete bullshit, just like so many of their original mission statement goals.

AEW wanted to kill WWE, but really all they did was make WWE the babyface while Tony pretty much pillage NJPW and killed the Indies in the US.

AEW is a lame.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Truth.

[Lock Jaw]

R-Truth?

[Mr. Nerfect]

Nah, just plain ol’ regular truth. As opposed to plain ol’ regular R-Truth.

[The Rogerer]

AEW sucks. There is not a single interesting thing on their shows. I don't watch anymore, but still read the results for Dynamite. I don't even bother to do that with Collision. Nothing happens ever, and gymnastic routines that are called "Bangers" but advance nothing at all.

Knowing how many people want out and are being refused and just kept locked away in Tony's vault is poetically funny. All the original bluster about AEW treating wrestlers good unlike that evil WWE turned out to be complete bullshit, just like so many of their original mission statement goals.

AEW wanted to kill WWE, but really all they did was make WWE the babyface while Tony pretty much pillage NJPW and killed the Indies in the US.

AEW is a lame.This is the ratings thread

[JT]

In the age of streaming, is ratings still a thing? XD

[Mr. Nerfect]

Yeah, kind of.

[The Rogerer]

In the age of streaming, is ratings still a thing? XDTV deals are still a massive source of revenue, advertisers pay for people to look at adverts. Streaming can make these companies money but it's mostly been companies just burning venture capital. Netflix getting WWE probably won't make money for them, but it is a logistical step into doing live broadcasting.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Nielsen has agreed to cover streaming. The services do release their numbers. AEW’s are just being guarded because they suck so bad.

Dave Meltzer has tried to draw a link between the numbers for Dynamite not being released and UFC PPV that did “tremendous” being kept quiet. “Most likely” he says. Of course, if the numbers were actually good, he would have been leaked them or his AEW sources would have told him definitively they can’t talk about them. But that’s not the case, is it?

[The Rogerer]

“Most likely” he says.

[Mr. Nerfect]

604k viewers for Dynamite. The Netflix bump is wearing off.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Collision did 197k viewers.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Dynamite did 605k viewers. It’s down about 200k from last year.

[Mr. Nerfect]

579k for Dynamite.

[Sepholio]

I love that you're still here fighting the good fight.

[Mr. Nerfect]

If anyone accidentally stumbles upon these forums, I want them to be able to see the truth.

[xrodmuc316]

More people stumble upon this forum than watch AEW :rofl::rofl::rofl:

[Mr. Nerfect]

You need to add the MAX numbers to that, xrod. Oh, it doesn’t make a difference?

[Mr. Nerfect]

This is why it’s important to take down Dave. Here’s him on the Collision ratings:

“Collision did 502K/0.21, don't have the chart. NBA lead-in of course helped a lot really the key given it was out of its regular time slot. That doesn't include MAX, so likely the biggest numbers since the early weeks of the show if you factor that in. First quarter (Omega & Ospreay vs. Takeshita & Fletcher) topped 1 million, but that's not a surprise.”

* He doesn’t have the chart? Where does he get his numbers from? It’s not that it’s charted that’s important, it’s that he clearly just gets his numbers fed to him as opposed to from a primary source.

* The NBA helped a lot gives way to it being out of its usual time slot in Dave’s second “sentence.” Dismissing its artificial boost to frame it as being impeded. Never mind AEW foolishly booked Grand Slam for that weekend in the first place. Poor AEW, being so late at night with the NBA All-Star lead-in giving it the healthiest start for it to ruin.

* He references MAX viewers despite no numbers ever being released. I’m sure both MAX viewers are happy to be included, but Dave is trying to give it a boost by saying “if you factor that in.” What in? What numbers are there to actually factor in? They’re completely phantom.

* He’s still trying to force Ospreay & Omega as draws. The lead-in did huge because of the NBA. He frames it ambiguously like it’s not a surprise their segment did those numbers without clarifying that it’s solely because of the lead-in. His readers WILL latch on to that. Many still try to claim that Omega is a draw.

There’s literally something wrong with every sentence (every run-on sentence) this cunt writes to smokescreen for this company. It’s beyond disingenuous. It’s deliberately misleading and poisons the discussion around the subjects.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Dave has gone into overdrive defending AEW’s falling numbers. :lol:

563k for Dynamite.

[xrodmuc316]

"Collision peaked at a Million viewers!"

It started with a million viewers and within 8 minutes of Kenny Omega and Will Ospreay, they lost 350,000 viewers.

The last Quarter hour did 294,000 TOTAL viewers, but the "reporting" says AEW thinks it was a huge success.

Pyramid Scheme.

[Mr. Nerfect]

He’s flipping out at people over Twitter telling them to “look at logic” and in the next breath is saying “We literally don’t know” when it comes to the heft of the MAX numbers. If they were substantial, we’d know about them. If there was interest in AEW, all metrics wouldn’t be rapidly declining. Look at logic, Dave.

The Collision rating apologetics are amazing. The number started off big because of the NBA, then it dropped like a ski slope because the product sucks.

[Mr. Nerfect]

The ratings predictably dropped off huge for Roderick Strong vs. Orange Cassidy and whatever followed with Kenny Omega. The show ended at around 467k. That’s where it’s heading. Remember when the sickos tried to convince people Orange Cassidy and Kenny Omega were stars?

[The Rogerer]

This is why it’s important to take down Dave. Here’s him on the Collision ratings:

“Collision did 502K/0.21, don't have the chart. NBA lead-in of course helped a lot really the key given it was out of its regular time slot. That doesn't include MAX, so likely the biggest numbers since the early weeks of the show if you factor that in. First quarter (Omega & Ospreay vs. Takeshita & Fletcher) topped 1 million, but that's not a surprise.”

* He doesn’t have the chart? Where does he get his numbers from? It’s not that it’s charted that’s important, it’s that he clearly just gets his numbers fed to him as opposed to from a primary source.

* The NBA helped a lot gives way to it being out of its usual time slot in Dave’s second “sentence.” Dismissing its artificial boost to frame it as being impeded. Never mind AEW foolishly booked Grand Slam for that weekend in the first place. Poor AEW, being so late at night with the NBA All-Star lead-in giving it the healthiest start for it to ruin.

* He references MAX viewers despite no numbers ever being released. I’m sure both MAX viewers are happy to be included, but Dave is trying to give it a boost by saying “if you factor that in.” What in? What numbers are there to actually factor in? They’re completely phantom.

* He’s still trying to force Ospreay & Omega as draws. The lead-in did huge because of the NBA. He frames it ambiguously like it’s not a surprise their segment did those numbers without clarifying that it’s solely because of the lead-in. His readers WILL latch on to that. Many still try to claim that Omega is a draw.

There’s literally something wrong with every sentence (every run-on sentence) this cunt writes to smokescreen for this company. It’s beyond disingenuous. It’s deliberately misleading and poisons the discussion around the subjects.Sorry, who's Dave?

[drave]

GD, Rog. GD.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Lol the ratings discourse is better than the actual content the company produces.

Meltzer on NXT: NXT was up to 799K/0.19 last night.

Meltzer on AEW: AEW did 598K/0.18, that’s with West Coast at 5p.m., obviously not including MAX. Beat everything on cable but NBA and Fox News.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Someone pointed out that there’s a top ten sports list on MAX and AEW isn’t on it.

[xrodmuc316]

Meltzer is so bitter that NXT kills AEW now :rofl:

[Mr. Nerfect]

I can’t wait for the bragging if Dynamite beats EVOLVE.

[The Rogerer]

Lol the ratings discourse is better than the actual content the company produces.

Meltzer on NXT: NXT was up to 799K/0.19 last night.

Meltzer on AEW: AEW did 598K/0.18, that’s with West Coast at 5p.m., obviously not including MAX. Beat everything on cable but NBA and Fox News.I wish we had some discourse on here

[Mr. Nerfect]

EVOLVE has 286k on YouTube. If that international audience is 40% or 50% of the Tubi audience, then it wouldn’t be surprising to discover it got between 572k and 715k total on Tubi.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Dave Meltzer is losing his mind over the ratings this week. :lol:

[Mr. Nerfect]

Lol, one of the sickos lied that AEW gets about 500k viewers each week on MAX. I think they meant to say it has had 500k views altogether.

[The Rogerer]

Dave Meltzer is losing his mind over the ratings this week. :lol:

[Lock Jaw]

Look folks, the ratings have to go down before they go back up. We are going to see the biggest boom period in wrestling like never before. Only the weak will lose!

[Mr. Nerfect]

What people don’t understand is that while ratings and attendance are going down, PPV, merchandise and MAX numbers are going up. Trust us!

[Lock Jaw]

We will make wrestling great again!

[xrodmuc316]

I saw the thing about 500,000 Max viewers. WBD already put something out that the most watched NBA game on Max was a Lakers vs Mavericks game. There was 50,000 people who watched that game on Max. So "according to sources", AEW is 10 times more popular than the NBA, because that makes sense.

I said it before, AEW is a nothing more than a Larp of a good business. It is all smoke and mirrors. AEW could get cancelled from TV and Tony Khan would still pretend AEW is doing the best they ever have.

[Mr. Nerfect]

I don’t know how we can possibly make wrestling great again when they’ve left Chad Gable off the WrestleMania card again.

[Lock Jaw]

El Gran Americano might wrestle though

[Mr. Nerfect]

I saw the thing about 500,000 Max viewers. WBD already put something out that the most watched NBA game on Max was a Lakers vs Mavericks game that like 50,000 people watched on Max. So "according to sources", AEW is 10 times more popular than the NBA.

I said it before, AEW is a nothing more than a Larp of a good business. It is all smoke and mirrors. AEW could get cancelled from TV and Tony Khan would still pretend AEW is doing the best they ever have.

It’s only the metrics you can’t see that are doing well. Something that dawned on me way too late was that the PPV estimates we get could be completely made up. Just blatant lies.

Tony Khan could be a flat-out, bald-faced liar. The kid that says he didn’t eat all the chocolate chip cookies with the evidence still smeared across his face. He may not have even read all the Observers he’s claimed to. He might just say things.

[Mr. Nerfect]

El Gran Americano might wrestle though

I’ve been impressed with the newcomer. I’m looking forward to his match with Rey Mysterio at Mania, but I do wish Chad Gable was getting his first singles opportunity at the grandest state of them all.

[xrodmuc316]

I feel like Nick Aldis is going to punish Randy Orton for that RKO come Wrestlemania, which I heard this year might actually fall on Rusev Day.

[Destor]

Is it bald-daced liar? I swear ive been saying bold-faced my whole life...terrifying

[Mr. Nerfect]

Is it bald-daced liar? I swear ive been saying bold-faced my whole life...terrifying

Probably a regional expression.

[Mr. Nerfect]

I feel like Nick Aldis is going to punish Randy Orton for that RKO come Wrestlemania, which I heard this year might actually fall on Rusev Day.

Every day is Rusev Day, so I think it’s a safe bet.

[Destor]

So Raws ratings have continued to drop. Theyre now at the bottom of netflixs top 10 which means if they drop below their current 2.7mil they will fall completely out of the published data and we wont get any updates on how the show is fairing.

Similarly the finaly recertificatied Neilson just released a new skew. They put out the top 100 shows. Raw didnt crack that list.

Im curious how a show locked by streaming drums in new viewers. They dont have lead ins or commercial opportunities or channel surfing.

Is the only thing it can actually do is hemorrhage?

[Destor]

And if new york fails in this new market what does that the industry as a whole...

[Big Vic]

So Cena really is ruining wrestling.

[screech]

So Raws ratings have continued to drop. Theyre now at the bottom of netflixs top 10 which means if they drop below their current 2.7mil they will fall completely out of the published data and we wont get any updates on how the show is fairing.

Similarly the finaly recertificatied Neilson just released a new skew. They put out the top 100 shows. Raw didnt crack that list.

Im curious how a show locked by streaming drums in new viewers. They dont have lead ins or commercial opportunities or channel surfing.

Is the only thing it can actually do is hemorrhage?

Maybe the best they can hope for is people happen to scroll by on Netflix while it's on and click on it, but realistically how many people are going to do that?

I mean, people do browse Netflix looking for shit to watch so it's kinda like channel surfing. Though I don't know if the live show starts playing while you are stopped there like the show would just play on your TV channel (I do not watch RAW live).

But the data already shows that that is not happening now so I don't think the odds are great that someone new goes "hey let's watch this."

[screech]

maybe the actual best they can hope for is to stay at like 2.5 million?

what do we think is the lowest number they can hit before Netflix says hey fix this shit?

[Destor]

I think the current numbers would lead to netflix taking the low year option and dropping raw so for my money theyre there now. And they have no card to play. Cena is the biggest draw you could muster and its not working.

This seems very dire to me

[Lock Jaw]

You mean the young generation with thousands of choices at their fingertips aren't deliberately clicking on and watching a weekly 3 hour show?!

And that the older generation who would actually still have and watch cable TV haven't followed over to Netflix?!

Who could have seen this coming?!

[xrodmuc316]

Netflix tracking is weird. To be considered a live viewer, you have to stream every second live. So if you start at 8:01pm, you are not considered a live viewer. If you pause the broadcast and come back 1 minute later, you are not considered a live viewer. If you rewind 30 seconds to see something again, you are no longer considered a live viewer.

So all in all, who knows, but it is still WAY more than the 40,000 that watch on Dynamite Max :rofl::rofl::rofl:

[Mr. Nerfect]

Lol, WWE is fine. Netflix just put out a statement saying they are looking to expand WWE programming and/or monetize it more thoroughly. Was the 2.6 million number viewers or homes? If it’s homes, then you have basically the same viewership as USA Network, which is what you would have expected, with 50% or so of the audience being international. They’re not all watching live because the world doesn’t run on US time.

The Netflix deal is a global deal. It’s about carrying WWE in ALL their international markets. They’ve got the backlog and contempory major events (outside Saturday Night’s Main Event). The NBC Universal, CW Network, Tubi and YouTube deals are about getting WWE content out there to people without Netflix. You also have social media and their celebrity tie-ins/special appearances for that.

Do US fans realize that in, say, Canada, Netflix doesn’t only carry Raw, but SmackDown, NXT, WrestleMania, Money in the Bank, SummerSlam and every WWE PPV ever? It sometimes gets lost in the sauce when Meltzer marks freak out because Raw isn’t getting 10 million viewers live for Raw every week.

You’ve then also got Netflix’s business model, which is subscription-based. While it would be groovy if WWE fans watched every second of every Raw ever, they really only need them to pay for the service. If subscribers are being linked to WWE interest then it doesn’t really matter. Signing up to Netflix is like a gym membership in many respects — they don’t expect every member of the gym to use it every day or go to every class.

WWE are so confident in their deals that they are using the time to promote their auxiliary and even independtly operated adjacent programming. AAA has been a focus on Raw, SmackDown and NXT lately. This week’s NXT was basically an infomercial for TNA Against All Odds.

The doom and gloom doesn’t track. It’s too old school to be reacting week-to-week with a US-only focus.

[Mr. Nerfect]

TLDR: WWE is ok, guys.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Netflix tracking is weird. To be considered a live viewer, you have to stream every second live. So if you start at 8:01pm, you are not considered a live viewer. If you pause the broadcast and come back 1 minute later, you are not considered a live viewer. If you rewind 30 seconds to see something again, you are no longer considered a live viewer.

So all in all, who knows, but it is still WAY more than the 40,000 that watch on Dynamite Max :rofl::rofl::rofl:

See, I didn’t even know that about counting live viewers. If that’s the case, I don’t count as a live viewer. I’m not watching Raw at 10am on a Tuesday. I don’t watch SmackDown live on Saturday either. I’ll jump in when the show is far along enough that I skip all the breaks. So I wouldn’t count as a live viewer for anything, and I am basically catching everything.

I am skeptical that even 40k watch Dynamite on MAX. I do love how some of the sickos out there try to imply that the WWE deal is so bad like if AEW went to Netflix it would be doing a larger audience. I also love the Meltzer maths on how bad the Netflix/WWE deal is, but somehow WBD/AEW is cooking.

[Destor]

Its not but the fact that AEW has been brought into a conversation that has nothing to do with it shows this isnt a good faith rebuttle

[Destor]

Wrestling can die. The total viewers and total products can reach zero. Being the king rat doesnt matter if the ship sinks.

[Destor]

You mean the young generation with thousands of choices at their fingertips aren't deliberately clicking on and watching a weekly 3 hour show?!

And that the older generation who would actually still have and watch cable TV haven't followed over to Netflix?!

Who could have seen this coming?!i do think long form content is being desired more. Podcasts run hours. Youtube favors ling form content (more ads per click.) obviously theyve hemorrhaged over a million viewers in an alarming period and the trend hasnt slowed so this three year deal doesnt give them a lot of run way to turn things around.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Its not but the fact that AEW has been brought into a conversation that has nothing to do with it shows this isnt a good faith rebuttle

Oh stop it, you’re better than that. This is the ratings thread. It’s not “talk about whatever Destor wants to.”

WWE is fine. You have your response. Wrestling can die. I’ve seen AEW do its best to try and kill it for about 6 years now while people scream about how amazing it is that they’re around. WWE are actually doing their best to help others grow. TNA, AAA, WWE ID. New Japan might be soon (and they need it). They’re actually trying to serve up alternatives to their glossiest product.

You can look at the live attendance to get another gauge of their health. They’re not exactly hurting when it comes to public perception right now. They have their 1st tier shows, where tickets are going for hundreds of dollars — packages into the thousands. Then you’ve got your 2nd tier, where cheapest tickets recently available were $40. Then you’ve got your 3rd tier which they are establishing.

[screech]

I think the current numbers would lead to netflix taking the low year option and dropping raw so for my money theyre there now. And they have no card to play. Cena is the biggest draw you could muster and its not working.

This seems very dire to me

I admittedly don't know a ton about TV ratings and whatnot, but losing a million+ viewers in less than six months seems PrettyBad

[Mr. Nerfect]

It was 6th most watched Netflix show globally. They got 2.6 million views. That’s not the same as viewers.

[Destor]

I admittedly don't know a ton about TV ratings and whatnot, but losing a million+ viewers in less than six months seems PrettyBad33% of the audience that was there for night 1 on netflix is gone. Its a significant issue. Theyve entered more markets as the months has rolled on and theyre gaining nothing for it. Theyre hemorrhaging views each week. They arent dropping out of the listings because bigger shows are entering their numbers are actively diminishing.

There's a hard bottom. AEW brings in the core wrestling fan and really nothing else. Wrestling ratings cant actually be lower than what they put out. Obviously wrestling is unsustainable at that rating and is fully support by money from other ventures and isnt organically operational. We all know that. But slap any wrestling on any national channel and it will pull those numbers.

WWE i think has a much higher floor. There's a significant number of people who wont watch anything else but will watch ANYTHING wwe puts out. Where that bottom is who knows but but the math says we're on our way to finding out.

The issue is netflix didnt pay that kind of money for a loss leader. Netflix is notorious for cutting there losses on SUCCESSFUL shows just because statics say after x number of seasons views TEND to drop. There's no reality where they keep paying for something thats shrinking. They never do that.

Its a significant issue and youd need AEW derangement syndrome to not know it.

[Lock Jaw]

Destor proving why he is the best rassling poster. Only one with true objectivity across both boards.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Destor proving why he is the best rassling poster. Only one with true objectivity across both boards.

Destor is a great poster, but he is not objective. Everyone has their biases. He has some great takes, but he also believes that Montreal was a work and CM Punk was the one trying to hurt wrestling in the AEW drama. He criticized the WWE/FOX deal in much the same way he is this Netflix one. And if he gets too rattled by an argument back, he says it’s because the other party can’t be objective.

[Mr. Nerfect]

33% of the audience that was there for night 1 on netflix is gone. Its a significant issue. Theyve entered more markets as the months has rolled on and theyre gaining nothing for it. Theyre hemorrhaging views each week. They arent dropping out of the listings because bigger shows are entering their numbers are actively diminishing.

There's a hard bottom. AEW brings in the core wrestling fan and really nothing else. Wrestling ratings cant actually be lower than what they put out. Obviously wrestling is unsustainable at that rating and is fully support by money from other ventures and isnt organically operational. We all know that. But slap any wrestling on any national channel and it will pull those numbers.

WWE i think has a much higher floor. There's a significant number of people who wont watch anything else but will watch ANYTHING wwe puts out. Where that bottom is who knows but but the math says we're on our way to finding out.

The issue is netflix didnt pay that kind of money for a loss leader. Netflix is notorious for cutting there losses on SUCCESSFUL shows just because statics say after x number of seasons views TEND to drop. There's no reality where they keep paying for something thats shrinking. They never do that.

Its a significant issue and youd need AEW derangement syndrome to not know it.

Which successful shows has Netflix cancelled? I did a quick search and got nothing, but I haven’t followed it too attentively.

It’s been explained to you how your read on modern data gathering metrics is possibly skewered. Going into new markets isn’t necessarily going to help them live — and may not even be the goal if they’re more concerned with expanding Netflix in those markets. How many different accounts access them each week across a subscription month? Internationally, how does SmackDown, NXT and PLE balance this?

You freak out over every media rights deal, dude. It’s got nothing to do with anyone else’s derangement syndrome.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Dynamite is doing so well on Max that it grew an entirely new company!

[Mr. Nerfect]

This week was the most attended Raw in Arizona history. 2.7 million views so far. #8 globally. Netflix prolly kicking themselves.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Money in the Bank only in the Top 10 in 19 countries.

[Mr. Nerfect]

497k for AEW’s Summer Blockbuster this week. Absolutely cooking.

[screech]

Would USA (or another network) take WWE back if/when Netflix tells them to fuck off?

I agree there are people who will watch WWE weekly, either out of habit or because they genuinely enjoy what's on there. For a time, the company will be able to count on whatever those numbers are. But will a network, after seeing such a steep drop in viewers in a short time, be willing to pay a bunch of money for that?

Maybe the better question is: How significant will the drop in money be from their last TV deal?

[Destor]

Id say absolutely. Traditional TV is desperate and will do anything. The issue is they have less money to spend everyday. The contracts WWE is paying out these days are insane and couldnt be honored without the streaming money. Theyd have to scale way back

[Lock Jaw]

Yeah, traditional TV craves live sports (or sports entertainment) as it is one of the only things that actually drive people to watch traditional live TV

[Destor]

And the ad companies know that eyeballs p ads are way higher on live tv. Show type shows are wayched in delay at a much higher volume. Theres no way they would get zero traditional tv offers. Just what do they look like is the question.


Market is shifting fast. A few years is almost a lifetime in the current environment

[Mr. Nerfect]

SmackDown #9 in Australia on a Tuesday (same day as Raw). I’d gather that people are watching it after the weekend and maybe after word of mouth about Punk/Cena and maybe even what Truth is up to. Getting it in before Raw (which was #3 on Wednesday).

[Mr. Nerfect]

Would USA (or another network) take WWE back if/when Netflix tells them to fuck off?

I agree there are people who will watch WWE weekly, either out of habit or because they genuinely enjoy what's on there. For a time, the company will be able to count on whatever those numbers are. But will a network, after seeing such a steep drop in viewers in a short time, be willing to pay a bunch of money for that?

Maybe the better question is: How significant will the drop in money be from their last TV deal?

USA has WWE now. They had the leverage to secure an NBC/Peacock deal from it too. USA wanted a third hour for SmackDown.

Netflix is not likely to tell them to fuck off lol. WWE are good at what they do. They’re content machines. Netflix let them put EVOLVE on Tubi and Worlds Collide on YouTube. They have content on broadcast TV, cable, free streaming and premium streaming. They have libraries to target different audiences through different mechanisms. They have the option of taking everything exclusive for big offers or diversifying their content for different revenue streams.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Raw only got 2.9 million views this past week. Top 10 in only 16 countries. In Canada, SmackDown was only at #9.

[xrodmuc316]

Tony Khan is out giving interviews saying their ratings on TBS are up year over year, which is easily proven incorrect since people can just look that up and see he is lying lol.

[Mr. Nerfect]

It’s weird, because the act of lying about it suggests that he believes the perception of AEW is one of growth — but the reality is one of decline — so at what point does the actual reality become important?

[Mr. Nerfect]

Guys, 736k for Dynamite this week. That Netflix deal not looking so hot right now.

[Mr. Nerfect]

SmackDown was 4th in the Top 10 today.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Lol, Dave Meltzer did an “unscentific” poll (his words) to measure AEW’s success on MAX. Meaning he asked the sickos who subscribe to his newsletter what they do and applied it to all fans. This is where rubbish like Dynamite having 500k comes from.

[xrodmuc316]

Basically exactly my reaction to Tony's bullshit ratings :rofl:

sSvGYVzXRLs

[Mr. Nerfect]

They got like 613k this week. Easy come, easy go. Dave Meltzer melted down. Threatened to block someone who asked for evidence when Dave said Dynamite is doing far better than NXT if you add the Max numbers (which he also claims he doesn’t know).

[Mr. Nerfect]

And we have a Dave Meltzer meltdown over the AEW numbers! He amalgamated and listed all the shows that did better than AEW by his own metrics, including HGTV. People have respectfully questioned why he does this so vigilantly with AEW m instead of just giving the data and he’s losing his mind lashing out saying people can’t understand English and claiming he applies the same standards to everyone. :lol:

It’s more entertaining than that shitty show, which got 584k for the 300th episode spectacular.

[Mr. Nerfect]

As Dave is going after people’s grasp on English, he is butchering the language himself. I’m starting to think I might be making fun of a senile man. He’s still being purposely sneaky though.

An example: Dave told someone he always lists the “competition.” He’s talking about shows that got a higher 18-49 demo. Technically anything is competition. He’s using “competition” euphemistically to avoid saying they beat Dynamite.

[xrodmuc316]

So it took 2 weeks to lose the 150,000 viewers they got from Grand Slam? Sounds like a company doing the best shows they ever have done (according to Tiny Khan). Classic AEW LOL

[Sepholio]

AEWompwahhhhhhhhhh

[The Rogerer]

sean rossssssaaaaaaaaap

[Mr. Nerfect]

Oh it didn’t even last 2 weeks, if you could even call it a spike.

[Mr. Nerfect]

SmackDown was #2 in Australia on Netflix today. I don’t check it vigilantly, but I don’t think I’ve ever seen it so high.

[Mr. Nerfect]

1.4 million people watched SNME on NBC. It was #1 in the archaic key demo. I wonder if Dave Meltzer is going to credit them with that and if he’s going to account for people watching on streaming like he does for Dynamite and MAX?

[Mr. Nerfect]

SNME has 587k YouTube views as well.

[xrodmuc316]

Meltzer is now saying AEW made All In so long to purposely counter program Saturday Night's Main Event. Not that AEW moved the start time to 3:00pm because they didn't want to go head to head with SNME, but that they put on a 6 hour PPV to show they are not afraid of WWE.

I shit you not lol

[Mr. Nerfect]

WWE got more viewers than any episode of Dynamite has ever gotten with a 58 yr old that the internet says sucks. If they had 10k to each show, they would have sold more tickets over the weekend too.

AEW needs to fear for its own house more than anything. WWE are still going light and easy on them. But AEW’s media rights partner is splitting into 2 and throwing them to the one likely to declare bankruptcy. If they want to keep poking the bear, they’re going to find out pretty quick.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Dave has acknowledged that the NBC numbers don’t include Peacock, but no word yet on if he is going to add 30%.

[The Rogerer]

Did SNME broadcast live on youtube, or after the fact, or was this some Youtube TV thing?

[Ben Rodrigues]

Did SNME broadcast live on youtube, or after the fact, or was this some Youtube TV thing?

It's on regular YouTube here in Australia and I imagine anywhere else where NBC is not a thing. I generally get the link from the WWE Australia X account.

[Ben Rodrigues]

Did SNME broadcast live on youtube, or after the fact, or was this some Youtube TV thing?

It's on regular YouTube here in Australia and I imagine anywhere else where NBC is not a thing. I generally get the link from the WWE Australia X account. Unsure if it's region locked.

[Mr. Nerfect]

588k for Dynamite. Dave is claiming that everyone is watching on MAX and it’s preposterous to think otherwise.

[The Rogerer]

Thank you Ben Rodrigues

[The Rogerer]

I haven't been following any wrestling news since the forum started crashing daily, it's kind of eye opening how little you hear about Dave Meltzer outside of wrestling.

[xrodmuc316]

How could it be possible that after the greatest, most successful North American PPV of all time, that Dynamite could have dropped 10% of their viewing audience from last week? Wasn't Hangman supposed to restore the feelings?!?!?

[Mr. Nerfect]

It’s almost like going from one terrible champ to another was a bad idea.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Evolution was #1 in Australia at some point. Raw has been in the global top ten 28 out of 28 weeks.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Collision got 348k. For those who believe in fairies and the 18-49 demo, they got a 0.06. It never scraped above 100k. Thank goodness this doesn’t count the 800k watching on MAX.

[Mr. Nerfect]

612k for Dynamite. The quarter-hours tell an interesting story this week. There’s a noticeable dip in the middle of the show for the World Title match. They usually get a top of the hour bump. Hangman Page does not work.

[xrodmuc316]

I love how it took Tony 2 years to come up with his big idea, which was to go back to the empty headed dumb fuck Adam Page, like he wasn't made to look like a total jackass the last 2 years after dropping the title.

This dude drank blood and committed arson, but yeah, lets make him the babyface champion LOL

[Mr. Nerfect]

If it were any sort of long-term plan, they wouldn’t have done any of that. This has just been thrown together because…reasons lol.

[Mr. Nerfect]

This week marks Nielsen implementing their Big Data + Panel methodology. This means that HBO Max will be counted when it comes to Dynamite. I’m sure Big Dave has been loud and proud about Big Data being included and isn’t suspiciously quiet because we’re about to find out AEW was getting around 35k views on HBO Max.

[Mr. Nerfect]

The Big Data + Panel stats won’t be available until later in the month apparently. It’s still Christmas though, as Dynamite did 472k viewers. But Dave Meltzer will still tell you that WWE’s counterprogramming backfired on them.

[Bad News Gertner]

Wow, under 500,000

R I P AEW

[Sepholio]

lolAEW

[Mr. Nerfect]

It’s funny to listen to podcasts that look at WCW or the WWF when they snicker at attendance, ratings or buys. Yet they’re somehow AEW fans that cannot keep the same energy even though AEW numbers would give WCCW a chortle.

TNA is a TV deal away from whooping AEW’s ass.

[xrodmuc316]

I am posting this here too, in the ratings thread, because that will screw up any future Dave Meltzer mathematical formula that would "ya know, be proof or whatever" that I am a bot.

Dave's new tactic is to lie about Raw's Netflix numbers, as opposed to lying about AEW's Max numbers.

According to Dave, there are "high level mathematicians", his words, on his wrestling forum, the one with the people smart enough to pay $14.99 a month to listen to Dave, that have figured out a formula that proves that only about 185,000 people watch Raw live.

This of course means Netflix is lying to all their stockholders about the number of people who watch Raw (just Raw, no lying about other shows apparently). The entire basis of this formula is that based on the amount of minutes watched, if you remove advertisement times from the total, that you can prove how few people actually watch live.

To Dave and the intelligent people who still have not figured out Dave has been scamming them out of money, it is impossible for the Raw numbers to be correct. WWE you see, simple cannot be successful on Netflix.

Dave and his minions of course ignore every possible variable. People either watch every single minute of Raw live, or watch every single minute Raw later. Nobody starts 15 minutes late, and thus misses the first few ad breaks, catches up to the live feed, and sees the remaining ads, thus has a different amount of viewing minutes than both somebody that watches every minute live with all the ads, or somebody that watches on a Wednesday afternoon with no ads.

There is also no acknowledgment whatsoever about the people who fast forward parts of the show, other than Dave stating "most people" do not know how to fast forward on Netflix. You see, in Dave's mind, everybody who doesn't subscribe for the right to listen to his stuttering umms and ahhs, well those people must be to mentally deficient to understand fast forwarding... :rofl::lol::rofl::lol::rofl:

[Mr. Nerfect]

Pretty sure Dave is lying about their PPV buys as well as the Max numbers. He also lies about AEW being profitable. Source: Tony Khan’s own press scrum where he went out of his way to use qualifiers like “hopeful profitability.”

[Big Vic]

It’s funny to listen to podcasts that look at WCW or the WWF when they snicker at attendance, ratings or buys. Yet they’re somehow AEW fans that cannot keep the same energy even though AEW numbers would give WCCW a chortle.

TNA is a TV deal away from whooping AEW’s ass.

Reminds me of Nintendo fans that gloat how much better the SNES was compared to the Genesis while being oblivious to the fact that their console team has been under powered for the last 30 years.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Collision bounced back…to 300k. That’s not including the 800k who watch on HBO Max. What do you mean live sports is being pulled from the Max service and being thrown onto a new one through Discovery Global?

[Mr. Nerfect]

465k for Dynamite this week.

[Mr. Nerfect]

NXT: 625k
Dynamite: 321k

You still have people who believe Dave Meltzer’s PPV numbers of 140k buys lol. This is despite YouTube numbers being down 60% for All Out.

They do TNA PPV numbers. They’re just embarrassed to say because they’re trying to brainwash a community that made fun of those numbers for years.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Good news for AEW this week. They almost got 500k viewers.

[Mr. Nerfect]

SmackDown was #1 in Australia on Netflix. There are deeper components to the WWE deals than just USA on Friday nights.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Ladies and gentlemen, they’re back. For the first time since NXT moved to the CW Network, AEW managed to score better viewership. 600k for Dynamite! I’m sure everyone enjoyed what they saw on Wednesday and will definitely be back next week.

[xrodmuc316]

Ladies and gentlemen, they’re back. For the first time since NXT moved to the CW Network, AEW managed to score better viewership. 600k for Dynamite! I’m sure everyone enjoyed what they saw on Wednesday and will definitely be back next week.

They instantly lost 109,000 viewers the following week.

Restored The Feeling :rofl::rofl::rofl:

[xrodmuc316]

TNA to get a show on AMC. 3rd place coming hard for AEW :rofl::rofl::rofl:

[The Rogerer]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LO4EWcv1bc0